From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 1 10:24:00 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l01FNqaJ001607 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 10:23:56 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l01FNlds000828 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 10:23:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l01FMwpj050571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 08:22:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l01FMr5E047846; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 08:22:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l01FMnKS047764 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 08:22:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by m08.lax.untd.com with SMTP id AABC3UK3VAVHV6RS for (sender ); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 07:22:27 -0800 (PST) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: QHEuP/IhRKXTJ0EJwxwhgiAizCNyDQU4kJhcTuON5K4= Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id MAZS4M4Q; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 07:21:55 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 07:19:27 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] CIETA Embroidery Newsletters Message-ID: <20070101.072054.3516.5.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,5-22 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-ContentStamp: 8:4:945492646 X-MAIL-INFO: 524040200045354db4eda93531657504499590bdf0a02dc0810d1549bd81b0f069f9816935f5400cb4d4f5813989a98de144edb531a46464c99d8551410510e45101893494f4ad09d1d4b0c4a455b9d5f4d155bdd46d75849d6dc4ad2d5590e4e4744d11f511a935b4a93554953554197490c0e9c1d975c0215909d90c21240df021b100044d144d408d5430354d95 X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 127.0.0.1|localhost|m08.lax.untd.com|cley@juno.com X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: de9023e3-9a3e-4b72-b4d7-6144a92127ff X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45992783.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 01 Jan 2007 10:23:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO oooooooo!!! Thanks Beth! :D Arlys On Sun, 31 Dec 2006 20:32:38 -0600 Beth and Bob Matney writes: > This site might be of interest: > http://www.annatextiles.ch/newslet/newsint.htm > > Includes the CIETA Embroidery Newsletters from Dec. 1995 to Sept > 2006 > > You might also find her home page > http://www.annatextiles.ch/index.html of > interest. > > Beth > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 1 17:43:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l01MhE7F015524 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 17:43:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l01Mh9pV011041 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 17:43:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l01MgROk004856 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 15:42:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l01MgMoU031393; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 15:42:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (mail.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l01MgI9F031326 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 15:42:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.156] (pm5-156.eos.net [205.133.149.156]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id l01MgGWr023986 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 17:42:17 -0500 (EST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Mon, 01 Jan 2007 18:25:02 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200701010015.l010Ewvl045226@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=53% Cc: Subject: [h-cost] movie costumes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4e3ff833-edf1-4597-b81e-10c996522de8 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45998E7D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 01 Jan 2007 17:43:13 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I haven't seen either of these movies discussed, so here goes. Today we took our kids to see "Night at the Museum." Lots of fun costumes -- at night all the characters in the museum come to life, so there are costumes from all eras and cultures. Because they are museum mannequins come to life, they are all supposed to be costumes (not real period clothes) so I had relief from my typical costumed-movie horror. There were LOTS more people in this movie than I thought there would be from the commercials, a whole Roman army, for example. It was a lot of fun, lightweight but very enjoyable. My favorite costumes were two people dressed as terra cotta Chinese soldiers. I thought they did a great job with those. There were also some ACW "cloth dummies" running around that were a lot of fun. Second movie -- I caught most of "One Night with the King" last night on television. It was a big-budget, released in theaters version of the story of Queen Esther that was out this fall. Talk about a cheesy movie! Really bad script, acting, etc. But the costumes!!!!! They range from what looks half decent (to me, not knowing what Biblical Persian clothes would have looked like, but at least plausible) to just awful. I heard that it was based on a sort of Evangelical Christian romance novel, and the guy who plays King Ahaseurus/Xerxes was supposed to be a sort of tortured romantic lead. But he looked preposterous, his clothes were awful, and he was so annoying I can't imagine anyone falling in love with him. The young actor who played the Egyptian king in "Night at the Museum" looked a lot more authentic AND a lot more romantic. Anyway, Esther's clothes were all over the place, and a lot of them looked like artsy prom dresses. She did look Jewish though, or at least a lot more Jewish than Xerxes looked Persian. In sum, the costumes in "Night at the Museum" were more authentic and more attractive than the ones in "One Night with the King." The movie was much better, too. I was supposed to take my daughter to see that one with some other girls and their moms, but we never found a time and I'm very glad. If I'd had to pay for it I would have wanted my money back. My daughter did go see "The Nativity Story" with people from church, so I was spared that. From the stills, it looked like more costume horror, though of the usual earnest thick weave, lots of knotted rags, and seams on the outside of the garment sort. Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 00:09:00 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0258xTn001816 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:09:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0258so0029263 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:08:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0258Lkg044218 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 22:08:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0258FQh060560; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 22:08:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0258B6R060487 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 22:08:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c7e.3aed1f1 (29679) for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:07:59 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:07:57 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 18d6c42e-8001-4369-bcb5-2d76ca3d2da0 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 4599E8E6.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 00:08:58 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/1/2007 5:43:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, gailscott@eos.net writes: From the stills, it looked like more costume horror, though of the usual earnest thick weave, lots of knotted rags, and seams on the outside of the garment sort. ************************ The best "biblical" costumes I've ever seen were in those Old Testament things Turner television did. They were all filmed in Italy I think and had Italian designers. I could never get all the way thru a whole one however...the scripts were so bad. Richard Harris played Abraham in one....I love to hate Richard Harris. It was hysterical...Ishmael and Isaac as kids come running in the tent for a hug. then run out laughing and Abraham says "God I love those boys." I laughed. Sarah has lines like "Your land has been fertilized by the dung of our goats." Pu-leeze! ANYWAY..... the costumes were amazing. In the one about Joseph, Potiphar and his wife look fantastic! If I remember....she was in a sheer coral red crinkled gauze shift to her feet that had a turquoise knitted over dress, very open in its working, that made the whole thing appear like a coral and turquoise geometric patterned tube that clung tightly to the body. The naked body showed thru the bright gauze and the open work knitted shift had bits of gold bobbles worked into it...and it ended in tied tassels at her ankles. She wore that familiar wig, like a big hair helmet with hammered gold leaves that dangled and shimmered all over it. The dark cole eyes and red lips....she looked like she stepped off a Pyramid wall! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 01:11:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026BPqw005213 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:11:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l026BKjt015404 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:11:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l026Aj0K049665 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:10:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026Af0T092300; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:10:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026Abhd092259 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:10:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1H1cr54Avl-0000GI; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:10:37 -0500 Message-ID: <008401c72e34$b08b1330$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000201c72d2c$1431fde0$6501a8c0@VMAA1> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anyone remember this dress? Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:10:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 64ecd4ef-2da5-4296-b1eb-5b463817948d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 4599F788.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:11:24 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi Linda, Good to see you on the web again! Those are some nice Cher links you sent. Thank you! You know I didn't take Cher's wig from the Richmond concert. Besides... I went to see her in Philly. Robin, is the dress you are describing on this page? http://www.everythingcher.com/pages/gal1970.htm Click on the thumbnail to the far right under the large photo... cream outfit. It has a tied knot at her throat. I have some vintage Cher magazine articles and the Bob Mackie book. I can't get to them until after Jan. 12. We remodeled my office and then my son moved in there until my Mom leaves on the 12th. Then yippee! My son will move back in his room and I can get back my office back. Funny... for Christmas I got more bookshelves for my office and can't get into my office! Anyways, the Mackie book is one of my favorite books. Robin, also on Cher's two latest concert CD's there are some nice photo montages of her career and costumes. I always wanted to do a photoshoot of Cher's wardrobe but she recently auctioned them off. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 01:13:48 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026DmQH005248 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:13:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l026DhkC006456 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:13:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l026DOrN049931 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:13:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026DNlb093575; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:13:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026DKx4093544 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:13:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1H1cti2JhN-0000Dh; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:13:19 -0500 Message-ID: <008801c72e35$10eab4b0$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000201c72d2c$1431fde0$6501a8c0@VMAA1> <008401c72e34$b08b1330$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anyone remember this dress? Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:13:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1af48122-2c9c-4ae5-8cf2-42d33d58532c X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 4599F818.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:13:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin, I am sorry it is Cher's DVDs not CDs. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 01:45:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026iw2r006568 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:44:58 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l026iiDe003751 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:44:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l026iKGs052533 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:44:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026iI92007570; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:44:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l026iESH007540 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:44:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA24681 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:31:09 -0600 Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 01:31:09 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anyone remember this dress? In-Reply-To: <008401c72e34$b08b1330$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b5decce4-b9fc-40f9-b030-7689ea6237bf X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 4599FF5C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:44:57 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Tue, 2 Jan 2007, Penny Ladnier wrote: > Robin, is the dress you are describing on this page? > http://www.everythingcher.com/pages/gal1970.htm Click on the thumbnail > to the far right under the large photo... cream outfit. It has a tied > knot at her throat. No, but that's cool too ... No, the one I remember had a single piece coming straight up from the skirt, over one breast, around the back of the neck, then down to cover (just) the other breast and then end. No crossing, knots, wraparounds. It was the asymmetricality, plus the near physical impossibility of it staying in place, that made it so striking. Good luck with the remodeling. If you should happen to see that dress in a photo in one of your books someday, please drop me a note! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 02:15:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l027FUJw013030 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 02:15:30 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l027FPp0027935 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 02:15:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l027ENqx055012 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:14:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l027EIKk021549; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:14:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l027EEeP021487 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:14:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus0) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1H1dqe46vr-0005KY; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 02:14:14 -0500 Message-ID: <00a101c72e3d$93e2b720$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anyone remember this dress? Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 02:14:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3c6aed3d-7d73-4a74-93e0-4b2c2ac4e450 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459A068D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 02:15:29 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin, When I can get in the office, I will take a look. I need to move the magazines off an old book shelf to the new one... so hopefully the Cher costume will be in one of those magazines. Update...I got into the office to get the Mackie book!!! My son actually cleaned up his mess! Can't get to the magazines. :( Page 65 of the book, "Unmistakably Mackie." There is a Cher dress that might be the one you are talking about. This dress is made from one solid piece of fabric.. no seams. The photos are b&w. It looks kinda Grecian. The skirt pulls up to her right side exposing the right leg and drapes (alot) around her left leg. The skirt swoops behind her right breast with a long hair braid covering her breast. The fabric goes behind her chest and over her left shoulder and arm, and pinned at wrist, with fabric draping down to the floor from the left arm. The fabric over the left shoulder is pinned somehow to the right side of the neck. This creates a bare diagonal line across her right breast to beneath the left hip. The two photos, front and back views, show Mackie pinning the costume on Cher for a photoshoot. I believe she is supposed to be an Indian by the two long thick braids with a criss-cross ribbons also a ribbon across her forehead, and she is holding a tall shear in the other hand with the draping. This photo was before her boob job. No photo credit was given. If this is not it... let me know and I will look more. I would scan the photos but my scanner bulb blew and can't get it to the shop until this week. Hopefully the techs will be back from the holidays. If not, I will photocopy it and mail it to you. Robin, I recently purchased a copy of this book cheap on Amazon.com used books. The book had not been used before. I guess it was an overstock. I am also re-grouting a bathroom... back to grout. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 2:31 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anyone remember this dress? > > On Tue, 2 Jan 2007, Penny Ladnier wrote: > >> Robin, is the dress you are describing on this page? >> http://www.everythingcher.com/pages/gal1970.htm Click on the thumbnail >> to the far right under the large photo... cream outfit. It has a tied >> knot at her throat. > > No, but that's cool too ... No, the one I remember had a single piece > coming straight up from the skirt, over one breast, around the back of the > neck, then down to cover (just) the other breast and then end. No > crossing, knots, wraparounds. It was the asymmetricality, plus the near > physical impossibility of it staying in place, that made it so striking. > > Good luck with the remodeling. If you should happen to see that dress in a > photo in one of your books someday, please drop me a note! > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 07:31:15 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CVEUn013122 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:31:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02CV5kG010108 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:31:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02CUSjm085691 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:30:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CUKg9002358; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:30:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from eastrmmtao02.cox.net (eastrmmtao02.cox.net [68.230.240.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CUFZT002211 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:30:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vmaa2@cox.net) Received: from eastrmimpo01.cox.net ([68.1.16.119]) by eastrmmtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.03 201-2131-130-104-20060516) with ESMTP id <20070102123010.OBJC9317.eastrmmtao02.cox.net@eastrmimpo01.cox.net> for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:30:10 -0500 Received: from VMAA1 ([68.225.179.207]) by eastrmimpo01.cox.net with bizsmtp id 6CUt1W00M4UskY40000000; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 07:28:53 -0500 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:30:03 -0500 Message-ID: <000c01c72e69$ba7545c0$6501a8c0@VMAA1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Medici mystery revealed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b63d72d7-da97-4736-825c-aa23ad874634 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459A508A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 07:31:13 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Interesting new discoveries about the Medici's: http://www.guardian.co.uk/italy/story/0,,1979151,00.html ::Linda:: (sorry, no relevant costume content, just kinda interesting story) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 07:36:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CaCPj013215 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:36:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02Ca7qM012319 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:36:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02CZlvg086511 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:35:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CZjZx006206; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:35:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from centrmmtao04.cox.net (centrmmtao04.cox.net [70.168.83.80]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CZfRw006088 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:35:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vmaa2@cox.net) Received: from eastrmimpo01.cox.net ([68.1.16.119]) by centrmmtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.03 201-2131-130-104-20060516) with ESMTP id <20070102123536.BRGC5993.centrmmtao04.cox.net@eastrmimpo01.cox.net> for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:35:36 -0500 Received: from VMAA1 ([68.225.179.207]) by eastrmimpo01.cox.net with bizsmtp id 6CaK1W00V4UskY40000000; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 07:34:19 -0500 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Anyone remember this dress? Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:35:29 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01c72e6a$7cc2a2d0$6501a8c0@VMAA1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <008401c72e34$b08b1330$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Importance: Normal X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6580ee39-178d-4004-935f-01dede12ae74 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459A51B7.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 07:36:11 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi Penny~! Yup, I'm still here... just don't post very often these days. I *try* to keep up with H-cost postings but admit that sometimes when they "flush" in great batches I do have to skim over a bunch. Glad to hear you and your family are doing well. Good luck on the office, and the grout! ::Linda:: On Behalf Of Penny Ladnier Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 1:10 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anyone remember this dress? Hi Linda, Good to see you on the web again! Those are some nice Cher links you sent. Thank you! You know I didn't take Cher's wig from the Richmond concert. Besides... I went to see her in Philly. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 07:52:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CqiSX013560 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:52:44 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02CqeCk031962 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:52:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02CqFuY089328 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:52:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CqD2h017790; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:52:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02CqAZt017753 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:52:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m252.in-tch.com [216.166.191.252]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l02CdDM10863 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 05:39:13 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 06:00:48 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 78567d44-1d6f-4961-8380-611d8e765153 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459A5598.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 07:52:43 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous boo-boo, right there. Also, the color of the gown sounds really wrong--is there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, January 01, 2007 10:07 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes > In the one about Joseph, Potiphar and his wife look fantastic! If I > remember....she was in a sheer coral red crinkled gauze shift to her feet that had a > turquoise knitted over dress, very open in its working, that made the whole > thing appear like a coral and turquoise geometric patterned tube that clung > tightly to the body. The naked body showed thru the bright gauze and the open > work knitted shift had bits of gold bobbles worked into it...and it ended in > tied tassels at her ankles. She wore that familiar wig, like a big hair helmet > with hammered gold leaves that dangled and shimmered all over it. The dark > cole eyes and red lips....she looked like she stepped off a Pyramid wall! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 10:41:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02FfeJs017137 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 10:41:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02FfZ58031530 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 10:41:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02FerYO008864 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 08:40:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02FeePh043970; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 08:40:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02FebEv043833 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 08:40:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from your1a4d29f243 (ool-45757a12.dyn.optonline.net [69.117.122.18]) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <0JB8002Y5ZJ5HA10@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 10:40:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 10:40:16 -0500 From: monica spence Subject: RE: [h-cost] Medici mystery revealed In-reply-to: <000c01c72e69$ba7545c0$6501a8c0@VMAA1> To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=10% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5d5940e4-5ebf-4554-bcd7-80eff575c8da X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459A7D2F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 10:41:39 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thanks! This great! Monica -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Linda Rice Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 7:30 AM To: 'Historical Costume' Subject: [h-cost] Medici mystery revealed Interesting new discoveries about the Medici's: http://www.guardian.co.uk/italy/story/0,,1979151,00.html ::Linda:: (sorry, no relevant costume content, just kinda interesting story) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 12:44:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02Hi9gJ021269 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:44:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02Hi491007993 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:44:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02Hh9f0031673 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 10:43:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02Hftal009911; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 10:42:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02HejVi004877 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 10:41:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c6d.8942821 (57365) for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:40:33 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:40:30 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 47e5ff58-175b-4f3c-8483-72fbe22aa595 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459A99E4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 12:44:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/2/2007 7:52:42 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, mooncat@in-tch.com writes: Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous boo-boo, right there. ************************ Well it may have been crocheted...or just knotted in some way....but you get the idea. I'm remembering, or trying to, something from looooong ago. ***************************** Also, the color of the gown sounds really wrong--is there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? ********************** Good question. But in this case, I don't care. This was TV... a movie, not a museum piece. And she still looked great and totally convincing. It's Potiphar's wife y'know. She doesn't even have a name as far as I know. And he was sexy and seductive, as per her theatrical purpose. It was beautiful! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 13:38:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02IcQnd022673 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:38:26 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02IcLFZ009786 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:38:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02IbJDH041550 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 11:37:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02IZvTc082336; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 11:37:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.192.83]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02IZFkB081431 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 11:35:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <20070102183501m1300ipgcve>; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 18:35:02 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: <83DD12DE-A86F-4880-8E63-C55F009258F3@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:35:00 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 57184c1e-529b-4186-b17b-d7b9a951e8c7 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459AA69D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 13:38:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Isn't Potiphar's wife traditionally believed to have been named Zuleika? Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 2, 2007, at 12:40 PM, AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 1/2/2007 7:52:42 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > mooncat@in-tch.com writes: > > Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a > humongous > boo-boo, right there. > > ************************ > > Well it may have been crocheted...or just knotted in some > way....but you get > the idea. I'm remembering, or trying to, something from looooong ago. > > ***************************** > > Also, the color of the gown sounds really wrong--is > there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? > > > ********************** > > > Good question. But in this case, I don't care. This was TV... a > movie, not a > museum piece. And she still looked great and totally convincing. It's > Potiphar's wife y'know. She doesn't even have a name as far as I > know. And he was > sexy and seductive, as per her theatrical purpose. It was beautiful! > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 14:19:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02JJHDu023975 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:19:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02JJC2V022267 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:19:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02JITHC048978 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:18:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02JIBbv031642; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:18:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com (nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02JHbk7030836 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:18:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.76.63] Received: from [192.168.1.100] (adsl-69-107-76-63.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.76.63]) by nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com (8.13.8 out.dk.spool/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02JH0BP021980 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:17:01 -0600 Message-ID: <459AB017.7040101@frys.com> Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 11:18:47 -0800 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7b8ba865-a309-4aa9-8a1b-82408c17827f X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459AB030.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 14:19:16 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous > boo-boo, right there. The Coptic people did a thing that looked a lot like knitting. Is this movie example something so far off? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 14:41:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02JftqX024612 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:41:55 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02JfpaH022228 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:41:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02JfDBa052244 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:41:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02Jf71a055099; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:41:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02JbHJ1051107 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:38:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.19218373; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:36:46 0000 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id l02JakR29576.; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:36:46 GMT Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:36:46 +0000 Message-Id: <459AB44102000014000C80C7@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:36:33 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: References: <200701021906.l02J1XoU013105@net.indra.com> In-Reply-To: <200701021906.l02J1XoU013105@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l02JbHJ1051107 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Green Valley X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d77b8334-8dae-4a71-bf46-2e88fefe6aca X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459AB57F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 14:41:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Before Christmas the BBC showed a film about preparing a Tudor feast, involving some of the same people as were in the "Green Valley" project. It was filmed at Haddon Hall here in Derbyshire, obviously in the summer although it was billed as a Christmas programme. It's a wonderful house, preserved but not lived in for centuries and so virtually unchanged. I've often thought I'd love to go there in costume. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 15:05:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02K5j8I025323 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:05:45 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02K5cI3004949 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:05:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02K4tJb055249 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:04:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02K3rvD078831; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:04:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52114.mail.yahoo.com (web52114.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.117]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l02K3640077943 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:03:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Received: (qmail 30241 invoked by uid 60001); 2 Jan 2007 20:03:01 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Ej25Ip8K4MIeTn2QkfPq5/K394n818Jl89mg0yIff3iIl9r/IvyyepOZDmepUDWJyG5YI0W8tdUuHhfASNlPQ1MkNwiXwKGjRocbae69h0ea6tRKHo1BYqatyk7qKxAJCzl2taPdzqRCIt5gZ7Di5BZd+PnZ2FgZcdfp/WtHPag= ; Message-ID: <20070102200301.30239.qmail@web52114.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [74.114.43.209] by web52114.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 12:03:01 PST Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:03:01 -0800 (PST) From: Kathy Page To: Historical Costume List MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Christmas Gift Exchange X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 927bca94-bffe-40d3-bd4d-401139603522 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459ABB12.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 15:05:44 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l02K5j8I025323 Status: RO Ha! Finally! my gift arrived! Apparently the description on the declaration wasn't convincing enough.... customs felt the need to open the package, so it was hung up at Canada Border Services Agency this whole time. Kelly Dorman sent me a beaded hat pin - it's just lovely! I had started my costuming days in the Victorian and Edwardian era, so I have a wonderful HUGE Victorian picture hat this will be perfect with! It's just the right colours for it too! Just in time to be photographed with my entire collection end of this week. I'm finally getting around to making a real portfolio. Very worth the wait. :-D Thank you! Kathy Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert (Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. It’s never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 15:07:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02K7hbQ025369 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:07:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02K7cXa007184 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:07:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02K7D0K055498 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:07:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02K645j081013; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:06:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02K4xv3079919 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 13:05:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 25E4638679 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:04:59 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:04:59 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 64d3aec0-d002-489f-a4ab-7828aa7b11fb X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459ABB8A.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 15:07:42 -0500 (EST) Status: RO The Coptic's had a form of needle knitting and to my understanding a form of macramé' was known in Egypt. They also knew how to dye their fabrics. This is a start. http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/fabrics.htm http://africanhistory.about.com/od/hieroglyphs/a/ColorTech.htm What makes you think that they were so primitive as to not know how to dye fabrics? De -----Original Message----- Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous boo-boo, right there. Also, the color of the gown sounds really wrong--is there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? --Sue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 2 16:13:11 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02LCxXf026760 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 16:13:04 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l02LCsOq013663 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 16:12:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02LBoJe064903 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:11:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02LArdq050058; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:11:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com (nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.44]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02LA0aB049105 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 14:10:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.76.63] Received: from [192.168.1.100] (adsl-69-107-76-63.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.76.63]) by nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com (8.13.8 out.dk.spool/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l02L9HjG017073 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:09:18 -0600 Message-ID: <459ACA6F.1060005@frys.com> Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 13:11:11 -0800 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=15% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c748cf67-35bc-41dc-a068-12d4a7de71c4 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459ACAD7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 02 Jan 2007 16:12:58 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > The Coptic's had a form of needle knitting and to my understanding a form of > macramé' was known in Egypt. It's called naalbinding, and is almost identical to knitting except that it's done with a threaded needle. The thread follows almost the same path as it does in knitting, except that the worker has to thread a new needle every once in a while. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:16:42 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EGcmS015294 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:16:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EGXZo004534 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:16:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EFwRJ002391 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:15:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EFgRC015795; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:15:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.189]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id kBCFFxlZ006085 for ; Tue, 12 Dec 2006 08:16:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wildthangstreasures@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 87829 invoked by uid 60001); 12 Dec 2006 15:15:49 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=3y9nWArQgtz+zZMi1joRhtDBDesQhuR7SvuOsJn5xbp86CJCYnbCamBh0tqHkmSUJEd9ZmIOPZWiMME65NWz9/xgq6mghTRQU6FN/4+jU2sGJ5hh2YceM+ARqfxfQNxI453McJWHR7+N9KOf24/hlwC1BGlkvnvqAfE24PmxhBM=; X-YMail-OSG: 6ahvEW8VM1mVXbMzSSOI7KhJgdigtIxF3.nEl5K9h8IFAKAKW06IG_boXaLBUCn_AvOkmVvrUPyNAOvwKXvZ3AwzAfSkT0YbRU4V8sYqo_DibL8MSwhZB542mAw2v_FDobLoDHrM1B2UXhw- Received: from [70.187.40.219] by web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 12 Dec 2006 07:15:49 PST Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2006 07:15:49 -0800 (PST) From: "Voncile W. Dudley" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <005701c71d34$86079fe0$8443a150@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <882075.86486.qm@web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=20% X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:13:18 -0700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-UUID: 72a9241b-04c6-48a4-9ab2-c5c2e7035a9e X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BBAC1.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:16:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm late checking my email. I would love to have any books that needs a good home especially garments from the 15th century up. Lady Von Hope I am not to late! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 11:18 PM Subject: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin > In the process of (finally) unpacking my books, I've been finding things > that could use a home other than mine. I have a Metropolitan Museum of > Art Bulletin from back in the days when they sent members these glossy > books every quarter. It's from the costume collection and contains large, > high-quality pictures of garments from 1695 through the early 1950's, > including microphotographs of some of the embroidered detail of the > garments. It's nice to look at, but way past anything I'm really > interested in. > So... I will scan and send photos of anything that someone fancies, and > the whole thing can belong to the first person who asks for it. (You have > two weeks to ask for the pictures, then I'll mail it.) The highlights: > > - Complete embroidered woman's dress from 1695 > - Four men's 18th c embroidered coats, one uncut, one with original > embroidery cartoon, one with pants and vest > - Men's banyans > - Assorted women's 18c dresses, one with panniers, most sack-backed, all > embroidered or hand-painted, 1740's - 1795 > - Assorted women's 19c outfits, day dresses, evening wear, several from > each decade > - Assorted women's 20c outfits, evening wear, suits, etc, up to the 50's > > -Helen/Aidan > > > - > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lady Von http://www.wildthangstreasures.com --------------------------------- Check out the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:17:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EHI3X015310 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:17:18 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EHEDC006606 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:17:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EG6R1002449 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:16:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EG20k016036; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:16:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep32.mail.dk (fep32.mail.dk [80.160.76.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02GB0m4073564 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 09:11:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep43.mail.dk ([195.41.46.226]) by fep32.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070102161055.WSII14357.fep32.mail.dk@fep43.mail.dk> for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 17:10:55 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.164.110.27]) by fep43.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070102161055.IUCB26664.fep43.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 17:10:55 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c72e88$a3e45a70$1b6ea450@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 17:11:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep43.mail.dk from [80.164.110.27] at Tue, 2 Jan 2007 17:10:53 +0100 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 2007 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-UUID: 37ce2fe7-a36e-44d9-b62e-8adee2511b50 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459BBAEA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:17:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO When thinking realistic, what do you think you will finish of historical costumes in 2007? Had it not ben for my insanity with embroidering every costume i make, i would probably finish much more. But this year i hope to finish the anglaise dress, the aurora red francaise dress, and maybe my green embroidered jacket wich is on my embroidery frame. Its only half done for the left side, but considering that i have finished all the embroidery for the anglaise dress and that the aurora red francaise only have pleating for decoration, i might be right that i wil finnish the green jacket. I already finished the yell ow waistcoat for it. Its not that i am in lack of inspiration, i have plenty of taffetas to make new costumes for myself. Also the most funny of it all is my insanity i have become with 18th century wigs. I just asked a swedish friend to make me a wig like Mr. Cossway in Jefferson in Paris, you know the funny dandy type. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:18:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EI6kU015343 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:18:06 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EI1N8019798 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:18:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EHZ4D002681 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:17:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EHWHE017354; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:17:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.wightman.on.ca (server01.clifford.wightman.ca [216.110.227.141]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id kBEInfsA070514 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 14 Dec 2006 11:49:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix, from userid 99) id 985F8D42C4; Thu, 14 Dec 2006 13:49:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from MAIN (dsl-v45-216-110-230-37.wightman.ca [216.110.230.37]) by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 752CAD4191; Thu, 14 Dec 2006 13:47:28 -0500 (EST) From: "Five Rivers Chapmanry" To: Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2006 13:47:31 -0500 Organization: Five Rivers Message-ID: <002b01c71fb0$9b737a10$6400a8c0@MAIN> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on server01.clifford X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-99.8 required=5.0 tests=HTML_FONT_BIG=0.232, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001,USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100 autolearn=disabled version=3.0.1 X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:11:23 -0700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Five Rivers Blog X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-UUID: 0ae992e8-288b-4360-8829-cb44aec57300 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459BBB19.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:18:05 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l03EI6kU015343 Status: RO As part of our new website, we now have an interactive blog available, where the monthly newsletter, surveys, and general comments will, and can, be posted. Come and visit. Let us know what you're thinking. Leave comments about our most recent survey. And we still have a modest number of sewing patterns and re-enactor supplies available, all at 60% discount! Regards, Lorina Stephens Five Rivers Chapmanry purveyors of historical sewing patterns, quality hand-crafted cooperage, re-enactor and embroidery supplies, and more. 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:18:57 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EIv0s015373 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:18:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EIrPG007085 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:18:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EIWQZ002849 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:18:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EIUP4018321; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:18:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d21.mx.aol.com (imo-d21.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02MoB71051679 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:50:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.be2.9b499aa (14467) for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 17:50:00 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 17:49:58 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5751589d-1bfa-4699-95e2-2abe58fb4499 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BBB4D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:18:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/2/2007 3:09:10 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, otsisto@socket.net writes: What makes you think that they were so primitive as to not know how to dye fabrics? ******************* I don't think that is what the poster meant. I think it was a reference to all the white linen we've found in tombs. White certainly was prevalent. Considering the climate, I can see why. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:21:38 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03ELcbE015445 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:21:38 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03ELX6G021398 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:21:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EKAF9003199 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:20:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EK5sV019963; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:20:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l034WvQc021478 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 21:32:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from heather.jones@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=L16ZHRIi333HhaLhVnCDc0MaFYPQizLw8yoDEqiwMjQ3vjIdfwG5HVDj3wiORMyk; h=Received:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:X-Priority:Content-Type:Message-Id:Content-Transfer-Encoding:From:Subject:Date:To:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.167.204.231] (helo=[10.0.1.2]) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H1xo8-0000Ny-Rg for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 23:32:57 -0500 In-Reply-To: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 20:34:08 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-ELNK-Trace: c920284270743d76aa459df8244ac33774bf435c0eb9d4780269eac70dddefe88d3271afc24d65077486c6becc8a208c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.167.204.231 X-DCC-wuwien-Metrics: net.indra.com 1290; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a66df5f1-e58d-4c08-bae0-948fe742f46d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459BBBEE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:21:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 2, 2007, at 5:00 AM, Sue Clemenger wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Monday, January 01, 2007 10:07 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes > > >> In the one about Joseph, Potiphar and his wife look fantastic! If I >> remember....she was in a sheer coral red crinkled gauze shift to >> her feet > that had a >> turquoise knitted over dress, very open in its working, that made >> the > whole >> thing appear like a coral and turquoise geometric patterned tube >> that > clung >> tightly to the body. The naked body showed thru the bright gauze >> and the > open >> work knitted shift had bits of gold bobbles worked into it...and >> it ended > in >> tied tassels at her ankles. She wore that familiar wig, like a >> big hair > helmet >> with hammered gold leaves that dangled and shimmered all over it. >> The > dark >> cole eyes and red lips....she looked like she stepped off a Pyramid > wall! > Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous > boo-boo, right there. Also, the color of the gown sounds really > wrong--is > there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? > --Sue > From the description, it sounds like it might have been inspired by a surviving Egyptian "bead net" dress -- a very open network made of threaded beads. The one I'm thinking of is basically a tubular sheath with shoulder straps and at the bottom hem it has a "fringe" of dangling flower-shaped beads. _Might_ -- I'd have to see the original to know if the suspicion holds up. There's a rather dark photograph of the item I'm thinking of about halfway down the page at: http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html Heather _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:21:46 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03ELkhX015452 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:21:46 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03ELfL8008613 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:21:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EJTJL003050 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:19:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EJOhJ019206; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:19:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l032TTY3038142 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:29:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m217.in-tch.com [216.166.191.217]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l032GYM05145 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:16:35 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <001401c72ee0$350c50a0$d9bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:38:07 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ab06a3a8-806a-4596-9ab6-24794254347c X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459BBBF5.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:21:45 -0500 (EST) Status: RO See, for me, it wouldn't have been convincing at all, given the (to me) obvious visual clues. We'll all pick up on different things, depending on our levels of interest/expertise, etc. I'm betting that most people in the intended audience of the movies discussed earlier in the thread would have the same reaction to peasants in burlap as you do to an Egyptian queen wearing clothing centuries, if not actual millenia, out of date. --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 10:40 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes > > In a message dated 1/2/2007 7:52:42 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > mooncat@in-tch.com writes: > > Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous > boo-boo, right there. > > ************************ > > Well it may have been crocheted...or just knotted in some way....but you get > the idea. I'm remembering, or trying to, something from looooong ago. > > ***************************** > > Also, the color of the gown sounds really wrong--is > there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? > > > ********************** > > > Good question. But in this case, I don't care. This was TV... a movie, not a > museum piece. And she still looked great and totally convincing. It's > Potiphar's wife y'know. She doesn't even have a name as far as I know. And he was > sexy and seductive, as per her theatrical purpose. It was beautiful! > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:22:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EMqV5015495 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:22:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EMl30011338 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:22:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03ELWlF003509 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:21:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03ELSP9021336; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:21:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02JfSMm055611 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 12:42:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.19218744; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:41:07 0000 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id l02Jf6R29943.; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:41:06 GMT Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:41:06 +0000 Message-Id: <459AB54302000014000C80CB@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:40:51 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: References: <200701021906.l02J1XoU013105@net.indra.com> In-Reply-To: <200701021906.l02J1XoU013105@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l02JfSMm055611 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Another film costume rant X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 86559f18-4d16-4db0-b47e-286b056de537 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BBC37.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:22:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Two programmes on British TV over Christmas showed Victorian brides in sleeveless dresses. One was the film of "Nicholas Nickleby", the other a version of "Dracula". Dammit, you wear DAY clothes to a wedding! (or used to.) Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:24:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EOP8F015557 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:24:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EOLvl030083 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:24:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03ENv7Q004266 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:23:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03ENt2R024233; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:23:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from victory.concentric.com (victory.concentric.com [207.155.253.154]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l030lcGi063081 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 17:47:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) Received: (www@localhost) by victory.concentric.com id TAA04870; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:47:34 -0500 (EST) [ConcentricHost SMTP Relay 1.17] Message-ID: <200701030047.TAA04870@victory.concentric.com> Received: from 209.78.214.253 (as jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) by register.concentric.com (207.155.252.195) with Concentric Web Mail; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 16:47:34 -0800 (PST) From: Julie To: Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 16:47:34 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <200701021902.l02J1XoT013105@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l030lcGi063081 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] name of a hat? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 51c81ac8-e26d-47c7-832f-d40c92dbc673 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BBC95.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:24:24 -0500 (EST) Status: RO What is the correct name of the medieval hat commonly referred to as the coffee filter hat? It looks like a sailor's hat without any crown and usually involves a chin strap and a hair net. I finished one over the holidays. Looks pretty good but I don't know what to call it so I can turn it in as an arts project Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:25:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EPqNA015597 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:25:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EPdat014540 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:25:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EPJ2s004542 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:25:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EOkYT025156; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:24:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web51303.mail.yahoo.com (web51303.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.38.169]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0311GK6072541 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 18:01:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from elvestoorder@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 95010 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Jan 2007 01:01:11 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=ZJW/E4Cxed+ZGS7BI5inPGEL0fTOkH1mq1GpvxVvAf6X2BUcddHCWNENGaMTm45BqaRhHLggmOvcw+i2SEc+o3uk45L8WNOqeDXtI7DNT3DpkjFakqPCJPdi+VSeXrYKDDOv++Og0lRERKQVgFJpZpfu1WNMhE6SpW7l+mSKpgM=; X-YMail-OSG: 3pmtny4VM1ngVaHDFkR2sGCumaAJiOHv6lxK2XqIlygwwVH2h0T2M1d.1lmPk7ceX58Jvw5lgOC4GAfl0WKYWXGNCVU4e3VGBbfc9_TUsO.NXH1myZHvP6HG8CtBWl0qY0Q8tWbZqFB5PJc- Received: from [69.177.224.102] by web51303.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 17:01:10 PST Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 17:01:10 -0800 (PST) From: Ann Catelli Subject: Egypt Re: [h-cost] movie costumes To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <459ACA6F.1060005@frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <73419.94577.qm@web51303.mail.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2ce4fff1-f1e1-4c9d-b460-14291ffe5dac X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BBCE3.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:25:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Nalbinding, the sort that looks like crossed-loop knitting, can be told from knitting by the way it increases and decreases. Dorothy Burnham wrote an excellent article where she analyzed 'ancient Egyptian knitting' and traced the thread path to prove all extant pieces she analyzed to be nalbinding. It was used for small pieces where shaping is very useful, such as socks, and other small pieces, which might be purses or other little items. The netted dresses from Egypt were, to my limited knowledge, made of strung beads, often faiance (man, can't spell that word, sort of glass that didn't get melted quite all the way) or what we'd now term semi-precious stone, and some gold mixed in. The Egyptians, by all accounts, really prized their beautiful white linen, which bleaches so beautifully. They wished, by and large, their costumes' color to come from the jewelry. Ann in CT --- Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > It's called naalbinding, and is almost identical to > knitting except that > it's done with a threaded needle. The thread > follows almost the same > path as it does in knitting, except that the worker > has to thread a new > needle every once in a while. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:26:35 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EQZNu015621 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:26:35 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EQU9B015526 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:26:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EQE05004695 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:26:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EPchl025909; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:25:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l032XBJJ040674 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:33:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m217.in-tch.com [216.166.191.217]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l032KHM05949 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:20:17 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <001d01c72ee0$b9b446a0$d9bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <459AB017.7040101@frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:41:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 268961d5-858c-45a9-9fdb-c624445fe763 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BBD16.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:26:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO You mean nalbinding? I don't believe there's any evidence of it being used for larger items of clothing, such as dresses. I know of socks, and a hat. No dresses. --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 12:18 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes > > Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous > > boo-boo, right there. > > The Coptic people did a thing that looked a lot like knitting. Is this > movie example something so far off? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:29:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03ETGl1015709 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:29:16 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03ETBIg018520 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:29:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03ESox5005105 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:28:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03ESglM028339; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:28:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com (wx-out-0506.google.com [66.249.82.225]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l033nGwk093610 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 20:49:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from athurman@gmail.com) Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id t11so7311941wxc for ; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:49:16 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=RU+ZAjmESA9gyrRHk8C1UH+ypabVimXEGRr/mbzZYYiqcvH/KytjLT5WNK2dWsF7xF7zKLd0HcZ8cj+GRVGCHaf/I3XkwtI+rm9bvGd+HKVS9PbHurb/jt+ZpyPs1i2hIUJQu4fgbsYm8Nxy0pnHf6BV8XUpUo5YEWj0hqQuqiI= Received: by 10.70.91.11 with SMTP id o11mr38069796wxb.1167796156541; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:49:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.70.77.1 with HTTP; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:49:16 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7d21ac190701021949i7fe462cfx6e3af15c19c6f05f@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 22:49:16 -0500 From: "A. Thurman" To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l033nGwk093610 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Spanish costume/Alcega X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 557e474d-0244-4b7e-9a72-2c812ddceca5 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BBDB7.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:29:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 14:46:54 +1300 > From: "michaela" > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Spanish costume/Alcega > To: "Historical Costume" > Message-ID: <005b01c72d46$b7a1e6b0$0301010a@michaela> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > There are very definitely two different garments and they almost certainly > serve a different purpose, I just have yet to work out what they are! > > The Vasquina occasionally come with a bodice, but the diagram very clearly > states when this is the case (Vasquina y cuerpo baxo) also remember the term > kirtle means different things at different times and probably our use of the > word to describe a bodiced garment for many periods isn't quite correct. > Also remember when you kirtle your skirts it means to bunch it up at the > hip;) I think you're right about "kirtle" meaning different things at different times, looking at Alcega I'd say that extends to different places as well. The only big difference I can notice at first glance is that what the translator is calling a "skirt" has curved seams, but a "kirtle" has straight seams. > > The Vasquina are all cut as gored skirts you will notice, so the waist will > be pleated/gathered. The fact that some come with a body... I'm not sure. > Perhaps they were worn with the doublet type bodices you can see at the > beginning of the diagrams (f 14.) Perhaps they were worn over the Verdugados > as it is constructed in a similar manner. Or were a replacement for the > Verdugados Actually, I did a bit of research and reading today and what I've found suggests that the skirts were shaped by gores, NOT pleated or gathered. There's a short photographic blurb in "Moda a Firenze" about Spanish influences, and some speculative layouts by an author called Carmen Bernis derived from Alcega in a book called "Alonso Sánchez Coello y el retrato en la corte de Felipe II". I have yet to run the latter through Google translator or the like (I don't speak/read Spanish) so it may be awhile before I figure out how good a source this is, though. > > The Faldellin are all half circle in shape with a seam across the front. I > personally wonder if these are mimicked by "tucks" in the fronts of court > dress we see. Perhaps the style started as a practical cutting issue with > these half circle skirts and then were used as decoration. I know I've seen > similar fossilisation of features in ceremonial dress but I cna't think of > many off the top of my head. Panniers under high waisted gowns is one that > springs to mind. > Maybe these were worn between vasquina and gowns to help acheive that cone > shape of he skirt. Maybe these were worn with the doublet type bodice at the > start of the book. I have not looked at the faldellin yet - I take from your description that these are another variant of skirt? > > I am going to look closer in the various Trachtenbuchen of the time to see > if there is any representation of dress other than what we see in portraits > of the time that may shed a light. They certainly helped me with my Koeln > dress research. If you find anything, would you be willing to share? I offer what little I have in exchange (from the looks of your site, you're WAY ahead of me!) > > Michaela de Bruce > http://sayaespanola.glittersweet.com > http://costumes.glittersweet.com Allison T. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 09:37:22 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EbM8j015931 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:37:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03EbH1j002948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:37:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03Ea8GB006458 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:36:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EZU6D035060; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:35:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m20.mx.aol.com (imo-m20.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EYmYv034522 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:35:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-m20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c78.98523fb (40520) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:34:31 -0500 (EST) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:34:29 EST Subject: [h-cost] name of a hat? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5017 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e6e55637-199f-475b-8e5b-fd74deb81ffb X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BBF9D.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:37:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO barbette and fillet? In a message dated 03/01/2007 14:24:07 GMT Standard Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: Message: 13 Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 16:47:34 -0800 (PST) From: Julie Subject: [h-cost] name of a hat? To: Message-ID: <200701030047.TAA04870@victory.concentric.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" What is the correct name of the medieval hat commonly referred to as the coffee filter hat? It looks like a sailor's hat without any crown and usually involves a chin strap and a hair net. I finished one over the holidays. Looks pretty good but I don't know what to call it so I can turn it in as an arts project Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:14:06 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FE6Na016923 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:14:06 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FE1QU022377 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:14:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03FDT9Y010565 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:13:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FDQwG066191; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:13:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FDMER066107 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:13:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m94.in-tch.com [216.166.191.94]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l03F0QM23654 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:00:26 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <004e01c72f4a$eb5d63c0$5ebfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701030047.TAA04870@victory.concentric.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] name of a hat? Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:22:01 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 245ce5cd-ffd4-4f44-a40c-eb6385866da6 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BC839.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:14:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dunno....I've always heard them referred to in informal terms--coffee filter hat, pie-crust hat, etc., depending on the particular style. You might look at the hat section in Cynthia Virtue's website--I recall seeing hat-ish stuff there in the past. --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 5:47 PM Subject: [h-cost] name of a hat? > What is the correct name of the medieval hat commonly referred to as the coffee filter hat? It looks like a sailor's hat without any crown and usually involves a chin strap and a hair net. > > I finished one over the holidays. Looks pretty good but I don't know what to call it so I can turn it in as an arts project > > Julie > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:16:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FGTUN016992 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:16:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FGOI3003244 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:16:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03FG1hs010951 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:16:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FFvwp068380; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:15:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FFqQ9068295 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:15:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m94.in-tch.com [216.166.191.94]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l03F2vM24335 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:02:58 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <005301c72f4b$45750ca0$5ebfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:24:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e1b2b0be-b32e-4b69-828a-884f6e0ee38d X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459BC8C8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:16:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A beaded/netted overgown? How cool is that? ;o) I hadn't heard of that intriguing garment, so thanks to you and the other poster who mentioned it. I can see now why the designers of AlbertCat's movie might have tried to imitate it. --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Heather Rose Jones" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes > > On Jan 2, 2007, at 5:00 AM, Sue Clemenger wrote: > > > Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous > > boo-boo, right there. Also, the color of the gown sounds really > > wrong--is > > there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? > > --Sue > > > > From the description, it sounds like it might have been inspired by > a surviving Egyptian "bead net" dress -- a very open network made of > threaded beads. The one I'm thinking of is basically a tubular > sheath with shoulder straps and at the bottom hem it has a "fringe" > of dangling flower-shaped beads. _Might_ -- I'd have to see the > original to know if the suspicion holds up. There's a rather dark > photograph of the item I'm thinking of about halfway down the page at: > > http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html > > Heather _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:16:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FGdLu016999 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:16:39 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FGYib012904 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:16:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03FGH8I011050 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:16:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FGF8c068653; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:16:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc13.comcast.net (alnrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.225.93]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FGAnW068500 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:16:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [192.168.1.3] (c-71-196-218-99.hsd1.co.comcast.net[71.196.218.99]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc13) with SMTP id <20070103151605b1300q4h8je>; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:16:05 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:16:04 -0700 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0c4ef76c-8eab-4206-8798-ac63770f66c5 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459BC8D2.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:16:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO When did this evidence about Egyptian beaded net dresses surface? I never heard of it before nor is it in my old costume history books. It's been decades since I studied the history of costume, but since I'm going to be teaching it this January I'd really like to keep up on recent developments. Sylrog On Jan 2, 2007, at 9:34 PM, Heather Rose Jones wrote: > > From the description, it sounds like it might have been inspired by a > surviving Egyptian "bead net" dress -- a very open network made of > threaded beads. The one I'm thinking of is basically a tubular sheath > with shoulder straps and at the bottom hem it has a "fringe" of > dangling flower-shaped beads. _Might_ -- I'd have to see the original > to know if the suspicion holds up. There's a rather dark photograph > of the item I'm thinking of about halfway down the page at: > > http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html > > Heather > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:22:31 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FMVB3017111 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:22:31 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FMQd9006217 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:22:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03FLkKq011806 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:21:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FLhAL073508; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:21:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FLdat073453 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:21:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m94.in-tch.com [216.166.191.94]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l03F8iM25810 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:08:45 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <005f01c72f4c$14447840$5ebfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:30:19 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] 1870s buttons.... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 37e2f77b-e55b-48f9-ab16-2b9187077e18 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459BCA32.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:22:30 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I have a question for you 19th century types, born out of completely idle curiosity. This Christmas, I was given a lovely bracelet comprising different buttons from the 1870s. They are all about 1/2 inch in diameter, and have surprisingly complex and lovely designs in them. They are made of cut steel and brass, with occasional tiny flecks of what looks like marcasite, and are fairly hefty in weight for their size (because of the metal, I'm guessing). What on earth would something like that have been used on? The garment fabric would have to be pretty substantial to not deform or tear from the weight.... --Sue in Montana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:33:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FXQhP021878 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:33:26 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FXLH9001116 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:33:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03FWdrR012858 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:32:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FVb4L082449; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:32:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l03FVWxH082272 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:31:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by m08.lax.untd.com with SMTP id AABC3ZVBHABPP9MA for (sender ); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:30:47 -0800 (PST) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: QHEuP/IhRKXTJ0EJwxwhgmjvUQY99meLjJtwqt7CmE4= Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id MA6YCQWX; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 07:29:55 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:11:55 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] name of a hat? Message-ID: <20070103.072904.2252.1.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-5,7-21 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-ContentStamp: 7:3:261686083 X-MAIL-INFO: 0231893d89e10970e1091db0091d5921e9610df90c4061f569140c20f534edb1f5b4951131b93154911dc10931b0 X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 127.0.0.1|localhost|m08.lax.untd.com|cley@juno.com X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7c0bab22-f11d-4f6f-bdc5-2aab7a04e411 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BCCC1.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:33:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Having been up for 5 minutes, my brain isn't working yet, but you might google 'Cynthia Virtue website'--she has a bunch of info on them and other period hats, incl. how to make them. Arlys On Tue, 02 Jan 2007 16:47:34 -0800 (PST) Julie writes: > What is the correct name of the medieval hat commonly referred to as > the coffee filter hat? It looks like a sailor's hat without any > crown and usually involves a chin strap and a hair net. > > I finished one over the holidays. Looks pretty good but I don't > know what to call it so I can turn it in as an arts project > > Julie > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:39:15 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FdFsO022018 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:39:15 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FdA2k004433 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:39:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03Fbj72013482 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:37:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FaJMj086831; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:37:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from S4.cableone.net (s4.cableone.net [24.116.0.230]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FZ4Qi085552 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:35:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kbaird@cableone.net) Received: from anteckim (unverified [72.24.105.253]) by S4.cableone.net (CableOne SMTP Service S4) with ESMTP id 88761477 for ; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 08:34:58 -0700 From: "Kim Baird" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] 1870s buttons.... Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:35:03 -0600 Message-ID: <009901c72f4c$bd7722f0$6401a8c0@anteckim> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <005f01c72f4c$14447840$5ebfa6d8@pavilion> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Thread-Index: AccvS0T/C5ZiuupcSsOgkslIlRuYPwAASyjQ X-IP-stats: Incoming Last 3, First 145, in=184, out=0, spam=0 X-External-IP: 72.24.105.253 X-Abuse-Info: Send abuse complaints to abuse@cableone.net X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d24f23b4-7a63-4555-ae70-3f1e3550ac13 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BCE1E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:39:14 -0500 (EST) Status: RO These sound like typical bodice buttons for a woman's dress. And there wold have been a lot of them used--think of a row of small buttons all down the front. A Victorian bodice was a substantial garment, with at least 2 layers of fabric, plus boning. Wish I had the button jar your bracelet came from! Kim in ND -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Sue Clemenger Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 9:30 AM To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Subject: [h-cost] 1870s buttons.... I have a question for you 19th century types, born out of completely idle curiosity. This Christmas, I was given a lovely bracelet comprising different buttons from the 1870s. They are all about 1/2 inch in diameter, and have surprisingly complex and lovely designs in them. They are made of cut steel and brass, with occasional tiny flecks of what looks like marcasite, and are fairly hefty in weight for their size (because of the metal, I'm guessing). What on earth would something like that have been used on? The garment fabric would have to be pretty substantial to not deform or tear from the weight.... --Sue in Montana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:42:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FgJPT022105 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:42:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FgCSm003947 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:42:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03Ffq3E014159 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:41:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FfiPE092587; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:41:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mail.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FfJe7092067 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:41:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.3b0.ad3fa5c (30740) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:41:06 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <3b0.ad3fa5c.32cd288f@aol.com> Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:41:03 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3a457c2b-0ea7-4dda-95c4-645e34fddc73 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BCED4.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:42:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/3/2007 9:17:40 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, wildthangstreasures@yahoo.com writes: have a Metropolitan Museum of > Art Bulletin from back in the days when they sent members these glossy > books every quarter. It's from the costume collection and contains large, > high-quality pictures of garments from 1695 through the early 1950's, *********************** Is that the one with the beautiful Regency gown of white mull with poofs all over it worn with a huge beige bonnet...and a child in a white gown...on the cover? I have that one somewhere. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:53:00 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03Fr0md022324 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:53:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FqtgC012723 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:52:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03FqISr016271 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:52:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03Fpi4k004758; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:52:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.191]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FnnXb002651 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:50:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katybishop64@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id y38so7738031nfb for ; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 07:49:48 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=FGDuRiXI5DS1d5kn7u0s2qN9BASMaLU0t3E7j+1fAMNNd83fzLzl5Uq5O1ztGGrIFKkxA5sXc8w9NZAYwNKdBKp+RY+NK9tZn9NUpqtVyWXXOK+SAifp2p0pK2O4Tcw9HGAKriCwU68TeEidL/BPMwpWKav5mR7rnKhBbD+Hq1Y= Received: by 10.82.184.2 with SMTP id h2mr1749399buf.1167839388348; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 07:49:48 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.184.5 with HTTP; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:49:48 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3586f5070701030749x11c5ac2dle246a146ee1c37a9@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:49:48 -0500 From: "Katy Bishop" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian In-Reply-To: <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5be4382e-86d3-453c-873c-cf9c84dc4161 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BD157.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:52:59 -0500 (EST) Status: RO There is one at the MFA in Boston, it was conserved several years ago, when I worked there or just before. I might have a picture somewhere in an old bulletin. It was beautiful beads in blues mostly as I recall. Katy On 1/3/07, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > When did this evidence about Egyptian beaded net dresses surface? I > never heard of it before nor is it in my old costume history books. > It's been decades since I studied the history of costume, but since I'm > going to be teaching it this January I'd really like to keep up on > recent developments. > > Sylrog > > On Jan 2, 2007, at 9:34 PM, Heather Rose Jones wrote: > > > > From the description, it sounds like it might have been inspired by a > > surviving Egyptian "bead net" dress -- a very open network made of > > threaded beads. The one I'm thinking of is basically a tubular sheath > > with shoulder straps and at the bottom hem it has a "fringe" of > > dangling flower-shaped beads. _Might_ -- I'd have to see the original > > to know if the suspicion holds up. There's a rather dark photograph > > of the item I'm thinking of about halfway down the page at: > > > > http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html > > > > Heather > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 10:55:15 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FtFFJ022354 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:55:15 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03FtA3G022708 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:55:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03FrqgB016561 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:53:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FrHPb006557; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:53:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m27.mx.aol.com (imo-m27.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.8]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03FrCja006387 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:53:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m27.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.bf7.d1e7cb4 (30740) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:53:00 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:52:57 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7c550125-15a6-44f8-b747-536ca4f25f87 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459BD1DE.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:55:14 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/3/2007 10:16:21 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, mooncat@in-tch.com writes: A beaded/netted overgown? How cool is that? ;o) *************** I thought so. I mean it's better than Liz Taylor or Claudette Colbert [though their costumes for their Cleopatras have their own amazing qualities] Watch.... Someone will dig up this Joseph thing and the gown will actually be white with a coral and turquoise overdress! Like I said, I'm trying to remember something I saw once quite a while ago. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 11:03:54 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03G3rKs022567 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:03:53 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03G3nBj027511 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:03:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03G3Qv7017909 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:03:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03G1sHR016049; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:02:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m14.mx.aol.com (imo-m14.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03G0LCO014416 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:01:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d03.63ecf28 (30740) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:00:13 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:00:11 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1870s buttons.... To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4944b93d-e67b-469a-aab9-45e556d2ed87 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459BD3E5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 11:03:52 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/3/2007 10:22:09 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, mooncat@in-tch.com writes: What on earth would something like that have been used on? The garment fabric would have to be pretty substantial to not deform or tear from the weight.... They might go down the front of one of those boned-to-death high necked bodices. These things are quite substantial....lined, innerlined, stabilized, and boned... and not easy to deform. Often the buttons go from neck to hem of the bodice, set close together. In princess gowns of the mid 1870's, they might go to the floor. Or they could be used for outer wear...a redingote or something. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 11:31:06 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03GV2jY023220 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:02 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03GUuEJ000513 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EG7hl002458 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:16:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EG4Xd016088; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:16:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mf3k.socket.net [216.106.88.98]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l02M8RqN010562 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:08:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 1EF093C399 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 16:08:27 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 16:08:27 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <459ACA6F.1060005@frys.com> Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e62faeca-9234-4241-9798-2873c5e0bfac X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BDA40.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 11:31:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I know it's naalbinding/nalbinding but did not know what the Coptics called it so I did not want to call it naalbinding. I guess I could have said a form of needle knitting that the Scandinavians refer to as naalbinding :) De -----Original Message----- > The Coptic's had a form of needle knitting and to my understanding a form of > macramé' was known in Egypt. It's called naalbinding, and is almost identical to knitting except that it's done with a threaded needle. The thread follows almost the same path as it does in knitting, except that the worker has to thread a new needle every once in a while. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 11:31:06 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03GUtaa023212 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:02 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03GUmLH019392 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:30:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03GU175022085 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:30:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03GSX9A044384; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:29:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smapp02.siteprotect.com (smapp02.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.203]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03GRQRx043241 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:28:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smapp02.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9B9413D00 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:27:22 -0600 (CST) Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "cschmitt@genteelarts.com" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1870s buttons.... X-Origin: 65.164.18.144 Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:27:22 -0600 Message-Id: <19181.1167841642@genteelarts.com> X-Mailer: SiteMail 5.6 - 65.164.18.144 - cschmitt@genteelarts.com X-Originating-Email: cschmitt@genteelarts.com X-Originating-Ip: 65.164.18.144 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l03GRQRx043241 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6dcabebe-be31-4ca8-9c52-31c67b0bcb6c X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459BDA38.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 11:30:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In addition to other comments: I've also found these buttons on garments made of lighter weight fabrics such as silk tafffeta. In many instances, the buttons are not sewn on. The shank is inserted through a hand-sewn eyelet and the button is secured on the wrong side with a clip, a long piece of linen twill tape, or a thin strip of leather or, in two examples, a piece of string. This technique provides much more support and less strain on the bodice. Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 1-4, 2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 11:31:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03GV2ja023220 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03GUuEL000513 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03ELDGC003434 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:21:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EL864020965; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:21:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l032aool043284 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:36:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m217.in-tch.com [216.166.191.217]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l032NuM06689 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:23:56 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <002601c72ee1$3c4c4860$d9bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 19:45:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b91a258c-a064-42e7-bbcb-377447b730db X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459BDA40.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 11:31:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Did I *ever* say, or intimate that Egyptians were primitive? Huh? Wherever did you get *that* idea? I asked if there was any evidence of *linens* being dyed *at that time.* Linens are notoriously difficult to dye using natural dyes. Good grief..... --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 1:04 PM Subject: RE: [h-cost] movie costumes > The Coptic's had a form of needle knitting and to my understanding a form of > macramé' was known in Egypt. They also knew how to dye their fabrics. > This is a start. > http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/fabrics.htm > http://africanhistory.about.com/od/hieroglyphs/a/ColorTech.htm > > What makes you think that they were so primitive as to not know how to dye > fabrics? > De > > -----Original Message----- > Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a humongous > boo-boo, right there. Also, the color of the gown sounds really wrong--is > there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? > --Sue > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 11:31:27 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03GVMl3023244 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03GVIJb032421 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EI2nv002768 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:18:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EHt63017712; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:17:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.wightman.on.ca (server01.clifford.wightman.ca [216.110.227.141]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l01Lc33u090137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 14:38:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix, from userid 99) id E4C34D3FC4; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 16:38:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from MAIN (dsl-v45-216-110-230-37.wightman.ca [216.110.230.37]) by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC78CD4423; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 16:35:31 -0500 (EST) From: "Five Rivers Chapmanry" To: Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 16:35:41 -0500 Organization: Five Rivers Message-ID: <000001c72ded$208fe9f0$6400a8c0@MAIN> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on server01.clifford X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-98.2 required=5.0 tests=HTML_FONT_BIG=0.232, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001,MISSING_SUBJECT=1.57,USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100 autolearn=disabled version=3.0.1 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 19:11:23 -0700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] (no subject) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-UUID: 83fdd3c2-2d71-4d80-a040-6938e264ffb5 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BDA56.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 11:31:21 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l03GVMl3023244 Status: RO Final Clearance on Patterns and Re-enactor Supplies! We've deep discounted our remaining stock of historical sewing patterns and re-enactor supplies to 75%! At these prices you can't go wrong! Cooperage Update Gary is still working on the few remaining cooperage orders he has, and is looking forward to opening for orders, and even having a bit of stock, around mid-year. Recipes of a Dumb Housewife We now have all the testers we need for Lorina's upcoming recipe book, Recipes of a Dumb Housewife. Revisions will take place during February, and a publication date tentatively set for March or April. We'll keep you posted about cost and pre-order information! Happy New Year As always, Gary and Lorina wish you all a contented, prosperous and healthy New Year. Five Rivers Chapmanry purveyors of historical sewing patterns, quality hand-crafted cooperage, re-enactor and embroidery supplies, and more. 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 11:31:32 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03GVMl5023244 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03GVIJd032421 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:31:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03EIobW002916 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:18:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03EIlux018603; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:18:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp2.mc.surewest.net (qsmtp.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.145]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l02NOS88085871 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 16:24:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 12974 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2007 15:24:28 -0800 Received: by simscan 1.1.0 ppid: 12880, pid: 12950, t: 3.4637s scanners: regex: 1.1.0 attach: 1.1.0 clamav: 0.84/m:41/d:2382 spam: 3.0.3 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21.surewest.net) (64.30.124.102) by qsmtp2 with SMTP; 2 Jan 2007 15:24:24 -0800 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070102151642.0254a848@surewest.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 15:23:59 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: RE: [h-cost] movie costumes In-Reply-To: References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.3 (2005-04-27) on qsmtp2.surewest.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.4 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,HTML_20_30, HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_QP_LONG_LINE autolearn=no version=3.0.3 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 23e36732-78cd-4cec-a613-a282840be5ea X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BDA56.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 11:31:27 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l03GVMl5023244 Status: RO At 12:04 PM 1/2/2007, you wrote: >The Coptic's had a form of needle knitting and to my understanding a form of >macramé' was known in Egypt. They also knew how to dye their fabrics. >This is a start. >http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/fabrics.htm >http://africanhistory.about.com/od/hieroglyphs/a/ColorTech.htm > >What makes you think that they were so primitive as to not know how to dye >fabrics? >De Until the addition of wool (and possibly cotton) to the fabrics used in Egypt, linen was the fabric, and linen does not dye very easily. Where colored clothing is shown in the tomb paintings, it is obvious that they individuals portrayed are foreigners who we know from other evidence used wool (which dyes beautifully and easily). To add color to outfits, the Egyptians used netted overdresses with various sorts of beads. So a white linen dress with an netted beaded overdress would be likely. A colored linen dress is not seen in any of the tomb paintings or in the tombs where linens (including clothing) were found. Joan Jurancich joanmj@surewest.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 12:32:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03HWF5e024737 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 12:32:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03HW7sV003805 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 12:32:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03HVHPg031901 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:31:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03HUdkh011348; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:31:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from swiftsure.concentric.com (swiftsure.concentric.com [207.155.252.156]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03HTnrg010363 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:30:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) Received: (www@localhost) by swiftsure.concentric.com id MAA12329; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 12:29:47 -0500 (EST) [ConcentricHost SMTP Relay 1.17] Message-ID: <200701031729.MAA12329@swiftsure.concentric.com> Received: from 209.78.214.253 (as jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) by register.concentric.com (207.155.252.157) with Concentric Web Mail; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:29:47 -0800 (PST) From: Julie To: , Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:29:47 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <200701031551.l03FocsI003615@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l03HTnrg010363 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Name of a Hat? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9c6310d8-5ea5-43cd-8438-d954207c5f9c X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459BE898.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 12:32:14 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I got an answer from Cynthia herself on the Milliner's list: ******** Heh. I think that one is my fault, at least partially. They really do look like coffee filters, don't they? "Fillet" is one term, "toque" is good if you subscribe to the closed-top version, and I don't know what the medievals reallly called them. I've heard some folks call them a "Plantaganet cap" but I don't know the provenance of that one. Cynthia ---- wrote: > Dunno....I've always heard them referred to in informal terms--coffee filter > hat, pie-crust hat, etc., depending on the particular style. You might look > at the hat section in Cynthia Virtue's website--I recall seeing hat-ish > stuff there in the past. > --Sue > > What is the correct name of the medieval hat commonly referred to as the > coffee filter hat? It looks like a sailor's hat without any crown and > usually involves a chin strap and a hair net. > > > > I finished one over the holidays. Looks pretty good but I don't know what > to call it so I can turn it in as an arts project > > > > Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 12:35:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03HZRtW024894 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 12:35:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03HZNXw021067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 12:35:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03HX2jc032061 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:33:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03HVFOl012033; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:31:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from swiftsure.concentric.com (swiftsure.concentric.com [207.155.252.156]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03HUdos011341 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:31:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) Received: (www@localhost) by swiftsure.concentric.com id MAA12329; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 12:29:47 -0500 (EST) [ConcentricHost SMTP Relay 1.17] Message-ID: <200701031729.MAA12329@swiftsure.concentric.com> Received: from 209.78.214.253 (as jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) by register.concentric.com (207.155.252.157) with Concentric Web Mail; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:29:47 -0800 (PST) From: Julie To: , Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:29:47 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <200701031551.l03FocsI003615@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l03HUdos011341 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Name of a Hat? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a6dd07a8-1002-4106-9150-d18869f5e1d4 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459BE95B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 12:35:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I got an answer from Cynthia herself on the Milliner's list: ******** Heh. I think that one is my fault, at least partially. They really do look like coffee filters, don't they? "Fillet" is one term, "toque" is good if you subscribe to the closed-top version, and I don't know what the medievals reallly called them. I've heard some folks call them a "Plantaganet cap" but I don't know the provenance of that one. Cynthia ---- wrote: > Dunno....I've always heard them referred to in informal terms--coffee filter > hat, pie-crust hat, etc., depending on the particular style. You might look > at the hat section in Cynthia Virtue's website--I recall seeing hat-ish > stuff there in the past. > --Sue > > What is the correct name of the medieval hat commonly referred to as the > coffee filter hat? It looks like a sailor's hat without any crown and > usually involves a chin strap and a hair net. > > > > I finished one over the holidays. Looks pretty good but I don't know what > to call it so I can turn it in as an arts project > > > > Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 13:23:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03INP4I025887 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:23:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03INKra004567 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:23:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03IMaG5041046 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:22:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03IKTLg067987; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:21:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.200.169]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l03IJrkM067136 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:20:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from emeraldepona@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 34291 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Jan 2007 18:19:47 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=mH5TFkcOOMxC3GZ+CIBar1siY323CBGXEHP3noL9F9hiVaK6vgD5SZ0IYqxLGNJfPP1tvBhK+8UA9G8u5aAfGadzMQG9UA4S3PwYMEHgnxT9hysXuFoLhLOQ8NMddpPLXiJq1MBZbH/Z1xj+cslOFnbsFbnJk4G67rBLvoiBrqc=; X-YMail-OSG: yGS37GAVM1l6vd.Mtbg9t5lxoudmAeaLljYFqqv5KiDuNaKD73RNm9af5QoYpcZE4g-- Received: from [208.111.207.6] by web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 10:19:47 PST Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:19:47 -0800 (PST) From: Chris Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000f01c72e88$a3e45a70$1b6ea450@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <843871.33999.qm@web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5b73e5be-745a-47c7-b9e5-ff4944e0d439 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459BF498.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 13:23:24 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi and we want to wish you all the very, very best for the New Year! I thought of you specifically Bjarne, but I don't doubt there's enough people on this list who will appreciate these too! http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_80.htm Chris R. As for historical costumes for this year? I have two 1880's ball gowns I WILL finish :) Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: When thinking realistic, what do you think you will finish of historical costumes in 2007? Had it not ben for my insanity with embroidering every costume i make, i would probably finish much more. But this year i hope to finish the anglaise dress, the aurora red francaise dress, and maybe my green embroidered jacket wich is on my embroidery frame. Its only half done for the left side, but considering that i have finished all the embroidery for the anglaise dress and that the aurora red francaise only have pleating for decoration, i might be right that i wil finnish the green jacket. I already finished the yell ow waistcoat for it. Its not that i am in lack of inspiration, i have plenty of taffetas to make new costumes for myself. Also the most funny of it all is my insanity i have become with 18th century wigs. I just asked a swedish friend to make me a wig like Mr. Cossway in Jefferson in Paris, you know the funny dandy type. Bjarne __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 13:38:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03IciQU026164 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:38:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03IcdqR024172 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:38:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03Ibnfi043129 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:37:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03IbAxn085719; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:37:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from vms042pub.verizon.net (vms042pub.verizon.net [206.46.252.42]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03IZdZP083970 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:36:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hdpinto@verizon.net) Received: from HELENPINTO ([71.126.41.222]) by vms042.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JBA00N8XZG33NQ5@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 11:34:18 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 12:33:35 -0500 From: "Helen Pinto" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin To: "Historical Costume" Message-id: <005f01c72f5d$4d6d6f30$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <882075.86486.qm@web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2f367c15-c08d-4e5f-bd75-104e4933f434 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459BF830.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 13:38:43 -0500 (EST) Status: RO The catalogue is gone, but if you send me your mailing address, I'll send you a CD-Rom of the scans of all the pages. -Helen/Aidan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Voncile W. Dudley" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 10:15 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin > > I'm late checking my email. I would love to have any books that needs > a good home especially garments from the 15th century up. > Lady Von > Hope I am not to late! > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Helen Pinto" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 11:18 PM > Subject: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin > > >> In the process of (finally) unpacking my books, I've been finding things >> that could use a home other than mine. I have a Metropolitan Museum of >> Art Bulletin from back in the days when they sent members these glossy >> books every quarter. It's from the costume collection and contains large, >> high-quality pictures of garments from 1695 through the early 1950's, >> including microphotographs of some of the embroidered detail of the >> garments. It's nice to look at, but way past anything I'm really >> interested in. >> So... I will scan and send photos of anything that someone fancies, and >> the whole thing can belong to the first person who asks for it. (You have >> two weeks to ask for the pictures, then I'll mail it.) The highlights: >> >> - Complete embroidered woman's dress from 1695 >> - Four men's 18th c embroidered coats, one uncut, one with original >> embroidery cartoon, one with pants and vest >> - Men's banyans >> - Assorted women's 18c dresses, one with panniers, most sack-backed, all >> embroidered or hand-painted, 1740's - 1795 >> - Assorted women's 19c outfits, day dresses, evening wear, several from >> each decade >> - Assorted women's 20c outfits, evening wear, suits, etc, up to the 50's >> >> -Helen/Aidan >> >> >> - >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > Lady Von > > http://www.wildthangstreasures.com > > > > --------------------------------- > Check out the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta - Fire up a more powerful email and > get things done faster. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 15:16:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03KGUq9028447 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:16:30 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03KGPLw002371 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:16:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03KEqIY060467 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:14:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03KETLM000995; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:14:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep31.mail.dk (fep31.mail.dk [80.160.76.195]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03KCcPE098527 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:13:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep46.mail.dk ([195.41.46.229]) by fep31.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070103201232.PPWZ29032.fep31.mail.dk@fep46.mail.dk> for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:12:32 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.164.110.218]) by fep46.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070103201232.JUKU15028.fep46.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:12:32 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c72f73$85244640$da6ea450@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <843871.33999.qm@web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:12:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep46.mail.dk from [80.164.110.218] at Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:12:26 +0100 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6fa9c743-c13e-4951-bcc2-d8395a6b4f35 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C0F19.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 15:16:29 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 7:19 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject > Hi and we want to wish you all the very, very best for the New Year! > > I thought of you specifically Bjarne, but I don't doubt there's enough > people on this list who will appreciate these too! > > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_80.htm > > Chris R. > > As for historical costumes for this year? I have two 1880's ball gowns I > WILL finish :) Dear Chris, Oh many many thanks for that link. How charming they are. Dont quite understand is it an angel standing with a gun? at the small house to the left? Quite interresting to study the closeup pictures of the chenille embroidery. I have a picture of danish garthers with english text, saying "When this you see, remember me!" But i think it was very used. Thanks again, and good luck with your ball gowns. Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 16:12:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LCrpr030039 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:12:53 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03LCmbf014860 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:12:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03LBN8x069976 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:11:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LAO8P066556; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:11:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03Fv4E5011143 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 08:57:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d32.40ab477 (41811) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:56:49 -0500 (EST) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:56:46 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] name of a hat? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5017 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d7a3e136-b2f5-4f3d-8bc0-87f2a4660f0c X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459C1C50.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:12:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Just went and checked and it is a barbette and fillet - the round bit with no crown being the barbette, and the fillet being the bit that goes under the chin (although have seen them without that in pics). don't have any nfo on what the hair net part is called though. debs _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 16:16:48 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LGh9P030133 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:16:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03LGcsn024766 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:16:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03LF0uL070489 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:15:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LEPq6070920; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:14:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d20.mx.aol.com (imo-d20.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.136]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03G9kPd024117 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 09:10:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cf4.38af365 (30740) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:03:29 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:03:26 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] name of a hat? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 540aaa1d-a3ce-4567-8d57-e7a6bf2dd823 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C1D37.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:16:42 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Might it be a "toque"? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 16:22:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LMg0i030268 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:22:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03LMb9x001063 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:22:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03LLimB071572 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:21:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LLcg0079388; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:21:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net (tomts13.bellnexxia.net [209.226.175.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LKiGA078402 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:21:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from shaneandsheridan@sympatico.ca) Received: from smtp1.sympatico.ca ([209.226.175.18]) by tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.13 201-253-122-130-113-20050324) with SMTP id <20070103212043.ZLQA1773.tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:20:43 -0500 X-Mailer: Openwave WebEngine, version 2.8.6.6 (webedge20-101-174-112-20020617)" From: Sheridan To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Re: [h-cost] name of a hat? Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:20:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20070103212043.ZLQA1773.tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 32d20bdf-45ee-462d-9aff-5403f16e561b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C1E9D.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:22:41 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Oh Jeeze, eh? Thats the knit thing you wear on your head in Canada eh? (pass the back bacon...) ;0) Sheridan in 'Northern' Ontario... > > From: AlbertCat@aol.com > Date: 2007/01/03 Wed AM 11:03:26 EST > To: h-costume@indra.com > Subject: Re: [h-cost] name of a hat? > > Might it be a "toque"? > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 16:27:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LR0Gq030348 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:27:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03LQsGO009818 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:26:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03LQK3b072274 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:26:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LPmjT084356; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:26:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LNaBY081702 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:24:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:27:27 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost] name of a hat? Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:27:22 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01812D65@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: <200701030047.TAA04870@victory.concentric.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] name of a hat? Thread-Index: AccvQ2lXL5ow+uSlTbaBra5Or1FFHgAOhsUg From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Jan 2007 21:27:27.0548 (UTC) FILETIME=[F7A3E7C0:01C72F7D] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l03LNaBY081702 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 38655105-7fcf-4e06-affc-fead8d00635c X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C1F9E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:26:59 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I think the chin-strap is a barbette, the hat part is a fillet & the net, a caul. Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Julie Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 7:48 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] name of a hat? What is the correct name of the medieval hat commonly referred to as the coffee filter hat? It looks like a sailor's hat without any crown and usually involves a chin strap and a hair net. I finished one over the holidays. Looks pretty good but I don't know what to call it so I can turn it in as an arts project Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 16:48:46 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LmktM030810 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:48:46 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03Lmf3e022656 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:48:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03Llo5s077040 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:47:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03Lkiw8009132; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:47:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc14.comcast.net (rwcrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.192.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LjrOY007934 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:46:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc14) with SMTP id <20070103214529m1400fe337e>; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:45:29 +0000 In-Reply-To: <000601c72f73$85244640$da6ea450@CPQ21932199711> References: <843871.33999.qm@web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <000601c72f73$85244640$da6ea450@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Message-Id: From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:45:26 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1290; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1e2e5916-0aa6-45df-9326-d3fe84c47232 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C24B9.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:48:45 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I suppose this is going to be a Rorshach -- I don't see an angel with a gun, but a spotted dog standing guard (the structure being dog house/guard house?) with a gun. But then, one man's angel could be another woman's spotted dog, I suppose... Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 3, 2007, at 3:12 PM, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 7:19 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject > > >> Hi and we want to wish you all the very, very best for the New Year! >> >> I thought of you specifically Bjarne, but I don't doubt there's >> enough people on this list who will appreciate these too! >> >> http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_80.htm >> >> Chris R. >> >> As for historical costumes for this year? I have two 1880's ball >> gowns I WILL finish :) > > Dear Chris, > Oh many many thanks for that link. How charming they are. > Dont quite understand is it an angel standing with a gun? at the > small house to the left? > Quite interresting to study the closeup pictures of the chenille > embroidery. > I have a picture of danish garthers with english text, saying "When > this you see, remember me!" But i think it was very used. > > Thanks again, and good luck with your ball gowns. > > Bjarne > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 16:58:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LwP5S031025 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:58:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03LwKMJ010069 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:58:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03Luphx078642 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:56:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03LujkU020596; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:56:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf4.socket.net (mf4a.socket.net [216.106.88.193]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03KLpPs010021 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:22:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf4.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id CF45A3743B for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:21:50 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 14:21:54 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <002601c72ee1$3c4c4860$d9bfa6d8@pavilion> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2c30083e-0179-4988-93b5-a21260b8b602 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459C26FC.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:58:24 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Mine was a simple question. How I read your question, it seemed to imply that you did not think that they were capable of dyeing fabric during that era, thus it seemed to me to imply primitive. Perhaps I should have used the word ignorant or something better to ask why you thought the Egyptians lacked dyeing skills during that era. <> De -----Original Message----- Did I *ever* say, or intimate that Egyptians were primitive? Huh? Wherever did you get *that* idea? I asked if there was any evidence of *linens* being dyed *at that time.* Linens are notoriously difficult to dye using natural dyes. Good grief..... --Sue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 17:03:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03M3QCw031127 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:03:26 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03M3Ll6018865 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:03:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03M2uL9079653 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:02:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03M2Ab0026820; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:02:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.28]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03KaT3B027249 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:37:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.173.211.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.173.211]) by pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H2Cqa-00041u-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 15:36:28 -0500 In-Reply-To: <000601c72f73$85244640$da6ea450@CPQ21932199711> References: <843871.33999.qm@web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <000601c72f73$85244640$da6ea450@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v749.3) X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <2F107494-F8D3-4785-9207-911C089DF5B1@mindspring.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:36:37 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.749.3) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 810802e6-a709-4bc3-98e7-c66867da94bc X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C2829.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:03:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO It looks to me like a border guard or castle guard at a small guardhouse. Lovely helmet. Halt! Happy new year, everyone! --Ruth Anne Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer On Jan 3, 2007, at 3:12 PM, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 7:19 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject > > >> Hi and we want to wish you all the very, very best for the New Year! >> >> I thought of you specifically Bjarne, but I don't doubt there's >> enough people on this list who will appreciate these too! >> >> http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_80.htm >> >> Chris R. >> >> As for historical costumes for this year? I have two 1880's ball >> gowns I WILL finish :) > > Dear Chris, > Oh many many thanks for that link. How charming they are. > Dont quite understand is it an angel standing with a gun? at the > small house to the left? > Quite interresting to study the closeup pictures of the chenille > embroidery. > I have a picture of danish garthers with english text, saying "When > this you see, remember me!" But i think it was very used. > > Thanks again, and good luck with your ball gowns. > > Bjarne > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 17:04:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03M4Kvb031150 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:04:20 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03M4FZZ032366 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:04:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03M3xwx079876 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:03:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03M3ru8028812; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:03:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m27.mx.aol.com (imo-m27.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.8]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03KihmG036687 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:45:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m27.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.408.709e4311 (40520) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:44:34 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <408.709e4311.32cd6fb0@aol.com> Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:44:32 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1870s buttons.... To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d934dec6-665a-4e07-85bc-8566839ad7dc X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C285F.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:04:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/3/2007 11:33:22 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, cschmitt@genteelarts.com writes: This technique provides much more support and less strain on the bodice. ************ Not to mention easy removal for the cleaning of the garment. And easy replacement. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 17:23:42 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03MNcdx031591 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:23:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03MNXLB019664 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:23:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03MMOYN083402 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:22:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03MLfQP048567; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:22:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from vms046pub.verizon.net (vms046pub.verizon.net [206.46.252.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03MLXeA048398 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:21:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hdpinto@verizon.net) Received: from HELENPINTO ([71.126.41.222]) by vms046.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JBB00DTPCQMLYZ3@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:21:21 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:20:41 -0500 From: "Helen Pinto" Subject: Re: [h-cost] name of a hat? To: "Historical Costume" Message-id: <025901c72f85$69035390$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c0760ce2-3657-45cc-a247-f3582194c4f7 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459C2CE5.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:23:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO debs wrote: > don't have any nfo on what the hair net part is called though. > Probably crespine. -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 17:29:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03MTY5u031710 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:29:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03MTTwa004474 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:29:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03MSc9C084442 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:28:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03MS4DK055083; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:28:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from vms042pub.verizon.net (vms042pub.verizon.net [206.46.252.42]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03M93nR034797 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:09:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hdpinto@verizon.net) Received: from HELENPINTO ([71.126.41.222]) by vms042.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JBB00NRQC4D3NP6@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:08:47 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:07:20 -0500 From: "Helen Pinto" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin To: "Historical Costume" Message-id: <022b01c72f83$8d5e7eb0$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <3b0.ad3fa5c.32cd288f@aol.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8a5a7d54-c94d-42ad-aa95-4f313179f589 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459C2E49.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:29:33 -0500 (EST) Status: RO That's the one, from Fall, 1987. You can have a CD-Rom of it, if you send me your mailing address. -Helen ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 10:41 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin > > In a message dated 1/3/2007 9:17:40 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > wildthangstreasures@yahoo.com writes: > > have a Metropolitan Museum of >> Art Bulletin from back in the days when they sent members these glossy >> books every quarter. It's from the costume collection and contains >> large, >> high-quality pictures of garments from 1695 through the early 1950's, > > > > *********************** > > > Is that the one with the beautiful Regency gown of white mull with poofs > all > over it worn with a huge beige bonnet...and a child in a white gown...on > the > cover? I have that one somewhere. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 17:48:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03Mm5ZS032067 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:48:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03Mm0uu021874 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:48:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03MlchB087056 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:47:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03Mjj7w072668; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:46:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03Mj1ZV071806 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:45:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c52.c7f6f92 (48624) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:44:51 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:44:48 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 219dc074-21e8-48ee-a584-ffddc11cf8aa X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C32A0.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:48:04 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/3/2007 5:29:14 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, hdpinto@verizon.net writes: That's the one, from Fall, 1987. You can have a CD-Rom of it, if you send me your mailing address. -Helen ****************** I shall. And I encourage others to also. It's a beauty. I also remember a great 1830's plaid dress with a bias pleated bertha [on a seated figure] and there was an insert left out at printing of an 1860's ball gown with a voluminous skirt and bodice made entirely of Brussels Lace....or was it Battenburg? Anyway, it's something to see! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 17:54:18 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03MsIWU032196 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:54:18 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03MsDX5004187 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:54:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03MrfvB088135 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:53:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03Mr8gC079908; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:53:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03MqN1L079113 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:53:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.146.160.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.146.160]) by pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H2Ey5-0001kF-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:52:21 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v749.3) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost] name of a hat? Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:52:29 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.749.3) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: dc92f7f9-1082-4bed-aa0b-49a8166fd138 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C3416.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 17:54:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Wouldn't "barbette" be derived from the root meaning "beard" and therefore logically be the part that goes under the chin? --Ruth Anne On Jan 3, 2007, at 10:56 AM, Debloughcostumes@aol.com wrote: > > Just went and checked and it is a barbette and fillet - the round > bit with > no crown being the barbette, and the fillet being the bit that goes > under the > chin (although have seen them without that in pics). > > don't have any nfo on what the hair net part is called though. > > debs > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 18:12:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NCANA032649 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:12:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03NC5Dr022884 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:12:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03NBRn8090373 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:11:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NAYr9097052; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:10:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc14.comcast.net (rwcrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.192.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03N9hDc096140 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:10:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [192.168.1.2] (c-71-196-218-99.hsd1.co.comcast.net[71.196.218.99]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc14) with SMTP id <20070103230938m1400fcothe>; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:09:38 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: <3586f5070701030749x11c5ac2dle246a146ee1c37a9@mail.gmail.com> References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> <3586f5070701030749x11c5ac2dle246a146ee1c37a9@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:09:36 -0700 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8f7c810d-f6f9-4b1e-bc34-411b0c7ef54f X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459C3845.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:12:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Speaking of ancient costume history, are any of you expert in the field of Mesopotamian costume? I'm wondering what else might have been dug up in that area since I studied costume history. Anyone know any good books on the subject? Sylrog On Jan 3, 2007, at 8:49 AM, Katy Bishop wrote: > There is one at the MFA in Boston, it was conserved several years ago, > when I worked there or just before. I might have a picture somewhere > in an old bulletin. It was beautiful beads in blues mostly as I > recall. > > Katy > > On 1/3/07, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: >> When did this evidence about Egyptian beaded net dresses surface? I >> never heard of it before nor is it in my old costume history books. >> It's been decades since I studied the history of costume, but since >> I'm >> going to be teaching it this January I'd really like to keep up on >> recent developments. >> >> Sylrog >> >> On Jan 2, 2007, at 9:34 PM, Heather Rose Jones wrote: >> > >> > From the description, it sounds like it might have been inspired by >> a >> > surviving Egyptian "bead net" dress -- a very open network made of >> > threaded beads. The one I'm thinking of is basically a tubular >> sheath >> > with shoulder straps and at the bottom hem it has a "fringe" of >> > dangling flower-shaped beads. _Might_ -- I'd have to see the >> original >> > to know if the suspicion holds up. There's a rather dark photograph >> > of the item I'm thinking of about halfway down the page at: >> > >> > http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html >> > >> > Heather >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > h-costume mailing list >> > h-costume@mail.indra.com >> > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > > -- > Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian > vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com > Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. > Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 18:15:31 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NFVtL032727 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:15:31 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03NFQDc023163 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:15:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03NEwKh090810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:14:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NDwdB000259; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:14:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp103.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com (smtp103.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com [206.190.36.81]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l03NCp29099048 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:13:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nicolaa@rogers.com) Received: (qmail 43080 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2007 23:12:45 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=rogers.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=p5z4YmlILG9D0Fr7LxHrXGJexN6gtgMtycO/RBuvffZk/H/8oPiHZ+81wHiIhh6wBVfm9VfMPR6UWdqxqkQIS8eB+qanpcrviUpEQRa6PBAvYfAQ8FWqxaRRAnL7RMriLgErA8GDQVB5XVBh+6eAsOzr4lt70J9cDw5M4nuDHOQ= ; Received: from unknown (HELO ?74.118.28.236?) (nicolaa@rogers.com@74.118.28.236 with plain) by smtp103.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2007 23:12:45 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: Y0TIKGwVM1kwkjVOHcgOjdLWch80ny0V0yknPvKg_lbgPRWnn0OgUZKj9_riMZqDeyAa22e0hHNreEkVLRJkkm57ESNjRTvTMjpR0l1VDCfC8rhtn4FrZ.vG56W3ZadaevE3Ti4s6.stzENnMDxI_AHgcMSF6ho0E5BBZcTlJNz1LYOzJF8BMstWFtoy Message-ID: <459C386E.4000209@rogers.com> Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:12:46 -0500 From: Susan Carroll-Clark User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Name of a Hat? 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X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:15:29 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Greetings-- Julie wrote: > I got an answer from Cynthia herself on the Milliner's list: > ******** > Heh. I think that one is my fault, at least partially. They really do > look like coffee filters, don't they? > > "Fillet" is one term, "toque" is good if you subscribe to the closed-top > version, and I don't know what the medievals reallly called them. I've > heard some folks call them a "Plantaganet cap" but I don't know the > provenance of that one. I might! Eleanor, the Countess of Leicester, sister of Henry III and definitely a Plantagenet, wears one on her seal. The seal also has the stylized "planta genet" (a sort of viney thing with a pod on the end), in this case bedecked with the arms of her husband, Simon de Montfort. (The back of the seal also notifies you that she's the sister of the King of England. I love it :-) Don't know if that's it, but it sure could be. Susan (member of Eleanor's fan club) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 18:17:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NH6Sj032766 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:17:06 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03NH10w024566 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:17:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03NGXFe091017 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:16:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NFUvK001677; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:16:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from omr.tzo.com (omr.tzo.com [64.27.166.104]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NEbuw000785 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:14:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from betsy@softwareinnovation.com) Received: from [76.186.80.34] (helo=softwareinnovation.com) by omr.tzo.com with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1H2FJX-0000b7-F1 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:14:31 -0500 Received: from PYC64 ([192.168.1.100]) by softwareinnovation.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:09:43 -0600 From: "Betsy Marshall" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:14:32 -0600 Organization: Software Innovation Message-ID: <004c01c72f8c$ed5472d0$6401a8c0@PYC64> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2826 Thread-Index: AccvTzMflIH+5aDZR4Kfgf0sanJ6iQAPZs3w In-Reply-To: <3586f5070701030749x11c5ac2dle246a146ee1c37a9@mail.gmail.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Jan 2007 23:09:43.0045 (UTC) FILETIME=[40AE7350:01C72F8C] X-Antivirus-Scanner: ClamAV - No Detected Virus, though you should still use a Local Antivirus on your computer. 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X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:17:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This might help... http://www.petrie.ucl.ac.uk/detail/details/index_no_login.php?objectid=UC177 43&accesscheck=%2Fdetail%2Fdetails%2Findex.php -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Katy Bishop Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 9:50 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian There is one at the MFA in Boston, it was conserved several years ago, when I worked there or just before. I might have a picture somewhere in an old bulletin. It was beautiful beads in blues mostly as I recall. Katy On 1/3/07, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > When did this evidence about Egyptian beaded net dresses surface? I > never heard of it before nor is it in my old costume history books. > It's been decades since I studied the history of costume, but since I'm > going to be teaching it this January I'd really like to keep up on > recent developments. > > Sylrog > > On Jan 2, 2007, at 9:34 PM, Heather Rose Jones wrote: > > > > From the description, it sounds like it might have been inspired by a > > surviving Egyptian "bead net" dress -- a very open network made of > > threaded beads. The one I'm thinking of is basically a tubular sheath > > with shoulder straps and at the bottom hem it has a "fringe" of > > dangling flower-shaped beads. _Might_ -- I'd have to see the original > > to know if the suspicion holds up. There's a rather dark photograph > > of the item I'm thinking of about halfway down the page at: > > > > http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html > > > > Heather > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 18:27:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NQuHI000530 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:27:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03NQpkD002301 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:26:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03NQAYB092351 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:26:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NP4EL010764; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:25:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2a.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NOG08009955 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:24:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 8633F34B70 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:24:16 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:24:19 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <004c01c72f8c$ed5472d0$6401a8c0@PYC64> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fbb44687-836f-4248-ad9c-33f749a40954 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C3BBB.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:26:55 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Nice! short version of url http://tinyurl.com/ydjm4p De -----Original Message----- This might help... http://www.petrie.ucl.ac.uk/detail/details/index_no_login.php?objectid=UC177 43&accesscheck=%2Fdetail%2Fdetails%2Findex.php _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 18:50:32 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NoS45001056 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:50:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l03NoNA8005400 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:50:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l03NnwSf095910 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:49:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l03NnCvT033934; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:49:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from outbound-mail.nyc.untd.com (outbound-mail.nyc.untd.com [64.136.20.164]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l03NmSve033171 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 16:48:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penhalion@juno.com) Received: from webmail42.nyc.untd.com (webmail42.nyc.untd.com [10.141.27.182]) by smtpout05.nyc.untd.com with SMTP id AABC32SFTAZCHYAJ for (sender ); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 15:48:01 -0800 (PST) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: fRRJgEOSsRehnOwCpkfn78Iz+ylSoI9AhSmuJ/Uj5eY/yhHhUF6nSw== Received: (from penhalion@juno.com) by webmail42.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id MA7UTSDS; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 15:47:28 PST Received: from [24.14.76.2] by webmail42.nyc.untd.com with HTTP: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:47:01 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.14.76.2] Mime-Version: 1.0 From: "penhalion@juno.com" Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:47:01 GMT To: h-costume@indra.com X-Mailer: Webmail Version 4.0 Message-Id: <20070103.154728.1712.967608@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> X-ContentStamp: 2:1:593183455 X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 10.141.27.182|webmail42.nyc.untd.com|webmail42.nyc.untd.com|penhalion@juno.com X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Holiday Exchange Received X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: cb22f050-1f5b-432f-a263-52e98d6a5bba X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459C413F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:50:27 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l03NoS45001056 Status: RO My package from Diane arrived today! She sent me a nice pair of scrubby gloves which will be great for getting rid of dry winter skin, several candles which I love, a small spiral notebook, two foot-fizzers for sore feet, a small pincushion, and a string of rice pearls and some beading needles. I will think of her generosity as I sew the pearls onto an Elizabethan partlet I have planned and every time I wear it. Thank-you, Diane! Karen Seamstrix _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 19:58:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l040warm002379 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:58:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l040wVNh020776 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:58:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l040vtal004533 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:57:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l040vlHB090745; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:57:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l040vcCZ090627 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 17:57:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0411CrJ024841 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:01:13 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:05:39 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <3586f5070701030749x11c5ac2dle246a146ee1c37a9@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701032005.39802.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9a760f09-ac53-43e0-b465-4fdc98c1b818 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C5137.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 19:58:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Wednesday 03 January 2007 6:09 pm, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > Speaking of ancient costume history, are any of you expert in the > field of Mesopotamian costume? I'm wondering what else might have been > dug up in that area since I studied costume history. Anyone know any > good books on the subject? Except for Mary Houston's book on the subject (which is sort of "ancient" itself!) I don't know of anything. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 21:09:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0428vpK003908 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:09:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0428q1C020413 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:08:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0428Cei012683 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:08:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04283Uv040542; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:08:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31012.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31012.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.201.70]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0427x9j040412 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:08:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from emeraldepona@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 9706 invoked by uid 60001); 4 Jan 2007 02:07:54 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=vTsLBk8NNwh23mFJZH4wMa85IwVw5EvvbQX/F5VQjXqS3GfIO8TsFjijA5VFTBMKSHIzADJt/GtWWs+EcipWdbMe6/hqZauXqpLk9NKtUnVQHdKhkl6GNQFpQtDE0H0/yH+dcCX4HxG3+s0VkCnpmMSNkGn2xrWhngug830+b+A=; X-YMail-OSG: 7uidqJ0VM1mYIqdU8GuAN9uyNLaoLDXOzM8TK3F934BhCLl_oA0k4FUYvcPSBerBW_S64mHzi9fBjRGEgk_q3pzSbE4az4G97EobFU6U5Q87RDwWQ2cVT9jlX2.wmleef.bgcJjroRpI50o- Received: from [208.111.207.6] by web31012.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:07:53 PST Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:07:53 -0800 (PST) From: Chris Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <181248.9394.qm@web31012.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 14c3caad-54a9-4e1b-bf88-5d0942bb23ae X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C61B4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:08:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I agree, I couldn't quite figure it out myself, but for such small work and with chenille thread...Yikes! I love this site and go there to drool often! Someday maybe I'll treat myself to something too...after I win the lottery ;) Lauren Walker wrote: I suppose this is going to be a Rorshach -- I don't see an angel with a gun, but a spotted dog standing guard (the structure being dog house/guard house?) with a gun. But then, one man's angel could be another woman's spotted dog, I suppose... Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_80.htm > > Dear Chris, > Oh many many thanks for that link. How charming they are. > Dont quite understand is it an angel standing with a gun? at the > small house to the left? > Quite interresting to study the closeup pictures of the chenille > embroidery. > I have a picture of danish garthers with english text, saying "When > this you see, remember me!" But i think it was very used. > > Thanks again, and good luck with your ball gowns. > > Bjarne __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 21:33:54 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042XsYQ004557 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:33:54 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l042XnQd030865 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:33:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l042XGBU015388 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:33:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042XBTM058623; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:33:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042X8u1058584 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:33:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from heather.jones@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=m36A7HcMXUNe+Op8JPygnru6NqRXxS2K62sZCiifpmujj4ae6imHiEmPu8YgBDGV; h=Received:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:X-Priority:Content-Type:Message-Id:Content-Transfer-Encoding:From:Subject:Date:To:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.167.204.231] (helo=[10.0.1.2]) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H2IPe-0004Mc-J7 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:33:02 -0500 In-Reply-To: <005301c72f4b$45750ca0$5ebfa6d8@pavilion> References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> <005301c72f4b$45750ca0$5ebfa6d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:34:11 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-ELNK-Trace: c920284270743d76aa459df8244ac33774bf435c0eb9d4780269eac70dddefe869348bed190ba8c7be77889bbd3f465a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.167.204.231 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 99c8b138-5e47-47c7-aa6c-10d93775cd59 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C678D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:33:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 3, 2007, at 7:24 AM, Sue Clemenger wrote: > A beaded/netted overgown? How cool is that? ;o) I hadn't heard of that > intriguing garment, so thanks to you and the other poster who > mentioned it. > I can see now why the designers of AlbertCat's movie might have > tried to > imitate it. > --Sue > Yeah, it's incredibly cool. (The same sort of technique seems to have been used for beaded-net sarcophagus covers that would include a facial portrait of the deceased.) I had fun making one for my "ancient Egyptian doll" -- see . It's about 2/3 of the way down the page. (The doll is about 10" tall.) Heather > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Heather Rose Jones" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2007 9:34 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes > > >> >> On Jan 2, 2007, at 5:00 AM, Sue Clemenger wrote: > >> >>> Not if what she was wearing was obviously knitted. That's a >>> humongous >>> boo-boo, right there. Also, the color of the gown sounds really >>> wrong--is >>> there any evidence of linens being dyed in Egypt at that time? >>> --Sue >>> >> >> From the description, it sounds like it might have been inspired by >> a surviving Egyptian "bead net" dress -- a very open network made of >> threaded beads. The one I'm thinking of is basically a tubular >> sheath with shoulder straps and at the bottom hem it has a "fringe" >> of dangling flower-shaped beads. _Might_ -- I'd have to see the >> original to know if the suspicion holds up. There's a rather dark >> photograph of the item I'm thinking of about halfway down the page >> at: >> >> http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html >> >> Heather > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 21:41:57 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042fvbI004741 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:41:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l042fqOL004764 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:41:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l042fWSE016139 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:41:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042fUB2064220; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:41:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042fO4K064163 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:41:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from heather.jones@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=G8PWIyjb7CT8Tlfqeii/gPi8Qh8XPhPqrIm37fVd0SiLdZcGtZ3GC+5Hxz6SUYNX; h=Received:Mime-Version:In-Reply-To:References:Content-Type:Message-Id:From:Subject:Date:To:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.167.204.231] (helo=[10.0.1.2]) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H2IXf-0003V3-0V for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:41:19 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion> <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> Message-Id: From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 18:42:27 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-ELNK-Trace: c920284270743d76aa459df8244ac33774bf435c0eb9d4780269eac70dddefe82549ea6a37e047172965978d8de079a6350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.167.204.231 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 18753c14-c21b-49ab-b22e-bb4ac8f7a009 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C6970.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:41:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 3, 2007, at 7:16 AM, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > When did this evidence about Egyptian beaded net dresses surface? > I never heard of it before nor is it in my old costume history > books. It's been decades since I studied the history of costume, > but since I'm going to be teaching it this January I'd really like > to keep up on recent developments. I've run across mentions of about 3 of the dresses, not all of which were preserved very carefully after discovery. The main researcher who seems to have written about them is Rosalind Hall. I believe there's some discussion in: Hall, Rosalind. 1981. "Fishing-net dreses in the Petrie Museum" in Gottinger Miszellen: 42:36-46. and there's a color picture in the "Shire Archaeology" series book on ancient Egyptian textiles, which she also wrote. Heather _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 21:51:57 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042pvV8004957 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:51:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l042pqT0010059 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:51:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l042pSQj017081 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:51:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042pQEK071060; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:51:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042pMGS071011 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:51:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l042swkv028126 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:54:58 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:59:25 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net> <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> In-Reply-To: <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701032159.25512.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9599dac2-a4f6-4d1c-aa31-b63db54d8841 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459C6BC8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:51:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Wednesday 03 January 2007 10:16 am, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > When did this evidence about Egyptian beaded net dresses surface? I > never heard of it before nor is it in my old costume history books. > It's been decades since I studied the history of costume, but since I'm > going to be teaching it this January I'd really like to keep up on > recent developments. I believe I saw a picture of such a beaded net dress in Archaeology magazine about two or three years ago. I think I still have the issue. If so, it may indicate when the find was actually made. Ooops! I was wrong--it wasn't Archaeology at all, and it was longer ago than a few years. The article I have in mind was in KMT: A Modern Journal of Ancient Egypt. Winter 1995-1996, vol. 6, No. 4. It's by a Rosalind Janssen, an assistant curator at the Petrie Museum of Egyptian Archaeology at University College London ("Petrie Museum") and it's called, "An Ancient Egyptian Erotic Fashion: Fishnet Dresses." Turns out that more than one have been found, and there are pictures of two restored (i.e., restrung) dresses accompanying the article. One is dated to the 4th Dynasty. The caption on the photo claims it was found during George Reisner's excavations at Giza in 1927 and is now at the Museum of Fine Arts in Boston (MFS 27.1548). Another was found by Brunton at Qau in 1923-24; the article has two pictures of this one; one as it was incorrectly restored in the 1960s and a more recent restoration; it is now in the Petrie Museum. A picture of what the caption calls "macrame" (but looks more like a net with beaded motifs at the bottom) and a mesh referred to as a "netted linen fragment" also appear, along with a painted statute and tomb painting that appear to show similar garments. In light of the age of the relevant finds and the tomb art, I'm surprised no reference to such a garment showed up in the older books. Anyway, I can send you scans of the photos (possibly even of the whole article) by private e-mail if you are interested. The article also discusses evidence for garments made of linen netting that would have been as erotic and more comfortable to wear. [Heather said:] > > On Jan 2, 2007, at 9:34 PM, Heather Rose Jones wrote: > > From the description, it sounds like it might have been inspired by a > > surviving Egyptian "bead net" dress -- a very open network made of > > threaded beads. The one I'm thinking of is basically a tubular sheath > > with shoulder straps and at the bottom hem it has a "fringe" of > > dangling flower-shaped beads. This description tallies pretty well with the "macrame" fragment pictured in the KMT article, though Janessen says the MFA dress has stylized bead flowers along the hem, too. (I'm not sure I think so, from the picture, though.) The macrame fragment is also in the MFA, so I'm not clear which item she means. > > _Might_ -- I'd have to see the original > > to know if the suspicion holds up. There's a rather dark photograph > > of the item I'm thinking of about halfway down the page at: > > > > http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html The "dark photo" referred to on the URL cited above appears to be a bad shot of the rear of the garment from the Petrie Museum. The KMT article has full-length shot of that garment, in color and from the front. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 21:55:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042tROu005017 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:55:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l042tM5H017755 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:55:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l042sr1s017442 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:54:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042sqi0073566; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:54:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042sm6q073513 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:54:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l042wOD8028219 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:58:25 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:02:51 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <005301c72f4b$45750ca0$5ebfa6d8@pavilion> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701032202.51658.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 364b7318-051e-4f06-b4c1-db645694d23f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C6C9A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:55:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Wednesday 03 January 2007 9:34 pm, Heather Rose Jones wrote: > On Jan 3, 2007, at 7:24 AM, Sue Clemenger wrote: > > A beaded/netted overgown? How cool is that? ;o) I hadn't heard of that > > intriguing garment, so thanks to you and the other poster who > > mentioned it. > > I can see now why the designers of AlbertCat's movie might have > > tried to > > imitate it. > > --Sue > > Yeah, it's incredibly cool. (The same sort of technique seems to > have been used for beaded-net sarcophagus covers that would include a > facial portrait of the deceased.) I had fun making one for my > "ancient Egyptian doll" -- see digthatdoll/egyptianwoman.html>. It's about 2/3 of the way down the > page. (The doll is about 10" tall.) I have very occasionally seen similar-looking garments (using plastic beads, naturally!) sold by vendors of belly dance costumes. These modern examples seem to be made using crochet techniques. "Egyptian beaded dress" or "beaded crochet dress" plugged into Google will sometimes turn up examples. I'd love to have one. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 21:56:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042uiS6005050 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:56:44 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l042udV0012384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:56:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l042uKIX017613 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:56:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042uIJJ074661; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:56:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l042uCKQ074577 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 19:56:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l042xmAx028247 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:59:48 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:04:15 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701032204.15533.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b42cf4fd-41c0-4c1b-a112-ef3b7119d6c0 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459C6CE7.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:56:43 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Wednesday 03 January 2007 9:42 pm, Heather Rose Jones wrote: > On Jan 3, 2007, at 7:16 AM, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > > When did this evidence about Egyptian beaded net dresses surface? > > I never heard of it before nor is it in my old costume history > > books. It's been decades since I studied the history of costume, > > but since I'm going to be teaching it this January I'd really like > > to keep up on recent developments. > > I've run across mentions of about 3 of the dresses, not all of which > were preserved very carefully after discovery. The main researcher > who seems to have written about them is Rosalind Hall. I believe > there's some discussion in: > > Hall, Rosalind. 1981. "Fishing-net dreses in the Petrie Museum" in > Gottinger Miszellen: 42:36-46. > > and there's a color picture in the "Shire Archaeology" series book on > ancient Egyptian textiles, which she also wrote. The woman who wrote the KMT article is probably the same person. It mentions that she's written several books on Ancient Egypt in collaboration with her husband, Jac. J. Janssen. Hall is probably her maiden name. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 22:22:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043MBAY005674 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:22:15 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l043M6Zk028350 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:22:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l043KRX9020387 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:20:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043KLev090901; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:20:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc11.comcast.net (alnrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.225.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043KHgD090812 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:20:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [192.168.1.3] (c-71-196-218-99.hsd1.co.comcast.net[71.196.218.99]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc11) with SMTP id <20070104032011b1100k3ebqe>; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 03:20:12 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: <200701032005.39802.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <3586f5070701030749x11c5ac2dle246a146ee1c37a9@mail.gmail.com> <200701032005.39802.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <46c39403355e4531308f0f60a6d90ed5@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:19:30 -0700 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5d5c794f-d8ba-4fdc-b27c-eee5512854ce X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459C72DE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 22:22:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Funny you should mention that book. I just so happen to have made a photocopy on it in its entirety when I ran across it for the first time a few years ago in a small town library. Since it was written in 1920, I've wondered ever since how accurate it is. Incredibly detailed, so I've been wondering. any consensus among you all? Sylrog On Jan 3, 2007, at 6:05 PM, Catherine Olanich Raymond wrote: > On Wednesday 03 January 2007 6:09 pm, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: >> Speaking of ancient costume history, are any of you expert in the >> field of Mesopotamian costume? I'm wondering what else might have >> been >> dug up in that area since I studied costume history. Anyone know any >> good books on the subject? > > Except for Mary Houston's book on the subject (which is sort of > "ancient" > itself!) I don't know of anything. > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point > of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 22:36:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043aKeB006031 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:36:20 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l043aFG8000828 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:36:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l043ZdhS022158 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:35:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043Zbb0000384; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:35:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc14.comcast.net (rwcrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.192.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043ZW2s000246 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:35:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from elena_o_tighearnaigh@comcast.net) Received: from rmailcenter15.comcast.net ([204.127.197.125]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc14) with SMTP id <20070104033527m1400fgn0me>; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 03:35:27 +0000 Received: from [67.183.93.199] by rmailcenter15.comcast.net; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 03:35:26 +0000 From: elena_o_tighearnaigh@comcast.net To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 03:35:26 +0000 Message-Id: <010420070335.19520.459C75FD000D187D00004C4022058861720809070E029D0E0A0809079BA101A10E020A040A@comcast.net> X-Mailer: AT&T Message Center Version 1 (Oct 4 2006) X-Authenticated-Sender: ZWxlbmFfb190aWdoZWFybmFpZ2hAY29tY2FzdC5uZXQ= MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0f01b2b3-494b-4d98-a794-5854fe650d80 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459C762F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 22:36:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Helen/Aidan, I happily received the CD-ROM just after Christmas! Thank you for the disc! Happy Happy dance... Elena/Gia -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Helen Pinto" > The catalogue is gone, but if you send me your mailing address, I'll send > you a CD-Rom of the scans of all the pages. > -Helen/Aidan > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Voncile W. Dudley" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 10:15 AM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin > > > > > > I'm late checking my email. I would love to have any books that needs > > a good home especially garments from the 15th century up. > > Lady Von > > Hope I am not to late! > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Helen Pinto" > > To: "Historical Costume" > > Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 11:18 PM > > Subject: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin > > > > > >> In the process of (finally) unpacking my books, I've been finding things > >> that could use a home other than mine. I have a Metropolitan Museum of > >> Art Bulletin from back in the days when they sent members these glossy > >> books every quarter. It's from the costume collection and contains large, > >> high-quality pictures of garments from 1695 through the early 1950's, > >> including microphotographs of some of the embroidered detail of the > >> garments. It's nice to look at, but way past anything I'm really > >> interested in. > >> So... I will scan and send photos of anything that someone fancies, and > >> the whole thing can belong to the first person who asks for it. (You have > >> two weeks to ask for the pictures, then I'll mail it.) The highlights: > >> > >> - Complete embroidered woman's dress from 1695 > >> - Four men's 18th c embroidered coats, one uncut, one with original > >> embroidery cartoon, one with pants and vest > >> - Men's banyans > >> - Assorted women's 18c dresses, one with panniers, most sack-backed, all > >> embroidered or hand-painted, 1740's - 1795 > >> - Assorted women's 19c outfits, day dresses, evening wear, several from > >> each decade > >> - Assorted women's 20c outfits, evening wear, suits, etc, up to the 50's > >> > >> -Helen/Aidan > >> > >> > >> - > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> h-costume mailing list > >> h-costume@mail.indra.com > >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > > Lady Von > > > > http://www.wildthangstreasures.com > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Check out the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta - Fire up a more powerful email and > > get things done faster. > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 22:58:51 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043wnis006615 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:58:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l043whlm031900 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:58:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l043wLuX024713 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:58:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043wDQo014189; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:58:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l043w8Ax014130 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 20:58:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0441iTM030030 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:01:45 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:06:11 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <200701032005.39802.cathy@thyrsus.com> <46c39403355e4531308f0f60a6d90ed5@ntw.net> In-Reply-To: <46c39403355e4531308f0f60a6d90ed5@ntw.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701032306.11697.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1f074766-c3e1-41d0-a817-c6414a1b6f92 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C7B73.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 22:58:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Wednesday 03 January 2007 10:19 pm, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > Funny you should mention that book. I just so happen to have made a > photocopy on it in its entirety when I ran across it for the first time > a few years ago in a small town library. Since it was written in 1920, > I've wondered ever since how accurate it is. Incredibly detailed, so > I've been wondering. any consensus among you all? Shrug. It's hard to say. To my knowledge, there aren't really any archaeological textile finds (as opposed to jewelry and clay tablets) in what was then Mesopotamia.... If I'm wrong, I'd be delighted to hear about it! -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 3 23:47:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l044lALA007740 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:47:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l044l5Zg026056 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:47:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l044kOYE029800 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:46:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l044jmbS045981; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:45:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l044jXDU045758 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:45:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c77.840b35d (58677) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:45:18 -0500 (EST) From: TeaRoseS@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:45:16 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5358 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Free books! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4f38596a-fc57-4c2c-b3f6-151fac0aaa20 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459C86C9.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 03 Jan 2007 23:47:09 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Okay, I knew that would get your attention. :) I have decided to reclaim the space on my bookshelves which is currently occupied by eleven issues of a booklike periodical called Renaissance Quarterly. They were published by the Renaissance Society of America from 1988 to 1992. None of them have any specifically costume-oriented content, but there is an article analyzing the Arnolfini marriage portrait and two articles discussing representations of Mary Tudor and Elizabeth I. I snagged these years ago when my college library was going to trash them, so if anyone on this list wants them, you can have them for the cost of shipping (which I reckon will be $10 or so in the US). Send me an e-mail off-list if you're interested. Tea Rose _TeaRoseS@aol.com_ (mailto:TeaRoseS@aol.com) or _thessalyrose@gmail.com_ (mailto:thessalyrose@gmail.com) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 00:36:02 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l045a25Q008801 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:36:02 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l045Zv4b025320 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:36:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l045ZXWo034474 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:35:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l045ZUlP076529; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:35:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l045ZPQE076472 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:35:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from heather.jones@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=lviifcJ5kyG64u01tY+YZ9thmiE4Fii6uAfan4a+krZ64eaaDxkfkiGMlAxWlSuL; h=Received:Mime-Version:In-Reply-To:References:Content-Type:Message-Id:Content-Transfer-Encoding:From:Subject:Date:To:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.167.204.231] (helo=[10.0.1.2]) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H2LG9-0001W7-0a for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 00:35:25 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <200701032306.11697.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <200701032005.39802.cathy@thyrsus.com> <46c39403355e4531308f0f60a6d90ed5@ntw.net> <200701032306.11697.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <01A60FEA-8A1C-4F66-B0A7-72934209F500@earthlink.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:36:38 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-ELNK-Trace: c920284270743d76aa459df8244ac33774bf435c0eb9d4780269eac70dddefe82be82cbbcc0374532f0d3e14bf9a219a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.167.204.231 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: eb23ef89-9fa6-4bb9-a2fe-9bd36d74f5c3 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C923D.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 00:36:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 3, 2007, at 8:06 PM, Catherine Olanich Raymond wrote: > On Wednesday 03 January 2007 10:19 pm, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: >> Funny you should mention that book. I just so happen to have made a >> photocopy on it in its entirety when I ran across it for the first >> time >> a few years ago in a small town library. Since it was written in >> 1920, >> I've wondered ever since how accurate it is. Incredibly detailed, so >> I've been wondering. any consensus among you all? > > Shrug. It's hard to say. To my knowledge, there aren't really any > archaeological textile finds (as opposed to jewelry and clay > tablets) in what > was then Mesopotamia.... If I'm wrong, I'd be delighted to hear > about it! I'm not aware of any surviving textile finds -- but there are a _lot_ of surviving artistic representations, including a lot of detailed and realistic 3-dimensional statuary. Deciphering some of the stylized textures can be interesting (especially the "tufted" look), but I wouldn't be at all surprised if an in-depth study could come up with some very plausible theories on construction and materials. Heather _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 00:44:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l045i54o008926 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:44:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l045i0CH015888 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:44:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l044kbqp029817 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:46:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l044k7hf046227; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:46:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.prismnet.com (smtp.prismnet.com [209.198.128.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l044jxAm046057 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:46:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from chiara.francesca@gmail.com) Received: from CHESLAPTOP (cpe-76-185-25-114.tx.res.rr.com [76.185.25.114]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp.prismnet.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l044jqMb024364 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:45:53 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from chiara.francesca@gmail.com) Message-ID: <019c01c72fbb$3b771c00$070ba8c0@CHESLAPTOP> From: "Chiara Francesca" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701032005.39802.cathy@thyrsus.com><46c39403355e4531308f0f60a6d90ed5@ntw.net> <200701032306.11697.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:33:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on smtp.prismnet.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 required=7.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.0 (2005-09-13) on smtp.prismnet.com X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d8a91db9-37da-4dd7-a51d-04da6e3adac1 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459C9421.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 00:44:04 -0500 (EST) Status: RO You may want to check the Cambridge online resources. I seem to remember that they had a few publications covering Mesopotamian textile impressions and some possible textile items. When I was in college oh low those many years ago one of the classes that was required for my degree was one specifically about Mesopotamia. (I did not finish my degree.) Since that was in the early 80's they sure as hell must have found something by now since they have had so many new things come up in the last 2 decades. You must also remember that at one point or another Iran, Anatolia, Syria and Palestine were also a part of Mesopotamia. Textiles, if they survived, I would bet are at Cambridge. :) Chiara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 10:06 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian > On Wednesday 03 January 2007 10:19 pm, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: >> Funny you should mention that book. I just so happen to have made a >> photocopy on it in its entirety when I ran across it for the first time >> a few years ago in a small town library. Since it was written in 1920, >> I've wondered ever since how accurate it is. Incredibly detailed, so >> I've been wondering. any consensus among you all? > > Shrug. It's hard to say. To my knowledge, there aren't really any > archaeological textile finds (as opposed to jewelry and clay tablets) in > what > was then Mesopotamia.... If I'm wrong, I'd be delighted to hear about it! > > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point > of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 00:49:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l045mtcV009025 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:49:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l045mpr5011585 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:48:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l045m9Jo035447 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:48:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l045m3N5083580; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:48:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l045lvFw083527 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 22:48:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1H2LSF0qff-0000Ik; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 00:47:56 -0500 Message-ID: <005c01c72fc3$de2c6c90$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion><5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net><5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net> <3586f5070701030749x11c5ac2dle246a146ee1c37a9@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:47:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 713597d8-cf7c-4833-83a5-4726a7c0c6ba X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C9543.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 00:48:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Katy, I am coming in late on the topic. Is this a 1920s Egyptian style beaded gown? Those were fashionable then. I haven't seen an ancient Egyptian beaded dress. I couldn't get this webpage link to work: http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/sexuality.html Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 01:01:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0461hHp009241 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:01:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0461cOV018919 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:01:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04610lM036372 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:01:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0460voM090482; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0460r9L090415 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos1.cos.agilent.com (relcos1.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.239]) by msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A4521C53A for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.233]) by relcos1.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9AFA1C274B for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosbh02.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.126]) by wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 23:00:39 -0700 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh02.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:39 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:37 -0700 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D9640213AE23@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> In-Reply-To: <200701031422.l03EMKSY022228@net.indra.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant Thread-Index: AccvQvqs3L4zhoCaR3qL0mb6QQEPrQAgjoyA From: To: , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Jan 2007 06:00:39.0249 (UTC) FILETIME=[A8EC9C10:01C72FC5] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0460r9L090415 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 150fed6c-cfd3-4748-853b-c438b25c7278 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459C9842.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 01:01:42 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Two programmes on British TV over Christmas showed Victorian > brides in sleeveless dresses. One was the film of "Nicholas > Nickleby", the other a version of "Dracula". Dammit, you wear > DAY clothes to a wedding! (or used to.) I thought that too, however in my most recent research project covering the elliptical hoop though the early bustle (1865-1874) a noticeable percentage of wedding dresses were in the evening dress style. No more then 25%, but a noticeable percentage anyway. -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 01:01:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0461mv5009244 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:01:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0461iP9015969 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:01:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0461P5F036408 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:01:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0461OEY090749; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:01:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0460stO090427 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos1.cos.agilent.com (relcos1.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.239]) by msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 985A53BAF for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.233]) by relcos1.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B21821C2758 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosbh02.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.126]) by wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 23:00:39 -0700 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh02.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:39 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:00:37 -0700 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D9640213AE23@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> In-Reply-To: <200701031422.l03EMKSY022228@net.indra.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant Thread-Index: AccvQvqs3L4zhoCaR3qL0mb6QQEPrQAgjoyA From: To: , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Jan 2007 06:00:39.0249 (UTC) FILETIME=[A8EC9C10:01C72FC5] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0460stO090427 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c6562148-4749-4c9d-bfee-381238bfec39 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459C9848.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 01:01:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Two programmes on British TV over Christmas showed Victorian > brides in sleeveless dresses. One was the film of "Nicholas > Nickleby", the other a version of "Dracula". Dammit, you wear > DAY clothes to a wedding! (or used to.) I thought that too, however in my most recent research project covering the elliptical hoop though the early bustle (1865-1874) a noticeable percentage of wedding dresses were in the evening dress style. No more then 25%, but a noticeable percentage anyway. -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 01:12:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l046CYew009459 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:12:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l046CT8q021349 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:12:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l046BweP037263 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:11:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l046BrhK096423; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:11:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l046BmbD096370 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:11:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1H2LpL2NwZ-0000Ix; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 01:11:48 -0500 Message-ID: <00a101c72fc7$33f91df0$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001401c72e6e$075a7f00$fcbfa6d8@pavilion><5E53F5CA-43F5-401C-A85B-3A01C5F3B23C@earthlink.net><5d060cf260826cb0bf95758635ed8b96@ntw.net><3586f5070701030749x11c5ac2dle246a146ee1c37a9@mail.gmail.com> <005c01c72fc3$de2c6c90$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:11:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8a44ea7d-15dd-4c5a-93f4-a5e7c35ce752 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459C9ACD.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 01:12:33 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Okay, I caught up on the topic... I'm sorry for my stupid question. I am wondering if these Egyptian dresses that were found in the 1920s were what made beaded dresses in the 1920s so fashionable. From my research, they appear in fashion around the same time as the dates of the beaded Egyptian dress finds. I am studying and will start soon documenting actual beading patterns from the 1920s dresses. It is amazing to me how some of the dresses from the 1920s survived with the chiffon in tact. We have some in the fashion collection that barely survived and the only thing they are good for is to document their patterns. You can not even tell what these dresses originally looked like. We have one dress that has about 15 lbs. of metal beadwork. It has survived well. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 01:24:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l046O2ik009669 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:24:02 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l046Nv2j029856 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:24:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l046NKxW038173 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:23:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l046NHAl002822; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:23:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep03.xtra.co.nz (fep03.xtra.co.nz [210.54.141.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l046NCZY002731 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 23:23:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from thebruce@ihug.co.nz) Received: from michaela ([125.238.124.133]) by fep03.xtra.co.nz with SMTP id <20070104062306.TXWG16699.fep03.xtra.co.nz@michaela> for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:23:06 +1300 Message-ID: <00fa01c72fc8$cf031980$0301010a@michaela> From: "michaela" To: "Historical Costume" References: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D9640213AE23@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:23:10 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=10% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8d3bb71a-6f50-4fb7-9111-adee06f01002 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459C9D7D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 01:24:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > > Two programmes on British TV over Christmas showed Victorian > > brides in sleeveless dresses. One was the film of "Nicholas > > Nickleby", the other a version of "Dracula". Dammit, you wear > > DAY clothes to a wedding! (or used to.) > I thought that too, however in my most recent research project covering the elliptical hoop > though the early bustle (1865-1874) a noticeable percentage of wedding dresses were in the > evening dress style. No more then 25%, but a noticeable percentage anyway. I found it's usually respectable middle class that wears day dress (and probably working class too as I suspect there wasn't much opportunity to go to the opera or the odd ball....) and the aristocracy could wear off the shoulder and the like. I was mostly looking at 1870s and 1880s there. Most of the brides on the Musee McCorde site are wearing clothing to the neck. None of the fashion plates show the lower necked style for weddings (though there are rather more open necks for day wear.) Michaela de Bruce http://glittersweet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 02:12:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l047CT1g014789 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 02:12:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l047COQ4012281 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 02:12:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l047BnLB042256 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:11:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l047Bgg0030841; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:11:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l047B8hT030538 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:11:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos1.cos.agilent.com (relcos1.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.239]) by msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10FCB3DB1 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:11:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.233]) by relcos1.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E05C51C2639 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:11:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosbh03.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.128]) by wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 00:11:01 -0700 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh03.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:11:01 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost] 1870s buttons.... Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:11:00 -0700 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D9640213AE2E@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> In-Reply-To: <200701031551.l03FocsI003615@net.indra.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] 1870s buttons.... Thread-Index: AccvT58BopbLNnXLQFakyc8FPzQqEQAeL1Eg From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Jan 2007 07:11:01.0663 (UTC) FILETIME=[7DADDAF0:01C72FCF] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l047B8hT030538 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fd776ede-010b-4234-8331-7a3b5d45f774 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459CA8D8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 02:12:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > I have a question for you 19th century types, born out of > completely idle curiosity. This Christmas, I was given a > lovely bracelet comprising different buttons from the 1870s. > They are all about 1/2 inch in diameter, and have > surprisingly complex and lovely designs in them. They are > made of cut steel and brass, with occasional tiny flecks of > what looks like marcasite, and are fairly hefty in weight for > their size (because of the metal, I'm guessing). > What on earth would something like that have been used on? > The garment fabric would have to be pretty substantial to not > deform or tear from the weight.... > --Sue in Montana Buttons were a reasonably common decoration for visiting dresses (e.g. fancy day dresses) - by decoration I mean used in places other then the center front or back opening. On the vintage garments I own that use button decoration (one of them is about 1878) the buttons are not functional and therefore can have extra re-enforcement, as well as simply having less stress then a button with an associated buttonhole. Wool (I have both a super fine weight and a tweed-jacket weight bodice in my collection), velvet, silk taffeta and silk faille were all common fabrics to make visiting dresses from - of those taffeta is the only one that is really fragile. Also, almost all bodices (and many skirts) were fully lined (usually with a very light weight brown-ish polished cotton - I assume it was their equivalent of cheap muslin since most linings are made of it.) One other comment - beyond the cotton lining the 4 day bodices I own from the 1860-1870s do not have any extra reinforcement at the center front openings. In one there is a bone placed beneath the buttons below the bust-shelf. But none of the others have that. It is simply the fashion fabric plus the cotton lining folded on itself once, with a tiny hem tucking the cut edges underneath. Hope that helps :-) -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 04:05:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0494rOm011098 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 04:04:58 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0494m4J002480 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 04:04:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0492n83052743 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 02:02:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0492jA2098090; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 02:02:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0492eLq098041 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 02:02:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.19350716; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:02:24 0000 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id l0492OF22349.; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:02:24 GMT Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:02:23 +0000 Message-Id: <459CC29202000014000C8301@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:02:10 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Name of a hat? References: <200701032319.l03NHNRq003440@net.indra.com> In-Reply-To: <200701032319.l03NHNRq003440@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e4133c79-8a74-413d-9e34-ffbba39ba26e X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459CC330.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 04:04:52 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Susan Carroll-Clark wrote: >Eleanor, the Countess of Leicester, sister of Henry III and >definitely a Plantagenet, wears one on her seal. The seal also has the >stylized "planta genet" (a sort of viney thing with a pod on the end), It's not a vine, it's the broom plant ("genista" in Latin), a shrub with yellow pea-like flowers. Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 06:31:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04BVati007014 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 06:31:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04BVUTn022006 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 06:31:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04BTBwf065634 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 04:29:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04BT59I091908; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 04:29:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp106.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com (smtp106.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com [68.142.225.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l04BT16O091759 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 04:29:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nicolaa@rogers.com) Received: (qmail 44246 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2007 11:28:56 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=rogers.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=dyF4WZdiqKmfa4OUT7QZ+q90FDiJDgwapxmtWOmgWAa4odBxJc+9O/HfrrMDq83e/6v4fZr7GjF9a5MrXkdPeD1P1uzIdBs7z8GbRkXzD42syLhuVHJlWbylJY5lLqWeNRQIvkcUeIegfGdzIUdRighKi84auJ2foYv4jh+VAU0= ; Received: from unknown (HELO ?74.118.28.236?) (nicolaa@rogers.com@74.118.28.236 with plain) by smtp106.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2007 11:28:56 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: pNqE.RkVM1m9i8YzJaEzpq_.1gN8.J40HpATOPz2.Lf8HDiu5Iflsnd6TpKAavyMabN2gUIFRm5WxOM7VdrribFYKZOebd0QQvN6qYd4r2ZB2Q-- Message-ID: <459CE4F9.3050206@rogers.com> Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 06:28:57 -0500 From: Susan Carroll-Clark User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Name of a hat? 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X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 06:31:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Greetings-- Kate M Bunting wrote: > Susan Carroll-Clark wrote: > > It's not a vine, it's the broom plant ("genista" in Latin), a shrub > with yellow pea-like flowers. > I knew it was a real plant...just couldn't remember which one and the corresponding Latin--thanks! Susan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 08:28:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04DSF8K017780 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:28:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04DSAGO010624 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:28:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04DR7mC078001 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 06:27:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04DR38X072495; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 06:27:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc15.comcast.net (sccrmhc15.comcast.net [63.240.77.85]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04DR0j8072347 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 06:27:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from goofy4@comcast.net) Message-Id: <200701041327.l04DR0j8072347@net.indra.com> Received: from stuckis.comcast.net (c-71-207-16-152.hsd1.pa.comcast.net[71.207.16.152]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc15) with SMTP id <20070104132654015004tr2ce>; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:26:54 +0000 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.1.0.9 Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 08:26:54 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Dianne & Greg Stucki Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 In-Reply-To: <000f01c72e88$a3e45a70$1b6ea450@CPQ21932199711> References: <000f01c72e88$a3e45a70$1b6ea450@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0cecb1b0-79e3-41d3-941f-c8465493731d X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459D00EA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 08:28:14 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 11:11 AM 1/2/2007, you wrote: >When thinking realistic, what do you think you will finish of >historical costumes in 2007?>> I am planning to finish the blue velvet pearled-and-spangled Elizabethan, a Spanish 16th century doublet gown, and several tunics and linen undergarments for Pennsic. Realistically, this is what I believe I can accomplish. Anything else, of course, is just an extra treat! Dianne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 10:08:06 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04F86Dl019580 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:08:06 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04F81P7030015 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:08:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04F7Soj090451 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:07:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04F7Kb6054173; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:07:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.134]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l04F7HjF054057 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:07:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ctrvlyfarm@sbcglobal.net) Received: (qmail 43769 invoked by uid 60001); 4 Jan 2007 15:07:12 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=geyFGStC0ZXbrMEbUqDv/5YRuL06hpQBZx3LiXqEqLtWAu0xGImkOGJ+ranpO2zUZOT10etdSnjEvPHI/U70kUWbPc6FgKraEHlDZqoRc9fLd4rxLClNQclKV4D3jdtbcOTYbOqjwxwWBv2+G1ctC4ycPOhor6YYTBCox8rX/Bk=; X-YMail-OSG: VzMXcZEVM1mOhpIK51tJMEbHvoXessama8MbGb0ciDJVkqJZe4f7MNhcZx_6gJVMJFkE1285O01a4zMfEHolMw_E1cI9alNzAVBQ98UgD2J30xNVIoWi8KTDralgtGTbRKKNUKysaTqWqi0- Received: from [68.250.179.38] by web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 07:07:11 PST Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 07:07:11 -0800 (PST) From: REBECCA BURCH Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <200701041327.l04DR0j8072347@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <1900.42596.qm@web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2a7f3594-2606-4927-9478-d49007444c32 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459D1851.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 10:08:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > >When thinking realistic, what do you think you will > finish of historical costumes in 2007?>> I hope to finish a new outfit for Ansel to wear at Bristol this summer. Which brings up another subject. I know some of you on the list attend the Bristol Faire. Ansel has brought last summer's outfit home and has requested some changes/adjustments be made. If anybody remembers him from the summer - any suggestions for improvements? I know the crotch length needs to be longer since he ripped out all the lacing and was forced to resort to suspenders to keep the slops up. And the doublet needs to fit better across the back. The codpiece seems to be fine, since it got some sort of award for "best male accessory"???? All of these changes need to be accomplished before he leaves for York, England to study for the next 6 months. He should arrive back just in time to start Faire again - so once again he will not be available for fittings!! Any suggestions will be appreciated. Rebecca Burch Center Valley Farm Duncan Falls, Ohio, USA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 10:32:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04FW82D019987 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:32:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04FW3Wa017283 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:32:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04FVSXO093812 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:31:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04FUndt077985; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:30:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04FUXqq077684 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:30:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.19381529; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:30:11 0000 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id l04FUAF19411.; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:30:10 GMT Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:30:10 +0000 Message-Id: <459D1D7202000014000C8407@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:29:54 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: [H-cost] French translation for Bjarne References: <200701041442.l04Efbmt030464@net.indra.com> In-Reply-To: <200701041442.l04Efbmt030464@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a193248e-55f9-4811-867c-97eee955befb X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459D1DF3.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 10:32:07 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Bjarne, In effect, they're apologising for the delay, but one of the books you ordered has not yet been supplied to them by the publisher, and they beg you to be patient for a few more days. They will let you know by e-mail when they can fulfil your order. Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 10:40:37 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04FeaAL020108 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:40:36 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04FeVE1015333 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:40:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04Fda3B094757 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:39:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04FcvK5086015; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:39:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04FcPnL085510 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:38:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.19382179; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:38:07 0000 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id l04Fc7F20699.; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:38:07 GMT Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:38:07 +0000 Message-Id: <459D1F5802000014000C840B@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:38:00 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Victorian wedding clothes References: <200701041442.l04Efbmt030464@net.indra.com> In-Reply-To: <200701041442.l04Efbmt030464@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f2e187d5-1db4-45f9-b2be-a44db4b4e5fe X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459D1FF0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 10:40:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Michaela wrote: >> I thought that too, however in my most recent research project covering the elliptical hoop >> though the early bustle (1865-1874) a noticeable percentage of wedding dresses were in the >> evening dress style. No more then 25%, but a noticeable percentage anyway. >I found it's usually respectable middle class that wears day dress (and >probably working class too as I suspect there wasn't much opportunity to go >to the opera or the odd ball....) and the aristocracy could wear off the >shoulder and the like. I was mostly looking at 1870s and 1880s there. Most >of the brides on the Musee McCorde site are wearing clothing to the neck. Thanks, Sunny and Michaela. Perhaps the Dracula bride was OK then, but the Nickleby wedding was middle-class and early Victorian. Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 11:18:31 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GIUwb020774 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:18:31 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04GIPwr030961 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:18:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04GHfch099925 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:17:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GH2Dm024759; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:17:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zixvpm01.creighton.edu (ZIXVPM01.creighton.edu [147.134.0.65]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GGQGd024137 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:16:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cynthiaabel@creighton.edu) Received: from zixvpm01.creighton.edu (ZixVPM [127.0.0.1]) by Outbound.creighton.edu (Proprietary) with ESMTP id 9F5432E82A6 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:14:34 -0600 (CST) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by zixvpm01.creighton.edu (Proprietary) with ESMTP id 7F3FC2E812F for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:14:34 -0600 (CST) Received: from exbe01.blue.jays.creighton.edu (exbe01.creighton.edu [147.134.2.111]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_29774)/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA27781 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:16:25 -0600 (CST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost] re: The other Boleyn girl Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:15:42 -0600 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] re: The other Boleyn girl Thread-Index: AccmFxLv1zhIEknzQC2a/t9k7KoBmQKAc2Jg From: "Abel, Cynthia" To: "Historical Costume" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l04GGQGd024137 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a198b2dd-8e6b-436d-afd5-74f0b3293e03 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459D28D1.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 11:18:29 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Warnicke's biog has some theories I disagree with: Anne was the eldest, not Mary, brother George was possibly gay and the premature son Anne miscarried was probably malformed(therefore in those days deemed a monster)and Anne's fault(its always the woman's fault!)which led Henry to believe she was a witch. Warnicke, however, does give a convincing argument for the traditional 1507 birthdate for Anne, although that would make Mary very, very young to have an affair with Henry. Most historians nowdays think Anne was born between 1500-1502. My own theory is that Anne was probably born in 1507 and went first to the Burgundian court at age 6 or 7. Warnicke points out that another of Henry's courtier's sent his daughter Jane to the Burgundian court at the same age. The regent Marguerite had English blood through her descent from Edward IV's sister.Henry VIII's younger sister, Mary, was originally engaged to Marguerite's nephew(?), so it could be that Mary Boleyn would have been a lady-in-waiting or maid of honor to Mary Tudor, a higher position than just being in the household of Marguerite. When the Burgundian marriage plans/treaty failed, Mary Tudor was made the bride of Louis, King of France, and Mary was in her household that traveled to France. Sir Thomas Boleyn swiftly removed Anne from Burgundy and secured her a place in the French royal household. However, the whole Anne as a scheming Monica Lewinsky and Henry as a besotted Bill Clinton(it is glaringly obvious in the novel)was Gregory's take. Cindy Abel -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Dor Mous Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 4:18 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: The other Boleyn girl That's the problem for me.They make out Philippa Gregory practically IS a historian now and a lot of people believe the hype. The novel was based on the highly controversial work of real historian, Retha Warnicke, whose crackpot theories have been lambasted many times. All the factual inaccuracies were Ms Gregory's, and there are plenty: basic facts, English culture, clothing etc. Even Mary Boleyn's not knowing how to make cook or make cheese was all wrong. Running a household was standard training for any English gentlewoman in the 16th century, even social climbers like the Boleyns. The distant, 'not getting her hands dirty' lady was a development of later ages, and Tudor ladies knew how to do everything, even when they could afford to pay someone else to do it. I understand that this is a film, based on a work of fiction. I'm happy that some changes will be made to cover dramatic license and furthering the story. This applies to costume too so I'm happy with some costume inaccuracy. But these costumes are just ugly. The French hood fronts are too small. Plain unflattering to both lead actresses. 'Anne of the Thousand Days', for all its many factual and costume inaccuracies, at least did Genevieve Bujold the courtesy of costuming her elegantly, and her inaccurate French hood fronts suited her. Never mind the dresses, I'm not sure I can bear a whole film watching Nathalie Portman and Scarlett Johannson with those things on their heads. I don't think it will have the comedy value of 'Shakespeare in Love' or the fine performances of 'Elizabeth', two other glaringly inaccurate but fairly enjoyable films. h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: Message: 4 Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2006 11:26:50 -0500 From: monica spence Subject: RE: [h-cost] re: The other Boleyn girl To: Historical Costume Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I read the book too, but it did not make me crazy. It is so easy to make a mistake about clothing when you are a writer with little or no background in clothing history. I pretty much ignore that stuff. Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 11:30:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GUH69020973 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:30:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04GUC1H004865 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:30:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04GSNQP001671 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:28:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GRPCb034997; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:27:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GQb5K034038 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:26:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.bf8.d3d89e4 (14467) for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:26:25 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:26:23 EST Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e38b035d-a564-4587-957f-9543fb83eeeb X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459D2B94.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 11:30:16 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/4/2007 1:01:41 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, sunshine_buchler@agilent.com writes: > Two programmes on British TV over Christmas showed Victorian > brides in sleeveless dresses. One was the film of "Nicholas > Nickleby", the other a version of "Dracula". Dammit, you wear > DAY clothes to a wedding! (or used to.) I thought that too, however in my most recent research project covering the elliptical hoop though the early bustle (1865-1874) a noticeable percentage of wedding dresses were in the evening dress style. No more then 25%, but a noticeable percentage anyway. -sunny ********************************** Perhaps 25% of brides were getting married in the evening instead of during the day. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 11:33:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GXmYg021033 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:33:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04GXhkA006548 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:33:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04GX8tD002468 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:33:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GWZMv040456; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:33:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta9.adelphia.net (mta9.adelphia.net [68.168.78.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GVf8F039373 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:32:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from tgilbert737@roadrunner.com) Received: from VAIO ([76.179.128.239]) by mta9.adelphia.net (InterMail vM.6.01.05.02 201-2131-123-102-20050715) with SMTP id <20070104163135.VNOZ20139.mta9.adelphia.net@VAIO> for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:31:35 -0500 Message-ID: <001901c7301d$c7ec3780$020fa8c0@VAIO> From: "Gilbert" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1900.42596.qm@web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:31:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 45257b49-7564-4c3a-b95e-099bcab18297 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459D2C68.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 11:33:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >> >When thinking realistic, what do you think you will >> finish of historical costumes in 2007?>> I hope to finish that $#& Empire Gown. I finished it once, only to find that the blue border I chose to offset the off-white ground of the bodice piece was a little too overwhelming, and made the bodice front look rather like the black bars seen on TV covering up the naughty bits. Not quite the effect for which I was aiming... Argh... Then, dare I speak of another project before this one is done, when my second book is published, I may tackle a dress that is circa 1775--this time with a pattern someone else made (I need a break from making my own for a moment). But, on the other hand, as that book is only *half* historical, I may not... Marjorie Marjorie Gilbert author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England www.marjoriegilbert.net Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm> _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 11:46:55 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GktQZ021235 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:46:55 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04Gkol7002442 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:46:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04Gk5Vw004778 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:46:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GjFQk053821; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:46:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04GiX40052861 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:45:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cbe.4f45f60 (14467) for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:44:24 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:44:22 EST Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2ff5283a-6e76-4295-a00a-76b9da082910 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459D2F7A.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 11:46:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/4/2007 11:29:29 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, AlbertCat@aol.com writes: Perhaps 25% of brides were getting married in the evening instead of during the day. ***************** I didn't mean that to sound as snarky as it does....forgive me. But it does make me think.... Where might the bride be going after the wedding? To the train station to commence the honeymoon? To a big whoop-de-do dinner after the ceremony? How might that affect things? It's not 'til like the 1830's that special wedding dresses come into play in the 1st place, isn't it? Remember in "Age of Innocence" [1870's] it was expected that May should again wear her wedding dress at least once in the 1st year of marriage. She wears it to the opera, so it was no day dress. For "Nicholas Nickleby" the idea of a sleeveless dress for any occasion at all is strange. Was this the film that came out a couple of years ago. That thing had some of the worst, laziest costuming I've ever seen! The 8 hour stage production on film from the 1980's has much superior costumes. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 12:04:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04H4p8u021614 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:04:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04H4kWX023751 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:04:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04H4FNW007530 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:04:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04H2SwJ071551; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:03:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wr-out-0506.google.com (wr-out-0506.google.com [64.233.184.228]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04H10md070058 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:01:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynndownward@gmail.com) Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i12so2283005wra for ; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:00:59 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=hcazaRqZdlmg0M2aIPV/edl5ZzyFd2GPZja3BJ9qtxIWKfPZlogLt3tAsS5mNog59FAg7zVDPvzQbc8YGjtz1JBC1d0w63V8eo+TPnUcvy1iDzhRfusMboI+CRMrQ7Cilw+n7Vzi00cZggIxYZ4VHS5jwvTdtqSR4Vtczo7m+iA= Received: by 10.90.115.4 with SMTP id n4mr364942agc.1167930059468; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:00:59 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.51.6 with HTTP; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:00:59 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <8296995c0701040900r6e0e4db8q930f25c74ad0d30e@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:00:59 -0800 From: "Lynn Downward" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin In-Reply-To: <010420070335.19520.459C75FD000D187D00004C4022058861720809070E029D0E0A0809079BA101A10E020A040A@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <010420070335.19520.459C75FD000D187D00004C4022058861720809070E029D0E0A0809079BA101A10E020A040A@comcast.net> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 61981cc8-84d9-4971-a6f8-60225b07c631 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459D33AE.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 12:04:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Helen/Aiden, I also received my disc, just before New Year's. I haven't had the time to check it out yet, but I've brought it to work to view at lunch. Thank you very much! LynnD On 1/3/07, elena_o_tighearnaigh@comcast.net wrote: > Helen/Aidan, I happily received the CD-ROM just after Christmas! > > Thank you for the disc! > > Happy Happy dance... > > Elena/Gia > > -------------- Original message -------------- > From: "Helen Pinto" > > > The catalogue is gone, but if you send me your mailing address, I'll send > > you a CD-Rom of the scans of all the pages. > > -Helen/Aidan > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Voncile W. Dudley" > > To: "Historical Costume" > > Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 10:15 AM > > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin > > > > > > > > > > I'm late checking my email. I would love to have any books that needs > > > a good home especially garments from the 15th century up. > > > Lady Von > > > Hope I am not to late! > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Helen Pinto" > > > To: "Historical Costume" > > > Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 11:18 PM > > > Subject: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin > > > > > > > > >> In the process of (finally) unpacking my books, I've been finding things > > >> that could use a home other than mine. I have a Metropolitan Museum of > > >> Art Bulletin from back in the days when they sent members these glossy > > >> books every quarter. It's from the costume collection and contains large, > > >> high-quality pictures of garments from 1695 through the early 1950's, > > >> including microphotographs of some of the embroidered detail of the > > >> garments. It's nice to look at, but way past anything I'm really > > >> interested in. > > >> So... I will scan and send photos of anything that someone fancies, and > > >> the whole thing can belong to the first person who asks for it. (You have > > >> two weeks to ask for the pictures, then I'll mail it.) The highlights: > > >> > > >> - Complete embroidered woman's dress from 1695 > > >> - Four men's 18th c embroidered coats, one uncut, one with original > > >> embroidery cartoon, one with pants and vest > > >> - Men's banyans > > >> - Assorted women's 18c dresses, one with panniers, most sack-backed, all > > >> embroidered or hand-painted, 1740's - 1795 > > >> - Assorted women's 19c outfits, day dresses, evening wear, several from > > >> each decade > > >> - Assorted women's 20c outfits, evening wear, suits, etc, up to the 50's > > >> > > >> -Helen/Aidan > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 12:09:35 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04H9ZS0021741 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:09:35 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04H9ULf024346 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:09:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04H7vQh008137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:07:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04H7Mwp076356; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:07:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep35.mail.dk (fep35.mail.dk [80.160.76.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04H7B0S076073 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:07:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep42.mail.dk ([195.41.46.225]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070104160650.SPQE11211.fep34.mail.dk@fep42.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 17:06:50 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.76]) by fep42.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070104160650.KIYL18380.fep42.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 17:06:50 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c7301a$5d3250d0$4c43a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701041442.l04Efbmt030464@net.indra.com> <459D1D7202000014000C8407@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> Subject: Re: [H-cost] French translation for Bjarne Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 17:06:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep42.mail.dk from [80.161.67.76] at Thu, 4 Jan 2007 17:06:47 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 198da253-a41d-4055-b121-762574b84eb1 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459D34CA.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 12:09:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Kate, Million thanks for your great help. I feared it might be they couldnt get it after all, but it surely is worth waiting for. Its the book about Marie Antoinettes wardrobe. Many many thanks Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 4:29 PM Subject: [H-cost] French translation for Bjarne > Bjarne, > In effect, they're apologising for the delay, but one of the books you > ordered has not yet been supplied to them by the publisher, and they beg > you to be patient for a few more days. They will let you know by e-mail > when they can fulfil your order. > > Kate Bunting > Librarian and 17th century reenactor > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 12:14:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04HExWs021834 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:14:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04HEs87000735 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:14:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04HERKx009241 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:14:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04HDsds082820; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:14:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04HDJRe082050 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:13:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos2.cos.agilent.com (relcos2.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.237]) by msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 677EA20EDC for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:50:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosvs02.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs02.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.188]) by relcos2.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDF9A146B8D for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:50:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosbh02.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.126]) by wcosvs02.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:50:19 -0700 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh02.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:50:19 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:50:17 -0700 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D9640213AF78@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> In-Reply-To: <200701041441.l04Efbms030464@net.indra.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film Thread-Index: AccwDwoiTPmG92PQQDy3nH9TmQPBJAAD3T7g From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Jan 2007 16:50:19.0390 (UTC) FILETIME=[6AE619E0:01C73020] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l04HDJRe082050 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 99cb1ca7-5cca-4c46-943f-0bb0354919ff X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459D360E.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 12:14:58 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > I found it's usually respectable middle class that wears day > dress (and > probably working class too as I suspect there wasn't much > opportunity to go > to the opera or the odd ball....) and the aristocracy could > wear off the > shoulder and the like. I was mostly looking at 1870s and > 1880s there. Most > of the brides on the Musee McCorde site are wearing clothing > to the neck. I agree that all the instances of evening-style wedding dresses are decidedly upper class - though not just the aristocracy, as there is an extant example from Chicago (or Cincinnati -- one of the Midwestern cities that starts with a "C"...). I suppose my argument depends on a very narrow definition of aristocracy to mean those whose families are lords - when you start talking about the "American aristocracy" it becomes impossible (imho) to differentiate the aristocracy from the upper class. > None of the fashion plates show the lower necked style for > weddings (though > there are rather more open necks for day wear.) Actually I found at least one fashion plate that showed an evening-style wedding dress. It's from "Le Monde Elegant", the September, 1870 issue. (Shown in Vyvyan Holland's _Hand Coloured Fashion Plates 1770 to 1899_, pg. 126). I've been surprised by how many fashion plates and extant wedding dresses fall into the "dinner dress" style with an open "V" or rectangular neckline - very similar to the day dresses, but day dresses and visiting dresses rarely seem to have an open neckline. -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 12:18:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04HI46c021908 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:18:04 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04HHxeW029429 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:18:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04HHTip009656 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:17:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04HGr6R086009; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:17:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.prismnet.com (smtp.prismnet.com [209.198.128.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04HEN01083261 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:15:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from webmail.io.com (webmail.io.com [209.198.128.99]) by smtp.prismnet.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l04HEGZC093674 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:14:16 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from 65.117.156.5 (SquirrelMail authenticated user ches) by webmail.io.com with HTTP; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:14:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <34500.65.117.156.5.1167930856.squirrel@webmail.io.com> In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:14:16 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant From: "Chiara Francesca" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on smtp.prismnet.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 required=7.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.0 (2005-09-13) on smtp.prismnet.com Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9224cdc5-b198-4f0e-8797-8f45c19b4b6e X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459D36C8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 12:18:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I often wondered the same thing. My dad is the curator of a very small south texas town museum. There are a few victorian wedding dresses in there and they are not of the same design. I took pictures but the glass they have on there is very reflective and they did not come out well. My favorite has a tulle that is beaded over laying the dress ... it is just beautiful. I will throw up the pictures if anyone wants to see them. Just let me know. Chiara On Thu, January 4, 2007 10:44 am, AlbertCat@aol.com said: > > In a message dated 1/4/2007 11:29:29 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > AlbertCat@aol.com writes: > > Perhaps 25% of brides were getting married in the evening instead > of during > > the day. > > > > ***************** > > I didn't mean that to sound as snarky as it does....forgive me. > > But it does make me think.... > > Where might the bride be going after the wedding? To the train > station to > commence the honeymoon? To a big whoop-de-do dinner after the > ceremony? How > might that affect things? > It's not 'til like the 1830's that special wedding dresses come into > play in > the 1st place, isn't it? > > Remember in "Age of Innocence" [1870's] it was expected that May > should > again wear her wedding dress at least once in the 1st year of > marriage. She wears > it to the opera, so it was no day dress. > > For "Nicholas Nickleby" the idea of a sleeveless dress for any > occasion at > all is strange. Was this the film that came out a couple of years > ago. That > thing had some of the worst, laziest costuming I've ever seen! The 8 > hour stage > production on film from the 1980's has much superior costumes. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 13:46:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04IjrgH023534 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:45:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04IjlwI009754 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:45:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04Ij5nf022358 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:45:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04IhxO0082332; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:44:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l047Cboi031455 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 00:12:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA30940 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:59:40 -0600 Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 01:59:40 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <005c01c72fc3$de2c6c90$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d1c1e606-8566-4b4d-8c80-ba67fdadfcc8 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459D4B5B.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 13:45:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A little prowling online turned up a teaching package from the Petrie museum that includes a photo and description of the bead-net dress (among many other items) and detailed directions for making one. I'm sure that the directions are modernized, but they're complex enough they clearly aren't meant to be Halloween-costume level. http://www.petrie.ucl.ac.uk/Textiles%20in%20the%20Petrie%20Museum.doc --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 14:14:36 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JEalI024161 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:14:36 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04JEVVs007509 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:14:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04JE0Eo026666 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:14:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JD4bj013948; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:13:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep35.mail.dk (fep35.mail.dk [80.160.76.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04EfVPg030293 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 07:41:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep42.mail.dk ([195.41.46.225]) by fep35.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070104144121.JOVY4127.fep35.mail.dk@fep42.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:41:21 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.76]) by fep42.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070104144121.KGWP18380.fep42.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:41:21 +0100 Message-ID: <002001c7300e$66482cf0$4c43a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:41:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep42.mail.dk from [80.161.67.76] at Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:41:15 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] french translation again X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 697631ab-d96b-49de-a5f7-c6ba41ba40af X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459D5217.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 14:14:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I dont know who to get help from except maybe one of you. I ordered books from the french amazon, and they sended me a note in french off cause. Saying: Notification d'un retard de livraison Numéro de commande Chapitre : 1684054 Numéro de commande Amazon : 736-2550099-8381908 Chèr(e) Drews Leif, Nous avons bien reçu votre commande du 28/12/2006 14:58:00. Malgré tous nos efforts, nous n'avons pas été en mesure de vous expédier le ou les articles à ce jour. Nous nous en excusons vivement. Nous mettons tout en oeuvre pour pouvoir vous les expédier dans les meilleurs délais. L'article ou l'un des articles de votre commande ne nous a pas encore été livré par l'éditeur ou par nos fournisseurs. Nous vous prions de bien vouloir patienter encore quelques jours. Dès que possible, nous vous préviendrons par e-mail de l'état d'avancement de la commande et de sa date d'expédition. Merci de votre compréhension. Could a kind sould help me out with this? Many many thanks in advance Bjarne . Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 14:18:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JISwo024251 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:18:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04JINMV028075 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:18:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04JGTrN026981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:16:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JFEVq016067; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:15:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from vms048pub.verizon.net (vms048pub.verizon.net [206.46.252.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JECXe015006 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:14:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hdpinto@verizon.net) Received: from HELENPINTO ([71.126.41.222]) by vms048.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JBC00JFYVWTEBW5@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 12:13:46 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 13:12:25 -0500 From: "Helen Pinto" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin To: "Historical Costume" Message-id: <015a01c7302b$e9e7ad70$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <010420070335.19520.459C75FD000D187D00004C4022058861720809070E029D0E0A0809079BA101A10E020A040A@comcast.net> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 848747ca-80bb-4f8a-a376-a78a6daf8b00 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459D5300.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 14:18:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Glad to hear it got there; enjoy, -Helen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 14:35:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JZq3c024592 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:35:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04JZlpp006081 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:35:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04JZN6t029689 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:35:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JYijs036281; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:35:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04FEcpp060849 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:14:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.173.84.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.173.84]) by pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H2UIf-0006MC-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 10:14:37 -0500 In-Reply-To: <2F107494-F8D3-4785-9207-911C089DF5B1@mindspring.com> References: <843871.33999.qm@web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <000601c72f73$85244640$da6ea450@CPQ21932199711> <2F107494-F8D3-4785-9207-911C089DF5B1@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v749.3) X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <2F278097-76B3-49DE-A828-71D6AE4DAC4F@mindspring.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:14:46 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.749.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: dcabda43-b447-4c81-a0e7-c25a1d9b045f X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459D5713.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 14:35:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO P.S. Surely that's a gun with attached bayonet over his shoulder? --Ruth Anne On Jan 3, 2007, at 3:36 PM, Ruth Anne Baumgartner wrote: > It looks to me like a border guard or castle guard at a small > guardhouse. Lovely helmet. Halt! > Happy new year, everyone! > --Ruth Anne Baumgartner > scholar gypsy and amateur costumer > > On Jan 3, 2007, at 3:12 PM, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" >> To: "Historical Costume" >> Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 7:19 PM >> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject >> >> >>> Hi and we want to wish you all the very, very best for the New Year! >>> >>> I thought of you specifically Bjarne, but I don't doubt there's >>> enough people on this list who will appreciate these too! >>> >>> http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_80.htm >>> >>> Chris R. >>> >>> As for historical costumes for this year? I have two 1880's >>> ball gowns I WILL finish :) >> >> Dear Chris, >> Oh many many thanks for that link. How charming they are. >> Dont quite understand is it an angel standing with a gun? at the >> small house to the left? >> Quite interresting to study the closeup pictures of the chenille >> embroidery. >> I have a picture of danish garthers with english text, saying >> "When this you see, remember me!" But i think it was very used. >> >> Thanks again, and good luck with your ball gowns. >> >> Bjarne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 14:40:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JetPc024672 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:40:55 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04JepRb024014 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:40:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04JdFFJ030539 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:39:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JchRP040927; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:39:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.189]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l04FKc5o067122 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 08:20:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wildthangstreasures@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 63215 invoked by uid 60001); 4 Jan 2007 15:20:33 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=TxBnRDnEH0uTf99qwNVyFgEHrJOebjKCb5EI+0enoG1G3RsBNHZgj+5RlQxW2SWoibZWAf8QvBweReQ4VxMwlWPlCWycJbBd9UfreakdAkakx125Pml5kdQLdNgOga2z40cRUHYGvLHrpe393PxqubxRvu0zCRDfAXKecye8FoM=; X-YMail-OSG: Saw2lZcVM1lXctfY9138CLtrF_IjAZ1RiwhZkbSpQpRW.6E4QYgOg7plcuSupHYU9VxESMHkhRg8KH3Gj60gn9aL3GejLF7NuEsobeuNwbE1ayp9xq4Vwx2UmpFJp2cKsxCJ0cgBR8AWDqQ- Received: from [70.187.40.219] by web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 07:20:32 PST Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 07:20:32 -0800 (PST) From: "Voncile W. Dudley" Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <108797.63201.qm@web33911.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2bb54643-e850-4e45-af24-d250ff021d7f X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459D5843.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 14:40:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Yep, incredibly cool. I made a large soft sculture doll that wears infant size clothing. When you start the doll you don't know the sex until it just takes on its own as it is finished. Can't say going to make a girl or boy because what you get is what you get just like real life. Enjoyed your site. Lady Von Yeah, it's incredibly cool. (The same sort of technique seems to have been used for beaded-net sarcophagus covers that would include a facial portrait of the deceased.) I had fun making one for my "ancient Egyptian doll" -- see digthatdoll/egyptianwoman.html>. It's about 2/3 of the way down the page. (The doll is about 10" tall.) Heather Lady Von http://www.wildthangstreasures.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 14:56:55 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JupYa025044 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:56:55 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04Jujpx008970 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:56:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04JtVj4033180 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:55:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JsRB9057200; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:54:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JpxDQ054798 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:52:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep44.mail.dk ([195.41.46.227]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070104195151.CVMR11211.fep34.mail.dk@fep44.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:51:51 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.76]) by fep44.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070104195151.KOSP11319.fep44.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:51:51 +0100 Message-ID: <003101c73039$d7641cc0$4c43a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <843871.33999.qm@web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com><000601c72f73$85244640$da6ea450@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:52:16 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep44.mail.dk from [80.161.67.76] at Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:51:50 +0100 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 431267a2-cbf9-492e-932c-4de640910e24 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459D5BFD.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 14:56:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi again, I gues you have to study many embroideries with motifs of persons, before you get the right eyes to read it. But your suggestion, makes scence. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lauren Walker" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 10:45 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject >I suppose this is going to be a Rorshach -- I don't see an angel with a >gun, but a spotted dog standing guard (the structure being dog house/guard >house?) with a gun. But then, one man's angel could be another woman's >spotted dog, I suppose... > Lauren M. Walker > lauren.walker@comcast.net > > > > On Jan 3, 2007, at 3:12 PM, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" >> To: "Historical Costume" >> Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 7:19 PM >> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 OT on this subject >> >> >>> Hi and we want to wish you all the very, very best for the New Year! >>> >>> I thought of you specifically Bjarne, but I don't doubt there's enough >>> people on this list who will appreciate these too! >>> >>> http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_80.htm >>> >>> Chris R. >>> >>> As for historical costumes for this year? I have two 1880's ball >>> gowns I WILL finish :) >> >> Dear Chris, >> Oh many many thanks for that link. How charming they are. >> Dont quite understand is it an angel standing with a gun? at the small >> house to the left? >> Quite interresting to study the closeup pictures of the chenille >> embroidery. >> I have a picture of danish garthers with english text, saying "When this >> you see, remember me!" But i think it was very used. >> >> Thanks again, and good luck with your ball gowns. >> >> Bjarne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 14:58:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JwlPP025080 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:58:47 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04Jwg5Y020793 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:58:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04Jv9BB033449 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:57:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JudvO059436; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:57:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04JtHL4058025 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:55:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA00546 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:42:23 -0600 Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:42:23 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 In-Reply-To: <200701041327.l04DR0j8072347@net.indra.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 21308ae3-cd7b-4846-aecc-70e13b84c95a X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459D5C72.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 14:58:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > >When thinking realistic, what do you think you will finish of > >historical costumes in 2007? I don't do much sewing these days, but I have a few must-do projects for the next few months. I have been dieting for health reasons, and after dropping 18 pounds have found that the Gothic fitted dress I use for my lectures is now too large for my new figure. I would like to re-make it before I speak at CostumeCon at the end of March. In a pinch I can wear my last lecture dress, about a decade old now, which once again fits me, but it is not ideal, as it is silk, and I like to demonstrate the effects of wool, which was historically more typical. (Sue C. will remember the silk dress as the one I wore in Boise.) However, I also want to make a sillier costume just-for-fun for CostumeCon -- who knows when I will have another excuse to do it. Can I do them both by the end of March? Don't know; I have journal editing and an article to write, in addition to my day job. CostumeCon info here: http://www.cc25.net/start.htm And info on my full day of lectures here: http://www.cc25.net/netherton.htm I'd love to know if I'll be seeing any h-costume people there! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 15:11:11 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04KBBa4025337 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:11:11 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04KB6f7028411 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:11:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04KAg1K035171 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:10:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04K9W4e072483; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:10:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wr-out-0506.google.com (wr-out-0506.google.com [64.233.184.230]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04I9DMM043769 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:09:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bestinterests@gmail.com) Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id 50so2217975wri for ; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 10:09:10 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=Q1SZPTRVyqCWdkkq1oJpqd4mie0Bm/dR4UGzIyduCfOxi24+bQdrnsgo5RPZZjs15hMchd+atWL4YTUwVDAvDn6d3/7qfwwMQwfjWGj4eFnBE0ucr+fjGu3el9H/PDY8jZk22VpEwm4H+W8ulRfkrHvJkjaUPJW6tiAEdIBJCNI= Received: by 10.78.203.13 with SMTP id a13mr2657031hug.1167932485860; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:41:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.78.37.3 with HTTP; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:41:25 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:41:25 -0800 From: "ann marie" To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] challenges of 16th century dress differences X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6bba9961-2fb3-4a72-8ee0-a1876156e0d2 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459D5F5A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:11:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Please assist me with your expertise in determining the differences between the French and English fashions of the 1560's for women. How did the skirts differ in shape and length? Bodice lines? Fabric choices? Embelishments? Sleeves attached or detached for changing? Recognizing that this may be a broad question, please be patient in helping me understand these differences across social classes. Thank you Ann Morton -- Live Well * Laugh Often * Love Much _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 16:41:55 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04Lfp3a026765 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 16:41:55 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04LfkEt024196 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 16:41:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04Lf8DQ048219 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:41:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04LeKTx069117; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:41:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04Lci0w067475 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:39:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A6BDC384B3 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:38:43 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:38:51 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] velvet question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 49df7135-eaa6-4442-bf09-23667d06a0a6 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459D749A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 16:41:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On a Norse list some people are trying to find out whether velvet or velvet like material was around during the "Viking" age. There is something about Egypt having a pile type fabric but someone send that it was totally different from velvet. So does anyone have the skinny on the subject? Thank you, De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 16:43:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04LhCcZ026786 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 16:43:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04Lh75d025007 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 16:43:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04LfvYE048399 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:41:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04LfONq070292; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:41:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04LcrJm067549 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:39:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D546BA99B for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:38:47 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <459D73E8.10502@reddawn.net> Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:38:48 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] challenges of 16th century dress differences References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9eeffbb0-50c3-42c5-aa10-b90a2ddc37c6 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459D74EB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 16:43:11 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ann marie wrote: > Please assist me with your expertise in determining the differences between > the French and English fashions of the 1560's for women. How did the > skirts > differ in shape and length? Bodice lines? Fabric choices? Embelishments? > Sleeves attached or detached for changing? Recognizing that this may be a > broad question, please be patient in helping me understand these > differences > across social classes. That's a very broad question. Herees a couple pictures to help you in your analysis: http://www.tate.org.uk/servlet/ViewWork?workid=1497 Unknown woman about 1569 in French style clothing. And some English in style from about the same time: http://www.tate.org.uk/servlet/ViewWork?workid=4208&searchid=44981 http://www.tate.org.uk/servlet/ViewWork?workid=4207&searchid=44981 Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 18:10:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04NABXG028330 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:10:16 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l04NA6Ss007462 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:10:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l04N9JlG062886 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 16:09:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04N8KaF064526; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 16:09:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from vms040pub.verizon.net (vms040pub.verizon.net [206.46.252.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l04N7YVn063633 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 16:08:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hdpinto@verizon.net) Received: from HELENPINTO ([71.126.41.222]) by vms040.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JBD00DMZ9I9OASP@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 17:07:14 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:06:05 -0500 From: "Helen Pinto" Subject: Re: [h-cost] french translation again To: "Historical Costume" Message-id: <00af01c73054$ecee8830$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <002001c7300e$66482cf0$4c43a150@CPQ21932199711> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 00f19ba0-6a05-4cc1-81b5-f4dc7ee9abc7 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459D894E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:10:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Bjarne- Here's a translation to English: Notification of a delay in delivery Chapter Order Number 1684054 Amazon Order Number 736-2550099-8381908 Dear Drews Leif, We have received your order of 12/28/2006:14:48:00. Despite all our efforts, we were not able to send you the items at this time. We are very sorry. We will make every effort to send them to you as soon as possible. The item or one of the items in your order has not been delivered to us yet by the publisher or our suppliers. Please be patient for a few days. As soon as possible, we will notify you by e-mail with the status of your order and a delivery date. Thank you for your understanding. Hope this helps, -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 20:01:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0511fQN030107 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:01:41 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0511ano006949 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:01:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05111bO078538 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:01:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0510cdJ076650; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:00:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l051061l076218 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:00:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0513kIX009099 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:03:46 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:08:08 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 74f68626-c9a4-4f35-a011-5a705d211b80 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459DA370.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:01:40 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Thursday 04 January 2007 2:59 am, Robin Netherton wrote: > A little prowling online turned up a teaching package from the Petrie > museum that includes a photo and description of the bead-net dress (among > many other items) and detailed directions for making one. I'm sure that > the directions are modernized, but they're complex enough they clearly > aren't meant to be Halloween-costume level. > > http://www.petrie.ucl.ac.uk/Textiles%20in%20the%20Petrie%20Museum.doc Neat! Thank you. (One more project for the "future projects" pile.) :-) -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 21:48:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052m12K031983 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:48:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l052lu4V007928 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:47:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l052lMsL089125 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:47:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052lGI6051926; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:47:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052lBZw051855 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:47:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m153.in-tch.com [216.166.191.153]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l052YEM01720 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:34:14 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <00ad01c73075$038e1ae0$99bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] velvet question Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:55:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b9a630d3-3e5a-422a-9962-5a2526bd8d9c X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459DBC5C.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 21:48:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I haven't heard of the Egyptian piled fabric, but as far as I know, velvet was invented well *after* the Viking Age, so no velvet Viking poofy pants! ;oD --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 2:38 PM Subject: [h-cost] velvet question > On a Norse list some people are trying to find out whether velvet or velvet > like material was around during the "Viking" age. > There is something about Egypt having a pile type fabric but someone send > that it was totally different from velvet. > So does anyone have the skinny on the subject? > Thank you, > De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 21:49:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052nGHH031999 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:49:16 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l052nBmq003494 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:49:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l052mmWC089314 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:48:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052mk0S053051; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:48:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l050sfv9072133 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 17:54:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l050wLoA008941 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:58:22 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:02:43 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <005c01c72fc3$de2c6c90$6700a8c0@momlaptop> <00a101c72fc7$33f91df0$6700a8c0@momlaptop> In-Reply-To: <00a101c72fc7$33f91df0$6700a8c0@momlaptop> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701042002.43780.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: be8da899-d536-48d0-ba76-3134b800ddd4 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459DBCA7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 21:49:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Thursday 04 January 2007 1:11 am, Penny Ladnier wrote: > Okay, I caught up on the topic... I'm sorry for my stupid question. > > I am wondering if these Egyptian dresses that were found in the 1920s were > what made beaded dresses in the 1920s so fashionable. From my research, > they appear in fashion around the same time as the dates of the beaded > Egyptian dress finds. They do, but the "beaded dresses" Rosalind Hall (?) Janessen talks about are significantly different than the finely beaded creations of the 1920s. They are a coarse mesh, made of either linen thread or large beads. Some of the western "beaded dresses" may incorporate motifs from Egyptian pictorial art, but I don't think the actual ancient "beaded dresses" were that big a factor. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 21:49:23 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052nN22032003 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:49:23 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l052nJTf030829 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:49:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l052n0AV089357 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:49:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052mxji053266; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:49:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0511oXl077539 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:01:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus0) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1H2dSv24Nj-0005Fz; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:01:50 -0500 Message-ID: <010701c73065$14883750$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:01:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: dbb1cbaf-2a89-4848-a47e-77e6061ccc3a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459DBCAF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 21:49:22 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Albert Cat, I have etiquette books from the later part of the Victorian period. They suggest that the bride wear her wearing dress for the first year after the wedding. She is to wear to special events. My grandmother married in 1901 and had a nice white wedding dress. She wore it church frequently. BTW, she was of modest means. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 21:56:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052uoFB032114 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:56:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l052ujx8003755 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:56:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l052uK7a090199 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:56:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052uIm0058285; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:56:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052uFPt058235 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:56:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m153.in-tch.com [216.166.191.153]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l052hIM04283 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:43:18 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <010601c73076$4787ba20$99bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:04:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 529e54de-0e3a-4e48-9078-2d7886a4ba25 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459DBE6D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 21:56:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I do remember, although mostly I remember you talking about silk fabric and how it works with the whole GFD engineering ideas. You actually showed us a couple of different ones, including one that was wool in some sort of diamond pattern? (foggy memory on the details). --Sue, who is going to be dabbling in the 13th century this year, and if she still fits into her GFD pattern, will be making one of those. Finally. ;o) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 1:42 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 > > > >When thinking realistic, what do you think you will finish of > > >historical costumes in 2007? > > I don't do much sewing these days, but I have a few must-do projects for > the next few months. I have been dieting for health reasons, and after > dropping 18 pounds have found that the Gothic fitted dress I use for my > lectures is now too large for my new figure. I would like to re-make it > before I speak at CostumeCon at the end of March. In a pinch I can wear my > last lecture dress, about a decade old now, which once again fits me, but > it is not ideal, as it is silk, and I like to demonstrate the effects of > wool, which was historically more typical. (Sue C. will remember the silk > dress as the one I wore in Boise.) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 21:56:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052ulr0032110 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:56:47 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l052uhUO011720 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 21:56:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l052uP8A090213 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:56:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052uMcN058357; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:56:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052uIup058284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:56:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.4] (209-148-118-4.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.4]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id l052uHku007903 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:56:17 -0800 Message-ID: <459DBE5B.1010001@lavoltapress.com> Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:56:27 -0800 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant References: <010701c73065$14883750$6700a8c0@momlaptop> In-Reply-To: <010701c73065$14883750$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8baab484-30d2-412b-8a10-c08d5f65e7a9 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459DBE6B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 21:56:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Penny Ladnier wrote: > Albert Cat, > > I have etiquette books from the later part of the Victorian period. > They suggest that the bride wear her wearing dress for the first year > after the wedding. She is to wear to special events. > Yes, but often as an evening dress, and not necessarily in the same form as when used as a wedding dress. It was not uncommon to make the wedding dress so that it could easily be transformed into an evening dress either permanently or at will (removable parts). Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 22:35:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053ZqA4000339 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:35:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l053ZlWV028029 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:35:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l053ZDES094350 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:35:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053Z7C4084955; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:35:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053Z35c084848 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:35:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from [10.0.1.2] (c-24-21-156-164.hsd1.mn.comcast.net [24.21.156.164]) by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id l053Yw012487 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:34:58 -0500 In-Reply-To: <00ad01c73075$038e1ae0$99bfa6d8@pavilion> References: <00ad01c73075$038e1ae0$99bfa6d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <410D1E23-75E3-4D24-A3C3-32E4EF132C2C@alfalfapress.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Althea Turner Subject: Re: [h-cost] velvet question Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:34:57 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=41% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: dcd511cb-c9f5-4762-b0c3-48aa800a0f5a X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459DC793.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 22:35:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO greetings, The pile fabrics were much less like velvet and much more like shag rugs. There are pile fabrics found in late antique/ early medieval in northern Europe. So while the velvet poofy pants wouldn't be correct and period, poofy pants made of shag would. >:D Althea On Jan 4, 2007, at 6:55 PM, Sue Clemenger wrote: > I haven't heard of the Egyptian piled fabric, but as far as I know, > velvet > was invented well *after* the Viking Age, so no velvet Viking poofy > pants! > ;oD > --Sue > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "otsisto" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 2:38 PM > Subject: [h-cost] velvet question > > >> On a Norse list some people are trying to find out whether velvet or > velvet >> like material was around during the "Viking" age. >> There is something about Egypt having a pile type fabric but >> someone send >> that it was totally different from velvet. >> So does anyone have the skinny on the subject? >> Thank you, >> De > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Althea Turner althea@alfalfapress.com "Ignorant themselves of the forces of nature and wanting to have company in their ignorance, they don't want people to look into anything; they want us to believe like peasants and not ask the reasons behind things." William of Conches, 12th century _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 22:44:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053iurx000527 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:44:56 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l053ip5v032028 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:44:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l053iTkY095173 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:44:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053iSC0090992; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:44:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053iO3T090943 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:44:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l053m4ju013631 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:48:05 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] velvet question Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:52:24 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <00ad01c73075$038e1ae0$99bfa6d8@pavilion> <410D1E23-75E3-4D24-A3C3-32E4EF132C2C@alfalfapress.com> In-Reply-To: <410D1E23-75E3-4D24-A3C3-32E4EF132C2C@alfalfapress.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701042252.25352.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f5c38618-a381-4664-b272-4a444f408113 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459DC9B3.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 22:44:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Thursday 04 January 2007 10:34 pm, Althea Turner wrote: > greetings, > The pile fabrics were much less like velvet and much more like shag > rugs. There are pile fabrics found in late antique/ early medieval > in northern Europe. So while the velvet poofy pants wouldn't be > correct and period, poofy pants made of shag would. >:D Not really. The northern European "shag rug" fabric was used for cloaks. I don't know of any other usage for them. The Egyptian pile fabric looks more like terry cloth. I'll see if I can find a picture on line. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 22:56:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053uYQj000781 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:56:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l053uTQJ017018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:56:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l053tT0f096088 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:55:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053tQkb097979; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:55:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m14.mx.aol.com (imo-m14.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l053tM1G097893 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:55:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-m14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d16.432871c (41811) for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:55:11 -0500 (EST) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:55:09 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] 2007 To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5017 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: cdb502c1-018a-4ba1-8240-a1a8cd12fecc X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459DCC6D.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 22:56:33 -0500 (EST) Status: RO of the me projects, rather than the work ones??? (ie the ones I'm doing cos I want to not beacause I'm getting paid). judging by previous experience, not a single one. :o) That said, my nice accountant boyfriend just worked out that apparently I made around three hundred individual garments last year, (bearing in mind that some of these were coifs and aprons etc), so I' not doing too badly..... debs happy new year btw > >When thinking realistic, what do you think you will finish of > >historical costumes in 2007? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 4 23:11:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l054BLMO001115 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 23:11:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l054BGop006590 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 23:11:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l052nAel089392 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:49:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l052n7uv053370; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 19:49:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.247]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l05121Ka077608 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:02:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 45176 invoked by uid 60001); 5 Jan 2007 01:01:56 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=acArlh1kwtpHiyoRWtqD4ja3U5OIxJG0ht7speWAxCCbcx6oiysnWYXjeD0AydkLYtor6Zjw2KtGt3Xk8CXViZnF/9RrUwwpQBOS1O9yTzQjpc4/yqcLThEOYKDWSZAxRl+7pnW3yH1K6lVstXbdCIWvPHwqniZU2nKyXM46SjQ=; X-YMail-OSG: A6SeFvEVM1kC6.CiT8IKNCHO49z0Cn0RjvAVxounP5JXCc5a8c2_U5nhebajlXZ09APxBMVgSZ0dPYm6wVTFlxZx64ItegG3I9QmUffm4jlOGjDv4Sy1Tz_eeSAYXViDCPf4fLfoDoe_yKI- Received: from [76.175.234.76] by web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 17:01:56 PST Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 17:01:56 -0800 (PST) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] challenges of 16th century dress differences To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <459D73E8.10502@reddawn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <501010.44070.qm@web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 72b2dcba-c49b-4df3-ae9d-2500a84e660b X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459DCFE4.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 04 Jan 2007 23:11:20 -0500 (EST) Status: RO And don't forget this, in the same group from the Tate. http://www.tate.org.uk/servlet/ViewWork?workid=1497&searchid=44981&currow=2&maxrows=5 The thing about home-grown English Elizabethan style is that there's not much in the way of it. It's largely borrowed from French, Italian, and Spanish. MaggiRos The Elizabethan World is at http://elizabethan.org --- Dawn wrote: > ann marie wrote: > > Please assist me with your expertise in > determining the differences between > > the French and English fashions of the 1560's for > women. How did the > > skirts > > differ in shape and length? Bodice lines? Fabric > choices? Embelishments? > > Sleeves attached or detached for changing? > Recognizing that this may be a > > broad question, please be patient in helping me > understand these > > differences > > across social classes. > > > That's a very broad question. Herees a couple > pictures to help you in > your analysis: > > http://www.tate.org.uk/servlet/ViewWork?workid=1497 > Unknown woman about 1569 in French style clothing. > > > And some English in style from about the same time: > > http://www.tate.org.uk/servlet/ViewWork?workid=4208&searchid=44981 > > http://www.tate.org.uk/servlet/ViewWork?workid=4207&searchid=44981 > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 04:34:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l059YKqo008023 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 04:34:20 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l059YF9C007823 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 04:34:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l059XUrA026072 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 02:33:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l059XPgn093330; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 02:33:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l059XKrc093273 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 02:33:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.19440673; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 09:32:58 0000 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id l059Wr120387.; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:32:57 GMT Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 09:32:53 +0000 Message-Id: <459E1B3C02000014000C84C5@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 09:32:44 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: References: <200701041716.l04HEp9m083846@net.indra.com> In-Reply-To: <200701041716.l04HEp9m083846@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: victorian wedding clothes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: be98ba58-a2e0-4a03-9a1e-5c2a50c49b0c X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459E1B97.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 04:34:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO AlbertCat wrote: >Where might the bride be going after the wedding? To the train station to >commence the honeymoon? To a big whoop-de-do dinner after the ceremony? How >might that affect things? >It's not 'til like the 1830's that special wedding dresses come into play in >the 1st place, isn't it? >Remember in "Age of Innocence" [1870's] it was expected that May should >again wear her wedding dress at least once in the 1st year of marriage. She wears >it to the opera, so it was no day dress. >For "Nicholas Nickleby" the idea of a sleeveless dress for any occasion at >all is strange. Was this the film that came out a couple of years ago. That >thing had some of the worst, laziest costuming I've ever seen! The 8 hour stage >production on film from the 1980's has much superior costumes. Yes, it was the recent film that I saw on TV. I was thinking of the 20th century convention of men wearing morning dress at a formal wedding. There are (or used to be) legal restrictions in the UK on the time of day a marriage ceremony can take place. Until the current vogue for evening wedding parties started, it was usual to get married in the late morning, then have the wedding "breakfast". In the afternoon the bride would change into her "going-away" outfit and the couple would leave for the honeymoon. I was assuming that these traditions evolved in the Victorian era. Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 05:01:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05A1xKT012830 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:01:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05A1p9B018303 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:01:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05A1TOn028840 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 03:01:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05A1PY1010852; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 03:01:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.153]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l05A1L4e010658 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 03:01:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 73905 invoked by uid 60001); 5 Jan 2007 10:01:16 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=P08WgaoeXPMM6P4SyP73zjG7dwVApeAeBLSGc1mACnMMDHKRMDrTuCVvGt9BJQ7CEjxgpy2/ZB2XoQjLruTlfPmbDEHjljnu7Ma0WuFkGZf7/vl7yPesiNaGqjdT1R8F7mBskGqi8CNPDo1OQ+wZrVCMqE37zMsTQFnbsprI9nw=; X-YMail-OSG: ndcqm1MVM1kZPwA7eK9MF6u.0h5czEfPwGl2Xjc0Lrw4yVWclD3B.ik4yjuYLRjMW8jV0l8LoMHcTegdix7bXkNnCoLp59OUBR9AJUwokZOiE.FiubpVpHXQInXV0VfeF5FGaMtrOPFR8JE- Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:01:15 PST Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 02:01:15 -0800 (PST) From: Zuzana Kraemerova To: h-costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <937349.72828.qm@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Schaube X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e063282a-e939-4adb-8484-c07dea7d95ac X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459E2210.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 05:01:57 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi all, I need a little help: I'm looking for pictures and patterns for this kind of dress: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Schaube.PNG it is called "Schaube" in German, originally from arabian "aljubbeh" or something like that. Somewhere I found that it is also called "robe", which is probably not very helpful, because the word "robe" can mean many different things. It is a sort of a shorter cloak, often with fur. I cannot tell more, as the robe was changing through centuries and the word for it was still the same. How's that called in English? Do you know any details about this kind of dress or where to find them? Books, webpages? With pictures or patterns? Thanks, Zuzana __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 05:35:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05AZdVU019994 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:35:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05AZYWu010763 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:35:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05AYsWj032567 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 03:34:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05AYo9C033602; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 03:34:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep32.mail.dk (fep32.mail.dk [80.160.76.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05AYkPV033479 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 03:34:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep42.mail.dk ([195.41.46.225]) by fep32.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070105103436.VZOH11619.fep32.mail.dk@fep42.mail.dk> for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:34:36 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.63.231.214]) by fep42.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070105103435.KXHD18380.fep42.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:34:35 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c730b5$1a3abf60$d6e73f50@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <937349.72828.qm@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:34:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep42.mail.dk from [80.63.231.214] at Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:34:31 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5cf2633d-91fa-4e0f-9d46-eacf72e065a3 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459E29F6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 05:35:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Koehlers A History of Costume have a pattern cut of a Schaube for a man. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zuzana Kraemerova" To: "h-costume" Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 11:01 AM Subject: [h-cost] Schaube > Hi all, > > I need a little help: I'm looking for pictures and patterns for this kind > of dress: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Schaube.PNG > it is called "Schaube" in German, originally from arabian "aljubbeh" or > something like that. Somewhere I found that it is also called "robe", > which is probably not very helpful, because the word "robe" can mean many > different things. > It is a sort of a shorter cloak, often with fur. I cannot tell more, as > the robe was changing through centuries and the word for it was still the > same. > How's that called in English? Do you know any details about this kind of > dress or where to find them? Books, webpages? With pictures or patterns? > > Thanks, > > Zuzana > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 06:05:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05B5nSB023621 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 06:05:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05B5iYq023423 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 06:05:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05B57mj035284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 04:05:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05B52Zs051461; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 04:05:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep01.xtra.co.nz (fep01.xtra.co.nz [210.54.141.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05B4vcc051350 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 04:05:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from thebruce@ihug.co.nz) Received: from michaela ([125.238.124.133]) by fep01.xtra.co.nz with SMTP id <20070105110445.VTSD19965.fep01.xtra.co.nz@michaela> for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:04:45 +1300 Message-ID: <00af01c730b9$52f947a0$0301010a@michaela> From: "michaela" To: "Historical Costume" References: <937349.72828.qm@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:04:51 +1300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 84a1da40-9f32-43f3-b481-a6b23f9e750b X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459E3108.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 06:05:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > I need a little help: I'm looking for pictures and patterns for this kind of dress: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Schaube.PNG > it is called "Schaube" in German, originally from arabian "aljubbeh" or something like that. Somewhere I found that it is also called "robe", which is probably not very helpful, because the word "robe" can mean many different things. Sort of but robe generally (should) refer to a garment that hangs from the shoulders as opposed to something that fits the torso or else fulfills the function of a modern coat (which can be semi fitted to the body but usually not form fitting.) Surcoat, Ropa these are similar items of the 16thC. Schaube is used in this sort of generalised term usually too. > It is a sort of a shorter cloak, often with fur. I cannot tell more, as the robe was changing through centuries and the word for it was still the same. Not always shorter, it was many different lengths and it is possible they all had different names depending on the specific use. Women wore them and they can be seen in many images. I collected several but it's so hard to hunt them out in the first place I wouldn't really know where to direct you! > How's that called in English? Do you know any details about this kind of dress or where to find them? Books, webpages? With pictures or patterns? The surcoats in Patterns of Fashion aren't too bad to go by. Then the Ropa in Alcega are also of a similar design. Many men wear them in portraits by German artists, and there are a number of them for women but they are usually seen full length in woodcuts or illuminations etc. Michaela who just handed on her Scahube as it was much too big in the shoulders. Super snuggly and warm though. http://glittersweet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 07:09:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05C9nps005954 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 07:09:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05C9i2g009076 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 07:09:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05C8qEK046857 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:08:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05C8i5d096913; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:08:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05C3bbr092433 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:03:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.42) id 1H2nnL-000FBr-FD for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 12:03:35 +0000 Message-ID: <9fGTqBC04jnFJw4E@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:01:56 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant References: <010701c73065$14883750$6700a8c0@momlaptop> In-Reply-To: <010701c73065$14883750$6700a8c0@momlaptop> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.06-U () X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=13% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 194e7f49-52bb-4abf-8054-aa8d8607cc7b X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459E4008.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 07:09:48 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Reading this thread, and the questions about necklines and sleeves, I wonder did it have any effect that a wedding dress is made for going to church, in the first place? Even quite recently, many people would frown upon a wedding dress that was off the shoulder or sleeveless - it might be covered up with a shawl or bolero jacket for the ceremony, and then uncovered for the reception. What was the dress code for church in Victorian times - I suspect it was much more severe in middle and lower classes, but what could an upper-class bride get away with? Jean Penny Ladnier wrote >Albert Cat, > >I have etiquette books from the later part of the Victorian period. >They suggest that the bride wear her wearing dress for the first year >after the wedding. She is to wear to special events. > >My grandmother married in 1901 and had a nice white wedding dress. She >wore it church frequently. BTW, she was of modest means. > >Penny Ladnier, >Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites >www.costumegallery.com >www.costumelibrary.com >www.costumeclassroom.com >www.costumeencyclopedia.com >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 07:37:38 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Cbc9l006556 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 07:37:38 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05CbX1A021562 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 07:37:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05Cb0An055094 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:37:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05CaqUi015999; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:36:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web51713.mail.yahoo.com (web51713.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.39.132]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l05CaocR015925 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 05:36:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from delasue@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 78912 invoked by uid 60001); 5 Jan 2007 12:36:44 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=TM/b7BIL/lvT6Fz+GBB6/bmuQ9ZlfFHn16FUH2IRYYUXIw71A0rrUU+evittC49M2usM15i5zZtvwPBAlsPS4a8MeyAUNg2Ia9+1Q+iGUruWoXI4E81i49nSJJ08icu3PgTX1Nnl2MyiBfwYBB2qXfkNtBwzkZVEMKd3e+NbPYY= ; Message-ID: <20070105123644.78910.qmail@web51713.mail.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: Tw6vuXIVM1kGr6V9rluUKl6G_7Xu8FHDumdZhoT4U3IHJm6CvxqHspYz1ehEpRe.Hv4QeHR5J66tXk.KjQ2yy87vG43MHKz9PFne.xd6FT4cgowRO.lv0nZFl7E.lUp.XZxNTRujqwBmYik- Received: from [68.227.201.252] by web51713.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 04:36:44 PST Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 04:36:44 -0800 (PST) From: Kay Shelton To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Seamstress in Houston? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 806feae6-cf15-4947-bbfa-f6c03bf980d0 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459E468D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 07:37:36 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm hoping someone on this list will know a seamstress in Houston willing to make a wedding dress for my future sister-in-law. The wedding is planned for October. She knows the style she wants and she wants silk satin. She's a lovely person who has a very nice figure. She'll look great in it. I told her I'd ask her, as y'all are apt to know all the sewers in town. Thanks for any help you can offer. Kay __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 08:04:02 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05D42q1007026 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 08:04:02 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05D3vVB009473 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 08:04:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05D3PVY060805 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 06:03:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05D3NCe033726; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 06:03:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05D3JjJ033621 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 06:03:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep44.mail.dk ([195.41.46.227]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070105130313.FLDP8046.fep34.mail.dk@fep44.mail.dk> for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:03:13 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.63.231.214]) by fep44.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070105130313.LAIO11319.fep44.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:03:13 +0100 Message-ID: <000901c730c9$db6cd150$d6e73f50@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <937349.72828.qm@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <00af01c730b9$52f947a0$0301010a@michaela> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:03:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep44.mail.dk from [80.63.231.214] at Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:03:07 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d9ac4b54-8a6a-46e1-b42b-dae6f2b12bdd X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459E4CBD.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 08:04:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO How about the garment Christine of Denmark wears. Its made of fur. Holbein painted her, scroll down to find it on the right side.............. http://www.italy.dk/turisme/lombardia/milano/mi-castello.htm Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "michaela" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube >> I need a little help: I'm looking for pictures and patterns for this > kind of dress: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Schaube.PNG >> it is called "Schaube" in German, originally from arabian "aljubbeh" or > something like that. Somewhere I found that it is also called "robe", > which > is probably not very helpful, because the word "robe" can mean many > different things. > > Sort of but robe generally (should) refer to a garment that hangs from the > shoulders as opposed to something that fits the torso or else fulfills > the > function of a modern coat (which can be semi fitted to the body but > usually > not form fitting.) Surcoat, Ropa these are similar items of the 16thC. > Schaube is used in this sort of generalised term usually too. > >> It is a sort of a shorter cloak, often with fur. I cannot tell more, as > the robe was changing through centuries and the word for it was still the > same. > > Not always shorter, it was many different lengths and it is possible they > all had different names depending on the specific use. Women wore them and > they can be seen in many images. I collected several but it's so hard to > hunt them out in the first place I wouldn't really know where to direct > you! > >> How's that called in English? Do you know any details about this kind >> of > dress or where to find them? Books, webpages? With pictures or patterns? > > The surcoats in Patterns of Fashion aren't too bad to go by. Then the Ropa > in Alcega are also of a similar design. Many men wear them in portraits by > German artists, and there are a number of them for women but they are > usually seen full length in woodcuts or illuminations etc. > > Michaela > who just handed on her Scahube as it was much too big in the shoulders. > Super snuggly and warm though. > http://glittersweet.com > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 08:08:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05D8Sl8007111 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 08:08:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05D8OHR007936 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 08:08:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05D84b4062079 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 06:08:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05D82C6037001; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 06:08:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mf3k.socket.net [216.106.88.98]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05D7wQ6036947 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 06:08:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id E9FA33C335 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 07:07:57 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 07:08:06 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-reply-to: <9fGTqBC04jnFJw4E@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: victorian wedding clothes, X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f40a799a-e737-4873-9696-d14aa1b6791d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459E4DC8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 08:08:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO You have probably seen these but just in case, Victorian wedding dresses http://tinyurl.com/y2eg4f http://tinyurl.com/y92ao6 http://tinyurl.com/y5aaga http://search.famsf.org:8080/view.shtml?record=210781&=list&=271&=dre http://tinyurl.com/yajfmh http://tinyurl.com/y4p2mu http://www.bridallexington.com/museum/plate3.jpg http://tinyurl.com/yyeltz http://dept.kent.edu/museum/exhibit/hours/marriage.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 10:44:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05FiTo9009971 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 10:44:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05FiNUQ008817 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 10:44:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05FhZ2e093395 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 08:43:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05FgUxR069781; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 08:42:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.162]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l05FZmsW062141 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 08:36:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 44549 invoked by uid 60001); 5 Jan 2007 15:35:30 -0000 Message-ID: <20070105153530.44547.qmail@web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com> DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=Zfa2l+Kdj+XOrHxV5OZPQisxu6kpmnG4e5xNHo9wh2CDQw56KHu1MzW3+4rLv0qst2wpRmJ+k8schi6RYnlMYW3ryzQbKe4SK6/J7SliKSzazoTCZAm3cZNQ7rjz6kFOA/okNrKsoxI/BZHz0oOWtwNaOWApt6cUvqGiA2DGX2o=; X-YMail-OSG: H.Z4WiAVM1msovjp4lgyZFHNfdrCq0g_DBw_MPjgWE_pvrdI1M0Fix.CmTnWhsRWl41lysN0PwIwFauAKtgaTdQAC2onjg9zNuQRQyZpA9m2K_EpiIqN8DkIdCuNd4pthWaThrc9rLv0pao- Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 07:35:30 PST Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 07:35:30 -0800 (PST) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000901c730c9$db6cd150$d6e73f50@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c3fda296-4136-4bce-82fd-b9d65b356e32 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459E7257.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 10:44:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thanks for help! Gonna search through our art museum library... But the more I search, the more I'm confused about what the word really means. Now I've found an explanation in one of the Czech history of costume books and it says that the "alchubba" was a long dress of mohammeds, opened in front. In 12th century it came to Europe with the crusades. They say that the word later changed to "Schaube", which was a large cloak worn in the entire Europe, especially in the time of Reformation. So the famous Henry VIII-portrait-like robes are probably those called Schaube. Are there some resources about the original garment? The arabian one? ----- Original Message ----- From: "michaela" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube >> I need a little help: I'm looking for pictures and patterns for this > kind of dress: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Schaube.PNG >> it is called "Schaube" in German, originally from arabian "aljubbeh" or > something like that. Somewhere I found that it is also called "robe", > which > is probably not very helpful, because the word "robe" can mean many > different things. > > Sort of but robe generally (should) refer to a garment that hangs from the > shoulders as opposed to something that fits the torso or else fulfills > the > function of a modern coat (which can be semi fitted to the body but > usually > not form fitting.) Surcoat, Ropa these are similar items of the 16thC. > Schaube is used in this sort of generalised term usually too. > >> It is a sort of a shorter cloak, often with fur. I cannot tell more, as > the robe was changing through centuries and the word for it was still the > same. > > Not always shorter, it was many different lengths and it is possible they > all had different names depending on the specific use. Women wore them and > they can be seen in many images. I collected several but it's so hard to > hunt them out in the first place I wouldn't really know where to direct > you! > >> How's that called in English? Do you know any details about this kind >> of > dress or where to find them? Books, webpages? With pictures or patterns? > > The surcoats in Patterns of Fashion aren't too bad to go by. Then the Ropa > in Alcega are also of a similar design. Many men wear them in portraits by > German artists, and there are a number of them for women but they are > usually seen full length in woodcuts or illuminations etc. > > Michaela > who just handed on her Scahube as it was much too big in the shoulders. > Super snuggly and warm though. > http://glittersweet.com > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 11:32:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05GWH8U010820 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:32:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05GWCfg022868 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:32:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05GVbir004055 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:31:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05GUcw8018712; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:31:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d20.mx.aol.com (imo-d20.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.136]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05GOBNT011363 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:24:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cef.61eb204 (42809) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:23:54 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:23:51 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f6d05f73-c9ca-4b63-aa32-4c80de235c74 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459E7D8C.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 11:32:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/5/2007 8:04:23 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: How about the garment Christine of Denmark wears. Its made of fur. Holbein painted her, scroll down to find it on the right side.............. http://www.italy.dk/turisme/lombardia/milano/mi-castello.htm ******************* When I was studying costume history in college [not too long after the Schaube went out of style...OK...really the mid 1970's] A schaube was also a short garment, like what you see Henry VIII wearing over his doublet with a set of bases. The thing with the big sleeves and a fur collar. _http://www.marileecody.com/henry8/henry8afterholbein1.jpg_ (http://www.marileecody.com/henry8/henry8afterholbein1.jpg) _http://www.marileecody.com/henry8/henry8eworth1.jpg_ (http://www.marileecody.com/henry8/henry8eworth1.jpg) Sometimes referred to as a jerkin. But the forms of these garments seem so different, the later jerkin being almost identical to a doublet, the terms can get confusing. I always referred to this type of Henry VIII over-robe thingie as a schaube. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 11:44:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Gi92o011476 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:44:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05Gi4Vh007339 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:44:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05GhCER007054 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:43:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Gg7jI031572; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:42:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m17.mx.aol.com (imo-m17.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05GWSjK020660 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:33:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cb7.6f924c8 (42809) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:32:04 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:31:59 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: victorian wedding clothes, To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 352d99c8-8ea2-4e68-b1a3-d7bfa820951e X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 459E8054.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 11:44:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/5/2007 8:08:33 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, otsisto@socket.net writes: http://search.famsf.org:8080/view.shtml?record=210781&=list&=271&=dre >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I really like this one. If I were designing a show that needed such a costume, I'd steal this one. Yummy! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 12:26:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05HQp85012253 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:26:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05HQk5w018942 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:26:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05HPwFO016685 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 10:25:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05HPpae078697; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 10:25:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from server025.dfw.nationwide.net (server025.dfw.nationwide.net [206.123.129.88]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l05HPj70078567 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 10:25:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 27882 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2007 17:25:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO XPS) (dch@inreach.com@67.174.246.110) by server025.dfw.nationwide.net with SMTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 17:25:44 +0000 From: "Diana Habra" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Schaube Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:25:43 -0800 Message-ID: <004301c730ee$88033610$0d00a8c0@XPS> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: Thread-Index: Accw6i0SATsJIDrgTRarj5BM/xmh4gAA6Y0g X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=27% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: aa453ede-c2b7-4ee3-a068-5931e3e21cd8 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459E8A56.008 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 12:26:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Just my 2 cents.... It seems to me that the term "schaube" has the same problem as the term coat or jacket in modern terms. We call all jackets the same thing but it does not indicate what style they are (long, short, leather, wool, nylon, etc.) So perhaps a "schaube" to them was just a term for a coat and using our modern context, we are trying to differentiate the styles by finding different words for them. But in period there was really only one term for them. I liken this issue to one I had when trying to differentiate different styles of renaissance German lady's dresses. In period they would have just called them dresses or "rocks" even though they had different features. Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 13:01:58 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05I1wk8012882 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:01:58 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05I1ru0004095 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:01:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05I0wqG024348 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:00:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05HxFYn015146; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:00:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com (wx-out-0506.google.com [66.249.82.225]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Hw6oe013754 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 10:58:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynndownward@gmail.com) Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id s7so6832936wxc for ; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 09:57:54 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=dXMKUuLg3SwzlRASV2kLQerMpDki3EkeQqGA2QMeYvPutD3AdIscyI/meeJMwpFFIb6DdZFwFZBT9K/2Rj/QmQTieyaGxN5jhZatdpka8Y3a9/LK2Ym+88/7mo6zVLbH2KrsiF35VI6RFLKYf/jAlCZB4NWzio35xOKkvO6tv/w= Received: by 10.90.80.8 with SMTP id d8mr963302agb.1168019474753; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 09:51:14 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.51.7 with HTTP; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:51:14 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 09:51:14 -0800 From: "Lynn Downward" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) In-Reply-To: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 90ffca02-572c-4d89-8684-a5a66dfa99cc X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459E9291.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 13:01:57 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin, thank you for sending us that link. It's only fabulous! Warning in case someone is thinking of making that dress, even for a doll: I do some net beading - my sister calls it the insane beading - and the way that net dress was reproduced promises that it would never survive a day of wear (not that they reproduced it for wear). The threads would have to be woven through the beads several times each for stability, especially since many of the beads used by the Egyptians are faence and are very sharp-edged and would cut through the threads. These beautiful dresses would be very time-consuming to produce and therefore probably owned only by the rich who could afford to have someone make them. in the case of musicians or dancers who might wear them, they would probably have been owned by the troupe or the owner of the troupe, like any other stage property. I "discovered" Ancient Egypt when I was about 9; it was my first historical focus and I still have a passion for it. That doesn't mean that I am the be-all in Egyptian knowledge by any means, but I know a bunch of random stuff about the Egyptians. And some things about off-loom beading. LynnD On 1/4/07, Catherine Olanich Raymond wrote: > On Thursday 04 January 2007 2:59 am, Robin Netherton wrote: > > A little prowling online turned up a teaching package from the Petrie > > museum that includes a photo and description of the bead-net dress (among > > many other items) and detailed directions for making one. I'm sure that > > the directions are modernized, but they're complex enough they clearly > > aren't meant to be Halloween-costume level. > > > > http://www.petrie.ucl.ac.uk/Textiles%20in%20the%20Petrie%20Museum.doc > > Neat! Thank you. > > (One more project for the "future projects" pile.) :-) > > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point > of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 13:17:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05IH25A013214 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:17:02 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05IGuDM006423 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:17:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05IGJCf028943 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:16:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05IFaI4033589; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:16:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-altamira.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-altamira.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.62]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05ICGBh029428 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:13:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.165.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.165] helo=faucet.net) by pop-altamira.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H2tXw-00003n-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 13:12:04 -0500 Message-ID: <459EA2AA.3080301@faucet.net> Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 13:10:34 -0600 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Questions re: Moda a Firenze References: <7d21ac190612261529n35fef81fwe5eaeb165a10b62c@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f14840f5-12b8-4cbd-8d69-b3155a736801 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459E9618.009 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 13:17:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Greetings to all, I have a different question about this book. To those of you in the US who got it when it first became available: how much did you pay for it, and when was that? I'm trying to establish the "original" price of this book to see how much it's gone up and how fast. The book itself says it's 58 euros, which translates (at today's rate) to $75, but I doubt anyone in the US got it for that once shipping was taken into account, and I know that the US vendors that carry/ied it upped the price for the same reason. Please reply to melanie@faucet.net Thanks! Melanie Schuessler _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 14:36:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05JaOmT015096 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:36:24 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05JaIWW017515 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:36:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05JZRP3052120 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:35:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05JYhkc017691; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:35:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05JXc9D016523 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:34:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 3CBCB384DB for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:33:37 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:33:47 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6b2fef4d-46f1-4e23-84bd-d9fdc54df59e X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EA8B3.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 14:36:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO My question is that one of the sites given for this dress states that when they restrung the dress they did not use all of the bead. Something like 1/4 (sorry pulling from memory) of the beads were not restrung on the dress so what we are seeing, is it more that they have restrung to match the statues and paintings or is the dress really that way? De -----Original Message----- Warning in case someone is thinking of making that dress, even for a doll: I do some net beading - my sister calls it the insane beading - and the way that net dress was reproduced promises that it would never survive a day of wear (not that they reproduced it for wear). The threads would have to be woven through the beads several times each for stability, especially since many of the beads used by the Egyptians are faence and are very sharp-edged and would cut through the threads. These beautiful dresses would be very time-consuming to produce and therefore probably owned only by the rich who could afford to have someone make them. in the case of musicians or dancers who might wear them, they would probably have been owned by the troupe or the owner of the troupe, like any other stage property. I "discovered" Ancient Egypt when I was about 9; it was my first historical focus and I still have a passion for it. That doesn't mean that I am the be-all in Egyptian knowledge by any means, but I know a bunch of random stuff about the Egyptians. And some things about off-loom beading. LynnD _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 14:37:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Jbr0E015120 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:37:53 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05JbmDt021092 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:37:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05JauGb052754 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:36:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05JaMwh019609; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:36:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05JI7we099588 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:18:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A1339389A4 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:18:06 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] RE: victorian wedding clothes, Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:18:16 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c063bba8-bdb5-44f3-b1f5-54c29c075ca4 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EA90C.006 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 14:37:52 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I had not noticed before but this has a vest(?) on it. -----Original Message----- http://search.famsf.org:8080/view.shtml?record=210781&=list&=271&=dre >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I really like this one. If I were designing a show that needed such a costume, I'd steal this one. Yummy! _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 14:57:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05JvrcE015504 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:57:53 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05JvlkI004059 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:57:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05Jv3UM057973 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:57:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Jtvtv038937; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:56:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31906.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31906.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.86]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l05JtGNK038078 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:55:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vickycoleen2000@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 16930 invoked by uid 60001); 5 Jan 2007 19:55:10 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=sfZZ2jHr1p+r+erT/DrXPQQVbD2n0qjDSlTeuYF0WsenWGUSMS7XqCRAcL6FO6MqLrBqO1s3LzAPngiJNIdeInVobDF4Sk33f4uLqF/B0OQ5nzAyM+PPCXDpY1DTNzbK3mO9J7x0P9oxN0063TTdk18c63VUd1eASpcVw9RA4Hc=; X-YMail-OSG: iv0shVAVM1lI9GSoVGU9d96dm4CPKevA7V6Xmcp9.xvBFhgdl78fKe31135KDeX9Sg-- Received: from [69.40.105.236] by web31906.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 11:55:10 PST Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 11:55:10 -0800 (PST) From: Vicky Simpson Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: victorian wedding clothes, To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <689636.16619.qm@web31906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3ddeffd4-701b-4a45-a19b-d6fc57b8cd7f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EADBB.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 14:57:52 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I had not seen them, thank you for sharing. They are beautiful. Vicky otsisto wrote: You have probably seen these but just in case, Victorian wedding dresses http://tinyurl.com/y2eg4f http://tinyurl.com/y92ao6 http://tinyurl.com/y5aaga http://search.famsf.org:8080/view.shtml?record=210781&=list&=271&=dre http://tinyurl.com/yajfmh http://tinyurl.com/y4p2mu http://www.bridallexington.com/museum/plate3.jpg http://tinyurl.com/yyeltz http://dept.kent.edu/museum/exhibit/hours/marriage.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume www.southerngracedesigns.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 15:04:38 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05K4cTG015703 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:04:38 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05K4XCT020500 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:04:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05K2k0r059225 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:02:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05K1pit045330; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:02:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mail.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05JxVnj042583 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:00:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d1c.210c3d0 (43930) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:54:18 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:54:15 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: victorian wedding clothes, To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fa34dab3-23f9-46c1-b5d1-52ef69872784 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EAF51.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:04:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/5/2007 2:37:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, otsisto@socket.net writes: but this has a vest(?) on it. ************* If you zoom in you will see that there is lace coming from the bodice peaking up from behind the skirt. Something is going on in the back. Maybe some kind of tail on the "vest". Or the vest may be attached to the bodice, although it doesn't really look it. Someone in San Francisco run check it out for us. :-P _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 15:09:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05K99Qr015835 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:09:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05K94Qo031635 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:09:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05K8Z4A060474 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:08:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05K80uM052145; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:08:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m18.mx.aol.com (imo-m18.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.208]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05K6RGN050186 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:07:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-m18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c8b.6547ecf (60468) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:06:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mblk-d30 (mblk-d30.mblk.aol.com [205.188.149.22]) by ciaaol-m02.mx.aol.com (v114.2) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLM021-ec34459eafb8d6; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:06:16 -0500 References: <200701050344.l053iSij091008@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:06:16 -0500 In-Reply-To: <200701050344.l053iSij091008@net.indra.com> X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI MIME-Version: 1.0 From: tearoses@aol.com X-MB-Message-Type: User X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 22250 Received: from 68.143.196.38 by mblk-d30.sysops.aol.com (205.188.149.22) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:06:16 -0500 Message-Id: <8C8FF1C1788DAFB-1444-15BB@mblk-d30.sysops.aol.com> X-AOL-IP: 205.188.149.22 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a7664b12-f857-4582-95a2-b7b14a23c2ca X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EB060.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:09:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Since we're talking about ancient costume, and somebody mentioned Jewish, does anybody know any reliable books on Biblical costume? I've always wanted to sculpt a Nativity scene, but I have no idea as to what appropriate costumes would look like. I did an admittedly shallow search a couple of years ago and couldn't turn up anything more credible than Racinet. I did read that it was a difficult subject because the Hebrews, like the Muslims, didn't believe in using human figures in their artwork. But given the dearth of information out there, I wouldn't be surprised if even that was a false statement. I suppose for the Nativity I could just dress them as Romans, or do a medieval theme or something, but if there is accurate information to be had, I'd like to know. Tea Rose p.s. Robin, I intend to be at CostumeCon for your lecture, but I haven't registered yet. I hope there's still room; I'm really excited about it! ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 15:31:02 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KUvAS016313 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:30:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05KUq8M020188 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:30:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05KUGZb064604 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:30:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KTTKG074009; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:30:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KSqD5073291 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:29:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA04266 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:16:00 -0600 Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:16:00 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume In-Reply-To: <8C8FF1C1788DAFB-1444-15BB@mblk-d30.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: dcfb177c-adef-4965-8d3c-aa92df6f42fd X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EB57C.006 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:30:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri, 5 Jan 2007 tearoses@aol.com wrote: > Since we're talking about ancient costume, and somebody mentioned > Jewish, does anybody know any reliable books on Biblical costume? I've > always wanted to sculpt a Nativity scene, but I have no idea as to > what appropriate costumes would look like. > > I suppose for the Nativity I could just dress them as Romans, or do a > medieval theme or something, but if there is accurate information to > be had, I'd like to know. >From what I hear, the costume would be the least of the difficulty in creating an accurate scene. There are also questions about what the setting really was like, given the architecture and living arrangements of the time. Our vision is based primarily on translations of words into "stable" and "manger," and assumptions of later periods as to what those would look like. Not long ago I heard about a scholar who looked at the original terminology in terms of archaeological evidence of building structures and came up with what sounded like a solid interpretation that was completely different. It seems some houses had an upper level that served as a "guest room," while the family slept downstairs. There was also a half-sunken side room that was used for animals in bad weather; the animals were fed from a built-in trough at the side of the human living area, making the trough eating-height for the cattle, etc. The author noted that since Mary had family in Bethlehem, it was unlikely that she would have no place to stay and no one to take her in. He posited an alternative reading that was consistent with the known terminology for the various parts of the structure. "No room in the inn" became "no room in the guest room," so Mary and family were placed not in a separate "stable," but rather in the interior animal room (not sure whether he thought the animals would have been indoors or not -- maybe not), and the "manger" became a convenient place to lay a new baby given the lack of a cradle. I have no idea whether this was shot down, but the idea of re-considering the translation made a lot of sense to me. But a "Nativity Scene" in the barn has a lot of history and resonance to it, and so you could legitimately use a medieval-ish costuming theme that would be consistent with the idea of the traditional nativity setting. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 15:41:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KfTeu016470 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:41:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05KfOqP011792 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:41:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05Kdlxa066875 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:39:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KcfDL084916; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:39:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web56712.mail.re3.yahoo.com (web56712.mail.re3.yahoo.com [66.196.97.71]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l05FuB0V082089 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 08:56:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hanstar88@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 20544 invoked by uid 60001); 5 Jan 2007 15:56:05 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=z/mbveuZ6zgW7aK3JBFHRbMYNI+McCh+q83Kg2ZXSzYuCWaMPTItwzm3CdzB8JtaWATc9GMuxVvX2u3LfqwjYEfSgLYdQhjJhZsUqQlQrCDRXbfDFRwxId8enWMzREJXHQWPzqY++pTQrpIkf/wNwGcjm6HoQieFPrHdKsnxffM= ; Message-ID: <20070105155605.20542.qmail@web56712.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Received: from [67.169.12.111] by web56712.mail.re3.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 07:56:05 PST Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 07:56:05 -0800 (PST) From: Mary To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0e8cb1f4-3f55-4bae-acf3-1ca1195a4410 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459EB7F4.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:41:28 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l05KfTeu016470 Status: RO I was poking around on the Polistampa website, which I believe is the publisher of the Moda a Firenze book. They have a notice on the site that they will reprint the book and it will be available in April 2007. If you pre-order it now, you get a 30% discount (off of 58 Euros). However, if you order from them, I recall that getting payment to them is quite difficult. I don't remember the details from when I tried to order this book from them when it first came out, but I finally gave up because I didn't have the time to jump through all the hoops it required! http://www.polistampa.com/asp/sl.asp?id=3653 ~Mary _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 15:52:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KqGF0016684 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:52:16 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05KqBQJ007249 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:52:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05KohLo069039 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:50:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KmMMu096134; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:49:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Kkcls094107 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:47:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA04319 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:33:47 -0600 Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:33:47 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <8C8FF1C1788DAFB-1444-15BB@mblk-d30.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] CostumeCon (was: Movies and ancient costume) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 77a9b6cd-8ed9-4728-aaa4-f2c0f18b7169 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EBA7B.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:52:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I was going to respond to this as part of my previous post, but it seemed to deserve its own subject line... On Fri, 5 Jan 2007 tearoses@aol.com wrote: > Robin, I intend to be at CostumeCon for your lecture, but I haven't > registered yet. I hope there's still room; I'm really excited about > it! At this point, I think they haven't assigned rooms yet, because they're still working out the other panels. Last I heard, the plan was that they'd ultimately make my room assignment based on the number of people signed up, with a little excess if possible for walk-ins and same-day registrants. People who sign up in advance are guaranteed a seat, and I'll have someone checking off names as people arrive. Which means if you sign up soon, you shouldn't have any problem getting on the list. If you wait too long, it might be harder. I know the CostumeCon people have really put themselves on the line in giving me space for a day, and they're concerned that I show I'm worth the resources they're devoting. Their primary purpose for signing me up is to increase visibility of CostumeCon among people interested in historical costume, and thus to increase attendance beyond the circle of people who already know about the event. If people are signing up for one-day memberships and registering for my lectures, it will probably be obvious that they're most likely going because I'm there. For those of you who decide to to attend the whole con (well worth it!) primarily because you want to come to my lectures, it would be useful if you noted along with your sign-up that my presence was a "draw" for you to attend the con, if only to ease their minds that yes, having me there really is helping broaden their audience. Remember that registering (either for the full con or one day) is just one step; to get signed up for my lectures is a separate step. Information on how to do that is here: http://www.cc25.net/netherton.htm I've attended one CostumeCon, and it was a *blast*. There were a number of people from this list there, and I hope to meet more at this coming CC. Perhaps we can have an h-cost meet-and-greet at some point. If you're attending and would be willing to sit on a panel in your area of expertise, I believe the planners are taking suggestions. If we want more historic programming, this is the way to make that happen. Panels typically have several "teachers," so some panels on historic techniques would be a good way to bring together people who are doing similar work for some face-to-face cross-fertilization ... and make the con even more attractive to historic costumers. Just be sure to note that you don't want to be scheduled opposite me (Saturday all day), so the historic-minded people (including the panelists) don't have conflicts about what to attend! Pierre, one of the CC25 heads, is on this list -- Pierre, please correct me if I have any of the above wrong. I don't know what the criteria are for choosing panelists. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 15:55:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KtKQ7016730 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:55:20 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05KtFUD002940 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:55:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05KsmXm070076 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:54:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Ks5bw002240; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:54:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Kqi01000482 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:53:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:55:16 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:55:20 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01813172@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: <20070105155605.20542.qmail@web56712.mail.re3.yahoo.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint Thread-Index: AccxCobUIBG1nAA8T9WIAcsteAnk5QAAR1Gg From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Jan 2007 20:55:16.0646 (UTC) FILETIME=[CD8F2460:01C7310B] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l05Kqi01000482 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 37817b0e-39f2-4e60-b70e-dabad64214b2 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459EBB34.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:55:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I went to the site, but didn't see notice of a discount. Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Mary Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 10:56 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint I was poking around on the Polistampa website, which I believe is the publisher of the Moda a Firenze book. They have a notice on the site that they will reprint the book and it will be available in April 2007. If you pre-order it now, you get a 30% discount (off of 58 Euros). However, if you order from them, I recall that getting payment to them is quite difficult. I don't remember the details from when I tried to order this book from them when it first came out, but I finally gave up because I didn't have the time to jump through all the hoops it required! http://www.polistampa.com/asp/sl.asp?id=3653 ~Mary _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 16:00:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05L0H0S016857 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:00:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05L0BpI026984 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:00:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05KxOvc071088 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:59:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KwK3W007205; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:59:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.186]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Kv5IL005675 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:58:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katybishop64@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so8896435nfe for ; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 12:58:01 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=XrC1dxQfhTpPVlYFRGza2uhaKj9E5v7BdHNbb+B/+p6QKDbrE/uW0uatKfLcWbGGypdXUXgYlGbcEL5jJnl5Gl1fSjXflr1Hzvo1Zfpz7nxpwUBurlxPviHQxir9PpLja31wv/Ltmd2ag9ULw77H4T/ftbfOdtXO5rBez+XIRrI= Received: by 10.82.113.6 with SMTP id l6mr2382201buc.1168030280789; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 12:51:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.184.5 with HTTP; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:51:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3586f5070701051251w3ff7c057w53d0e74407fc4315@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:51:20 -0500 From: "Katy Bishop" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: victorian wedding clothes, In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 31487184-85a6-4973-a030-20c150028cc7 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EBC5C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:00:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A few years ago in a Costume Society of America journal there was an article on this same wedding dress, there might have even been a pattern diagram. It might have been 1990: "Fashion on the Frontier." Can't find the issue at the moment. I seem to recall the owner was heading west to get married there. Katy On 1/5/07, AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 1/5/2007 2:37:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > otsisto@socket.net writes: > > but this has a vest(?) on it. > > > > ************* > > > If you zoom in you will see that there is lace coming from the bodice > peaking up from behind the skirt. Something is going on in the back. Maybe some > kind of tail on the "vest". Or the vest may be attached to the bodice, although > it doesn't really look it. > > Someone in San Francisco run check it out for us. :-P > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 16:26:51 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LQpFm017397 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:26:51 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05LQk8x025737 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:26:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05LQDQQ076910 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:26:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LPRxW038436; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:26:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KnNPP096969 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:50:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B3DEB385D8 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:40:08 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:40:19 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <20070105153530.44547.qmail@web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: Schaube X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a8909d4b-01e5-4136-85d2-cbbd899b6072 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459EC296.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:26:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >From the German Ren list: There are a few period patterns (Italian and Spanish) for schaube-like garments: http://www.elizabethancostume.net/schnittbuch http://www.elizabethancostume.net/Tailors And Alcega's pattern book also has some "sleeved cloak" type patterns. I don't know of any commercial schaube patterns available, but others may. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 16:40:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LeTZP017619 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:40:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05LeNCQ026127 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:40:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05LdZYC080251 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:39:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LcplP054853; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:39:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LFp2A027102 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:16:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H2wQ3-0008Np-0r; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:16:07 -0600 Received: from 65.13.105.239 ([65.13.105.239]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:16:06 -0500 Message-ID: <20070105161606.up2ss1o0juo044kc@www.goldsword.com> Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:16:06 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint References: <20070105155605.20542.qmail@web56712.mail.re3.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20070105155605.20542.qmail@web56712.mail.re3.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32003] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php X-Source-Args: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php /usr/local/cpanel/base/horde/imp/compose.php X-Source-Dir: :/base/horde/imp X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l05LFp2A027102 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1fa0e3a6-9512-4f38-a1dc-7afada23f5a4 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EC5C7.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:40:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Quoting Mary : > I was poking around on the Polistampa website, which I believe is > the publisher of the Moda a Firenze book. They have a notice on the > site that they will reprint the book and it will be available in > April 2007. If you pre-order it now, you get a 30% discount (off of > 58 Euros). However, if you order from them, I recall that getting > payment to them is quite difficult. I don't remember the details > from when I tried to order this book from them when it first came > out, but I finally gave up because I didn't have the time to jump > through all the hoops it required! > > http://www.polistampa.com/asp/sl.asp?id=3653 > You have to have your bank make an electronic transfer of funds to their bank. One more thing, when they were offering a 20% discount, shipping to the states was *almost* as much as the book. With a 30% discount, shipping is certainly more. I *did* have the receipt that they sent, but I'm not finding it at the moment ... Found it! original price 58.00 E discount -11.60 E subtotal 46.40 E shipping 33.60 E Susan (who really hopes that they reprint it even if I already do have a copy!) ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 16:42:32 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LgS14017653 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:42:32 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05LgNr0030570 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:42:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05Lfb9c080764 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:41:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Lep67057182; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:41:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from tomts36-srv.bellnexxia.net (tomts36.bellnexxia.net [209.226.175.93]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LXdOP048689 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:34:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dluckham@sympatico.ca) Received: from Main.sympatico.ca ([64.231.207.63]) by tomts36-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.13 201-253-122-130-113-20050324) with ESMTP id <20070105213336.VYAW1862.tomts36-srv.bellnexxia.net@Main.sympatico.ca> for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:33:36 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.2.20070105163427.00d23510@pop8.sympatico.ca> X-Sender: b1jerw63@pop8.sympatico.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:35:22 -0500 To: h-costume@mail.indra.com From: Dawn Luckham Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] re Victorian wedding gowns X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 48001bc8-92a4-4e02-8626-3dc5f97f32f1 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EC63F.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:42:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO About the San Francisco wedding dress: There is an article in "Dress,The Annual Journal of the Costume Society of America" 1980, Volume 5. The article written by Shane Alder is entitled "A Diary and a Dress". The dress was made by (for?) Mehitable Berry Felton to wear at her wedding to James L. Sperry in San Francisco September 17, 1864. It was never worn. Miss Felton wore her travel dress for her wedding. She traveled from South Danvers, Massachusetts. A month's travel. As there is a diary with the dress, there is quite a bit of documentation with it. The article in "Dress" offers a grid pattern for the "scarf", which appears as a bolero from the front and a fichu from the back. It's an interesting shape and wraps around the neck over the bustline, following under the arm and tied at the back waist. The upper back of the scarf is triangular with the point of the triangle almost touching the tie at the back waist. It's one of my favourite examples of a Victorian era wedding gown, too! Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 16:58:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LwJix017906 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:58:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05LwEAe003072 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:58:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05LvcL3084268 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:57:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LusgU075080; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:57:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.188]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LtPw1073537 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:56:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katybishop64@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so8911373nfe for ; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 13:55:23 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=lfsxpPgHW3pr3f/bvCoNlmKvVszt029e+FbyVH4Zk0bC65WO8WhsT2npLCzaG9GwiRWWMK/J38PfY5n479BoThUiZ6WV8eYeSPKsaWQn40Zosba+8AsRkbKMoFw89tVksxdS1nRpN3WbRYGU0vhgBrKQcjATPHaqhJFnKNxmLDU= Received: by 10.82.114.3 with SMTP id m3mr2259842buc.1168034123421; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 13:55:23 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.184.5 with HTTP; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:55:23 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3586f5070701051355n6387a473k6e40a50058f0e134@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:55:23 -0500 From: "Katy Bishop" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] re Victorian wedding gowns In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20070105163427.00d23510@pop8.sympatico.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <5.1.1.6.2.20070105163427.00d23510@pop8.sympatico.ca> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e548cd4c-f741-4df7-85f8-379fb15c5e63 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EC9F7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:58:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thanks, I remembered the article, but could not put my hand on the issue. The dress is lovely. I've always wanted to copy it. Katy On 1/5/07, Dawn Luckham wrote: > About the San Francisco wedding dress: > > There is an article in "Dress,The Annual Journal of the Costume Society of > America" 1980, Volume 5. The article written by Shane Alder is entitled "A > Diary and a Dress". > > The dress was made by (for?) Mehitable Berry Felton to wear at her wedding > to James L. Sperry in San Francisco September 17, 1864. It was never > worn. Miss Felton wore her travel dress for her wedding. She traveled > from South Danvers, Massachusetts. A month's travel. > > As there is a diary with the dress, there is quite a bit of documentation > with it. The article in "Dress" offers a grid pattern for the "scarf", > which appears as a bolero from the front and a fichu from the back. It's > an interesting shape and wraps around the neck over the bustline, following > under the arm and tied at the back waist. The upper back of the scarf is > triangular with the point of the triangle almost touching the tie at the > back waist. > > It's one of my favourite examples of a Victorian era wedding gown, too! > > Dawn > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 17:11:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05MBPNM018109 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:11:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05MBH52031237 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:11:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05MAn1G087178 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:10:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05M9wA4089129; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:10:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05M67Vk084910 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:06:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus0) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1H2xCN3rMo-0005Lb; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 17:06:05 -0500 Message-ID: <001601c73115$ac79dbd0$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com> <8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:05:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9cc5303f-ddcd-45f2-8296-d1ec9722af7f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459ECD05.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 17:11:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Lynn, I too have had an interest in ancient Egypt's history since a child. I took a week long masters level class in Egyptian art. They brought in experts from all the world to lecture. One expert had been doing Egyptian archaeology at one site since the early 1960s. These experts could agree with one another. Two lecturers even got into saying that the other expert's theories were completely wrong in their lectures. I think the main problem is that 90% of ancient Egyptian history is under sand. The more that is uncovered the more we will know. I loved the class but never recommend anyone taking it in the manner I did. It was for seven days from 8AM to 11:00 PM. By Thursday, I felt like I was joining a cult. It was very overwhelming and too much information to soak in my brain in one week. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lynn Downward" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 12:51 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) > Robin, thank you for sending us that link. It's only fabulous! > > Warning in case someone is thinking of making that dress, even for a > doll: I do some net beading - my sister calls it the insane beading - > and the way that net dress was reproduced promises that it would never > survive a day of wear (not that they reproduced it for wear). The > threads would have to be woven through the beads several times each > for stability, especially since many of the beads used by the > Egyptians are faence and are very sharp-edged and would cut through > the threads. These beautiful dresses would be very time-consuming to > produce and therefore probably owned only by the rich who could afford > to have someone make them. in the case of musicians or dancers who > might wear them, they would probably have been owned by the troupe or > the owner of the troupe, like any other stage property. > > I "discovered" Ancient Egypt when I was about 9; it was my first > historical focus and I still have a passion for it. That doesn't mean > that I am the be-all in Egyptian knowledge by any means, but I know a > bunch of random stuff about the Egyptians. And some things about > off-loom beading. > > LynnD > > > On 1/4/07, Catherine Olanich Raymond wrote: >> On Thursday 04 January 2007 2:59 am, Robin Netherton wrote: >> > A little prowling online turned up a teaching package from the Petrie >> > museum that includes a photo and description of the bead-net dress >> > (among >> > many other items) and detailed directions for making one. I'm sure that >> > the directions are modernized, but they're complex enough they clearly >> > aren't meant to be Halloween-costume level. >> > >> > http://www.petrie.ucl.ac.uk/Textiles%20in%20the%20Petrie%20Museum.doc >> >> Neat! Thank you. >> >> (One more project for the "future projects" pile.) :-) >> >> >> -- >> Cathy Raymond >> >> "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point >> of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost >> >> > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 17:58:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Mw9gT019046 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:58:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05Mw44r026688 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:58:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05MvS9H096156 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:57:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05MuJJM035792; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:56:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc3-s22.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s22.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.222]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05MsRl8033517 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:54:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauradi7@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.174.37]) by bay0-omc3-s22.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:54:06 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:54:06 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.174.200 by by103fd.bay103.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:54:05 GMT X-Originating-IP: [72.93.80.155] X-Originating-Email: [lauradi7@hotmail.com] X-Sender: lauradi7@hotmail.com From: "Laura Dickerson" To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:54:05 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Jan 2007 22:54:06.0285 (UTC) FILETIME=[6727B7D0:01C7311C] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] movie costume (more recent) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: cbe511f3-431d-4bd6-ba1c-eea26892470e X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459ED7FC.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 17:58:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I fell in love with the clothes worn by Naomi Watts in "The Painted Veil." It's set in the mid-1920s, and the clothes (designed by Ruth Meyer) follow somewhat her character's development from a spoiled flightly socialite to someone rather different (no spoilers). Does anybody know how accurate the clothes are? The trailer and some stills are available at the web site http://wip.warnerbros.com/paintedveil/ Laura Dickerson _________________________________________________________________ Find sales, coupons, and free shipping, all in one place!  MSN Shopping Sales & Deals http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctid=198,ptnrid=176,ptnrdata=200639 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 18:42:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Ngg84019909 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:42:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l05Ngb0p021066 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:42:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l05Nfxxs004476 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:41:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05NfrLe078485; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:41:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m16.mx.aol.com (imo-m16.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.206]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05Nflk4078300 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:41:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-m16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c14.d8eac30 (60449) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:41:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mblk-d30 (mblk-d30.mblk.aol.com [205.188.149.22]) by ciaaol-r01.mx.aol.com (v114.2) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLR012-ec21459ee22b1fc; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:41:31 -0500 References: <200701051911.l05JAouu092227@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] Schaube Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:41:31 -0500 In-Reply-To: <200701051911.l05JAouu092227@net.indra.com> X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI MIME-Version: 1.0 From: tearoses@aol.com X-MB-Message-Type: User X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 22250 Received: from 68.143.196.38 by mblk-d30.sysops.aol.com (205.188.149.22) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:41:31 -0500 Message-Id: <8C8FF3A295EB8ED-1444-21FF@mblk-d30.sysops.aol.com> X-AOL-IP: 205.188.149.22 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b9458e33-bb7f-4219-b274-63828a0719c9 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EE26E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:42:41 -0500 (EST) Status: RO If you want one like the Henry VIII robe, there's a pattern in the Tudor Tailor book. Here are some dress diaries for women's schaubes: http://www.curiousfrau.com/Diaries/Schaube.htm http://myra.hem.nu/costume/DressDairies/Schaube/Schaube_Dairy.htm http://catrijn.blogspot.com/search/label/schaube Hope this helps! Tea Rose ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 19:27:54 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l060RoIV020737 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:27:54 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l060RjYH018735 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:27:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l060R6jY011977 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:27:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l060QxHs014339; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:27:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l060QsuB014260 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:26:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l060Ufum026983 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:30:41 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:34:57 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com> <8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2631109f-d9f8-4b04-a6f3-4e968e85249c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EED01.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 19:27:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Friday 05 January 2007 12:51 pm, Lynn Downward wrote: > Robin, thank you for sending us that link. It's only fabulous! > > Warning in case someone is thinking of making that dress, even for a > doll: I do some net beading - my sister calls it the insane beading - > and the way that net dress was reproduced promises that it would never > survive a day of wear (not that they reproduced it for wear). The > threads would have to be woven through the beads several times each > for stability, especially since many of the beads used by the > Egyptians are faence and are very sharp-edged and would cut through > the threads. As for folk brave enough to try to make such a beaded dress, I have two words of advice--dental floss. Stronger than any other thread I know of (makers of belly dance garb sometimes suggest it for beading dance bras). > These beautiful dresses would be very time-consuming to > produce and therefore probably owned only by the rich who could afford > to have someone make them. in the case of musicians or dancers who > might wear them, they would probably have been owned by the troupe or > the owner of the troupe, like any other stage property. That would be my guess, as well. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 19:54:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l060sYq1021251 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:54:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l060sTDl013984 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:54:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l060rx0g017090 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:53:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l060rs8N035305; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:53:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32208.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32208.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.139]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l060rmZf035157 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:53:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sstormwatch@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 47131 invoked by uid 60001); 6 Jan 2007 00:53:43 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=eGG9BbA6nNgqaYQY4NvvyZS4VlU0f5v1vaPM/th2KQeubPdbiXcjJvGam31GSy3gJpjp/TXide7I3WCR5TfQdY9fbxuk6EZv10d87mobfZLAm97B9+RRLLAi2UeVoiez7mn715Z6CtM2Q8TG3VFVyv5zNmVh3+ggkLlqdDShOA0=; X-YMail-OSG: GP6SrywVM1lDfjg4oqjYo9cv0RQK_kVUrSFVjUd3i.dRGASi1iPauBWSl2BJeCKd3as_sXbtlTA_prbqyAzLS04Dwg.bXFLxo87L7PaTK.b3i1eGuAI1XZ_p0RwJvj_sp2CtlHSBWgxui7YottfyuW0kTqPjcH0Dfw-- Received: from [129.8.206.204] by web32208.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:53:43 PST Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:53:43 -0800 (PST) From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20070105153530.44547.qmail@web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <271493.46788.qm@web32208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3229acb8-3ff7-47ac-bfda-20b67afed292 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EF345.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 19:54:32 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Schaube is the German word for what the English called a gown, according to Cunnington's book (Handbook of English Costume in the 16th Century). Another term used in England for what is probably the Henry VIII style gown is "shamew", "chammer", or "chymer". However, the descriptions for both appear similar, with no mention of length. In fact, the description of the "gown" entry sounds more like the Henry VIII style than the entry for the other words above. Then there is the sub-description for "demigown" which is the short version, although a period term seems to be "a short rydinge gown", since they were often worn while on horseback. That's according to the book, not me. I will tell you it is very confusing trying to figure out the various terms used, as they often overlap or mean multiple things. Because they also used "frock", "coat", "cassock" and "gabardine" for various outer garments. As to patterns, currently _The Tudor Tailor_ has one version, and there is something in the _Patterns for Theatrical Costumes: Garments, Trims and Accessories from Ancient Egypt to 1915_ by Katherine Strand Holkeboer. I also know that Period Patterns #53 is currently available, with two other companies working on the Henry VIII style patterns for release I don't know when. Kimiko __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 20:03:35 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0613ZM8021413 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:03:35 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0613UJP001000 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:03:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06138Tn018444 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:03:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l061352L041393; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:03:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32205.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32205.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.136]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0612x9X041251 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:03:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sstormwatch@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 63813 invoked by uid 60001); 6 Jan 2007 01:02:54 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=gsFbe9EcdKSVxLxbPaezdPwANn2cFfbTLbD9pUEpmtPGgWHJgFcIVaKjpuslY6l9ZW8j38d8YBlvb3JZE7RxI/xwgd51jAu6tBH6ahc16BdCL5nstMAv9XokkXqlbnIIU1MKwm6Z0HLBv5sI8e0m99m4xn/kdZE5/+Rnslbc0Vo=; X-YMail-OSG: m61AgKgVM1ks8Uw41r2kY43Io_KZ3MGJHo5unsy5TM6w3byue1iHsiNiKsMcgUgoQ5u9CGHSRylKS9K3PNcmppR8FCmGv2OliF8rl95ieGJQEafF4_PQg_op07gtOpl9kblXr0jEz8tkRy0- Received: from [129.8.206.204] by web32205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 17:02:53 PST Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:02:53 -0800 (PST) From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <76533.63184.qm@web32205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-Servercave-Metrics: net.indra.com 1183; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=23% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1fa0827d-36b2-4654-8669-84a6a59fa1c8 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EF562.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 20:03:33 -0500 (EST) Status: RO The overrobe part is called a gown, among other terms (see my other post on that). The part with the skirt at later times was called a jerkin, but early on in the 16th c. was termed a jacquette or jacket. The jacket would have the U shaped opening, or sometimes V shaped, or closed down the front, and would have the skirt attached. The skirt could be worn seperately and be known as a base. The jacket could have a set of sleeves, or the sleeves could belong to the doublet worn underneath, or both at once! (and then you add the gown sleeves as well) And apparantly, the doublet would also have a skirt of some sort, tho usually shorter. So many layers to a man's outfit, and I had thought men got away with wearing less than women at a Tudor faire. I learned better. Kimiko AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: When I was studying costume history in college [not too long after the Schaube went out of style...OK...really the mid 1970's] A schaube was also a short garment, like what you see Henry VIII wearing over his doublet with a set of bases. The thing with the big sleeves and a fur collar. _http://www.marileecody.com/henry8/henry8afterholbein1.jpg_ (http://www.marileecody.com/henry8/henry8afterholbein1.jpg) _http://www.marileecody.com/henry8/henry8eworth1.jpg_ (http://www.marileecody.com/henry8/henry8eworth1.jpg) Sometimes referred to as a jerkin. But the forms of these garments seem so different, the later jerkin being almost identical to a doublet, the terms can get confusing. I always referred to this type of Henry VIII over-robe thingie as a schaube. _______________________________________________ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 20:33:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l061XdWp021913 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:33:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l061XYo3019678 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:33:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l061X8Nm023219 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:33:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l061X3Sd061073; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:33:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s7.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s7.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.79]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l061Wx7g060975 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:33:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from luann_mason@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.161.85]) by bay0-omc1-s7.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:32:53 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:32:53 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 71.36.99.166 by BAY106-DAV13.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 01:32:50 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [71.36.99.166] X-Originating-Email: [luann_mason@msn.com] X-Sender: luann_mason@msn.com From: "LuAnn Mason" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com><8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com> <200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:33:50 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:33:50 -0800 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2007 01:32:53.0896 (UTC) FILETIME=[960DC880:01C73132] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 95819fba-4546-491c-b0cc-25d6153c1d19 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459EFC6E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 20:33:38 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l061XdWp021913 Status: RO Dental floss would be one option, but ever since I discovered kevlar beading thread, I haven't used dental floss again. The kevlar is nice and thin like regular thread, cuts easily, and doesn't fray like dental floss. Just an alternative.... LuAnn in Washington ----- Original Message ----- From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 4:34 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) On Friday 05 January 2007 12:51 pm, Lynn Downward wrote: > Robin, thank you for sending us that link. It's only fabulous! > > Warning in case someone is thinking of making that dress, even for a > doll: I do some net beading - my sister calls it the insane beading - > and the way that net dress was reproduced promises that it would never > survive a day of wear (not that they reproduced it for wear). The > threads would have to be woven through the beads several times each > for stability, especially since many of the beads used by the > Egyptians are faence and are very sharp-edged and would cut through > the threads. As for folk brave enough to try to make such a beaded dress, I have two words of advice--dental floss. Stronger than any other thread I know of (makers of belly dance garb sometimes suggest it for beading dance bras). > These beautiful dresses would be very time-consuming to > produce and therefore probably owned only by the rich who could afford > to have someone make them. in the case of musicians or dancers who > might wear them, they would probably have been owned by the troupe or > the owner of the troupe, like any other stage property. That would be my guess, as well. -- Cathy Raymond > "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 21:05:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0625XlJ022421 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:05:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0625SSL014733 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:05:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06251L1027828 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:05:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0624pXh083531; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:04:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.230]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0624niv083500 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:04:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so3709421nzf for ; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:04:48 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=hrmMKuUKaIO184vfK2Ow4/GgwnFiMvj57Mn9dKpVOC/2hjGutDwkGWKrG3Kw99bme7sjcUy56PLCA0ATk4SyiwWCTE1TLe0v9q3bAUXcUuWF4C0ElZFN89IMX6Ykc6tTeinxRwr4OeQRg5+kv/4l34RGgEIVnRT1OkIXUkt5img= Received: by 10.65.219.5 with SMTP id w5mr2234012qbq.1168049088770; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 18:04:48 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.65.196.15 with HTTP; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:04:48 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:04:48 -0800 From: Cin To: h-cost Subject: Re: [h-cost] movie costumes--Egyptian MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e98a368b-4815-4b38-ade0-e1cddaca53ca X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F03E8.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 21:05:32 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >Speaking of ancient costume history, are any of you expert in the >field of Mesopotamian costume? I'm wondering what else might have been >dug up in that area since I studied costume history. Anyone know any >good books on the subject? >Sylrog Not so much costume as cooking... but the Assyrian cunieform tablets at Cambridge were translated (err, that's Cambridge in Massachussetts). The tablets were recipes. Here's the pop archaeology book on the project. http://www.superchefblog.com/2005/07/oldest-cuisine-in-world-jean-bottero.html There's also a much more scholarly one (in French by the same author) that I used for a Stanford paper years ago. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 22:04:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0634WN3023326 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:04:36 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0634RC7020815 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:04:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0633pDh036583 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:03:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0633lVm021279; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:03:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smapp05.siteprotect.com (smapp05.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.200]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05K72ds050956 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:08:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smapp05.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D3D613CEA for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:06:39 -0600 (CST) Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "cschmitt@genteelarts.com" To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] RE: victorian wedding clothes, X-Origin: 65.164.18.144 Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 14:06:39 -0600 Message-Id: <18485.1168027599@genteelarts.com> X-Mailer: Qwest Office WebMail 5.6 - 65.164.18.144 - cschmitt@genteelarts.com X-Originating-Email: cschmitt@genteelarts.com X-Originating-Ip: 65.164.18.144 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l05K72ds050956 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 50c1155a-6c47-44c8-b435-fb360960d9b9 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F11BB.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:04:31 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri Jan 5 14:18 , 'otsisto' sent: >I had not noticed before but this has a vest(?) on it. > It's not a vest. It's a shaped fichu; triangular back ending at the waist, long tails that come over the shoulder then wrap to the back and tie. It is trimmed with box pleated silk ribbon ruching and Chantilly lace. There are detailed photographs of it in the book "To Love and To Cherish". The dress has a low body - wide off-the- shoulder neckline, short puffed sleeves, pointed waistline. The dress belonged to a young lady from New England (I don't have her name at this location). She sailed around the Cape to San Francisco where she would wed her fiance. She was married shortly after her arrival (the next day, I believe) in the dress she traveled in; the wedding dress was never worn. :-( I'll look up the details and post them when I get home this evening. Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 1-4, 2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 22:08:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0638u4R023407 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:08:56 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0638kWj027001 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:08:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0637Bss037238 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:07:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0637A3w023585; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:07:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05LlsRB065727 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:48:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus0) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1H2wul0xjb-0005Ix; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 16:47:52 -0500 Message-ID: <000801c73113$21067740$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <010701c73065$14883750$6700a8c0@momlaptop> <9fGTqBC04jnFJw4E@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: victorian wedding clothes, was [h-cost] Another film costume rant Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:47:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f2fa0405-d0d8-4a31-b016-133c39f13547 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F12BE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:08:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I wore an off the shoulder wedding gown in 1978 in a Baptist church. No one frowned upon it. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 22:10:37 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063AbRQ023431 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:10:37 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l063AWFY029774 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:10:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l063A4e4037670 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:10:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0639bl9025184; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:09:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpauth.cybermesa.com (smtpauth.cybermesa.com [65.19.4.28]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l060YQBN020474 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:34:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sovagris@cybermesa.com) Received: from [10.0.1.3] (65-101-171-13.desm.qwest.net [65.101.171.13]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtpauth.cybermesa.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l060YEab011239 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:34:21 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <1D30AC38-192E-4B72-B907-498B41EAB895@cybermesa.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed To: h-costume From: Suzanne Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:34:11 -0600 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88/2414/Thu Jan 4 18:41:51 2007 on smtpauth.cybermesa.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Subject: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c9488e42-e2a6-4041-990e-22682ede8d49 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F1328.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:10:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Answering more than one question at once: Yes, I plan on going to CostumeCon. Mostly for the Netherton sequence ;-) but what the heck, might as well stay for Sunday, too. Since I've never gone before, what do I need to know ahead of time? Costuming is a hobby, not my profession, so I'm a little worried about how I'll fit in. Like, what's a "hall costume"??!? I'm assuming that we all wear our stuff all the time but that you keep the competition main entries under wraps until the last minute, so anything else is a "hall" costume... is that about right? And because of CostumeCon, I've bumped the "orange Italian Ren" aka "Hobby Lobby Florentine" (no spinach, just cabbage) to the top of my list of projects to complete this year. For the Sunday ORANGE hall costume contest. Suzanne p.s. can't register until next month when the bank balance recovers from Christmas--sorry! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 22:32:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063Wq3O023979 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:32:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l063Wluf002577 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:32:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l063Arak037781 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:10:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063ApMF025913; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:10:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l061jA1E069645 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:45:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1H30cP2EQE-0000Hj; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 20:45:10 -0500 Message-ID: <004501c73134$4b1c6140$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com><8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com><200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:45:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5e8a936b-ecd5-4df9-9c5c-eb6ed681a574 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 459F185F.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:32:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Luann, Where do you purchase the Kevlar thread? I am dealing with metal beads from the 1920s and scared they might cut the thread. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 22:38:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063cXPe024092 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:38:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l063cSiq009970 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:38:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l063c7Ti041966 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:38:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063c5MQ041933; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:38:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m17.mx.aol.com (imo-m17.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063c1ID041845 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:38:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-m17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.38d.20fb152f (42809) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:37:50 -0500 (EST) From: TeaRoseS@aol.com Message-ID: <38d.20fb152f.32d0738c@aol.com> Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:37:48 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5358 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ef65954d-072f-443e-a9e3-594ca5a8308b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F19B4.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:38:32 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I have heard about that theory, but I didn't know the name of the historian. It makes a lot of sense to me; I've seen replicas of those ancient split-level houses on TV. Regarding the resonance of the scene in the barn, you have a point. I guess the modern concept of a Nativity scene is a descendent of the fictional costumes depicted in Medieval art, huh? Just like Saint Catherine and her sideless surcoat. I'd still like to know if there was any accurate information, though. Tea Rose In a message dated 1/5/2007 9:07:14 P.M. Central Standard Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:16:00 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume To: Historical Costume >From what I hear, the costume would be the least of the difficulty in creating an accurate scene. There are also questions about what the setting really was like, given the architecture and living arrangements of the time. ..... But a "Nativity Scene" in the barn has a lot of history and resonance to it, and so you could legitimately use a medieval-ish costuming theme that would be consistent with the idea of the traditional nativity setting. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 22:48:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063mTcQ024259 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:48:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l063mOHN026822 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:48:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l063m7rO043605 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:48:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063m5TH047782; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:48:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d21.mx.aol.com (imo-d21.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063m1ZJ047689 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:48:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-d21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cb6.7055925 (42809) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:47:54 -0500 (EST) From: TeaRoseS@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:47:52 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon (was: Movies and ancient costume) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5358 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2f00dba0-ef7a-4aa9-9363-d34749bac112 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F1C08.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:48:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Actually, the main draw for me is that it's within driving distance of where I live. I SO wish there was more costuming stuff near Kansas City. (Is a Dickens Fair too much to ask?) But I'll be happy to tell them it's all about the historical lectures. :) Dawn and I wanted to go last year when it was in Des Moines, but I was dealing with a broken foot and the attendant medical bills and couldn't spare the price of registration. We drove up and visited the vendor hall, but I have a feeling we missed all the fun stuff. Tea Rose In a message dated 1/5/2007 9:07:14 P.M. Central Standard Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:33:47 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton Subject: [h-cost] CostumeCon (was: Movies and ancient costume) To: Historical Costume _h-costume@indra.com_ (mailto:h-costume@indra.com) For those of you who decide to to attend the whole con (well worth it!) primarily because you want to come to my lectures, it would be useful if you noted along with your sign-up that my presence was a "draw" for you to attend the con, if only to ease their minds that yes, having me there really is helping broaden their audience. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 22:55:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063tKBo024360 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:55:20 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l063tFCC006887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:55:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l063ATXS037716 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:10:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l063ARUN025660; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:10:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06131hg041340 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:03:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 095F838973 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:02:59 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 19:03:10 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-Servercave-Metrics: net.indra.com 1183; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3099998e-f430-4b21-9f26-f65c6040b204 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F1DA3.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:55:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO size "D" beading floss works about the same and is a little cheaper the dental floss. But if you can't get beading floss then dental is the way to go. And if you do not want to repair beadwork on a garment that you created "DO NOT" use regular sewing thread, no matter how much the thread matches. (lesson as a novice learned) De -----Original Message----- As for folk brave enough to try to make such a beaded dress, I have two words of advice--dental floss. Stronger than any other thread I know of (makers of belly dance garb sometimes suggest it for beading dance bras). _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 23:31:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l064VOpC024936 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:31:24 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l064VJN0005068 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:31:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06350kv036759 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:05:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0634vPX022023; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:04:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05KZho0081158 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:36:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B389B389A0 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:35:42 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] RE: Victorian wedding clothes, Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 14:35:53 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: bc22d8dc-cab9-4436-b076-ad17f94ccca7 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F2617.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 23:31:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I love this site's zoom. :) I wonder if the lace seen on the back of the skirt is a ruffle or bow. Yeah, the drawback with this site is that you can't see the back. :P De -----Original Message----- If you zoom in you will see that there is lace coming from the bodice peaking up from behind the skirt. Something is going on in the back. Maybe some kind of tail on the "vest". Or the vest may be attached to the bodice, although it doesn't really look it. Someone in San Francisco run check it out for us. :-P _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 5 23:31:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l064VOpE024936 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:31:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l064VJN2005068 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:31:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0634PEb036653 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:04:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0634O7t021670; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 20:04:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d04.mx.aol.com (imo-d04.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l05K7hWE051609 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 13:08:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from PasoVasz@aol.com) Received: from PasoVasz@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cd3.78a2d92 (52425) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:07:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.0.104] (host-24-225-211-205.patmedia.net [24.225.211.205]) by ciaaol-m06.mx.aol.com (v114.2) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLM069-ccc9459eaffd2a5; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:07:25 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: <291b87270b48b3f38141dcd2a39a65f7@aol.com> From: Susan Data-Samtak Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: vest on Wedding Dress Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:07:22 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-AOL-IP: 24.225.211.205 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fb9ee15a-bb59-47b8-9d41-7279cd074b21 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F2617.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 05 Jan 2007 23:31:24 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l064VOpE024936 Status: RO Maybe a "bolero" ? Susan "Slow down. The trail is the thing, not the end of the trail. Travel too fast and you miss all you are traveling for".  - "Ride the Dark Trail" by Louis L'Amour On Jan 5, 2007, at 2:54 PM, AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 1/5/2007 2:37:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > otsisto@socket.net writes: > > but this has a vest(?) on it. > > > > ************* > > > If you zoom in you will see that there is lace coming from the bodice > peaking up from behind the skirt. Something is going on in the back. > Maybe some > kind of tail on the "vest". Or the vest may be attached to the > bodice, although > it doesn't really look it. > > Someone in San Francisco run check it out for us. :-P > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 00:23:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065NY5k025711 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:23:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l065NSkf021769 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:23:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l065N6m1053840 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:23:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065N16G001641; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:23:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s31.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s31.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.103]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065MvYm001563 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:22:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from luann_mason@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.161.81]) by bay0-omc1-s31.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:22:52 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:22:52 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 71.36.99.166 by BAY106-DAV9.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 05:22:49 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [71.36.99.166] X-Originating-Email: [luann_mason@msn.com] X-Sender: luann_mason@msn.com From: "LuAnn Mason" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com><8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com><200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com> <004501c73134$4b1c6140$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:23:51 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:23:51 -0800 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2007 05:22:52.0223 (UTC) FILETIME=[B67F64F0:01C73152] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=9% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: bba8baec-023b-4cac-a1ab-cda2bbc58247 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F3250.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:23:32 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l065NY5k025711 Status: RO Penny, I get mine at the local bead shop, but if you Google "kevlar beading thread" it can be mail ordered for about $2.50 a spool. HTH-- LuAnn ----- Original Message ----- From: Penny Ladnier To: Historical Costume Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 5:45 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress Luann, Where do you purchase the Kevlar thread? I am dealing with metal beads from the 1920s and scared they might cut the thread. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 00:36:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065aGrv025918 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:36:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l065aC3k010611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:36:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l065ZlNv055028 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:35:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065Ziuw008539; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:35:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065ZfHH008485 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:35:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=radiks.net; b=dHZVyfM6YhyAGb462ucDBZeT7ME4jFi57WsoAL03sZK+9glelkE/LbliHevbS36L; h=Received:Message-Id:X-Mailer:Date:To:From:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.81.2.235] (helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H34DV-0001N8-3Q for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:35:41 -0500 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20070105232229.077cc2a0@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 23:35:19 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200701060311.l063B7oN026078@net.indra.com> References: <200701060311.l063B7oN026078@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e5334545a5d4a25b07e18d4f1205b06397ca870c4011c145420350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.81.2.235 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume-Con X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0a03227d-3242-47c4-b0f9-13c45611e5fa X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F354C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:36:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 09:11 PM 1/5/2007, you wrote: >Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:34:11 -0600 >From: Suzanne >Subject: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects > >Answering more than one question at once: > >Yes, I plan on going to CostumeCon. Mostly for the Netherton >sequence ;-) but what the heck, might as well stay for Sunday, >too. Since I've never gone before, what do I need to know ahead of >time? Costuming is a hobby, not my profession, so I'm a little >worried about how I'll fit in. Like, what's a "hall costume"??!? >I'm assuming that we all wear our stuff all the time but that you >keep the competition main entries under wraps until the last minute, >so anything else is a "hall" costume... is that about right? For almost all of us - costuming is a hobby. Sometimes also an obsession, but....that's another story. If you love costumes, whether you make exact reproductions of the most elaborate historical gowns, or put together a pirate out of thrift store finds, if you love costume, this is for you. When we started going to Costume Cons (22 years ago now...) we didn't even know how to sew. We just knew we wanted to do this. We also include production people (we can't show off our stuff without lights and sound, after all...), photographers, and those who don't work in fabric but make great props and special effects. All of us (well, most anyway) are amateurs and do this for fun. Yes, a "hall costume" is just what you wear around the convention, it's not required, but adds to the atmosphere of the con. Sometimes it's just funky street wear. Sometimes it's re-enactment level. Anything from ancient history to the far future can and will be seen, as CC encompasses both historical and Fantasy/Science Fiction. Theatrical costuming is welcome also. There are two competitions, a Fashion Show, and the Friday Night Social. Our Social theme is a Rock and Roll party, to fit with the "Hell Freezes Over Tour" theme of the con. The Saturday hall costume competition is Pirates. If you go to www.Costume-Con.org , click on "Timeline", there is a list of all the previous Costume Cons with links to pictures, and sometimes program lists and other stuff. This will give you an idea of what it's all about. And if you're there on Friday, I believe one of the panels scheduled will be "Welcome to your first Costume Con!". Hope to see many of you there. Pierre Pettinger (co-chair) Sandy Pettinger (nag) >And because of CostumeCon, I've bumped the "orange Italian Ren" aka >"Hobby Lobby Florentine" (no spinach, just cabbage) to the top of my >list of projects to complete this year. For the Sunday ORANGE hall >costume contest. > >Suzanne >p.s. can't register until next month when the bank balance recovers >from Christmas--sorry! "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 00:39:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065dY8V025980 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:39:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l065dTMK016298 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:39:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l065dF9t055285 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:39:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065dE9q010246; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:39:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065dAYj010211 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:39:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1H34Gr1o5N-0000Fc; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:39:10 -0500 Message-ID: <009801c73154$fb5eb3d0$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com><8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com><200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com><004501c73134$4b1c6140$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:39:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4d78a676-72cb-4b05-a78b-6852626d1d6f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F3611.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:39:32 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thank you Luann! Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 00:49:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065nEvf026196 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:49:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l065n9S4032280 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:49:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l065mrZH056170 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:48:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065mqIG015381; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:48:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s28.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s28.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.100]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065mmkf015295 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:48:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from luann_mason@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.161.87]) by bay0-omc1-s28.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:48:42 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:48:42 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 71.36.99.166 by BAY106-DAV15.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 05:48:41 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [71.36.99.166] X-Originating-Email: [luann_mason@msn.com] X-Sender: luann_mason@msn.com From: "LuAnn Mason" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com><8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com><200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com><004501c73134$4b1c6140$6700a8c0@momlaptop> <009801c73154$fb5eb3d0$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:49:43 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:49:43 -0800 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2007 05:48:42.0868 (UTC) FILETIME=[52C10B40:01C73156] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b2a8aada-1d47-4e74-a014-20f225668585 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F3855.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:49:13 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l065nEvf026196 Status: RO No problem, Penny. I think you'll be pleased with the results. It's not period, of course, but it is effective and doesn't visually detract from the final appearance. LuAnn ----- Original Message ----- From: Penny Ladnier To: Historical Costume Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 9:39 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress Thank you Luann! Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 00:53:18 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065rDYj026284 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:53:13 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l065r9og006476 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:53:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l065qnpR056479 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:52:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065qmc0017543; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:52:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065qgwn017446 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:52:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l065uT1e004787 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:56:30 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:00:46 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701060100.46146.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2d8e9a6b-a01c-4372-9e8c-233cedcb5b76 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F3945.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:53:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Friday 05 January 2007 8:33 pm, LuAnn Mason wrote: > Dental floss would be one option, but ever since I discovered kevlar > beading thread, I haven't used dental floss again. The kevlar is nice and > thin like regular thread, cuts easily, and doesn't fray like dental floss. > Just an alternative.... Never heard of the stuff, but it sounds like it's worth a try! Where does one buy it? -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 00:56:39 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065udCW026357 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:56:39 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l065uYnk012274 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:56:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l065tHn7056670 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:55:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065tGB4018826; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:55:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065tCta018791 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:55:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l065wxh3004851 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:58:59 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:03:15 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <004501c73134$4b1c6140$6700a8c0@momlaptop> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701060103.15483.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 68a99e48-1961-4c20-b222-385b86451cc2 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F3A12.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:56:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Saturday 06 January 2007 12:23 am, LuAnn Mason wrote: > Penny, I get mine at the local bead shop, but if you Google "kevlar beading > thread" it can be mail ordered for about $2.50 a spool. > Sorry, I missed this message the first time! Please ignore my reply a;sking the same question. Thanks. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 01:05:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0665RPn026479 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:05:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0665Muj027678 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:05:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06658qS057439 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:05:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06655FB023629; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:05:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06651qu023555 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:05:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:16768 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1H34fm-00083Z-KP for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:04:55 -0600 Message-ID: <02d501c73158$96a0eb80$3900a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1D30AC38-192E-4B72-B907-498B41EAB895@cybermesa.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:04:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9c30f264-57ff-4ff8-8b16-d898b2338f00 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F3C23.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 01:05:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm planning to go to CostumeCon, too. It'll be my first one, and I plan to make a few things to wear there, but I'm still trying to figure out what I should make for it (other than my one Impressive Gown, and that piratish coat I've been meaning to make all this past year but never got around to even starting). I'm planning to attend the whole weekend, since Yay! It's local for me, and Boo, I doubt I'll make it to another one anytime soon as I don't travel well lately. I'd say let's all figure out a way to meet up while we're there, but I expect we'll all be meeting in Robin's classes, anyway! Here's what I'm planning to make for my Impressive Gown (yes, it must be capitalized, as I've been planning it for years now): http://www.formfunction.org/temp/mi03977f11a.jpg Being saintswear, though, it's a bit hard to figure out a way to engineer it as an actual outfit, but not trying to use period construction techniques should help a lot. I'd planned to bead the breastband, but since all I've done so far is finally pick out all the fabrics (copper/eggplant dupioni, purple/black taffeta, orange rayon dupioni overlayed with gold/purple silk organza, magenta sari 'silk') that'll be involved, it doesn't look like that's going to happen by March. I have yet to figure out what I'm going to do for headwear, either, sigh... -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 01:27:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l066RT5O026735 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:27:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l066ROhv031170 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:27:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l066Qv0w058784 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:26:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l066QrSo034249; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:26:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l066QnCb034215 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:26:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA05724 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:14:01 -0600 Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:14:01 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects In-Reply-To: <02d501c73158$96a0eb80$3900a8c0@compaqub> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 07ac6dcd-2fa6-467e-a0b4-4fe33ff1d906 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F414C.006 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 01:27:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Sat, 6 Jan 2007, E House wrote: > I'd say let's all figure out a way to meet up while we're there, but I > expect we'll all be meeting in Robin's classes, anyway! Y'know, the obvious thing would be for the h-cost people to meet either before my official class time, or during the lunch break. I am allowed to set my own schedule for my room. I will be in there setting up my slides quite early, as soon as they unlock it for me (and then running off to dress), but of course people would be welcome to bring the beverage of their choice, or maybe breakfast, and come in early to socialize. Or we could all get our lunches as take-out or brown-bag and come back to the room -- I've asked for an hour and a half for lunch break, so there will be plenty of time as long as people aren't all lining up at the hotel restaurant. (There's lots of fast food in the area.) Even if you're not signed up for my lectures, I don't think there would be any problem in you joining a h-cost meet-and-greet either pre-lectures or during the lunch period, as long as you scoot out when the start time approaches (and we start checking names). I will clear this with my con-committee handlers, of course -- I need to see whether they allow people to bring food into the rooms, for instance. And if there's a killer historic panel going on during the lunch break, I don't want to suggest anything that would compete with that. Once I'm sure of the logistics, I'll let the list know shortly before the convention. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 01:29:54 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l066Tskt026763 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:29:54 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l066TnHK002402 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:29:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l065Zks5055025 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:35:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065ZgFP008512; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:35:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l065Zd9P008469 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 22:35:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=radiks.net; b=J01ipVlGgL8nocS47c6WIjPOarnVcoZGNv002XZT5YfaD1tlrOcokPPb1B3RCDky; h=Received:Message-Id:X-Mailer:Date:To:From:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.81.2.235] (helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H34DS-0001N8-VF for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 00:35:39 -0500 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20070105231422.077c9d10@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 23:22:20 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200701060306.l0635sqA022786@net.indra.com> References: <200701060306.l0635sqA022786@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e5334545a5d4a25b07e419e1fc1e04151d2bd2b112f9d2e3fcd350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.81.2.235 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume-Con X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b749c493-3689-46cf-a000-dc9534936df9 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F41DD.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 01:29:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 09:06 PM 1/5/2007, you wrote: >Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:33:47 -0600 (CST) >From: Robin Netherton >Subject: [h-cost] CostumeCon (was: Movies and ancient costume) > >At this point, I think they haven't assigned rooms yet, because they're >still working out the other panels. Yes, we're still working out all the other panels. We're a bit later than expected due to an unforeseen problem. It will get done. >Which means if you sign up soon, you shouldn't have any problem >getting on the list. If you wait too long, it might be harder. > >If you're attending and would be willing to sit on a panel in your area of >expertise, I believe the planners are taking suggestions. If we want more >historic programming, this is the way to make that happen. Panels >typically have several "teachers," so some panels on historic techniques >would be a good way to bring together people who are doing similar work >for some face-to-face cross-fertilization ... and make the con even more >attractive to historic costumers. Just be sure to note that you don't want >to be scheduled opposite me (Saturday all day), so the historic-minded >people (including the panelists) don't have conflicts about what to >attend! Yes, we are taking suggestions for panels, and volunteers for panelists, but hurry - we need to get the schedule firmed up Very Soon Now ;-). >Pierre, one of the CC25 heads, is on this list -- Pierre, please correct >me if I have any of the above wrong. I don't know what the criteria are >for choosing panelists. Can you speak knowledgeably and clearly on a topic of interest to costumers? Do you know how to do a nifty technique or work with an unusual material? Costume-Con is about all types of costuming, so let us know what you know! Contact us at costumrs@radiks.net and we'll talk. Pierre Pettinger (co-chair) Sandy Pettinger (helper and nag :) ) >--Robin "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 02:25:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l067P0Pk003873 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 02:25:04 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l067Otv4015710 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 02:24:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l067OYmn063417 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:24:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l067OUeM062231; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:24:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l067OQuC062200 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 00:24:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 0869B3897C for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:24:26 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:24:38 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f895f29e-e57d-465e-ab5a-c6dbe518aa14 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F4EC7.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 02:24:59 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sadly it looks like I will have to miss the Con. I am in the process of looking for a new vehicle and so my finances will be tight. :( It's wittled down to a Matrix and a CR-V. De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 06:05:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06B59g5015167 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 06:05:13 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06B4x46024026 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 06:05:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06B4Li0079518 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 04:04:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06B4F6D077677; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 04:04:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep30.mail.dk (fep30.mail.dk [80.160.76.194]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06B4AWO077596 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 04:04:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep41.mail.dk ([195.41.46.142]) by fep30.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070106110400.ZGHX20297.fep30.mail.dk@fep41.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:04:00 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.14]) by fep41.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070106110400.LMIM20909.fep41.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:04:00 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c73182$5fdf7ce0$0e14a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:04:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep41.mail.dk from [80.161.20.14] at Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:03:51 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] metmuseumcd X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f59ec05a-e72b-4d2b-877e-c1a220b6c3b6 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459F825B.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 06:05:07 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Helen! Your lovely cd arrived this morning. I have just enjoyed all the gorgeous pictures. It was very gennerous and kind of you to do all this for us all. Thousinds of thanks from my part........... The blue dress is my favourite, (18th century) i just wished there was a picture of its back. And that 20ies dress with the ribbon roses is to die for. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 10:38:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06Fc8gq031684 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:38:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06Fc2Lv002750 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:38:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06FbZS5006868 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 08:37:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06FbLlI045802; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 08:37:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l069I4Al019898 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 02:18:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7B21E1303E6; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 09:11:14 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Schaube Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:18:09 -0800 Message-ID: <001001c73173$95043730$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20070105153530.44547.qmail@web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l069I4Al019898 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 517622a6-a905-4afb-9731-4a528d004dac X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459FC25B.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 10:38:07 -0500 (EST) Status: RO There is a short one in "The Tudor Tailor", page 87, pattern on pages 93-94. It's a starting point. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Zuzana Kraemerova Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 7:36 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube Thanks for help! Gonna search through our art museum library... But the more I search, the more I'm confused about what the word really means. Now I've found an explanation in one of the Czech history of costume books and it says that the "alchubba" was a long dress of mohammeds, opened in front. In 12th century it came to Europe with the crusades. They say that the word later changed to "Schaube", which was a large cloak worn in the entire Europe, especially in the time of Reformation. So the famous Henry VIII-portrait-like robes are probably those called Schaube. Are there some resources about the original garment? The arabian one? ----- Original Message ----- From: "michaela" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube >> I need a little help: I'm looking for pictures and patterns for this > kind of dress: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Schaube.PNG >> it is called "Schaube" in German, originally from arabian "aljubbeh" or > something like that. Somewhere I found that it is also called "robe", > which > is probably not very helpful, because the word "robe" can mean many > different things. > > Sort of but robe generally (should) refer to a garment that hangs from the > shoulders as opposed to something that fits the torso or else fulfills > the > function of a modern coat (which can be semi fitted to the body but > usually > not form fitting.) Surcoat, Ropa these are similar items of the 16thC. > Schaube is used in this sort of generalised term usually too. > >> It is a sort of a shorter cloak, often with fur. I cannot tell more, as > the robe was changing through centuries and the word for it was still the > same. > > Not always shorter, it was many different lengths and it is possible they > all had different names depending on the specific use. Women wore them and > they can be seen in many images. I collected several but it's so hard to > hunt them out in the first place I wouldn't really know where to direct > you! > >> How's that called in English? Do you know any details about this kind >> of > dress or where to find them? Books, webpages? With pictures or patterns? > > The surcoats in Patterns of Fashion aren't too bad to go by. Then the Ropa > in Alcega are also of a similar design. Many men wear them in portraits by > German artists, and there are a number of them for women but they are > usually seen full length in woodcuts or illuminations etc. > > Michaela > who just handed on her Scahube as it was much too big in the shoulders. > Super snuggly and warm though. > http://glittersweet.com > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 12:33:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06HXqor001732 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:33:56 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06HXlto000619 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:33:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06HSHN2020673 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:28:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06HSAnZ021865; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:28:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com (wx-out-0506.google.com [66.249.82.239]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06HS7VG021819 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:28:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from athurman@gmail.com) Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id t11so8718822wxc for ; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 09:28:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=eFX368B0PZJR/cXWzIynKLhyJvRWo8G/QJ2I1zwsVtewJeVyfxxw/cfAAaV4CStJsObVy8KyKqeFj3OUZLLUOIcwuIwSjDs/5GTzdcithdPbg012X1siT6v3iVndfhHgpNkXzqW67k8vMa2vPrQYwLtObiLQPGLqFqD/CyBjj0w= Received: by 10.70.32.10 with SMTP id f10mr45414008wxf.1168104487050; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 09:28:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.70.77.1 with HTTP; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 09:28:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7d21ac190701060928u539f23cfwbcec2b885f26f98e@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:28:06 -0500 From: "A. Thurman" To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: CostumeCon and projects X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 894e88a9-6a7c-4cd4-afdd-c5c74c7dfc7d X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459FDD7B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 12:33:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO For CC 2004 the H-Costume folks arranged for registration to put a big red "H" stamp on member name tags so H-costume people could identify each other on sight. Perhaps something similar could be arranged this year? At this stage, I strongly doubt I'm attending due to financial limitations, though if I can miraculously pull some extra $ out of my hat I would definitely shift my priorities to make it happen! Allison T. > Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 01:14:01 -0600 (CST) > From: Robin Netherton > Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects > To: Historical Costume > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > > On Sat, 6 Jan 2007, E House wrote: > > > I'd say let's all figure out a way to meet up while we're there, but I > > expect we'll all be meeting in Robin's classes, anyway! > > Y'know, the obvious thing would be for the h-cost people to meet either > before my official class time, or during the lunch break. I am allowed to > set my own schedule for my room. I will be in there setting up my slides > quite early, as soon as they unlock it for me (and then running off to > dress), but of course people would be welcome to bring the beverage of > their choice, or maybe breakfast, and come in early to socialize. Or we > could all get our lunches as take-out or brown-bag and come back to the > room -- I've asked for an hour and a half for lunch break, so there will > be plenty of time as long as people aren't all lining up at the hotel > restaurant. (There's lots of fast food in the area.) Even if you're not > signed up for my lectures, I don't think there would be any problem in you > joining a h-cost meet-and-greet either pre-lectures or during the lunch > period, as long as you scoot out when the start time approaches (and we > start checking names). I will clear this with my con-committee handlers, > of course -- I need to see whether they allow people to bring food into > the rooms, for instance. And if there's a killer historic panel going on > during the lunch break, I don't want to suggest anything that would > compete with that. Once I'm sure of the logistics, I'll let the list know > shortly before the convention. > > --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 12:42:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06HgXSv001914 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:42:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06HgS0W029197 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:42:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06Hg3BJ022419 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:42:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06Hg10i031362; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:42:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06HfvFJ031303 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:42:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from carynsobel@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=aqLOIGYsgISXiuFdAd2B93Y0z6ZBlFITgn/m/f6GmACp6zndQeP8gyovTCiS/QvC; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [4.157.14.202] (helo=SobelWriting) by elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H3FYL-0001xW-2I for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 12:41:57 -0500 Message-ID: <00fc01c731ba$2544ea60$ca0e9d04@SobelWriting> From: "Caryn Sobel" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1D30AC38-192E-4B72-B907-498B41EAB895@cybermesa.com> <02d501c73158$96a0eb80$3900a8c0@compaqub> Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:43:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-ELNK-Trace: 251666aee31a72c3c5fbd2bc086b8747239a348a220c26097b68df821fec9e2a4ff0e4d68ef4a50d350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 4.157.14.202 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 072a5e18-84f9-416b-9716-edcbde1bc9ad X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 459FDF84.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 12:42:32 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This will be our first CostumeCon, too. My daughter submitted a few designs, and my husband and I decided it would be a nice, fun gift for her to go--it's her senior year of high school, and she has been working hard. She is making an "updated" Empire-style dress with a leather coat, and I don't know what else yet. We are both *very* excited about Robin's lectures, and are looking forward to meeting some of the faces behind the names here (and the f-costume list, which Emily is on). Caryn P.S. Does anyone know if there are other youngsters like her at CostumeCon? I was hoping she wouldn't be the only one her age there. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 12:59:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06HxodK002300 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:59:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06Hxjf9007579 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:59:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06HxPLT024776 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:59:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06HxMkh042909; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:59:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06HxI24042856 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:59:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m8.in-tch.com [216.166.191.8]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l06HkJM04712 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:46:19 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <001401c731bd$99b367c0$08bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1D30AC38-192E-4B72-B907-498B41EAB895@cybermesa.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:07:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 68632a24-b10f-463f-a91e-bf4c13d80cef X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459FE391.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 12:59:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO That sounds like it would be an eye-watering match to my long-planned-never-made "Tequila Sunrise" fitted gown. Hot pink/fuchsia wool gown (lined in matching hot pink linen), with a surcoat in tangerine orange velvet. I believe I have enough fuchsia-purple to do an optional overgown, if'n I wanted. ;o) --Sue, tied to local (SCA) obligations in March, so no CostumeCon for her ;o( ----- Original Message ----- From: "Suzanne" To: "h-costume" Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 5:34 PM Subject: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects > Answering more than one question at once: > > Yes, I plan on going to CostumeCon. Mostly for the Netherton > sequence ;-) but what the heck, might as well stay for Sunday, > too. Since I've never gone before, what do I need to know ahead of > time? Costuming is a hobby, not my profession, so I'm a little > worried about how I'll fit in. Like, what's a "hall costume"??!? > I'm assuming that we all wear our stuff all the time but that you > keep the competition main entries under wraps until the last minute, > so anything else is a "hall" costume... is that about right? > > And because of CostumeCon, I've bumped the "orange Italian Ren" aka > "Hobby Lobby Florentine" (no spinach, just cabbage) to the top of my > list of projects to complete this year. For the Sunday ORANGE hall > costume contest. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 13:03:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06I3Yab002381 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 13:03:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06I3MwI012735 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 13:03:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06I34Mo025348 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:03:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06I34Au045428; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:03:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06I30jd045386 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:03:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m8.in-tch.com [216.166.191.8]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l06Ho1M05482 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:50:01 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <003101c731be$1e0f1280$08bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com> <200701060100.46146.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:11:40 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ed864509-2097-4ccb-9561-55cd5b85383b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459FE46A.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 13:03:33 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Try Fire Mountain Gems, maybe? They're in Oregon, but I know that they do mail order.... --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 11:00 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) > On Friday 05 January 2007 8:33 pm, LuAnn Mason wrote: > > Dental floss would be one option, but ever since I discovered kevlar > > beading thread, I haven't used dental floss again. The kevlar is nice and > > thin like regular thread, cuts easily, and doesn't fray like dental floss. > > Just an alternative.... > > Never heard of the stuff, but it sounds like it's worth a try! Where does one > buy it? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 13:30:31 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06IUVZ4002897 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 13:30:31 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06IUQkc030147 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 13:30:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06ITk7V027851 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:29:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06ITdNh062964; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:29:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l06ITWm8062774 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:29:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by m08.lax.untd.com with SMTP id AABC394U8A6G9BVJ for (sender ); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:28:46 -0800 (PST) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: QHEuP/IhRKXTJ0EJwxwhgnnhV5Ni+q6RbCo+mN3Hi+M= Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id MBEZSDHL; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 10:28:46 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 10:17:14 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) Message-ID: <20070106.102829.3460.1.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-6,8-43 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-ContentStamp: 16:8:2850798462 X-MAIL-INFO: 34a19c259c0d55cc0d55d57855d52861d198c8fc48c19869386548896901e8c969c55d59a13ca109e9d58c55a178 X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 127.0.0.1|localhost|m08.lax.untd.com|cley@juno.com X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0f07b31d-b279-4623-84c8-7e92ec73a3d3 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459FEAC2.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 13:30:30 -0500 (EST) Status: RO And they're incredibly helpful. Mail order makes up the bulk of their business. www.firemountaingems.com Arlys On Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:11:40 -0700 "Sue Clemenger" writes: > Try Fire Mountain Gems, maybe? They're in Oregon, but I know that > they do > mail order.... > --Sue > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 11:00 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie > costumes--Egyptian) > > > > On Friday 05 January 2007 8:33 pm, LuAnn Mason wrote: > > > Dental floss would be one option, but ever since I discovered > kevlar > > > beading thread, I haven't used dental floss again. The kevlar > is nice > and > > > thin like regular thread, cuts easily, and doesn't fray like > dental > floss. > > > Just an alternative.... > > > > Never heard of the stuff, but it sounds like it's worth a try! > Where does > one > > buy it? > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 14:18:57 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06JIrm1003838 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 14:18:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06JImiw006670 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 14:18:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06JI7B8033696 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:18:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06JHp4T095589; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:17:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06JHPon095297 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:17:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.178] (pool180-178.patriot.net [209.249.180.178]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3sarge3) with ESMTP id l06JHJrt015695 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 14:17:23 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v733) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <60A5B98D-6428-41C9-B047-8B363E36B01C@patriot.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Carol Kocian Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:58:39 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.733) X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: eb993cb7-e0e2-4e35-8efb-47bc4eabe0c9 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459FF618.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 14:18:52 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 6, 2007, at 2:14 AM, Robin Netherton wrote: >> I'd say let's all figure out a way to meet up while we're there, >> but I >> expect we'll all be meeting in Robin's classes, anyway! > > Y'know, the obvious thing would be for the h-cost people to meet > either > before my official class time, or during the lunch break. At some Costume Society of America meetings, H-costume people would identify themselves by a red "H" on their name tag. The same could be done with a convention badge. I carried a red sharpie around with me at one meeting, so if I recognized someone she could mark her badge right there. :-) So if people can't make it to a meet-up, they can still recognize each other any time. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 14:59:37 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06JxbJC004714 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 14:59:37 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06JxWeM001397 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 14:59:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06Jx8eb038450 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:59:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06Jx3kP023545; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:59:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web51309.mail.yahoo.com (web51309.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.38.175]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l06Jx0Aq023438 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:59:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from elvestoorder@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 23398 invoked by uid 60001); 6 Jan 2007 19:58:55 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=eBJ7NfRuTsZXwI43GzNLX7Vfhx6Ec8dmuRD1vMP9iQ3oiTtdnPU22vpISoUFdloksntpDMLlWCOwA/qlBxgZrpgkqHtfcYSwT+fdzBSPerlpb6h5E8SLUOethMndsxNLw2YVE/LRhD9AvIhzK+L2LtZYPMFPy4TmeezvKcxnPZU=; X-YMail-OSG: lEHHwDsVM1lOrVzKDt_5vazcipLadpwORxUkff_IphpCQZh5RS0Dk6NFIUYTRJZYunVpY_wdePctWZW4QU5_QvZiuZHNNe4wUjhlTulleno6L4obEEFiuyWrfUN..19uwcigOpd8f8H67cfIm7a3HmgpBQ-- Received: from [69.183.50.229] by web51309.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 11:58:55 PST Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 11:58:55 -0800 (PST) From: Ann Catelli To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <00fc01c731ba$2544ea60$ca0e9d04@SobelWriting> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <75166.23036.qm@web51309.mail.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: CostumeCon X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8cbee6d5-bda1-4376-9047-8cb729939e0a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 459FFFA4.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 14:59:36 -0500 (EST) Status: RO --- Caryn Sobel wrote: > P.S. Does anyone know if there are other youngsters > like her at CostumeCon? > I was hoping she wouldn't be the only one her age > there. There were several young-mid teens kids there last year; I hope to see them again--they're great! Do any of you have the problem that when you get all excited about an aspect of costuming, and try to tell your friends about it, and they start to avoid you? Costume-Con is Full of costume enthusiasts, even the ones likely to spend the whole weekend in t-shirts and jeans (me, last year). Even hanging out in the Con Suite can be a costuming experience. :) I've been to quite a lot of CC's, around 15, and they're great fun. I may not pay as much attention to new people as I'd like, as I don't see my old friends from prior CCs from year to year, and I get too focused. Attract my attention! I'm glad to meet new people, especially fellow costume enthusiasts. :) I'll be there with a medium-sized to big doll in my arms, cloth or resin ball-jointed. I haven't decided who's going to go yet. Ann in CT __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 18:31:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06NVxYJ010262 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 18:31:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l06NVr12010458 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 18:31:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l06NVANx062521 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 16:31:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l06NV1pZ062613; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 16:31:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web56703.mail.re3.yahoo.com (web56703.mail.re3.yahoo.com [66.196.97.62]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l06NUupO062510 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 16:30:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hanstar88@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 42818 invoked by uid 60001); 6 Jan 2007 23:30:50 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=sFlQjM6IiXjTAu05Iwmc7V4edJPt1FEA1zW/8c18/KxxymlbeZJl8TMgN5Wc+9vI3B0dJUdoIj4Smpzmh9+NbGYWRCsHYkCOEPUCUCHap9d49E7KGjHF/6PucrkafhYaCDySTXwJNDOadTHOAsvEH1UnhIZ4b0Q67iDjOpT2/kI= ; Message-ID: <20070106233050.42816.qmail@web56703.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Received: from [67.169.12.111] by web56703.mail.re3.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 15:30:50 PST Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 15:30:50 -0800 (PST) From: Mary To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Moda a Firenze - reprint X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 15ca1786-10f4-4033-ad10-8de66b1c98a1 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A03169.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 18:31:58 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l06NVxYJ010262 Status: RO Maybe they got too many pre-orders? LOL I *swear* they had a notice up that said 30% off until March. ~mary Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:55:20 -0500 From: "Rickard, Patty " Subject: RE: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint I went to the site, but didn't see notice of a discount. Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Mary Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 10:56 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint I was poking around on the Polistampa website, which I believe is the publisher of the Moda a Firenze book. They have a notice on the site that they will reprint the book and it will be available in April 2007. If you pre-order it now, you get a 30% discount (off of 58 Euros). However, if you order from them, I recall that getting payment to them is quite difficult. I don't remember the details from when I tried to order this book from them when it first came out, but I finally gave up because I didn't have the time to jump through all the hoops it required! http://www.polistampa.com/asp/sl.asp?id=3653 ~Mary _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 19:02:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0702SK5010927 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 19:02:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0702Mg4027379 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 19:02:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0701rOr065472 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 17:01:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0701pF3081975; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 17:01:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0701k5D081877 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 17:01:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Chindora@aol.com) Received: from Chindora@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cf3.6853b50 (52353) for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 19:01:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from MBLK-R03 (mblk-r03.mblk.aol.com [152.163.211.194]) by ciaaol-r02.mx.aol.com (v114.2) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLR027-cc8145a0385e220; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 19:01:34 -0500 References: <20070106233050.42816.qmail@web56703.mail.re3.yahoo.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2007 19:01:33 -0500 In-Reply-To: <20070106233050.42816.qmail@web56703.mail.re3.yahoo.com> X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI MIME-Version: 1.0 From: chindora@aol.com X-MB-Message-Type: User X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 22250 Received: from 66.177.236.38 by MBLK-R03.sysops.aol.com (152.163.211.194) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 19:01:33 -0500 Message-Id: <8C90006209309AA-1398-11AF@MBLK-R03.sysops.aol.com> X-AOL-IP: 152.163.211.194 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] A scrap of Victorian velvet X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0661704a-97d9-40d9-b0cd-78313af51ad6 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A0388E.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 19:02:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Greetings :) I am upholstering an organ stool, approximately 1880-1890 vintage, and have come across a scrap of velvet with the pile intact. If anyone is interested in the scrap, please e-mail me off the list and I will be happy to send it along. It is a deep burgundy colour with a very nice, thick pile. The scrap was somehow mashed up into the stuffing and is what the original exterior was made from, but it has had no wear. The original seat covering was still there, underneath a slightly younger but still early 20th century piece of (now) very worn brocade. The original velvet seat was completely worn down to a nubbin, with absolutely none of the pile left showing, but the ground fabric matches the scrap that I found inside. I am fairly certain that this is the original velvet as there were only two sets of nails in the frame, those holding the still velvet ground and then the much further spaced decorative tacks that were holding the brocade in place. :) ~Kimberley Jacksonville, Florida -----Original Message----- From: hanstar88@yahoo.com To: h-costume@indra.com Sent: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 3:30 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: Moda a Firenze - reprint Maybe they got too many pre-orders? LOL I *swear* they had a notice up that said 30% off until March. ~mary Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:55:20 -0500 From: "Rickard, Patty " Subject: RE: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint I went to the site, but didn't see notice of a discount. Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Mary Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 10:56 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Moda a Firenze - reprint I was poking around on the Polistampa website, which I believe is the publisher of the Moda a Firenze book. They have a notice on the site that they will reprint the book and it will be available in April 2007. If you pre-order it now, you get a 30% discount (off of 58 Euros). However, if you order from them, I recall that getting payment to them is quite difficult. I don't remember the details from when I tried to order this book from them when it first came out, but I finally gave up because I didn't have the time to jump through all the hoops it required! http://www.polistampa.com/asp/sl.asp?id=3653 ~Mary _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 19:40:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l070ed5a012180 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 19:40:39 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l070eVZ0021279 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 19:40:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l070dt19069285 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 17:39:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l070dpiU003217; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 17:39:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l070dmn9003138 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 17:39:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A3C9BB475 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 18:39:42 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45A04162.5090802@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2007 18:40:02 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: CostumeCon and projects References: <7d21ac190701060928u539f23cfwbcec2b885f26f98e@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <7d21ac190701060928u539f23cfwbcec2b885f26f98e@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: bb2aa36d-88a8-4b54-8030-4feed3c8a221 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A0417F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 19:40:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A. Thurman wrote: > For CC 2004 the H-Costume folks arranged for registration to put a big > red "H" stamp on member name tags so H-costume people could identify > each other on sight. Perhaps something similar could be arranged this > year? I think I have a half-finished red beaded H from our aborted trip last year.... I was planning to go to St Louis because it's only a half day drive. And yeah, Robin's lectures are a big draw, too. I guess I better get moving on my costumes then, they've been hanging ignored for a year now. :( Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 6 22:50:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l073oXPT017532 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 22:50:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l073oSE8002842 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 22:50:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l073njEp087089 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 20:49:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l073nesv003226; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 20:49:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nlpi001.sbcis.sbc.com (nlpi001.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l073nZ50003128 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 20:49:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.48.45] Received: from [192.168.1.101] (adsl-69-107-48-45.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.48.45]) by nlpi001.sbcis.sbc.com (8.13.8 out.dk.spool/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l073mitn004430 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 21:48:44 -0600 Message-ID: <45A06E36.3080207@frys.com> Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2007 19:51:18 -0800 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Schaube References: <937349.72828.qm@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <937349.72828.qm@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=10% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 03cb55a9-be2b-4881-8d49-b7109108069d X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A06E04.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 06 Jan 2007 22:50:32 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > I need a little help: I'm looking for pictures and patterns for this kind of dress: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Schaube.PNG > it is called "Schaube" in German, originally from arabian "aljubbeh" or something like that. Somewhere I found that it is also called "robe", which is probably not very helpful, because the word "robe" can mean many different things. > It is a sort of a shorter cloak, often with fur. I cannot tell more, as the robe was changing through centuries and the word for it was still the same. > How's that called in English? Do you know any details about this kind of dress or where to find them? Books, webpages? With pictures or patterns? > I don't know where you live, but in America the great-great-grandchild of this garment is worn by judges and graduates. They're likely to have a yoke with the back piece gathered into it. Snape, in the Harry Potter movies, wears one. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 00:35:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l075YuPJ019987 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 00:35:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l075Yp3J008123 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 00:34:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l075YPlP095874 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 6 Jan 2007 22:34:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l075YKIM050984; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 22:34:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l075YHDt050943 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 22:34:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from carynsobel@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=ZzShpR+exDohwP8Y4erVy/zoHtaUF0o9CI+W4kivwLPRvKWI/JxvG4XPqymwmOHt; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [4.156.231.26] (helo=SobelWriting) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H3Qfg-00056s-3l for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 00:34:16 -0500 Message-ID: <002601c7321d$a3c9a4d0$1ae79c04@SobelWriting> From: "Caryn Sobel" To: "Historical Costume" References: <75166.23036.qm@web51309.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: CostumeCon Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 00:35:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-ELNK-Trace: 251666aee31a72c3c5fbd2bc086b8747239a348a220c26099df6b3dc0b259ea66841d981c095dabc93caf27dac41a8fd350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 4.156.231.26 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5200dd0e-6304-42c6-9aef-fefa417a155c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A0867B.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 00:34:55 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thanks, Ann. That's good news! My daughter's only "true" historical costume so far for CostumeCon is still in the research phase--she saw the movie "Hero" and is trying to find what era the costume might be from (not much from the Qin era so far), if it is based on a real style. I thought that a wrap-type dress might be quicker to do when she already has her hands full with the earlier ones, and will give me something to do a little embroidery with. We'll see how that goes... Caryn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 13:20:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07IK4rw019639 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 13:20:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l07IJvTK021881 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 13:20:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l07IJLhZ043788 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 11:19:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07IJ6kD091207; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 11:19:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from navgw2.mccc.edu (navgw2.mccc.edu [198.133.170.232]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l07IJ2H6091018 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 11:19:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from pinner@mccc.edu) Received: from tecoma.mccc.edu ([198.133.170.1]) by navgw2.mccc.edu (SMSSMTP 4.1.0.19) with SMTP id M2007010713185619197 for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 13:18:56 -0500 Received: from Kate ([198.133.170.246]) by tecoma.mccc.edu (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l07IIr8r003667 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 13:18:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <013901c73288$55aa1760$50a810ac@Kate> From: "Kate Pinner" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701042008.08486.cathy@thyrsus.com><8296995c0701050951w9ccdfd5rd11a43244d27f8fd@mail.gmail.com> <200701051934.57503.cathy@thyrsus.com> Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 13:19:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] dental floss(was: The bead-net dress ) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a7bc34a3-f3e7-4d5c-bc09-57ca79632bd9 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A139CD.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 13:20:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dental floss also is great for buttons for stage -- almost totally actor-proof! Kate ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 7:34 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] The bead-net dress (was: movie costumes--Egyptian) > On Friday 05 January 2007 12:51 pm, Lynn Downward wrote: >> Robin, thank you for sending us that link. It's only fabulous! >> >> Warning in case someone is thinking of making that dress, even for a >> doll: I do some net beading - my sister calls it the insane beading - >> and the way that net dress was reproduced promises that it would never >> survive a day of wear (not that they reproduced it for wear). The >> threads would have to be woven through the beads several times each >> for stability, especially since many of the beads used by the >> Egyptians are faence and are very sharp-edged and would cut through >> the threads. > > > As for folk brave enough to try to make such a beaded dress, I have two > words > of advice--dental floss. Stronger than any other thread I know of (makers > of > belly dance garb sometimes suggest it for beading dance bras). > >> These beautiful dresses would be very time-consuming to >> produce and therefore probably owned only by the rich who could afford >> to have someone make them. in the case of musicians or dancers who >> might wear them, they would probably have been owned by the troupe or >> the owner of the troupe, like any other stage property. > > That would be my guess, as well. > > > > > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point > of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 15:03:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07K34u1021899 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:03:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l07K2x5n004456 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:03:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l07K2Bvn074176 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 13:02:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07K272V091983; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 13:02:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52113.mail.yahoo.com (web52113.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.116]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l07K22mY091837 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 13:02:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Received: (qmail 83393 invoked by uid 60001); 7 Jan 2007 20:01:56 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=bMFG7prZoSGeKvwsKidkZ7X4Vb0r3lbnXWDkOI+L7e1vY5EH3oEdYmOFjYOmSFn7gHXgaiT19H6bKyV7hz+Iw4YsVqnm6tNHEevi3OAPezVDYCSlrrsjyAdYCZMFYaIJdgTEFsN8efEINDtkkA0TJYC6gib30Q3XJdvmmacVTvk= ; Message-ID: <20070107200156.83391.qmail@web52113.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [74.114.43.209] by web52113.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 12:01:56 PST Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 12:01:56 -0800 (PST) From: Kathy Page To: Historical Costume List MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Florentine Men's wear, c. 1475 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d69681d7-0f49-4317-9acf-b92aec64a7d2 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A151F3.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 15:03:03 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l07K34u1021899 Status: RO I'm picking back up with this project in a big way, and in my Sunday meanderings through my art references, something has come to mind. I am cross posting this, so some of you might get it twice. It wouldn't be original to suggest that men's hose were footless, it's how they were worn that seems to jump out at me. I could never quite figure out how they had them soooo skin tight. Yes, wool stretches where it needs to (but it doesn't return, which makes this a real conundrum), but there is a point that even that won't work - the ankle fitting was my biggest concern. I am sure to say they didn't make hose out of wool exclusively, either. So I started looking to see what I could find... I found several that had lacing up the back of the calf, a closure at the ankle, and of course the stirrup reaching under the instep. This suggests to me how linen or silk hose were treated, being less elastic than wool. Flip through images on this site, it's loaded with various detail images: http://www.scrimatorino.it/images/iconxv.html These pics in particular: http://www.scrimatorino.it/images/icon/xv/xv-13.jpg Lacing up the back of the calf, lower left, man in red hose. Look between the lacing, the colour of his skin doesn't show through - it's white. http://www.scrimatorino.it/images/icon/xv/xv-43.jpg two again, man on lower left. There is clearly two distinct colours going on, and I am pretty sure that isn't armour. Same thing here. Second man from right, foreground. Look at the opening in his boot, there is a distinct line: http://jessamynscloset.com/images/more%20art/vic%5C This guy, you can't miss he is wearing socks over his hose. Piper on right: http://jessamynscloset.com/images/postspainimages/Reyeshombres/rhIV.jpg The man in yellow has his hose split *up from* the foot and tucked away, rather than rolled down, as we are used to seeing it. http://jessamynscloset.com/images/postspainimages/Pinturas%20sobre/PS138.jpg These guys here are showing more realistic sag and bag at the joints that I would expect: http://jessamynscloset.com/images/postspainimages/Nobleza2/no18.jpg Also at the high ankle on the man at left, I would swear there was a ridge where the hem of a sock would be *under* his hose. This guy has a button closure at the inner ankle: http://jessamynscloset.com/images/postspainimages/Nobleza2/no147.jpg I also have a photo of an extant man's hose, although I can't for the life of me relocate where I got it from. All I know is that it's contemporary to this project, based on where I filed it. The cut doesn't seem too surprising until one looks to the hip to waist, then all the measurements seem really off - far too low of a seat rise to meet the waist, assuming the wearer was at least reasonably proportionate. Oddly too, these are not likely wool - it's a broad striped brocade cut on the straight of grain. Another thing I am trying to deal with is getting the seat tight enough to look the way they should, yet give him something to sit down with. Luckily the man in question isn't overly endowed in the caboose department, but still, my first efforts to have it cover over the back of the hip to the point of almost meeting at the waist, yet have him the space to sit it, succeeded in immediately tearing away from their points at the farsetto waist. Interestingly, this guy is wearing the back of his hose about the same way my client would have to, man on right in red: http://jessamynscloset.com/images/more%20art/1406Cabrera I guess in my mental meanderings, I am wondering if anyone has tried employing these adjustment techniques, actually uses the footless hose and sock combination, and has found a way to accomplish covering someones' butt yet they had the space to sit in, without the use of endless fish inserts to force roundness into the back of the hose. I can't justify using fish, there is not one image out there that places a seam of any kind over the fullest part of the hip. Any ideas? Kathy Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert (Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. It’s never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 16:47:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07Lldor024324 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:47:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l07LlYaW025588 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:47:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l07Lksjp094445 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:46:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07Lknn6079424; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:46:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52114.mail.yahoo.com (web52114.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.117]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l07K44x6093814 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 13:04:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Received: (qmail 97954 invoked by uid 60001); 7 Jan 2007 20:03:58 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=m1r/sQZ819/84Hsi4duI2HLU0xg4FCEoqkrR+9GJ+qnLRvD6EltCv84k6YrnFhLfyZ0fY1hQoqR8KIv8oJQIdiO49dKXRIj/RId82TWEmBln1qGMsU93SGt1GVygR84RA1NYSy4zDoNiXIMbQ3ee1Hg9w1+zHZYlOaqBPmaig38= ; Message-ID: <20070107200358.97952.qmail@web52114.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [74.114.43.209] by web52114.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 12:03:58 PST Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 12:03:58 -0800 (PST) From: Kathy Page To: Historical Costume List MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3b3e6cba-0cfb-48aa-bf44-c8e5dc215f6e X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A16A76.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 16:47:38 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l07Lldor024324 Status: RO I have someone wanting a pair of those Birka poufy pants. Does anyone have a general assembly, pattern sort of thing out there that I might use? I swear someone out there had a fairly definitive how to, but I can no longer locate it. Kathy Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert (Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. It’s never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 17:14:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07ME9jR025327 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:14:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l07ME2fi006540 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:14:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l07MDhPs098793 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:13:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07MDf9T000829; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:13:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-61.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07MDa8a000664 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:13:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 398B8BB6A0 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:13:31 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45A170A8.8050702@reddawn.net> Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2007 16:14:00 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants References: <20070107200358.97952.qmail@web52114.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20070107200358.97952.qmail@web52114.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1953ecc5-ddcf-40e4-a22c-0bee35c3221e X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A170AB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 17:14:07 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Kathy Page wrote: > I have someone wanting a pair of those Birka poufy pants. Does anyone have a general assembly, pattern sort of thing out there that I might use? I swear someone out there had a fairly definitive how to, but I can no longer locate it. > > Kathy > Basic drawstring pants: www.reddawn.net/costume/drawstri.htm Warning, it's aimed at people who really don't know how to sew. :) Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 17:24:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07MOP5U025683 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:24:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l07MOKWx014489 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:24:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l07MNsiX000831 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:23:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07MNoKV008971; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:23:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.200.171]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l07MNlfm008843 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:23:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from emeraldepona@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 89443 invoked by uid 60001); 7 Jan 2007 22:23:42 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=ivaH5kbeOl0Z37+reCtT9cuNQRanZmEbFsylnFOktRNnDl2m4DvhKeHxjQIO5D8UTNm7bnBCkNnOGpFwaD4TBeW4b/3gNRa9yWIv7nYqzVajxSI4PhDClFetYhje4R2FgumIjLSaNtvgK81nDrobckdEF6ggxfvtrAipFr2LCR0=; X-YMail-OSG: sc8THLoVM1nKEBM_nrisDLvRwlbDfNSrRJ9d6.2Ey7vAQiT5FT68IlEBcV_P6xe4EWQ6E1_BugOcYWSSYEz_gWFC.XCmJ11qakhGNDLsklG8YoRUsXhmkABfheBW4s2DSaevfeKwZcTGjQ-- Received: from [208.111.207.6] by web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 14:23:42 PST Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:23:42 -0800 (PST) From: Chris Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <45A170A8.8050702@reddawn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <148347.88798.qm@web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2db9df1e-4650-459e-b2ba-58d008c8dfc5 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A17314.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 17:24:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Try Thora's page: http://www.vikinganswerlady.com/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 17:36:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07Ma4JB025955 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:36:04 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l07MZxnW032194 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:36:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l07MZc3p002473 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:35:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07MZaxw017853; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:35:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07MZXOE017768 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:35:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from optonline.net (hamstr8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.23]) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <0JBI00M7IS2PVA60@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 17:35:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.240.3.208] (Forwarded-For: 70.90.217.145, [10.240.3.208]) by mstr8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mshttpd); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 22:35:13 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2007 22:35:13 +0000 (GMT) From: monicaspence@optonline.net Subject: Re: [h-cost] Questions re: Moda a Firenze In-reply-to: <459EA2AA.3080301@faucet.net> To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Sun Java(tm) System Messenger Express 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006) Content-language: en X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal References: <7d21ac190612261529n35fef81fwe5eaeb165a10b62c@mail.gmail.com> <459EA2AA.3080301@faucet.net> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 647fcbf2-d009-4abb-ad48-b9c719725a81 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A175CF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 17:36:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I ordered mine a few days after it was published ( when I found out about it) from Michael Shemansky for $95USD. Monica ----- Original Message ----- From: Melanie Schuessler Date: Friday, January 5, 2007 1:18 pm Subject: Re: [h-cost] Questions re: Moda a Firenze To: Historical Costume > Greetings to all, > > I have a different question about this book. To those of you in > the US > who got it when it first became available: how much did you pay > for it, > and when was that? I'm trying to establish the "original" price > of this > book to see how much it's gone up and how fast. > > The book itself says it's 58 euros, which translates (at today's > rate) > to $75, but I doubt anyone in the US got it for that once > shipping was > taken into account, and I know that the US vendors that > carry/ied it > upped the price for the same reason. > > Please reply to melanie@faucet.net > > Thanks! > Melanie Schuessler > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 17:51:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07Mp5TZ026250 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:51:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l07Mp0x8019961 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:51:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l07MoTNo004938 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:50:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07MoQnF029366; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:50:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp104.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com (smtp104.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com [206.190.36.82]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l07MoNGJ029249 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:50:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nicolaa@rogers.com) Received: (qmail 50094 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2007 22:50:17 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=rogers.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=hNviq5ruZH0OkPXSjdhqr4RkMOgmZ7XOrC+ypBQWyNAG68plfH0MWCUttUwOAKZuHYHMFmL0UaFHLzKBFSXtELL3vbi6GzrwvJTfpAfIX6F6i9aUZTpFGf7ykXB31PBWjUeDVoS8+jkMQ6PWbqlD+9a71BJGOFw/Rh8Ozx5Ef2M= ; Received: from unknown (HELO ?74.118.28.236?) (nicolaa@rogers.com@74.118.28.236 with plain) by smtp104.rog.mail.re2.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2007 22:50:17 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: LuffKPgVM1n7AwUzN0tjO460REVx6siKQ9u26WcDcR0vJRTaM4pEhKc74yy1vMY8Bw-- Message-ID: <45A17931.3040705@rogers.com> Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2007 17:50:25 -0500 From: Susan Carroll-Clark User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants References: <148347.88798.qm@web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <148347.88798.qm@web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 099f3569-b84f-4eb3-a545-8ac4a9b6a319 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A17954.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 17:51:04 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Greetings-- Chris wrote: > Try Thora's page: http://www.vikinganswerlady.com/ > Right name, wrong site. The Viking Answer Lady is Gunnvor, not Thora. Mistress Thora Sharptooth wrote a good article on the "poufy pants" many years ago, which used to be available on her website ( http://www.cs.vassar.edu/~capriest/vikresource.html) but no longer appears to be there. From what I understand from a discussion another list it may be that she has reconsidered the evidence for the poufy pants and no longer thinks they were quite so poufy, but more just standard trousers with lower-leg binding. Susan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 18:00:57 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07N0v4k026405 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 18:00:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l07N0ql8001165 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 18:00:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l07N0Xpt006997 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:00:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l07N0VCf037402; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:00:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.200.171]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l07N0Rw5037303 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:00:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from emeraldepona@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 726 invoked by uid 60001); 7 Jan 2007 23:00:22 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=MUJlLk9F/rjbD9PyeD7ZhmFa3HyA1jHDxaZN+kGTYpDol1LnMqE7srtTmMexSXXyy+J4wWBibGVsFMdlnGaZq2NkoR185VjvEujkY0f4lELX86qYlRGveX2Mg5Xlc/aMZ3cj+lsu6On8yskqtgcydzQU1hVl3+AioaHy5/AA8fU=; X-YMail-OSG: kqPzgvoVM1mP9Vt8Z0Y6164053uZ2HAovQLSXUePbymKv41QVm5hkbya0k9QB2iFk0duDChP2gdFbz0BSU9XgjVTs_QNB9u4C2LYzTLlwamv1y9a0oYCkQistOnmV9LCZdglLDZ.cNmBy0w- Received: from [208.111.207.6] by web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 15:00:22 PST Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:00:22 -0800 (PST) From: Chris Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <45A17931.3040705@rogers.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <527123.620.qm@web31008.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f2a27f73-db92-4681-b7e8-415bf848659f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A17BA4.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 18:00:55 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Right! Realized my error as soon as I hit 'send' :) Thanks for catching it. Susan Carroll-Clark wrote: Greetings-- Chris wrote: > Try Thora's page: http://www.vikinganswerlady.com/ > Right name, wrong site. The Viking Answer Lady is Gunnvor, not Thora. Mistress Thora Sharptooth wrote a good article on the "poufy pants" many years ago, which used to be available on her website ( http://www.cs.vassar.edu/~capriest/vikresource.html) but no longer appears to be there. From what I understand from a discussion another list it may be that she has reconsidered the evidence for the poufy pants and no longer thinks they were quite so poufy, but more just standard trousers with lower-leg binding. Susan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 7 19:13:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l080D9LA027936 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 19:13:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l080D402031105 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 19:13:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l080CRYC017013 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:12:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l080CNnD091337; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:12:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l080CJeT091283 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:12:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA11103 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 18:59:39 -0600 Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 18:59:39 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] dental floss(was: The bead-net dress ) In-Reply-To: <013901c73288$55aa1760$50a810ac@Kate> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 27837356-6e1c-4d1a-8549-5d2e60fbf4fe X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A18C90.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 19:13:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Sun, 7 Jan 2007, Kate Pinner wrote: > Dental floss also is great for buttons for stage -- almost totally > actor-proof! Nothing like it to hold heavy cartridge-pleated skirts, too. I did one in pink once, for which I used cinnamon-flavored floss! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 05:46:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08Ak8cP019072 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 05:46:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l08Ak35u015278 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 05:46:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l08AjUO8001808 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 03:45:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08AjPAQ001009; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 03:45:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from outbound-mail-50.bluehost.com (outbound-mail-50.bluehost.com [69.89.18.19]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l08AjLhV000957 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 03:45:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from g.vinje@drakt.org) Received: (qmail 23656 invoked by uid 0); 8 Jan 2007 10:45:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box77.bluehost.com) (70.103.189.77) by mailproxy3.bluehost.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2007 10:45:19 -0000 Received: from cm-84.208.194.046.chello.no ([84.208.194.46] helo=acer.upc.no) by box77.bluehost.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1H3s0F-00085V-BB for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 03:45:19 -0700 Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2007 11:45:05 +0100 To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants From: "G.Vinje" Organization: privat Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20070107200358.97952.qmail@web52114.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20070107200358.97952.qmail@web52114.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: Opera Mail/9.02 (Win32) X-Identified-User: {515:box77.bluehost.com:draktorg:drakt.org} {sentby:smtp auth 84.208.194.46 authed with g.vinje+drakt.org} X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=23% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 081326e4-e9fc-428e-884b-90d0fb3c7b26 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A220EB.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 05:46:07 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Sun, 07 Jan 2007 21:03:58 +0100, Kathy Page wrote: Poufy swedish 9th-10thC pants; http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/drakter/monster/dvmpasbyxor.pdf You'll probably figure out what goes where from the drawings. The stuff that is hard to figure out if you can't read the language; Your waistbands lenght should be the same as your waistmeasurements. The width of each pantleg is 3,20m between C and B. Cut 2. Pleat where you see a dotted line between C and B. Gunvor -- "Jeg har sagt ja og nei og DA får du lov" Anders (nesten 4 år) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 11:25:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08GPZTO013696 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 11:25:35 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l08GPTFX030071 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 11:25:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l08GFlXM050097 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 09:15:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08GF9Rt076294; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 09:15:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web26501.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (web26501.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.146.176.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l085PitJ094909 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 22:25:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lenastrid@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 26720 invoked by uid 60001); 8 Jan 2007 05:25:38 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=ngspopZGYeYMseDaq3/7tWVuPcWqtWsHDQqGpH5oHz3T0HTa3WZP/FFtKvqqe2sk0LEQElKLd0UhHMtFkhNGtBYusSgbzHD5umCxI6OAMLdIhq9yfgvZw8eOoKDOUKR6bSHLhW85ABPKvkrfhkWVqC1r3nQZO2gD7hgWH1z+uys=; X-YMail-OSG: .zcGL9sVM1kOHtk7IoT4Rm3iaXBHIsYDQyCq_DTDkny2hjC_l7trx5b5DhqoqvlciNpwz5qJl.FhFN5sUHQqhu29eZZ90uSKbQw45PM.TTVOlwQKjwM- Received: from [81.236.182.41] by web26501.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 05:25:38 GMT Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 05:25:38 +0000 (GMT) From: Lena Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20070107200358.97952.qmail@web52114.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <588445.26046.qm@web26501.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ad8f0cf2-b1f8-4df9-9721-b794d205c7fc X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A27079.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 11:25:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO --- Kathy Page wrote: > I have someone wanting a pair of those Birka poufy > pants. Does anyone have a general assembly, pattern > sort of thing out there that I might use? I swear > someone out there had a fairly definitive how to, > but I can no longer locate it. > > Kathy There's a pattern and info at the Swedish Historiska världar website: http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/eng/drakter/vherre/vherrefr.htm http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/drakter/monster/dvmpasbyxor.pdf The drawing ought to make the construction fairly straightforward, but if you have problems, contact me and I can translate the pattern pdf. /Lena Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 12:05:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08H5dPK014510 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 12:05:39 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l08H5Yq2017219 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 12:05:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l08H51GF058801 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 10:05:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08H4MYR032804; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 10:04:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l089iNlJ056727 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 02:44:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.19666369; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 09:44:09 0000 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id l089i7P20145.; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 09:44:08 GMT Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 09:44:06 +0000 Message-Id: <45A2125C02000014000C86EE@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2007 09:43:56 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume References: <200701060306.l0635sqC022786@net.indra.com> In-Reply-To: <200701060306.l0635sqC022786@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 10a1a7ea-9b55-4b3b-afa4-c8862a2a939c X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A279DE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 12:05:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin wrote: >From what I hear, the costume would be the least of the difficulty in >creating an accurate scene. There are also questions about what the >setting really was like, given the architecture and living arrangements of >the time. Our vision is based primarily on translations of words into >"stable" and "manger," and assumptions of later periods as to what those >would look like. IIRC, a stable isn't mentioned, only the manger, which it was assumed must have been in the animals' quarters. >[snip]. The author noted that since Mary >had family in Bethlehem, it was unlikely that she would have no place to >stay and no one to take her in. He posited an alternative reading that was >consistent with the known terminology for the various parts of the >structure. "No room in the inn" became "no room in the guest room," so >Mary and family were placed not in a separate "stable," but rather in the >interior animal room (not sure whether he thought the animals would have >been indoors or not -- maybe not), and the "manger" became a convenient >place to lay a new baby given the lack of a cradle. I have no idea whether >this was shot down, but the idea of re-considering the translation made a >lot of sense to me. Sounds plausible to me, but I didn't think anything was known about Mary's family except from medieval legend? Was the author referring to them having to go to Bethlehem because Joseph's ancestors came from there? Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 13:09:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08I9TvN015818 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 13:09:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l08I9NWZ007456 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 13:09:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l08I8iTP070106 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 11:08:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08I7hud010294; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 11:08:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08Ha4q6070961 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 10:36:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA13545 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 12:23:26 -0600 Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 12:23:26 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume In-Reply-To: <45A2125C02000014000C86EE@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 74da25ec-930d-4ccd-b53c-c4b388c085e0 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A288D3.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 13:09:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Mon, 8 Jan 2007, Kate M Bunting wrote: > Sounds plausible to me, but I didn't think anything was known about > Mary's family except from medieval legend? Was the author referring to > them having to go to Bethlehem because Joseph's ancestors came from > there? No idea. I remember the family connections being explained, but this isn't my area of study, so I didn't retain the details. (I think I heard this reported in a lengthy segment on an NPR news show.) --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 14:28:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08JS0Zh017366 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 14:28:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l08JRtjH012535 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 14:27:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l08JR6jB084003 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 12:27:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08JQG59003332; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 12:26:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc14.comcast.net (sccrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.200.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08JPco7002363 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 12:26:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc14) with SMTP id <200701081925120140047ev0e>; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:25:12 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <588445.26046.qm@web26501.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <588445.26046.qm@web26501.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <1237F7B1-12EA-473D-8B10-AE112FB94B31@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 14:25:13 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ce0a0f04-f26e-4204-8cdb-e831da0ae0fa X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A29B3B.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 14:27:59 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l08JS0Zh017366 Status: RO Excuse me for being a dope -- my project keeps slipping backwards in time, so what i originally thought took place post-Norman conquest is looking more and more like a late Viking-era development, and so NOW I am more interested in Norse poufy pants than I expected to be -- but the Swedish Historiska pdf sure seems to imply the pants were gathered around the knee, and I had heard rumors that the pants weren't really gathered, just looked that way because of tighter wraps on the lower legs. Has this been resolved anywhere? I'm always finding that the details I really LIKE -- in this case, the gathers -- turn out to be modern interpretations not supported by the historical evidence. I keep meaning to add an article to my Web site about how often historical accuracy is like going shopping with a mean, unfashionable auntie. Thanks for any clue on these guys, anyway! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 8, 2007, at 12:25 AM, Lena wrote: > > --- Kathy Page wrote: > >> I have someone wanting a pair of those Birka poufy >> pants. Does anyone have a general assembly, pattern >> sort of thing out there that I might use? I swear >> someone out there had a fairly definitive how to, >> but I can no longer locate it. >> >> Kathy > > There's a pattern and info at the Swedish Historiska > världar website: > http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/eng/drakter/vherre/vherrefr.htm > http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/drakter/monster/dvmpasbyxor.pdf > > The drawing ought to make the construction fairly > straightforward, but if you have problems, contact me > and I can translate the pattern pdf. > > /Lena > > Send instant messages to your online friends http:// > uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 15:58:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08KwZBt019379 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 15:58:41 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l08KwTE2004219 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 15:58:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l08KuaAJ099710 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 13:56:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08Ku935007646; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 13:56:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.153]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l08KtsVi007164 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 13:56:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 96871 invoked by uid 60001); 8 Jan 2007 20:55:45 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=oQJw+SwcqQm4H+R1biDJgeq/orP71Sn6gcPBBAu3ctUau/B57yToq5+no13ic3sAeeX6AUk0Fet+Do2yfMm19MDcFQ57MdzzXyUZhxkS58TgXq7AK3QHzpTkfnEwLsNPtE00KVLJA20IHGUzcqd8gVqbegEVjl08vWiiCuHH+rI=; X-YMail-OSG: Y34.PKsVM1mgIIEbUiRYB0uvRGx9vtxykBFT5bbP1jsht8_ZK2X7FFWWZaZjcpHXmSwOn10_rpssOs1.gAilL80koeeCZoJzClgrzdJ_Nh2E3U.HzbXvmQrg2VCs8Ti3QxuSWZoWWIxp7fY- Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 12:55:45 PST Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 12:55:45 -0800 (PST) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <1237F7B1-12EA-473D-8B10-AE112FB94B31@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <621352.96866.qm@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1eff828b-ca85-44b8-a3a2-1d4bf5131b9a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A2B075.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 15:58:33 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Yesterday I just saw a pattern of the viking wide trousers. It's on this webpage: http://www.kostym.cz/ I cannot figure out the direct page, so you have to choose english, then enter and the pants are under "pattern's adaptation" - "trousers". If you then click on the pattern, the text appears in Czech, but they only say that there was no exact garment found yet and that the pattern is not a historical reconstruction, but it's aim is to achieve the same appearance. It's gathered at the waist and under the knees. For gathering, they recommend inserting a simple drawstring. For the author it seems redundant to make complicated pleats at the back - taking inspiration from the tight originals. Lauren Walker wrote: Excuse me for being a dope -- my project keeps slipping backwards in time, so what i originally thought took place post-Norman conquest is looking more and more like a late Viking-era development, and so NOW I am more interested in Norse poufy pants than I expected to be -- but the Swedish Historiska pdf sure seems to imply the pants were gathered around the knee, and I had heard rumors that the pants weren't really gathered, just looked that way because of tighter wraps on the lower legs. Has this been resolved anywhere? I'm always finding that the details I really LIKE -- in this case, the gathers -- turn out to be modern interpretations not supported by the historical evidence. I keep meaning to add an article to my Web site about how often historical accuracy is like going shopping with a mean, unfashionable auntie. Thanks for any clue on these guys, anyway! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 8, 2007, at 12:25 AM, Lena wrote: > > --- Kathy Page wrote: > >> I have someone wanting a pair of those Birka poufy >> pants. Does anyone have a general assembly, pattern >> sort of thing out there that I might use? I swear >> someone out there had a fairly definitive how to, >> but I can no longer locate it. >> >> Kathy > > There's a pattern and info at the Swedish Historiska > världar website: > http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/eng/drakter/vherre/vherrefr.htm > http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/drakter/monster/dvmpasbyxor.pdf > > The drawing ought to make the construction fairly > straightforward, but if you have problems, contact me > and I can translate the pattern pdf. > > /Lena > > Send instant messages to your online friends http:// > uk.messenger.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 16:29:39 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08LTbur020167 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 16:29:37 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l08LTWqE020653 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 16:29:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l08LSq69005969 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 14:28:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08LSmEJ044940; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 14:28:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web26510.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (web26510.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.146.176.47]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l08LSgh9044709 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 14:28:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lenastrid@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 67229 invoked by uid 60001); 8 Jan 2007 21:28:36 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=KDMCwr6FWUibiyJe9yOGyzFQ/Oiqz19pi9e6x9ex+otuftkRPk8+Yjf/iaY8Wvh63qzcB3SwqJk3ebVTZPmHa1yyCMAQQ6d4TkgokHV1W5qfIromcoEisgl2HiZ2An/WlrV+cVyGUTzGOr/o5aXPn/rpnHXXIuSFu+O5lp0ANvY=; X-YMail-OSG: IuWldWEVM1nF8y1kz6tSQq.b_83iY6b6vFrXU.5QFmsMyM0L79iA3U25wS2Ny1HK8w-- Received: from [81.236.182.41] by web26510.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 21:28:36 GMT Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:28:36 +0000 (GMT) From: Lena Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norse poufy pants To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <1237F7B1-12EA-473D-8B10-AE112FB94B31@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <226853.58406.qm@web26510.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 456f77df-eac7-4815-ad90-bda04d0eda2a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A2B7BC.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:29:36 -0500 (EST) Status: RO --- Lauren Walker wrote: > but the Swedish Historiska pdf sure seems to imply > the pants were > gathered around the knee, and I had heard rumors > that the pants > weren't really gathered, just looked that way > because of tighter > wraps on the lower legs. Has this been resolved > anywhere? AFAIK, no-one knows how these trousers looked like below the knee. All (two?) archaeological finds consist of fragments of the seat. You can ask at the english forum over at Historiska världar (http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/forum). Ny Björn or someone else ought to be able to tell you about the current state of research. /Lena Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 18:03:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08N3RHX022017 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:03:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l08N3M3P023552 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:03:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l08N1pFp020865 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 16:01:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08N1iwg044568; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 16:01:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com (ug-out-1314.google.com [66.249.92.171]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l08IiNFb054795 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 11:44:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aspasia1@gmail.com) Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id k40so7467506ugc for ; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 10:44:22 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=WY6skS4drRyUfsE9HD7qI0gYJ4BNEO5YxcF0rx0OEgykGE1FvBWGX6XjkzN373oaRIdwsBtTQhwgqyccmzRPkf/Rcn67r1QOu/+Uois0706kk/5LOqYEEHqE6C5yCr+ssnFzrpN2HkmzlVqTrx48TI3Ud2Qs/GYs/f0XImGEPPM= Received: by 10.67.92.1 with SMTP id u1mr17831037ugl.1168281862422; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 10:44:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.67.22.17 with HTTP; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 10:44:22 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 13:44:22 -0500 From: "Bonnie Booker" To: "Historical Costume" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: Subject: [h-cost] chemise styles X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: dc03a9f3-359c-4b6b-b204-db9e19144774 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A2CDBA.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 18:03:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I am looking through Hispanic Costume 1480-1530 and it keeps mentioning chemises in "the Spanish style: or in "the French style" or in "the German style." I see all kinds of necklines. Can anyone tell me the difference? Thank you. -- Aspasia Moonwind _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 19:38:35 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l090cRMX023781 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:38:31 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l090cMXL026843 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:38:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l090bWhr034814 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 17:37:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l090bSsg031597; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 17:37:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l090bO9C031533 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 17:37:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1H44zT0SxC-0000Hd; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 19:37:24 -0500 Message-ID: <002601c73386$51c110f0$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] dental floss(was: The bead-net dress ) Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:37:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1be8af09-ac1f-46b8-bb15-75c215a79055 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A2E3FE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 19:38:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin, You are so clever! Thank you for the suggestion. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 19:51:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l090pAv6024043 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:51:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l090p5vv009172 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:51:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l090oHZj036466 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 17:50:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l090oGA0042214; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 17:50:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l090oDbj042166 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 17:50:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus0) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1H45Br298t-0005L0; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 19:50:12 -0500 Message-ID: <005e01c73388$1bce6b30$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:50:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c509ccd8-73a2-425a-8f8b-d01d24d5619b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A2E6F9.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 19:51:09 -0500 (EST) Status: RO When is Costume Con coming back to the East Coast? I have always wanted to go, but traveling for a long distance is a problem. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 20:06:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09161JQ024391 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:06:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0915uj2026682 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:05:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0915Egm038208 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:05:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0915BGb052704; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:05:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09158Tn052663 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:05:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA14787 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:52:33 -0600 Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:52:32 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects In-Reply-To: <005e01c73388$1bce6b30$6700a8c0@momlaptop> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ce9bdf55-d48c-45b7-959c-cb2c212fd39c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A2EA74.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 20:06:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Mon, 8 Jan 2007, Penny Ladnier wrote: > When is Costume Con coming back to the East Coast? I have always wanted to > go, but traveling for a long distance is a problem. CC26 will be April 25-28, 2008, in San Jose. CC27 will be in May 2009 in Baltimore, MD -- not too far from you, Penny. For CC28, I believe there's a bid from Milwaukee. CostumeCon has two (different) websites: www.costume-con.com and www.costume-con.org . --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 20:10:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l091AAOI024493 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:10:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l091A0Bw004349 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:10:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0919X6i038662 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:09:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0919WrH055831; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:09:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0919S9C055777 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:09:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1H45UV0jXa-0000EB; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 20:09:28 -0500 Message-ID: <007d01c7338a$cdfb4b50$6700a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:09:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=15% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3fc4b1f0-e719-4041-8b2c-85b7fdc36da3 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A2EB68.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 20:10:09 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin, Thank you! I can make the Baltimore one. I was in Baltimore Saturday. It is a three hour drive with DC traffic. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 20:55:38 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l091tTZM025459 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:55:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l091tOen018968 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:55:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l091sgWh043705 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:54:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l091sd2I087222; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:54:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from metis.sjsu.edu (metis.sjsu.edu [130.65.3.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l091sZj7087095 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:54:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from attrembl@bovil.com) Received: from [130.65.37.143] (sjs-130-65-37-143.sjsu.edu [130.65.37.143]) by metis.sjsu.edu (8.12.10+Sun/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l091sTYa014199 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 17:54:29 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <64E489D6-C19F-4D9A-B460-2A4DC22779E0@bovil.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Andrew T Trembley Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon (was: Movies and ancient costume) Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 17:54:26 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a20a744b-4502-4071-b2f8-c60be84b467e X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A2F60C.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 20:55:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 5, 2007, at 7:47 PM, TeaRoseS@aol.com wrote: > Dawn and I wanted to go last year when it was in Des Moines, but I was > dealing with a broken foot and the attendant medical bills and > couldn't spare the > price of registration. We drove up and visited the vendor hall, but > I have a > feeling we missed all the fun stuff. Sorry to hear about your troubles. I had a blast at Des Moines, but attendance was pretty low; there are just too many other things to go to Memorial Day Weekend. That said, I skipped my local science fiction convention (something I haven't done since I moved to San Jose) to go to Costume-Con in Des Moines. -- andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen - http://www.bovil.com/ Play Internet Argument-Losing Bingo! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 21:23:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l092Nohk026111 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:23:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l092Njtw031777 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:23:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l092N7MV047037 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:23:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l092N2YN006108; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:23:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from metis.sjsu.edu (metis.sjsu.edu [130.65.3.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l092MwE1006009 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:23:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from attrembl@bovil.com) Received: from [130.65.37.143] (sjs-130-65-37-143.sjsu.edu [130.65.37.143]) by metis.sjsu.edu (8.12.10+Sun/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l092MqYa015963 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:22:53 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) In-Reply-To: <1D30AC38-192E-4B72-B907-498B41EAB895@cybermesa.com> References: <1D30AC38-192E-4B72-B907-498B41EAB895@cybermesa.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <4BC5A9B3-B0FE-4970-B542-8356B8F8F5BC@bovil.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Andrew T Trembley Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon and projects Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:22:50 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0a610079-a657-428f-83b9-c4b14654909b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A2FCB1.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 21:23:48 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 5, 2007, at 4:34 PM, Suzanne wrote: > Yes, I plan on going to CostumeCon. Mostly for the Netherton > sequence ;-) but what the heck, might as well stay for Sunday, > too. Since I've never gone before, what do I need to know ahead of > time? Costuming is a hobby, not my profession, so I'm a little > worried about how I'll fit in. Costume-Con was started (and is still organized) by costume hobbyists and amateurs. Some of us have gone pro, but most of us haven't; the costume business is a real bear to make a decent living in. The pros who attend are just as enthusiastic and friendly as the amateurs, and often find themselves thankful that the amateurs are content to stay amateurs. Stay for Sunday night. The Historical Masquerade (stage competition) is on Sunday night, and people really pull out all the stops for it. You'll regret it if you don't. If you can, come Friday. The Friday night social is always a blast, and with the Rock 'n' Roll theme, it's an excuse to throw together something more recently historical, like 1950's or 60's fashion. That or something based on Sophia Coppola's "Marie Antoinette." > Like, what's a "hall costume"??!? I'm assuming that we all wear > our stuff all the time but that you keep the competition main > entries under wraps until the last minute, so anything else is a > "hall" costume... is that about right? Many of the traditions of Costume-Con come from fan-run science fiction conventions. "Hall costumes" are an example of that. They're any sort of costume you wear around the halls, and they've been around since Forry Ackerman and a friend wore "futuristic" clothes to the first World Science Fiction Convention in 1939. There are pictures of Forry at The term is really just to differentiate between hall costume and presentation/competition costume. Presentation costumes need to work from the stage, and can be incredibly large and/or impractical. Hall costumes should be wearable for as long as you like, and convenient for sitting in panels, having dinner, going to parties, taking the elevator and other necessities. Unlike some other costume conferences, Costume-Con encourages attendees to wear costumes throughout the weekend. Some people (the folks who aren't fighting luggage allowances) will go through several changes of clothes each day. Many people build presentation costumes with the intent to wear the costumes (or part of the costume) in the halls at future events. Pierre and Sandy are infamous for the level of detail and practicality that they work into their stage costumes that you only see when they're wearing them (huge wings, floral collars or other uncomfortable whatnot removed) in the halls at another event. > And because of CostumeCon, I've bumped the "orange Italian Ren" aka > "Hobby Lobby Florentine" (no spinach, just cabbage) to the top of > my list of projects to complete this year. For the Sunday ORANGE > hall costume contest. I think I'm wearing my sunglasses all Sunday. -- andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen - http://www.bovil.com/ San Jose, CA - '72 R75/5 '86 R100 (mine) - '92 K75sa '03 R1150R (Kevin's) "It's not pink, it's peach-colored. Pink is tacky." --Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel read the FAQ... Ridicule: http://www.idiots-r-us.org/ read the FAQ... IBMWR: http://www.ibmwr.org/faq-files/ read the FAQ... AirList: http://www.airheads.org/faq.html read the FAQ... Hoaxes & Urban Legends: http://urbanlegends.about.com/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 21:52:23 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l092qNXe026793 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:52:23 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l092qI6g007000 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:52:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l092po23050099 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:51:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l092pkWL025624; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:51:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web51313.mail.yahoo.com (web51313.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.39.123]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l092phWD025519 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 19:51:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from elvestoorder@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 22845 invoked by uid 60001); 9 Jan 2007 02:51:37 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=Xdm6f5rUFr2WlDIbumeBKG2b4+M9KUT6PMPWM6hK8F312ptxdvU3JhSf9nNZmn9Nf+/Hu6LCbA3lZ6VTkSTh/Apxo39APqsMP5OUpDX1Ih47RSHWULJ7iIpD2lAh78jkVwWByvpax2+UBuD5eki8YdB5TBQF0LHBWJQwKrav+uw=; X-YMail-OSG: 3_37wKAVM1kRo7a2ze0pYWsWTBG0DxgZ.5PPxXT6 Received: from [69.183.50.229] by web51313.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 18:51:37 PST Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 18:51:37 -0800 (PST) From: Ann Catelli Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <534124.22801.qm@web51313.mail.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 57740a66-36d1-4410-9006-50f7488a7f8b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A30362.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 21:52:22 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Here's the relevant quote from: Including the bit which your source says may have been tweaked quite a bit: Luke2/4-7 "So Joseph also went up from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to Bethlehem the town of David, because he belonged to the house and line of David. He went there to register [for taxes] with Mary, who was pledged to be married to him and was expecting a child. While they were there, the time came for the baby to be born, and she gave birth to her firstborn, a son. She wrapped him in cloths and placed him in a manger, because there was no room for them in the inn." [My insertion] So, according to Luke, no Marian connections in Bethlehem. Ann in CT --- Robin wrote: > > No idea. I remember the family connections being > explained, but this isn't > my area of study, so I didn't retain the details. ( > > --Robin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 22:00:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0930lH4026995 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:00:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0930gL5017814 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:00:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0930C4H050873 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:00:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l093092r031391; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:00:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09305s1031348 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:00:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA15081 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:47:31 -0600 Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:47:31 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume In-Reply-To: <534124.22801.qm@web51313.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 57ae8005-1ca3-47d6-96e0-0c786594878e X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A3055A.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 22:00:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Mon, 8 Jan 2007, Ann Catelli wrote: > Here's the relevant quote from: > > Including the bit which your source says may have been > tweaked quite a bit: > ... > So, according to Luke, no Marian connections in > Bethlehem. Perhaps it was Joseph's connection, then, which does seem pretty obvious. I was listening to the report for pleasure, and this was some time ago; what I came away remembering was that there was a pretty convincing argument for why it would have been reasonable for them to contact local relatives if they needed a place to stay. As I recall, the researcher also talked a lot about living arrangements and local customs, including hospitality. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 22:11:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l093BCrt027212 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:11:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l093B7Bu028041 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:11:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l093AXJ3052047 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:10:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l093AWAZ038634; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:10:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l093AT5U038559 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:10:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA15123 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:57:54 -0600 Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:57:54 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d5a1d7f1-e9cf-4b16-aa4f-2f7e73d2ef0c X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A307CB.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 22:11:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Following up my own post -- a quick Google, as often happens, is enough to shed light. Apparently this idea of the "guest room" with the manger has been around for a while; some of the citations I'm seeing are to papers from the 1970s and 1980s. Here are a couple of nice summary pages: http://www.ancientsandals.com/articles/01_jesus_birth.htm With nice photos and diagrams. http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/cwn/122206NazarethVillage.aspx And not a word about costume in either of them, I think. Oh well. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 8 23:02:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0942dOU028282 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:02:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0942Ybs020287 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:02:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0941ksr056790 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:01:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0941d2h077144; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:01:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.228]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0941bZl077117 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 21:01:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from missdoornink@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so4230197nzf for ; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 20:01:35 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:from:to:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-mailer:in-reply-to:thread-index:x-mimeole:message-id; b=YE8+Zbwap9nuNH3ObfTwtQI9O8VxypanOw19vD42lOeuntdauc2wmJFX5peZcqRsMr53ftlOrCGsqWAPnIRhlUBckvKO0aGV5IO20vz+9NhitIz8256yMDpiY6TbHKNcsSAVqPUr7rEVf0Cz/k4WTig30HrewHSyyDFowrj/DKk= Received: by 10.65.200.14 with SMTP id c14mr135715qbq.1168315295134; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 20:01:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from doorninklaptop ( [71.54.203.202]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id q18sm31345194qbq.2007.01.08.20.01.33; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 20:01:34 -0800 (PST) From: "Elisabeth Doornink" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 20:01:27 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-Reply-To: Thread-Index: Acczm+6jJzTdoyxHRuafKuDKYsFNBAABiv6A X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Message-ID: <45a3139e.3454cfa7.48f3.fffffb32@mx.google.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fc6c82dc-207c-4298-ae22-bec6afaa8332 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A313DA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 08 Jan 2007 23:02:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Yeah, my pastor gave a sermon relating to this subject several weeks before Christmas. In the Greek, the word that is usually translated 'inn' in Luke is the same word used for the 'upper room' or 'guest room' in the Last Supper. Thinking about it, it makes me feel sorry for Mary - stuck in a full house with her husband-to-be's relatives, in labor with a child that obviously wasn't Joeseph's. Quia Christus Perpetuo Regnat, Elisabeth -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Robin Netherton Sent: Monday, January 08, 2007 7:58 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume Following up my own post -- a quick Google, as often happens, is enough to shed light. Apparently this idea of the "guest room" with the manger has been around for a while; some of the citations I'm seeing are to papers from the 1970s and 1980s. Here are a couple of nice summary pages: http://www.ancientsandals.com/articles/01_jesus_birth.htm With nice photos and diagrams. http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/cwn/122206NazarethVillage.aspx And not a word about costume in either of them, I think. Oh well. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.16.7/620 - Release Date: 1/8/2007 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.16.7/620 - Release Date: 1/8/2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 00:42:42 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l095gc9a030546 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 00:42:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l095gX5M009614 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 00:42:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l095forx066593 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:41:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l095fkDF042745; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:41:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mf3k.socket.net [216.106.88.98]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l095fhcF042706 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:41:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 2B1A43D42D for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:41:43 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:42:04 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <45a3139e.3454cfa7.48f3.fffffb32@mx.google.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b7eab89f-b3ed-456c-9d40-1c2b9b66ae64 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A32B49.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 00:42:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I don't this it was obvious. I was told that Jewish custom considered engagement a promise and therefore no stigma was placed on premarital sex, so unless Joseph went around telling everyone that the child wasn't his (which would have nullified the engagement) I don't think it was obvious. Now as to the debate of whether God of a fashion impregnated Mary or that Joseph was the biological father and God imbue spiritual gifts....is a debate for another list. De -----Original Message----- in labor with a child that obviously wasn't Joeseph's. Quia Christus Perpetuo Regnat, Elisabeth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 01:47:42 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l096lcUo031871 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 01:47:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l096lXdA030489 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 01:47:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l096ko78072039 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:46:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l096kk83081688; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:46:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52107.mail.yahoo.com (web52107.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.110]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l096ki2m081615 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:46:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Received: (qmail 81944 invoked by uid 60001); 9 Jan 2007 06:46:39 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=5MbBpiBE5iZ4Cj0qVkO+yZUeMyAh3rvsWOP0w8pzS5K7mwqKwMgvjdLnEZkNVyZMaaG49G6ltg2IFKzu/NOxUJYPLrwr3ByqA0OPl2rFDimLabEeij4v2AUZ4HjexaZTWHIWJ852vPrJXk/+8+6pjsiaTJfQRYWaVlsE+Jmeakw= ; Message-ID: <20070109064639.81942.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [74.114.43.209] by web52107.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 22:46:39 PST Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 22:46:39 -0800 (PST) From: Kathy Page To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Norse poufy pants X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 06898cf2-b533-43b5-8e64-550a94c67e71 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A33A85.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 01:47:37 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l096lcUo031871 Status: RO AH! That's the one! The exact one he pointed me to. I knew I had seen a pattern at some point, I just couldn't dig it out of the site. Thanks to everyone! Kathy There's a pattern and info at the Swedish Historiska världar website: http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/eng/drakter/vherre/vherrefr.htm http://www.historiska.se/histvarld/drakter/monster/dvmpasbyxor.pdf You'll probably figure out what goes where from the drawings. The stuff that is hard to figure out if you can't read the language; Your waistbands lenght should be the same as your waistmeasurements. The width of each pantleg is 3,20m between C and B. Cut 2. Pleat where you see a dotted line between C and B. Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert (Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. It’s never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 09:47:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09ElAaV005330 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 09:47:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l09El4f3002273 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 09:47:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l09EkMbu030869 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 07:46:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09EkFsf022923; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 07:46:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d20.mx.aol.com (imo-d20.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.136]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09EkBHv022790 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 07:46:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d2b.3fd73a6 (48576) for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 09:45:57 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 09:45:54 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-Servercave-Metrics: net.indra.com 1183; Body=1 rep=9% Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4b3413e4-ef7e-4c34-8b6f-b71f3375ed5e X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A3AAE8.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 09:47:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/9/2007 12:43:00 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, otsisto@socket.net writes: Now as to the debate of whether God of a fashion impregnated Mary or that Joseph was the biological father and God imbue spiritual gifts....is a debate for another list. ************** Like the whole thing is a myth [a lovely one, though] written long after the event and Luke's death by some anonymous author. But that is a debate for another list, since it doesn't affect the costuming. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 14:58:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09JwOo1014981 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:58:24 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l09JwJe9017943 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:58:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l09JvLmi081977 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 12:57:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09JvFok049126; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 12:57:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc15.comcast.net (sccrmhc15.comcast.net [204.127.200.85]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09JvB3m048956 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 12:57:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [192.168.1.2] (c-71-196-218-99.hsd1.co.comcast.net[71.196.218.99]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc15) with SMTP id <20070109195706015004v3rpe>; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 19:57:06 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Historical Costume From: Sylvia Rognstad Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 12:57:01 -0700 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Virgin Quees X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3ca47150-a9c4-44df-8dc3-dbcce1fd2eaa X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A3F3DB.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 14:58:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I don't know if the PBS series "The Virgin Queen" is showing in all necks of the woods, but it just started here in Colorado this past Sunday. I'm wondering what you all thought of it, costume or otherwise? Sylrog _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 16:16:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LGFxF016929 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:16:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l09LG9QR029681 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:16:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l09LF9od096118 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:15:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LEuoN034884; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:14:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc11.comcast.net (alnrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.225.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LEg5a034503 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:14:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc11) with SMTP id <20070109211433b1100k0na5e>; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 21:14:33 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: Message-Id: <4FB09929-557F-4792-917D-2CD1A93A1890@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Virgin Queen Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:14:28 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b7788375-dadc-48c2-a22b-26271231fa48 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A40619.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:16:13 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I watched part I this weekend. My first impression was that I sure have seen the story of these years and these relationships told in a number of interesting ways lately, and I am not sure if this version is adding anything of value. It seems sort of like a drier version of the story in the Cate Blanchett _Elizabeth_ movie, so far, and for all its inaccuracies, I liked that movie better. I also rather liked Helen Mirren's portrait in the _Elizabeth I_ miniseries. Costume- wise, my main quibble so far is that none of them seem to actually FIT the actress Anne Marie Duff. That's my two cents. Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 9, 2007, at 2:57 PM, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > I don't know if the PBS series "The Virgin Queen" is showing in all > necks of the woods, but it just started here in Colorado this past > Sunday. I'm wondering what you all thought of it, costume or > otherwise? > > Sylrog > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 16:32:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LWDX6017265 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:32:13 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l09LW756015929 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:32:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l09LVcZ2098893 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:31:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LVbSN052444; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:31:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LVYVl052325 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:31:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82B1CBC2AD for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 15:31:28 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45A409E1.3010208@reddawn.net> Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 15:32:17 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Virgin Queen References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8497b3c9-f042-4d28-8a85-23b1c68b6da5 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A409D7.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:32:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > I don't know if the PBS series "The Virgin Queen" is showing in all > necks of the woods, but it just started here in Colorado this past > Sunday. I'm wondering what you all thought of it, costume or otherwise? > I enjoyed it the first time it aired in 2005, but I'm not watching it the second time around. I thought they did a reasonable job of telling the story and making it realistic, but I seem to recall a lot of folks hated it. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 16:42:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LgHkk017479 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:42:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l09Lg1c2008712 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:42:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l09Leoc7000716 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:40:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09Lejh4062590; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:40:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09Lea44062302 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:40:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.39]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 09 Jan 2007 21:37:19 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAEKao0XUSnInh2dsb2JhbACNPgEBCQ4q Received: from 88-107-104-136.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.104.136]:2204 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1H4Oek-0005X6-Ca for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 21:37:18 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070109213456.034d3d88@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 21:37:15 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] Virgin Queen In-Reply-To: <45A409E1.3010208@reddawn.net> References: <45A409E1.3010208@reddawn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 352e7f54-a864-4704-b9fb-2f5d369f77b7 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A40C29.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:42:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 21:32 09/01/2007, you wrote: >Sylvia Rognstad wrote: > >>I don't know if the PBS series "The Virgin Queen" is showing in all >>necks of the woods, but it just started here in Colorado this past >>Sunday. I'm wondering what you all thought of it, costume or otherwise? > >I enjoyed it the first time it aired in 2005, but I'm not watching >it the second time around. I thought they did a reasonable job of >telling the story and making it realistic, but I seem to recall a >lot of folks hated it. I made ruffs (so I know accuracy was not paramount!) for this show, and saw some of the clothes in the making - they were using Janet Arnold and Jean Hunnisett. However, they weren't using them very well in my opinion, as the clothes were no better than any of the other Elizabeth films in recent years. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 16:51:18 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LpIc8017662 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:51:18 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l09LpDDY021223 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:51:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l09Lob9O002321 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:50:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09Loa8p072843; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:50:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zixvpm01.creighton.edu (ZIXVPM01.creighton.edu [147.134.0.65]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l09LoXuE072771 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 14:50:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cynthiaabel@creighton.edu) Received: from zixvpm01.creighton.edu (ZixVPM [127.0.0.1]) by Outbound.creighton.edu (Proprietary) with ESMTP id E2A482E81F4 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 15:48:29 -0600 (CST) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by zixvpm01.creighton.edu (Proprietary) with ESMTP id C322E2E811A for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 15:48:29 -0600 (CST) Received: from exbe01.blue.jays.creighton.edu (exbe01.creighton.edu [147.134.2.111]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_29774)/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA23787 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 15:50:32 -0600 (CST) x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Virgin Quees Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 15:48:56 -0600 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Virgin Quees Thread-Index: Acc0KBxrMqddNVKDRLGd6J/xOyw0UgADuqCw From: "Abel, Cynthia" To: "Historical Costume" X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l09LoXuE072771 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b892c3c7-326f-47e5-9b31-eb14e96adb46 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A40E51.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:51:16 -0500 (EST) Status: RO We have to all stop laughing at the costuming(yeah, right)since historical accuracy, especially for the lead actors, has to always give way to 1)budget, 2)director's vision, 3)what is aesthetically pleasing right now to viewers--especially for the lead actors, and 4)budget(again). I actually appreciated the film Marie Antoinette for pointedly being up-front about not being strictly historically correct in costume--such films or productions often end up seeming more historically correct. Cindy Abel -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 1:57 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Virgin Quees I don't know if the PBS series "The Virgin Queen" is showing in all necks of the woods, but it just started here in Colorado this past Sunday. I'm wondering what you all thought of it, costume or otherwise? Sylrog _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 20:50:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A1o7X2022033 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 20:50:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0A1o25N019472 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 20:50:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0A1n4UX035174 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 18:49:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A1mwmX085346; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 18:48:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A1msqO085307 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 18:48:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m48.in-tch.com [216.166.191.48]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l0A1ZrM20809 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 18:35:54 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <006601c7345a$b3b47e80$30bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 18:57:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Subject: [h-cost] OT? Firefly/Serenity costumes.... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 80b7e494-6d6d-4b91-85bf-cbac076ac046 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A4464A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 20:50:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hope this is okay....H-costume being the only relatively-general costume list I'm on. Has anyone out there ever done anything with the costumes from either the movie or the series? For some reason, the recent thread about hall costumes for CostumeCon, combined with a recent Serenity marathon, has created this odd urge to make something...different. Something that would look good under a brown coat. Oh, and a brown coat, of course. I think it would be a lot of fun to play with the combinations of western, chinese, and futuristic style elements.... --Sue, also feeling a craving for something from Middle Earth.....*sigh*......I don't have enough time as it is! ;o) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 9 22:46:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A3k2e3024392 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 22:46:06 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0A3ju1F030448 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 22:46:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0A3jIHg050453 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 20:45:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A3jCwL064909; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 20:45:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.131]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A3j9MH064863 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 20:45:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from genteelarts (oh-71-50-225-154.dyn.embarqhsd.net [71.50.225.154]) by smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64F0932C02E for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 21:44:24 -0600 (CST) From: "Carolann Schmitt" To: "'Historical Costume'" References: <5.1.1.6.2.20070105163427.00d23510@pop8.sympatico.ca> Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 22:45:03 -0500 Organization: Genteel Arts Message-ID: <000101c73469$b69ef670$f600a8c0@genteelarts> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AccxEq3lW6HFACq1ThSFT9xLBywYSQDVvKIQ In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20070105163427.00d23510@pop8.sympatico.ca> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 1860s Conference X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 130165c1-4117-43a1-aee2-ec05324cd0d6 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A46175.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 09 Jan 2007 22:46:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO (My apologies to those who are members of several lists and may be receiving multiple copies of this message.) This is a friendly reminder that registrations for the 2007 Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference must be post-marked, faxed, emailed or phoned by January 29, 2007 to receive the discounted rate. Registrations received after that date will be charged the full fee; deadline for all reservations is February 10, 2007. We are also pleased to announce that we are offering the junior registration fee to full-time college students as well as to participants age 17 and under. Please note your institution of higher learning on your registration form. While spaces are available for each of the pre-conference workshops and seminars, some of the sessions are full. You are encouraged to register now if you wish to attend a particular session; if the sessions you request are full you will be accepted for your second or third choice of times. Don't forget to include your registration form if you're entering the special competition for the best reproduction of a Civil War era quilted petticoat. Our juried Marketplace will be open to conference participants and the general public on Friday from 11AM-7PM, Saturday from 7:30AM-5:30PM, and Sunday from 8AM-12:30PM. In its thirteenth year, the Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference offers a full program of presentations on the clothing and culture of the mid-19th century, pre-conference workshops, tours and seminars, a juried Marketplace and an extensive display of original garments and artifacts. The conference will be held in Harrisburg (Camp Hill), PA on March 1-4, 2007. The registration fee includes all meals on Saturday and Sunday. Please contact me at the address below with any questions. Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 1-4, 2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 10 02:47:27 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A7lMiA012718 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 02:47:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0A7lHAc025874 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 02:47:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0A7kfvH034620 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 00:46:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A7kZRb085909; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 00:46:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A7kVsF085851 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 00:46:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A8321669036C; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 07:39:30 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 23:46:18 -0800 Message-ID: <001e01c7348b$6a0ffe40$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0A7kVsF085851 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f15cd164-ffb4-4c8a-bb4f-fa0c9f75e634 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A49A05.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 02:47:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Since an "inn" of the time had everyone sleeping communally (I believe), who wouldn't rather go through labor and delivery in the peace, privacy and warmth of the barn/stable. That's what I would have chosen. I always thought it funny that everyone seems to think it was a bad thing that they got the stable. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of AlbertCat@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 6:46 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume In a message dated 1/9/2007 12:43:00 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, otsisto@socket.net writes: Now as to the debate of whether God of a fashion impregnated Mary or that Joseph was the biological father and God imbue spiritual gifts....is a debate for another list. ************** Like the whole thing is a myth [a lovely one, though] written long after the event and Luke's death by some anonymous author. But that is a debate for another list, since it doesn't affect the costuming. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 10 09:19:39 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AEJdr5031548 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 09:19:39 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0AEIS8F009662 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 09:19:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0AEHifc077255 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 07:17:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AEHd1u042348; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 07:17:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ultra7.eskimo.com (IDENT:root@ultra7.eskimo.com [204.122.16.70]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AEHaa5042274 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 07:17:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from judymitch@theoldforest.net) Received: from [69.72.29.101] (core-dc-4-101.dynamic-dialup.coretel.net [69.72.29.101]) by ultra7.eskimo.com (8.13.6/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0AEHVkq012719 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 06:17:32 -0800 Message-ID: <45A4F590.9040704@theoldforest.net> Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 09:17:52 -0500 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20041217 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT? Firefly/Serenity costumes.... References: <006601c7345a$b3b47e80$30bfa6d8@pavilion> In-Reply-To: <006601c7345a$b3b47e80$30bfa6d8@pavilion> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c8c1dfc6-6dd8-4b04-86b3-f8d893d51eb3 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A4F5CE.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 09:19:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sue Clemenger wrote: > Hope this is okay....H-costume being the only relatively-general costume > list I'm on. > Has anyone out there ever done anything with the costumes from either the > movie or the series? For some reason, the recent thread about hall costumes > for CostumeCon, combined with a recent Serenity marathon, has created this > odd urge to make something...different. You might ask on F-Costume I know there have been some people who have made outfits there. And there are a number of groups/sites listed for Firefly/Serentiy on > --Sue, also feeling a craving for something from Middle > Earth.....*sigh*......I don't have enough time as it is! ;o) Don't forget and the chat list at for that! -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 10 12:08:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AH8Oh6002906 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 12:08:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0AH7ate016436 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 12:08:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0AH6OLO006711 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:06:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AH6FcO010767; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:06:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s35.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s35.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.171]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AH6COZ010606 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:06:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.25]) by bay0-omc2-s35.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 09:06:07 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 09:06:07 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV15.phx.gbl with DAV; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 17:06:04 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "TheRenaissanceTailor" , "h-costume" Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:06:06 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:06:06 -0700 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Jan 2007 17:06:07.0116 (UTC) FILETIME=[9E441CC0:01C734D9] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ddcdb1b4-c0c1-4399-8df4-4e39fdf6f249 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A51D5B.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 12:08:23 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0AH8Oh6002906 Status: RO Hi all, as you may know already, I am re-creating this gown for the Phoenix Art Museum. http://tinyurl.com/y6phle I think the bolster type French Farthingale would be most appropriate - ( like those in the oft sited French Dutch caricature). Have any of you constructed this type? How did you approach it? I started with a softly stuffed tube which gave a reasonable silhouette, but I'd like to hear what you have been successful with. Robin? I know you have done this - but didn't see any construction details in your posts. Thanks, Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 10 13:31:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AIUsZ3004609 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:30:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0AIU4L2030502 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:30:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0AITHuQ021765 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 11:29:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AIShim009863; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 11:28:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AISRlI009499 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 11:28:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA20641; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:15:59 -0600 Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:15:59 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: TheRenaissanceTailor X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 98e6729f-9014-49fe-b588-ccf04f5ff9dc X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A530AC.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:30:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Wed, 10 Jan 2007, Saragrace Knauf wrote: > I started with a softly stuffed tube which gave a reasonable > silhouette, but I'd like to hear what you have been successful with. > > Robin? I know you have done this - but didn't see any construction > details in your posts. Odd, I thought I had that in there -- I remember talking about it on-list, but I don't see it in the posts I collected on my website. It may have been in later postings after I put together the collection. I tried a cylindrical tube, but it didn't work for the size I needed; it wouldn't bend well enough without too much creasing/bunching on the inner curve. I also wanted it to be narrower and tapered in the front, and much larger at the sides and back. So I tried two crescents, a top and bottom one, with the bottom one larger for more depth and the top one smaller for less roundness and a slightly flatter surface. (Think of a bagel with a vertical cut at center front, slice the whole thing in half to make two rounds, and then curve off some of the outer edge as you approach the center front. Two crescents.) That worked but not as well as the next iteration, in which I used roughly trapezoidal wedges to produce the two crescents. (Think orange sections with the tips cut off, and an "equator" line dividing the top and bottom.) That not only allowed me to do some shaping along the sides of the trapezoids, smoothing out the curves to create the correct shape, but also to cut the entire thing out of a fraction of the fabric that I needed for cutting full crescent shapes. It was very easy to tweak the fit, too, because I had a lot of seam lines for adjustment. In our case, the outer-edge seam line made a good place to attach a casing for bents to create a stiffer rim, but this isn't evident in all the images, and doesn't appear necessary for yours. You also probably don't want much flattening of the top surface, so you might cut your top and bottom halves the same proportions. But you'll still want to taper almost to nothing in the front. Here's a thread where I talked a little about some visual documentation for the seaming: http://sca.uwaterloo.ca/Fashion/index.cgi?l=hcos03&s=bum%20roll&Cmd=Match+1 See postings of March 16 and following. If you call up the entire month as a text file: http://sca.uwaterloo.ca/~fashion/archives/hcos03/hcos03.cl ...you can find continuing discussion by searching on "bum roll". If my description above doesn't cover the issue you were aiming at, please tell me. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 10 14:36:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AJaqMl005846 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 14:36:56 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0AJZmZ1004897 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 14:36:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0AJYvfr035736 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 12:34:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AJYkkw088442; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 12:34:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0A89fmf002266 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 01:09:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from silvaragreenleaf@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=rOD/YzehhW8RsC3sHrfqlJxiiAEdQ3z7zVgSCl18QaKq+pGCGLCJ5nTBqhtMnvvK; h=Received:Message-ID:X-Priority:Reply-To:X-Mailer:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.48.39.74] (helo=earthlink.net) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H4YWi-0006Ax-CU for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 03:09:40 -0500 Message-ID: <410-2200713108941281@earthlink.net> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: EarthLink MailBox 2004.1.42.0 (Windows) From: "Silvara" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] OT? Firefly/Serenity costumes.... Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 00:09:41 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-ELNK-Trace: 55793bc9c6738afdef8548c534e04b911aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79d5a17878b3a993504c2a8ea12db1e79f350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.48.39.74 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-UUID: ba1f7958-cc98-41e5-a46f-aeac62669234 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A54022.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 14:36:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I have done Firefly costumes, and have some links to other sites. Silvara > [Original Message] > From: Sue Clemenger > To: > Date: 1/9/2007 5:50:22 PM > Subject: [h-cost] OT? Firefly/Serenity costumes.... > > Hope this is okay....H-costume being the only relatively-general costume > list I'm on. > Has anyone out there ever done anything with the costumes from either the > movie or the series? For some reason, the recent thread about hall costumes > for CostumeCon, combined with a recent Serenity marathon, has created this > odd urge to make something...different. Something that would look good > under a brown coat. Oh, and a brown coat, of course. > I think it would be a lot of fun to play with the combinations of western, > chinese, and futuristic style elements.... > --Sue, also feeling a craving for something from Middle > Earth.....*sigh*......I don't have enough time as it is! ;o) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 10 16:26:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ALQGC1007948 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:26:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ALPJJl013372 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:26:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ALOZWX055656 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 14:24:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ALOP5A009913; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 14:24:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s12.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s12.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.148]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ALOM0Q009725 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 14:24:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.140.22]) by bay0-omc2-s12.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:24:16 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:24:16 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 24.215.119.128 by BAY135-DAV12.phx.gbl with DAV; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 21:24:13 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.215.119.128] X-Originating-Email: [estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com] X-Sender: estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com From: "kelly grant" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 17:24:08 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Jan 2007 21:24:16.0620 (UTC) FILETIME=[AEBADAC0:01C734FD] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 764b799a-8769-4d60-ba43-cf77fe1ed902 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A559C6.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:26:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi Saragrace I just finished a similar outfit, and had a french farthingale underneath. I had started out with a flat boned article, held with a bolster about 1/2 the diameter of the circle I wanted (depth?). This I was later convinced wouldn't work, and so sewed a large casing to the outside of the flat farthingale and stuffed it with cotton. I ended up wearing two bolsters. You can see the flat farthingale and the first bolster on my website under 'Estela's Projects' I hope to have the website updated soon with the finished pieces. The web address is www.goldenoakinn.com/projects_estela.htm Let me know if this helps and if you have any other questions. I will love to see your finished project! Kelly ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "TheRenaissanceTailor" ; "h-costume" Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 1:06 PM Subject: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? Hi all, as you may know already, I am re-creating this gown for the Phoenix Art Museum. http://tinyurl.com/y6phle I think the bolster type French Farthingale would be most appropriate - ( like those in the oft sited French Dutch caricature). Have any of you constructed this type? How did you approach it? I started with a softly stuffed tube which gave a reasonable silhouette, but I'd like to hear what you have been successful with. Robin? I know you have done this - but didn't see any construction details in your posts. Thanks, Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 10 18:04:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AN3xZc010068 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 18:04:03 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0AN38GT004141 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 18:03:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0AN1keE069975 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:01:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AN1fWn011206; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:01:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0AN1chH011096 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:01:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c97.6807033 (43933) for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 18:01:27 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 18:01:24 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a46235bb-338a-44cc-843e-09d0c46644be X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A570AC.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 18:03:57 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/10/2007 4:25:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com writes: I started with a softly stuffed tube which gave a reasonable silhouette, but I'd like to hear what you have been successful with. ************************ Nice gown. Boy, the ruff will be fun, no? A stuffed bolster is the way to go since it has that Dutch feel and should be sorta soft and bulky. You can get a better shape if the "tube" is shaped, curved a bit and cut in 2 identical pieces, an upper and lower piece. I've made one out of heavy knit, which curves easier around the body, but this isn't period as far as I know. Cloth on the bias might help and actually be period. And in the caricatures, if I remember correctly, there are bands of trim going around the width of the bolster every so often. These might also be casings for bones [ and/or seams or darts] to help the padded thing keep it's shape [in both directions]. You might try some Rigelene or cable ties or some kind of boning at intervals. And I'd make it pretty, y'know. Some interesting fabric with some trim. Makes a person more inclined to wear the thing. And since you have to cut and make it anyway, have some fun. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 10 19:25:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0B0PkKV011886 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 19:25:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0B0OpoG007533 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 19:25:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0B0Nh8I080334 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 17:23:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0B0Nc4q082636; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 17:23:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wr-out-0506.google.com (wr-out-0506.google.com [64.233.184.232]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0B0NRLY082486 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 17:23:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aviendiora@gmail.com) Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id 58so210459wri for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:23:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=r9pwkDPX587/riHqxm++RAeXptzFn8MAA9FLHYB/vC6A/bYaDu1ZGGbVlScBaJX8Kq9pv8+PgcPA911bL/OjcPjnNzhLKefPHnYoRgaXXLIZMGQFtIMFvH1bJiwfTNFSGfplqZkBinrePC7i37i6QDkny/rhkrgPRb4gDublrAo= Received: by 10.90.55.19 with SMTP id d19mr691203aga.1168475007161; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:23:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.29.10 with HTTP; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:23:27 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 16:23:27 -0800 From: Avien To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT? Firefly/Serenity costumes.... In-Reply-To: <006601c7345a$b3b47e80$30bfa6d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <006601c7345a$b3b47e80$30bfa6d8@pavilion> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4342e9f7-0ef6-45dd-8b48-5a43396fb225 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A583D6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 19:25:45 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi! I've done a few costumes from both Serenity and Firefly and there are several more on the to-do list. I've done mostly repros rather than something based off of the series so far but it would be a lot of fun just to create something that would fit in. Maybe for the next Browncoat Ball. =) And so far I have three browncoats, two I made and one was just a lucky find at a thrift store, and I have at least one more planned. They're good just for wearing, don't even need an event so you can never have too many. Avien On 1/9/07, Sue Clemenger wrote: > > Hope this is okay....H-costume being the only relatively-general costume > list I'm on. > Has anyone out there ever done anything with the costumes from either the > movie or the series? For some reason, the recent thread about hall > costumes > for CostumeCon, combined with a recent Serenity marathon, has created this > odd urge to make something...different. Something that would look good > under a brown coat. Oh, and a brown coat, of course. > I think it would be a lot of fun to play with the combinations of western, > chinese, and futuristic style elements.... > --Sue, also feeling a craving for something from Middle > Earth.....*sigh*......I don't have enough time as it is! ;o) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 08:21:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BDL809026493 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 08:21:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0BDKH9Y010279 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 08:21:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0BDJJ14066515 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 06:19:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BDJECs006110; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 06:19:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BDJ6ko006026 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 06:19:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep44.mail.dk ([195.41.46.227]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070111131906.EVUY9879.fep34.mail.dk@fep44.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:19:06 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.214]) by fep44.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070111131905.PKIF11319.fep44.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:19:05 +0100 Message-ID: <004301c73583$1d450940$d614a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:19:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep44.mail.dk from [80.161.20.214] at Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:19:04 +0100 X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] website X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 79b144b1-f874-40e8-944f-c9eec53e111c X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A63991.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 08:21:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi, I had bookmarked a website someone on 18th c womans list had posted long time ago, perhaps anybody here did the same? Its a university in USA who uploaded a large collection of the Galleries des Modes et Costumes francaises in high resolution. I have desperately looked for the bookmark, but i dont have it anymore. Anybody know where it is, please send it for the list! Many thanks Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 09:15:35 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BEFZW3028515 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:15:35 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0BEEoWw028899 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:15:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0BEELc8074111 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 07:14:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BEEAKL053595; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 07:14:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep31.mail.dk (fep31.mail.dk [80.160.76.195]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BEE6G7053433 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 07:14:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep47.mail.dk ([195.41.46.230]) by fep31.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070111141400.HTBF27047.fep31.mail.dk@fep47.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:14:00 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.214]) by fep47.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070111141400.PLLN13466.fep47.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:14:00 +0100 Message-ID: <007a01c7358a$cbc1e770$d614a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:14:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep47.mail.dk from [80.161.20.214] at Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:13:59 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0affdde6-7464-4fa1-90bf-86efcd61b448 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A6465A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:15:33 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Saragrace, Your link didnt work for me, is there a chance you could post it again? As for a small flat wheel i made the pattern from Jean Hunnisets book, used a flat steel in the outer edge. I didnt slide in the steel to a casing, but i made a tape for the steel wich i sewed together to a ring, and then attached to the edge. At the waist i made a drawstring. When the waist was tightened, the outer edge got tight and nice. I made a small bumroll in the back attached to the wheel. This worked fine for a dress with a ruffle pinned to the wheel made of dupioni silk. But now i couldnt see wich type of dress you are working on, perhaps it is only a bolster farthingale you want? Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "TheRenaissanceTailor" ; "h-costume" Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 6:06 PM Subject: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? Hi all, as you may know already, I am re-creating this gown for the Phoenix Art Museum. http://tinyurl.com/y6phle I think the bolster type French Farthingale would be most appropriate - ( like those in the oft sited French Dutch caricature). Have any of you constructed this type? How did you approach it? I started with a softly stuffed tube which gave a reasonable silhouette, but I'd like to hear what you have been successful with. Robin? I know you have done this - but didn't see any construction details in your posts. Thanks, Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 09:33:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BEXU4M029294 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:33:30 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0BEWedI021920 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:33:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0BEW5gB076375 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 07:32:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BEW2AC069775; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 07:32:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s39.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s39.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.111]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BEVxVv069673 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 07:32:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.14]) by bay0-omc1-s39.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 06:28:42 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 06:28:42 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV4.phx.gbl with DAV; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:28:38 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 07:28:42 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 07:28:42 -0700 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Jan 2007 14:28:42.0324 (UTC) FILETIME=[CB24F940:01C7358C] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 'fun' Ruff -was French Farthingale construction tips? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6d709822-4e2a-4d70-b7c1-e3a9616f82da X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A64A88.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:33:29 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0BEXU4M029294 Status: RO Yeah, I started the actual ruff yesterday. (My noodlings on it are on the site). I timed myself yesterday; it took me almost two hours just to split the six yards into 4 pieces, (thank goodness, organza tears nicely) then press, insert the braid and sew just one section! Yikes! Sg ----- Original Message ----- From: AlbertCat@aol.com To: h-costume@indra.com Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 4:01 PM ************************ Nice gown. Boy, the ruff will be fun, no? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 12:06:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BH63Aj002842 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 12:06:03 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0BH4unT011949 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 12:06:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0BH4L9X001287 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 10:04:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BH49Ep032929; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 10:04:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp103.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com (smtp103.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com [209.73.179.141]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0BH3vGW032583 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 10:04:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: (qmail 73751 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2007 17:03:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO IBMTHINKPAD) (rlksm1@verizon.net@72.95.157.205 with login) by smtp103.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2007 17:03:51 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: Upc_t3sVM1kEZLqx9.fcLaFFWiUk82IpN8TSjlhU1NF735KReQl7PwVTJIKJDsLciqXh_SwSvTQ6OZDnJAeWcE3tC4yubj2y12MSRTAl5_dgTsbdObckNyg- Message-ID: <002e01c7359b$223b40a0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45A409E1.3010208@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20070109213456.034d3d88@suziclarke.co.uk> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Virgin Queen Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 11:11:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 26eb8031-c75f-44f0-8b7b-5dab7485f095 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A66E38.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 12:06:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I just watched this 'at home' over the hollidays and was puzzled especially by the skirt extensions (or lack of same)..Your suggestion about the designers were using the right scholarship but ...badly... is certainly my take on the overall projection of Ren Fashion. I was also quite put off with the appearances of "dirty linen" showing at the neckline. I assume that it was unbleached muslin. Knowing what the Inventories list and how much Elizabeth loved dressing up, I don't think that this take on realism suits well with her (presumed) character. Finally watched the latest (!!) Pride and Prejudice last eve and if ever there was a film that proclaims the Publication Date, this is certainly one of them. Again, the skirts caught my eye first. Oh how they clung and how billowy . Silk "on the farm?" I don't think so. I was also disappointed that more of Jane Austin in the script was not used. The whole farm setting was not quite what I think "Living in the Country" was in the early 19th C for a middleclass family down in funds. The whole interpretation of Elizabeths character lacked the depth that other productions have succeeded in making her out to be. Therefor, P&P is hardly more than a working title with some casche. Kathleen ----- From: "Suzi Clarke" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 4:37 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Virgin Queen > At 21:32 09/01/2007, you wrote: >>Sylvia Rognstad wrote: >> >>>I don't know if the PBS series "The Virgin Queen" is showing in all necks >>>of the woods, but it just started here in Colorado this past Sunday. I'm >>>wondering what you all thought of it, costume or otherwise? >> >>I enjoyed it the first time it aired in 2005, but I'm not watching it the >>second time around. I thought they did a reasonable job of telling the >>story and making it realistic, but I seem to recall a lot of folks hated >>it. > I made ruffs (so I know accuracy was not paramount!) for this show, and > saw some of the clothes in the making - they were using Janet Arnold and > Jean Hunnisett. However, they weren't using them very well in my opinion, > as the clothes were no better than any of the other Elizabeth films in > recent years. > > Suzi > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 16:12:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BLCEom007594 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 16:12:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0BLBOfu029727 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 16:12:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0BLAjvD043522 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:10:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BLASD2022773; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:10:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37511.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37511.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.158]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0BKYhgv081784 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:34:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 90887 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Jan 2007 20:34:37 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=UmFR/NCnUMV7pFtxIygJQrvupKj++uTWDeKyMcBzpNrVDuIeQlWgxfkBg03wf0t670eBIHFqccn3LytY9p8lejfFiFeTQwFGGBuwJn6mQPday9t0AsrzX8Q5dTHQXNLuVHozhkaRNmzrmeSzgZeWFkcI6C33tMU8bBKUqVR/8dM=; X-YMail-OSG: p9y8VVEVM1nEL_gUTxZ68TkVW6veywSA3wsezZfv Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37511.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 12:34:37 PST Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 12:34:37 -0800 (PST) From: Zuzana Kraemerova To: h-costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <850528.90382.qm@web37511.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] spiral lacing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 34eea66b-4aea-40f3-9cef-d29658229e84 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A6A7FC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 16:12:13 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I've got a really stupid question, but recently a costumer who I thought knew a lot about clothing, historical finds of original garments etc. made doubts about spiral lacing as the only lacing style in middle ages. She made some sort of a pourpoint and it was laced by criss-cross lacing. When I told her I was not too sure about the accuracy, she answered she was not sure that there was only one lacing style used in that time. What do you think about that? When came criss-cross lacing in? Thanks, Zuzana --------------------------------- Any questions? Get answers on any topic at Yahoo! Answers. Try it now. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 16:52:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BLqTPI008317 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 16:52:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0BLphq1016194 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 16:52:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0BLpB3K055243 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:51:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BLp2DX070833; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:51:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0BLou7L070704 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:50:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id F281C389B4 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:50:55 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] spiral lacing Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:51:03 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <850528.90382.qm@web37511.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 23eff54c-6d74-492c-9378-1437bc721af0 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A6B16F.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 16:52:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO You can find crisscross but not as common as spiral. Also it may depend on region and era. Using Florentine late 15th century as example: spiral http://festiveattyre.com/research/earlyflor/3flor1.html Spiral w/a twist http://festiveattyre.com/research/earlyflor/3flor8.html crisscross with a twist http://festiveattyre.com/research/earlyflor/3flor5.html crisscross http://festiveattyre.com/research/earlyflor/3flor3.html http://festiveattyre.com/research/earlyflor/3flor20.html ladder http://festiveattyre.com/research/earlyflor/3flor4.html http://festiveattyre.com/research/earlyflor/3flor9.html http://festiveattyre.com/research/earlyflor/3flor11.html De -----Original Message----- I've got a really stupid question, but recently a costumer who I thought knew a lot about clothing, historical finds of original garments etc. made doubts about spiral lacing as the only lacing style in middle ages. She made some sort of a pourpoint and it was laced by criss-cross lacing. When I told her I was not too sure about the accuracy, she answered she was not sure that there was only one lacing style used in that time. What do you think about that? When came criss-cross lacing in? Thanks, Zuzana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 19:57:37 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C0vbnE011734 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:57:37 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0C0ukMF031593 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:57:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0C0uAOV082695 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 17:56:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C0u6Gs054384; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 17:56:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m23.mx.aol.com (imo-m23.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.4]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C0u21c054268 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 17:56:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c3b.bdf1743 (58808) for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:55:41 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:55:39 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Catching up on old miniseries [was, Virgin Queen] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: cde9c7ad-c218-4119-9adf-605862a590b7 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A6DCCF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:57:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO And I'm seeing for the 1st time the "Bleak House" with Gillian Anderson. I liked very much the Diana Rigg version. This one is much "bleaker"...babba bing. Everyone looks great, but it's all too grey and dreary so far. I know much of it is SUPPOSED to be but part of that is the contrast with the not so dreary places. Everywhere is grey in this production so far. Gillian looks great [and is quite good, but I expected her to be], still there is something about her look....I can't put my finger on it... The Deadlock's world should be posh and expensive and full of the things that everyone wants, but at the same time empty and cold. All that Victorian brickerbrack should somehow appear unsatisfying. So far it's just dark. And the weird sorta space-age transitions...swoosh! Wassup w'that? But I've got a long way to go so I don't want to be hard on it. It's really quite good in spite of my vague complaints. I also saw for the 1st time "Gangs of New York". Boy...Leo does nothing for me and Cameron Diaz....shudder! Still, Daniel Day Lewis is as usual amazing. I like the costumes. I didn't mind the strange mix of oriental stuff when they're in the oriental circus. And the upper crust ladies and gents look fantastic....though there are few of those. I liked the color put into the gangs, and the dandy look of the leaders. This is just a notion taken from today's gangs rendered in period. And since the thing is a fairy tale....even though it used a few historical events...a little imagination doesn't bother me. I just like Sandy Powell's style, and that's all there is to it. I should go watch "Orlando" and "Velvet Goldmine" again.... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 20:06:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C16pJM011959 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 20:06:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0C161Zo009605 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 20:06:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0C15erQ083893 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 18:05:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C15XNw062136; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 18:05:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m18.mx.aol.com (imo-m18.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.208]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C15TCu062021 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 18:05:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c04.d71f40a (58808) for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 20:05:10 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 20:05:08 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] spiral lacing To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 796d723c-5976-4d10-a274-6535d80069f4 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A6DEF9.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 20:06:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/11/2007 4:12:04 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, zkraemerova@yahoo.com writes: What do you think about that? When came criss-cross lacing in? Spiral lacing is usually the method for utilitarian lacing, like up closings and stuff. But there is also decorative lacing. We had a discussion about it not long ago. There some examples of late Gothic and early Renn. lacing up the front of gowns that criss-crossed, looped, and did all manner of decorative patterns meant to be seen.... if I remember correctly. Criss-cross lacing for corsets and things comes with the industrial revolution.... the cord being machine made now instead of by hand and therefore cheap enough to use twice the length. Also, the tightness of the corsets at the time almost require it. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 21:21:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C2LtuC013376 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:21:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0C2L9Jg022063 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:21:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0C2K5se093747 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:20:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C2K0Ag020992; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:20:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C2JuE4020948 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:19:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m30.in-tch.com [216.166.191.30]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l0C26qJ12402 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:06:53 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <002e01c735f1$5ec7eea0$1ebfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 19:28:37 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Appearance of ladies' houpelandes??? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f0e4ba67-5304-4af0-b7d4-e3aa9f03006d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A6F095.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:21:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm in the early stages of thinking about undertaking a houp...like, in a year or so, predicated, of course, on the theory that I'll actually have built the correct garments to go *underneath* by then! ;o) I've been wondering, though...when did they first start showing up as being worn by women? I'm specifically interested in the earlier styles.... --Sue, in a sunny-but-cold Montana winter (brrr...darned good time to stay in and look through costuming books, and peruse fabric stash.....) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 23:14:55 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C4EoCw015793 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:14:54 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0C4DxoG003284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:14:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0C4DUFN008578 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:13:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C4DQ0o005915; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:13:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C4DLtB005859 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:13:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA25697 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:01:00 -0600 Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:01:00 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Appearance of ladies' houpelandes??? In-Reply-To: <002e01c735f1$5ec7eea0$1ebfa6d8@pavilion> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 34774c99-353d-4816-829c-9ae7225e1cd3 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A70B07.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:14:48 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Thu, 11 Jan 2007, Sue Clemenger wrote: > I'm in the early stages of thinking about undertaking a houp...like, > in a year or so, predicated, of course, on the theory that I'll > actually have built the correct garments to go *underneath* by then! > ;o) I've been wondering, though...when did they first start showing up > as being worn by women? I've seen them in English brasses from the 1390s or so, but most of the manuscript images I can think of are 1400-1430. Be aware, too, that in the 1380s and 1390s you see some gowns that look like early versions of what we call houppelandes now -- full in the body but not quite so full as later, high neckline or a bit of a collar but not the very tall ones yet, fairly narrow but not tight sleeves that haven't yet grown into the big bells or bags. The transition is gradual, so it's hard to point to a moment when the gowns officially qualify as "houppelandes," and probably most of the people at the time called them all "gowns" (or their language's equivalent of that word) anyway. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 11 23:26:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C4QdDk016024 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:26:39 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0C4Pr3H002559 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:26:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0C4PaTB010391 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:25:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C4PYVT015234; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:25:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.131]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C4PVUu015189 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 21:25:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from genteelarts (oh-71-50-225-154.dyn.embarqhsd.net [71.50.225.154]) by smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EFD532C031 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 22:24:45 -0600 (CST) From: "Carolann Schmitt" To: "'Historical Costume'" References: <00cf01c71be0$076f7e00$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> Subject: RE: [h-cost] Met Museum Bulletin Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:25:22 -0500 Organization: Genteel Arts Message-ID: <002e01c73601$ad299840$f600a8c0@genteelarts> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <00cf01c71be0$076f7e00$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> Thread-Index: AccczDRRfRleVbC6RO+Gt9Zmgos2ggZNQyvw X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=13% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6f4520b7-ae9e-491b-bb7c-507597649580 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A70DD2.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:26:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I was the very lucky winner of the original copy of the bulletin. It arrived late last week and I'm enjoying it immensely. A very sincere thanks to Helen for sharing it and all the scans with me and the list. Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 1-4, 2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 00:05:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C55l8j016830 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:05:47 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0C54uSx020915 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:05:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0C54QWj015040 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 22:04:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C54Omx042413; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 22:04:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C54KEf042356 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 22:04:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA25814 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:51:59 -0600 Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:51:59 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] spiral lacing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f526f2c5-8499-4acd-b303-c83c37ded357 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A716F8.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:05:45 -0500 (EST) Status: RO As De has already shown, you can find all sorts of lacing patterns over the course of the Middle Ages and Renaissance, particularly if you look at a variety of fashions and in different places and times. But that doesn't justify using different patterns interchangeably; each type of lacing functioned a little differently. So some will work on some sorts of garments, and others will not work as well. And of course, many things were laced -- not just body garments, but also shoes, purses, and utilitarian objects (horse tack? cart covers?). Each situation had its own needs, and may have called for different types of lacing patterns. AlbertCat wrote: > Criss-cross lacing for corsets and things comes with the industrial > revolution.... the cord being machine made now instead of by hand and > therefore cheap enough to use twice the length. Also, the tightness of > the corsets at the time almost require it. One consideration is whether the goal is to create an unbroken visual area. Spiral lacing allows you to overlap the sides, which is very useful in lacing up parts of a gown where you want the lacing to act like a seam (or, in modern equivalent, a zipper) and you don't want any gapping or slipping. When you have laced something tightly with a spiral, it really doesn't move or gap; the overlapping edges are the equivalent of a bunch of layers wrapped round and round with a cord, almost like a flexible bone. From a distance, the lacing is almost unnoticeable, and artists often did not show it at all even when it's clear it was there (e.g. you might see a dress being laced-up in one scene, and in the next, the lacing isn't depicted at all). With corsets, if I understand correctly, the edges typically were not meant to overlap, and perhaps not even to abut. Spiral lacing wouldn't be as effective as crisscross lacing in that case. Bear in mind also that the modern understanding of crisscross lacing usually means the way you'd lace your shoes -- you always come out of the hole with each pass. That means the lace passes between the edges and you physically can't overlap them, just abut them with a little room for the laces to cross in between. Also, each hole holds only one lace; the laces skip alternate holes as they zigzag up the opening. Sometimes you see a criss-cross pattern in styles that are normally associated with spiral lacing (e.g. 14th century fitted dresses). In the cases I'm thinking of, this is not done with a modern criss-cross, but with two spirals going in opposite directions. This creates a pattern of connected X's (or diamonds, if you like) down the visible side, and a row of "dashes" on the inside. It is very, very strong, and also doesn't have the issue of the sides going slightly offset from each other as with a single spiral lace, because the two laces are counterbalancing each other. Also, with this sort of double-spiral lace, each lace goes through all the holes, rather than skipping in zigzags the way modern criss-cross lacing does, so it is very different from a modern criss-cross in several ways. However, I've seen people point to the occasional double-spiral pattern on a medieval brass as an example of criss-cross lacing. It isn't. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 00:40:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C5eU8G017595 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:40:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0C5deLa004986 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:40:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0C5cgvt018837 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 11 Jan 2007 22:38:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C5cJjT065548; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 22:38:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0C5bM8Q064941 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 22:38:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0C5fhCU029363 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:41:43 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] spiral lacing Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:45:41 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701120045.41393.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 72198239-2291-457d-98a5-5c590b938e2e X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A71F1C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:40:29 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Friday 12 January 2007 12:51 am, Robin Netherton wrote: [snip] > Sometimes you see a criss-cross pattern in styles that are normally > associated with spiral lacing (e.g. 14th century fitted dresses). In the > cases I'm thinking of, this is not done with a modern criss-cross, but > with two spirals going in opposite directions. This creates a pattern of > connected X's (or diamonds, if you like) down the visible side, and a row > of "dashes" on the inside. It is very, very strong, and also doesn't have > the issue of the sides going slightly offset from each other as with a > single spiral lace, because the two laces are counterbalancing each other. > Also, with this sort of double-spiral lace, each lace goes through all the > holes, rather than skipping in zigzags the way modern criss-cross lacing > does, so it is very different from a modern criss-cross in several ways. > However, I've seen people point to the occasional double-spiral pattern on > a medieval brass as an example of criss-cross lacing. It isn't. Right. Jen Thompson has a good discussion of spiral lacing, with pictorial examples and discussion, here: http://www.festiveattyre.com/research/lacing/lacing.html -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 06:07:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CB7RRP006930 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 06:07:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CB6YY6003168 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 06:07:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CB5sg2055312 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 04:05:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CB5mJc086501; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 04:05:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CB5hZg086389 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 04:05:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep43.mail.dk ([195.41.46.226]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070112110537.ORBK9879.fep34.mail.dk@fep43.mail.dk> for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:05:37 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.66]) by fep43.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070112110536.EBJD21862.fep43.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:05:36 +0100 Message-ID: <004b01c73639$a5cfe710$4243a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <850528.90382.qm@web37511.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] spiral lacing Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:06:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep43.mail.dk from [80.161.67.66] at Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:05:35 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f9769fa3-a0c3-4ffc-8ba3-33d70431b41c X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A76BBA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 06:07:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi, I must admit that i dont believe that either, that spiral lacing was the only way it was done. Off cause they made as much variation as possible, for decorative purpose, they were not stupid! Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zuzana Kraemerova" To: "h-costume" Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 9:34 PM Subject: [h-cost] spiral lacing > I've got a really stupid question, but recently a costumer who I thought > knew a lot about clothing, historical finds of original garments etc. made > doubts about spiral lacing as the only lacing style in middle ages. She > made some sort of a pourpoint and it was laced by criss-cross lacing. When > I told her I was not too sure about the accuracy, she answered she was not > sure that there was only one lacing style used in that time. > What do you think about that? When came criss-cross lacing in? > > Thanks, > > Zuzana > > > --------------------------------- > Any questions? Get answers on any topic at Yahoo! Answers. Try it now. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 07:42:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CCg5DM023719 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:42:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CCfE7Q025554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:42:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CCeaT2066004 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 05:40:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CCeX63054907; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 05:40:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37509.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37509.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.156]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0CCeUNC054798 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 05:40:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 96659 invoked by uid 60001); 12 Jan 2007 12:40:24 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=FMV5hnz73DnvJCfeOrauJ8MKC1WhOren+BtjEon0R5J24k/qYcBLl4v7sQoBKFb/U16RsDWgXtSabDL9OfWs3lqrYZi/hqI3GRAsxrId66Cxw1bvX32W6TLEY1NInRa5YFSuSQXx0RkpjG/I1YkfOPh9qc1lJzlW8442DjEf7Ro=; X-YMail-OSG: lt_dn5wVM1nS9FLihDdmZ8i0APBFrPaQTB7W_yWWJIIXyKe1uFt2ySmCAH6yEAzq19YyQmXk4xHYxXV24qdFyjaLxHB9O_bfwrQmyF5BSkxpW9Ayap7YUVGUZlB.mBRDxflbYjIMTT5cqV0- Received: from [195.122.195.226] by web37509.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 04:40:24 PST Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 04:40:24 -0800 (PST) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] spiral lacing To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <823668.96296.qm@web37509.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 763e67df-f046-4a34-9fec-dbf645d99df2 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A781EA.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:42:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sometimes you see a criss-cross pattern in styles that are normally associated with spiral lacing (e.g. 14th century fitted dresses). In the cases I'm thinking of, this is not done with a modern criss-cross, but with two spirals going in opposite directions...." Can you give some concrete portraits or links where this can be seen? Or another example of some other sorts of lacing used in the middle ages? Could a "double spiral lacing" have been used for fastening pourpoints? --------------------------------- Access over 1 million songs - Yahoo! Music Unlimited. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 09:57:27 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CEvRqQ026683 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 09:57:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CEuaob004114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 09:57:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CEtxD3027490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:55:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CEtjwk015663; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:55:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s36.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s36.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.108]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CEtS0R015376 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:55:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.29]) by bay0-omc1-s36.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 06:55:23 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 06:55:22 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV19.phx.gbl with DAV; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:55:18 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "h-costume" References: <007a01c7358a$cbc1e770$d614a150@CPQ21932199711> Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:55:25 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:55:25 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Jan 2007 14:55:22.0862 (UTC) FILETIME=[AF8D70E0:01C73659] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] URL Repost - Re: French Farthingale construction tips? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f11b8973-5640-4640-ac59-c2b9852e9b9c X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A7A1A4.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 09:57:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Bjarne, try these. I have changed my settings to text only. Hopefully they will come across better. http://tinyurl.com/y6phle http://saragrace.us/html/A1_GoldenAgeDressDiary_PAMPics.html Saragrace ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 7:14 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? > Dear Saragrace, > Your link didnt work for me, is there a chance you could post it again? > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 10:11:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CFB5If027052 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:11:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CFAFiZ026068 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:11:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CF8q2U030574 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:08:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CF8jGT029337; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:08:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s35.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s35.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.171]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CF8dKP029131 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:08:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.23]) by bay0-omc2-s35.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:08:31 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:08:31 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV13.phx.gbl with DAV; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 15:08:30 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:08:38 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:08:38 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Jan 2007 15:08:31.0649 (UTC) FILETIME=[85B4C910:01C7365B] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Robin - A specific question Re: French Farthingale construction tips? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a4cf742f-3900-4047-852b-04f55b02a7d6 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A7A4D7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:11:04 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin, thank you for your help, I think I get most of it. In one of the last lines of your post though: > But you'll still want to taper almost to nothing in the front.> Do you mean the whole bum roll, or just the pieces? I am assuming you mean the pieces....'cause this roll looks pretty much the same size all the way round.... Just want to be sure. Thanks, Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 10:26:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CFQYjE027359 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:26:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CFPgRA023490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:26:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CFPIEi033981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:25:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CFPGQL046379; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:25:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CFPDfh046199 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:25:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m89.in-tch.com [216.166.191.89]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l0CFC6J09495 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:12:06 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <000401c7365f$0fa1bf40$59bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Appearance of ladies' houpelandes??? Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:33:49 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c69e32db-55ba-4d0c-a61e-61aa48f109df X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A7A876.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:26:32 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thanks for the reminder on the terminology . It's awkward sometimes, switching back and forth between terms used in a given period, and terms used now, let alone oddities like "garb" that are subgroup specific. ;o) What I've been finding, graphically, certainly supports what you're saying. I'm seeing bits and pieces in various texts (costuming books, mostly) that mention the appearance of pleated gowns/houpelandes in men, earlier than in women. And I remember you talking in one of your lectures about wearing a proper fitted gown as an underlayer for a houp. Since, eventually, I'll actually be making clothing appropriate for my SCA persona, who wears English styles of the mid-late 1300s, I'm trying to pin down when houps first appeared as feminine apparel, and in what forms. I want to be able to give myself more options than just a kirtle/fitted gown-and-surcoat combination. A couple of shifts, a couple of undergowns, and a couple of options for the outer layer, ideally. (Plus accessories, headgear, etc., of course.) I've got a friend with some books that have images of brasses--I'll check those out. Mostly what I've got, myself, is a moderately bad reprint of the Tres Rich Heures, which I'll use if I have to....;o) --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 10:01 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Appearance of ladies' houpelandes??? > I've seen them in English brasses from the 1390s or so, but most of the > manuscript images I can think of are 1400-1430. > > Be aware, too, that in the 1380s and 1390s you see some gowns that look > like early versions of what we call houppelandes now -- full in the body > but not quite so full as later, high neckline or a bit of a collar but not > the very tall ones yet, fairly narrow but not tight sleeves that haven't > yet grown into the big bells or bags. The transition is gradual, so it's > hard to point to a moment when the gowns officially qualify as > "houppelandes," and probably most of the people at the time called them > all "gowns" (or their language's equivalent of that word) anyway. > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 12:54:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CHs1b8031319 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:54:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CHrBlw007578 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:53:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CHpr9a060812 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:51:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CHpkC8008461; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:51:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com (ug-out-1314.google.com [66.249.92.172]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CFReou048797 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:27:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kristinolivia@gmail.com) Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id o38so715457ugd for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:27:40 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=T+IVWWY+o3VNegs9Z8KlZuDBD8N4NnV+OJDNRYHGJEyM9meIWZL0mPrJrh4K5phfZiYNOAoNlJ9TVKV726jQVcP0JUGW695fmJzKnbRKMC0w2v1ZQPdPW525tBhCIm2CQUquof/AtVnGPwzpXwcPDJzkgTJ+F2Ve7ad7DRTPnzg= Received: by 10.78.131.8 with SMTP id e8mr374977hud.1168615656080; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:27:36 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.78.129.18 with HTTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:27:35 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <33a78bfb0701120727n6b0fee3va135e05517c69ab@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 10:27:35 -0500 From: Kristin To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Tardis In-Reply-To: <457E498B.40300@bovil.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <200612111537.kBBFaX7m015914@net.indra.com> <457D895202000014000C70C3@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> <1165873991.457dd3477a297@webmail.netspace.net.au> <200612120314.kBC3EV33052992@net.indra.com> <457E498B.40300@bovil.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 372e3260-117a-4f81-82a7-7e23e5393b3f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A7CB07.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:54:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ... yes, Rose and the Dr. visited her mother quite a few times. But now that they're all in the alternate universe, no more Rose. :( On 12/12/06, Andrew Trembley wrote: > > Dianne & Greg Stucki wrote: > > At 04:53 PM 12/11/2006, you wrote: > >> I have one in my garage (don't ask), > >> > >> -C. > >> > > Now you KNOW we have to ask! > No, if she said she had one in her kitchen, asking would be imperative. > Garage, not so much. > > (and I know why at least one person would have a police box in their > kitchen) > > andy > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 13:11:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CIBk90031894 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:11:46 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CIAttr032207 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:11:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CIAUN7063696 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:10:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CIALJi028060; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:10:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CIA86c027794 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:10:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA27673 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:57:50 -0600 Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:57:49 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Robin - A specific question Re: French Farthingale construction tips? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ba352f97-8535-44af-9812-740cc3d7e320 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A7CF2F.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:11:44 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri, 12 Jan 2007, Saragrace Knauf wrote: > Do you mean the whole bum roll, or just the pieces? I am assuming you > mean the pieces....'cause this roll looks pretty much the same size > all the way round.... My impression was that it protruded less in the front than in the back, but I may have been wrong. If it does protrude less in front, then taper your roll so it's a crescent rather than a donut when viewed from the top. This is often easier to see in sculpture! There are several variables that affect the fall of the front of the skirt -- degree of protrusion is one, and tilt is another. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 14:19:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CJJItR006243 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:19:24 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CJIPQb001359 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:19:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CJHoHs079644 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:17:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CJHiC6005220; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:17:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web27210.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (web27210.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.146.182.100]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0CJHeuk005032 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:17:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katherinejsanders@yahoo.co.uk) Received: (qmail 84755 invoked by uid 60001); 12 Jan 2007 19:17:34 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.co.uk; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=LVo1AGAMPHF3XDQ0TgrlOSxJXHT2GbcFLax3wEc4AVk63zvFS8ZuOiROW8kSWf49Qybylp0Z+Vd8RgLNAdGDjDUF8Jrhi8UmBrOV0sg34KaK3tYkkoMz+wkAlPJcF5lt3M1m2rmqH1U7SI1WxajZiu/ohxicnHIqLGU4nE8lrcQ= ; Message-ID: <20070112191734.84753.qmail@web27210.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.155.204.82] by web27210.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:17:34 GMT Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:17:34 +0000 (GMT) From: katherine sanders To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 48607cc4-475d-4e28-abb5-856482737ca3 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A7DF01.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:19:16 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0CJJItR006243 Status: RO Dear List I am about to make a final (i.e. not in calico/muslin) robe a la francaise: its primary purpose will be display for photographs and showing at wedding fairs etc., to try and persuade people that period clothing is lovely etc etc. Now I'm swithering about fabric - the two choices are a) expensive, pretty and therefore out of my league, realistically or b) sort of appropriate, synthetic and more obtainable. Since I'll end up having to use a cheaper fabric this time around, does anyone have recommendations on what is more appropriate? OK, I can't be completely authentic but I'd rather avoid something that screams 'upholstery' and puts of anyone who knows anything about the period. (Suppliers in the UK would be stupendous, but even links to pics of semi-appropriate would be terribly useful and appreciated). Many thanks! Katherine p.s. got "Dangerous Liaisons" catalogue for Christmas - yummmy!!! "A positive attitude may not solve all of your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort" - Herm Albright ___________________________________________________________ What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Yahoo! Mail Championship. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 14:33:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CJXuUk006611 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:33:56 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CJX6RD011700 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:33:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CJWM99082372 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:32:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CJWC5E021910; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:32:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep32.mail.dk (fep32.mail.dk [80.160.76.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CJW7g5021693 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:32:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep46.mail.dk ([195.41.46.229]) by fep32.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070112193201.SMQV12238.fep32.mail.dk@fep46.mail.dk> for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 20:32:01 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.132]) by fep46.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070112193201.QMSD15028.fep46.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 20:32:01 +0100 Message-ID: <000b01c73680$66cc0930$8414a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20070112191734.84753.qmail@web27210.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 20:32:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep46.mail.dk from [80.161.20.132] at Fri, 12 Jan 2007 20:31:56 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 96b3ba76-cb36-4b55-89a0-793e18284a25 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A7E272.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:33:55 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Very easy, Why not go for a lovely soft indian cotton? I have seen some real ones made of the fine printed linnens, and considering the linnen was very fine and soft and cotton like, why not go for it. Could be lovely in both printed or plain collours. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "katherine sanders" To: Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 8:17 PM Subject: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise Dear List I am about to make a final (i.e. not in calico/muslin) robe a la francaise: its primary purpose will be display for photographs and showing at wedding fairs etc., to try and persuade people that period clothing is lovely etc etc. Now I'm swithering about fabric - the two choices are a) expensive, pretty and therefore out of my league, realistically or b) sort of appropriate, synthetic and more obtainable. Since I'll end up having to use a cheaper fabric this time around, does anyone have recommendations on what is more appropriate? OK, I can't be completely authentic but I'd rather avoid something that screams 'upholstery' and puts of anyone who knows anything about the period. (Suppliers in the UK would be stupendous, but even links to pics of semi-appropriate would be terribly useful and appreciated). Many thanks! Katherine p.s. got "Dangerous Liaisons" catalogue for Christmas - yummmy!!! "A positive attitude may not solve all of your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort" - Herm Albright ___________________________________________________________ What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Yahoo! Mail Championship. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 15:44:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CKiYqw008604 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 15:44:38 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CKhleB014396 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 15:44:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CKgvij094632 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:42:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CKgmAx097007; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:42:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from metis.sjsu.edu (metis.sjsu.edu [130.65.3.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CKgfvH096756 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:42:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from attrembl@bovil.com) Received: from [130.65.37.143] (sjs-130-65-37-143.sjsu.edu [130.65.37.143]) by metis.sjsu.edu (8.12.10+Sun/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CKgYYa021171 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:42:35 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) In-Reply-To: <33a78bfb0701120727n6b0fee3va135e05517c69ab@mail.gmail.com> References: <200612111537.kBBFaX7m015914@net.indra.com> <457D895202000014000C70C3@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> <1165873991.457dd3477a297@webmail.netspace.net.au> <200612120314.kBC3EV33052992@net.indra.com> <457E498B.40300@bovil.com> <33a78bfb0701120727n6b0fee3va135e05517c69ab@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <946393B4-67BC-4C3F-8718-3524D8BA0385@bovil.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Andrew T Trembley Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Tardis Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 12:42:32 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b1e99ef3-a8a7-4778-a2e8-f1fe45802e29 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A7F303.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 15:44:33 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 12, 2007, at 7:27 AM, Kristin wrote: > On 12/12/06, Andrew Trembley wrote: >> >> Dianne & Greg Stucki wrote: >> > At 04:53 PM 12/11/2006, you wrote: >> >> I have one in my garage (don't ask), >> >> >> >> -C. >> >> >> > Now you KNOW we have to ask! >> No, if she said she had one in her kitchen, asking would be >> imperative. >> Garage, not so much. >> >> (and I know why at least one person would have a police box in their >> kitchen) > > ... yes, Rose and the Dr. visited her mother quite a few times. > But now > that they're all in the alternate universe, no more Rose. :( Well... Adam's mom did have a Tardis in her living room once, but I was talking "person" and not "fictional character." -- andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen - http://www.bovil.com/ San Jose, CA - '72 R75/5 '86 R100 (mine) - '92 K75sa '03 R1150R (Kevin's) "It's not pink, it's peach-colored. Pink is tacky." --Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel read the FAQ... Ridicule: http://www.idiots-r-us.org/ read the FAQ... IBMWR: http://www.ibmwr.org/faq-files/ read the FAQ... AirList: http://www.airheads.org/faq.html read the FAQ... Hoaxes & Urban Legends: http://urbanlegends.about.com/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 16:29:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CLTLpw009747 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:29:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CLSU6n003680 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:29:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CLRn5j002489 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:27:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CLRgje045098; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:27:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CLRakX044991 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 14:27:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA28199 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:15:18 -0600 Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:15:18 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] spiral lacing In-Reply-To: <823668.96296.qm@web37509.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f4bc6758-3de4-446c-aa24-7083183218d3 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A7FD7E.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:29:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri, 12 Jan 2007, Zuzana Kraemerova wrote: > Sometimes you see a criss-cross pattern in styles that are normally > associated with spiral lacing (e.g. 14th century fitted dresses). In > the cases I'm thinking of, this is not done with a modern criss-cross, > but with two spirals going in opposite directions...." > > Can you give some concrete portraits or links where this can be > seen? In Rougham, Suffolk, England, is a 1405 brass to Sir R. Drury and his wife. The lady's fitted dress clearly has a series of connected X's (forming diamond shapes) going up the front. Her sleeves are knuckle-length and buttoned. I don't know if this is online; the search function at the MBS site doesn't seem to be working at the moment. But you can find it in Muriel Clayton's "Catalogue of Rubbings of Brasses and Incised Slabs," from the Victoria and Albert Museum, published by HMSO (London); I have the 1979 edition, which was all over the place some years ago and is probably available via ILL if you're really keen on seeing it. Looking further, I see this source may be problematic. I have another image of the brass in another book (very obscure, a locally published catalog of Suffolk brasses) that shows the X's better, and each one is engraved as a single diamond-shaped quatrefoil, perhaps meant to look like buttons. Then again, I've never seen diamond-shaped buttons, so this could be the result of the brass designer drawing the design with lacings, and the engraver (or the purchaser) deciding that wasn't fancy enough and tarting up the connected diamonds so that they look more like buttons (which were common on brasses of this style in England). From my experience with brasses, I can attest that this is not unheard-of -- you can get some really weird things going on with brasses as the stock designs pass through additional hands and as patrons request changes. I have seen occasional double-spirals elsewhere, but no images are coming to hand at this instant, and I'm not keen to go through my entire collection. > Or another example of some other sorts of lacing used in the middle > ages? Spiral lacing, with its diagonal lines, is easy to find. The marble effigy of the Countess of Warwick (1370s) in St. Mary's Church, Warwick, shows clear spiral lacing on offset holes, with a pair of even holes at both top and bottom. I show slides of this sculpture in my lecture on the fitted dress (the lecture I'm giving at CostumeCon), and you can find a decent photo in Margaret Scott's "Visual History of Costume: The 14th and 15th centuries," fig. 28. The more you look, the more of these you see, though they are most likely to be apparent in images where the lacing is partly opened. The Rohan Hours illumination of the nursing Madonna shows a gold dress laced with red cord, with the dress half-open and the spiral pattern very clear. The Fouquet portrait of Agnes Sorel as the Virgin, better known for the exposed breast and the over-the-bust seams, has a single lace that zigzags up on what must be inset lacing rings that would be invisible when the dress is shut. For dresses laced closed, illuminators are more likely to treat the lacing as invisible, but not always. I remember snapping a photo of some minor anonymous illumination in the Philadelphia Art Museum (a loose leaf in the collection, not on public display) because it had a nice neat spiral lace on a fitted dress. My interest centers on England/France/Flanders through the mid 15th century. Go further afield and later in time, and you see more variations. There are loads of decorative styles of lacing in Italy and Germany in the 15th century and later, including ladder lacing, lacing that loops around itself with each pass, and so forth. Many of these are on styles where the sides of bodices are meant to stay open over a decorative underlayer, so the lacing is done in a decorative way as well. > Could a "double spiral lacing" have been used for fastening > pourpoints? Certainly it could, but I think a single spiral would probably be sufficient. It's certainly much more common in the visual sources. One of the things to think about is how this affects your lacing holes. If you intend to do a single spiral lace, you might put your lacing holes offset, so that the top edge lines up evenly after you've pulled it shut. (This has been discussed here before, so I won't go into detail now; if you don't understand that, just ask.) If you make your lacing holes even on both sides, you have two options. One is to do a double spiral, which keeps the sides even. The other is to do a single spiral and let the top be a little uneven; this also shows up in some of the images (the ones I'm thinking of are Italian and/or mid-15th century). If your friend made her pourpoint with even lacing holes, then a double-spiral lace would be a lot more secure, and more easily documentable, than a modern criss-cross. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 18:27:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CNR59s012574 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:27:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CNQECB006302 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:27:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CNPlmI021602 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:25:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CNPY90069055; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:25:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CNPUKi068931 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:25:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cff.7026f71 (39330) for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:25:16 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:25:14 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 98104ea3-22d5-4ad1-a11c-7f2d14bf56f5 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A81916.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:27:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO They make some very lovely synthetic taffetas. Try to get one that's not so heavy. Now having said that, I do like some of the oriental satin brocades you find at Jo Ann's.... if you can find one that isn't dragons or bamboo. I've found some with a butter yellow background covered with little multicolor flowers. Also one in coffee with black flowers evenly spread across it. Also a cream one with chrysanthemums. These can be a little heavy but they look very rich. Polyester is not a dreadful as it used to be. Sometimes it looks exactly like silk, though never feels like it. Also chintz...striped or floral....can be perfect. Check the drapery department, but make a huge effort to choose something that doesn't look like curtains [even though many real gowns do]. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 18:35:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CNZo8g012792 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:35:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CNZ5fe008167 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:35:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CNYmHL023120 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:34:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CNYhIS077965; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:34:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CNV3xS074365 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:31:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA28631 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:18:44 -0600 Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:18:44 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Appearance of ladies' houpelandes??? In-Reply-To: <000401c7365f$0fa1bf40$59bfa6d8@pavilion> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 13c551c3-b564-4101-929f-a112004002d4 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A81B29.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:35:48 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri, 12 Jan 2007, Sue Clemenger wrote: > I've got a friend with some books that have images of brasses--I'll check > those out. Mostly what I've got, myself, is a moderately bad reprint of the > Tres Rich Heures, which I'll use if I have to....;o) If you ILL one book, let it be Margaret Scott's "Visual History of Costume: The 14th and 15th Centuries." Lots of primary images smack on target for you, many of them brasses or effigies that aren't easy to find elsewhere. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 19:00:23 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D00NFg013370 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:00:23 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0CNxXvh018493 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:00:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0CNxCrl026454 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:59:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CNxAlg099469; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:59:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc13.comcast.net (alnrmhc13.comcast.net [206.18.177.53]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0CNx6Ol099333 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:59:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (failure[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc13) with SMTP id <20070112235900b130033glce>; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 23:59:00 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) To: h-costume h-costume Message-Id: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:58:21 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Aprons X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 118a5548-a925-43e6-b61e-1e56b6fdf743 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A820E5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:00:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know when women began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? Too many of my history-of-costume books are in storage right now and I just can't seem to recall when they start showing up in the art. Does anyone have this info easily at hand? Thanks! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 19:08:00 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D07xCq013584 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:07:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0D07CcP007850 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:07:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0D06jE1027448 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:06:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D06gLa006337; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:06:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.netspace.net.au (mail-out5.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.92]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D06bHY006265 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:06:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stilskin@netspace.net.au) Received: from localhost (webmail4.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.171]) by mail.netspace.net.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13EC517047A for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:06:35 +1100 (EST) Received: from 220-253-122-29.VIC.netspace.net.au (220-253-122-29.VIC.netspace.net.au [220.253.122.29]) by webmail.netspace.net.au (IMP) with HTTP for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:06:35 +1100 Message-ID: <1168646795.45a8228bced46@webmail.netspace.net.au> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:06:35 +1100 From: stilskin@netspace.net.au To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Tardis References: <200612111537.kBBFaX7m015914@net.indra.com> <457D895202000014000C70C3@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> <1165873991.457dd3477a297@webmail.netspace.net.au> <200612120314.kBC3EV33052992@net.indra.com> <457E498B.40300@bovil.com> <33a78bfb0701120727n6b0fee3va135e05517c69ab@mail.gmail.com> <946393B4-67BC-4C3F-8718-3524D8BA0385@bovil.com> In-Reply-To: <946393B4-67BC-4C3F-8718-3524D8BA0385@bovil.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.1 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4b5e815b-bdca-48cf-88b0-c6be53a657a7 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A822B0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:07:58 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > > ... yes, Rose and the Dr. visited her mother quite a few times. > > But now > > that they're all in the alternate universe, no more Rose. :( > Ah, so much for watching that last episodde if it ever gets repeated, -C. ------------------------------------------------------------ This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 19:11:07 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0B60g013684 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:11:06 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0D0AFpM012815 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:11:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0D09oZq027997 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:09:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D09mYb009176; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:09:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.netspace.net.au (mail-out5.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.92]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D09h0X009107 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:09:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stilskin@netspace.net.au) Received: from localhost (webmail4.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.171]) by mail.netspace.net.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A887170351 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:09:43 +1100 (EST) Received: from 220-253-122-29.VIC.netspace.net.au (220-253-122-29.VIC.netspace.net.au [220.253.122.29]) by webmail.netspace.net.au (IMP) with HTTP for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:09:43 +1100 Message-ID: <1168646983.45a8234790cb0@webmail.netspace.net.au> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:09:43 +1100 From: stilskin@netspace.net.au To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.1 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7904107e-43cf-463c-937d-12cede2fa6a4 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A82367.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:11:04 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know when > women began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? When they are about 4 and start helping around the kitchen. Sorry, couldn't resist, -C. ------------------------------------------------------------ This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 19:18:57 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0IvRK013852 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:18:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0D0I7AS021247 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:18:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0D0Hmpv029089 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:17:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0HGEC015497; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:17:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc14.comcast.net (sccrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.200.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0HBK6015364 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:17:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc14) with SMTP id <2007011300170501400ok3nje>; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 00:17:05 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <1168646983.45a8234790cb0@webmail.netspace.net.au> References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> <1168646983.45a8234790cb0@webmail.netspace.net.au> Message-Id: From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:17:07 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 15a89086-98ed-4aec-a944-28a6b5b20691 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A8253F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:18:55 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hmm, yes, but, WHEN were they four? ;-) And could they tie the aprons themselves at that age? Sorry; end-of-week silliness. I would still like to know, you know, HISTORICALLY when, ahem. The Apron appeared. Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 12, 2007, at 7:09 PM, stilskin@netspace.net.au wrote: >> Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know when >> women began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? > > > When they are about 4 and start helping around the kitchen. > > Sorry, couldn't resist, > > -C. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 19:25:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0P5BF014009 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:25:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0D0OFPY027553 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:25:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0D0NxY6029875 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:23:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0NwLR021159; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:23:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from py-out-1112.google.com (py-out-1112.google.com [64.233.166.183]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0Ntc5021127 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:23:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from garbaholic@gmail.com) Received: by py-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id u77so484388pyb for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:23:55 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=h687QgU+josQbXYn7o+iXFUyiuKXl923UAe6KEG/sAOL2sw1LEfObtlhz5BmxgTK+C0YDYQD3nWebRcxk8wGFgOTe3qMzNu/gdI/HxYB/r9s0ddQyISzxp8m7isOz6GLFofyS9N5QC/hK1tI8cL3DxxEf+vW2DYQimdkRwvgkOs= Received: by 10.35.40.10 with SMTP id s10mr2252328pyj.1168647835665; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:23:55 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.35.16.1 with HTTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:23:55 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <870801590701121623u2fc861b8i74c7c3489e26b0e8@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:23:55 -0600 From: "Alexandria Doyle" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> <1168646983.45a8234790cb0@webmail.netspace.net.au> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1e3e658d-bfd8-46e2-b854-b45ecd69600a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A826AF.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:25:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO German Ladies were wearing them in the 16th century. Not neccessarily the beginning, but a point to start from. alex On 1/12/07, Lauren Walker wrote: > > Hmm, yes, but, WHEN were they four? ;-) > And could they tie the aprons themselves at that age? > Sorry; end-of-week silliness. I would still like to know, you know, > HISTORICALLY when, ahem. The Apron appeared. > Lauren > Lauren M. Walker > lauren.walker@comcast.net > > > > On Jan 12, 2007, at 7:09 PM, stilskin@netspace.net.au wrote: > > >> Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know when > >> women began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? > > > > > > When they are about 4 and start helping around the kitchen. > > > > Sorry, couldn't resist, > > > > -C. > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 19:29:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0TD67014095 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:29:13 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0D0SISS031926 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:29:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0D0Rw47030539 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:27:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0RoBh024423; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:27:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0RiMw024336 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:27:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA28817 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:15:27 -0600 Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:15:27 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons In-Reply-To: <870801590701121623u2fc861b8i74c7c3489e26b0e8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: cd6e2c1f-caa3-47ca-9e74-606eb55065db X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A827A3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:29:11 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri, 12 Jan 2007, Alexandria Doyle wrote: > German Ladies were wearing them in the 16th century. Not neccessarily the > beginning, but a point to start from. They're in the Luttrell Psalter, early 1300s. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 12 19:59:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0xL0h014803 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:59:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0D0wUBQ030890 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:59:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0D0w9Lb035594 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:58:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0w7DK049957; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:58:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mf3k.socket.net [216.106.88.98]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0D0w4KB049902 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:58:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id EF0783D16E for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:58:03 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:58:13 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8e32dad1-307a-49e9-82b4-44e1058922a0 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A82EB6.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:59:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO the rectangular shape can be seen in the 1300s but when they added the waist tie I don't know. Some mid 1500s Germanic portraits look like they might have the waist tie. Sorry I have no specifics. De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Lauren Walker Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 5:58 PM To: h-costume h-costume Subject: [h-cost] Aprons Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know when women began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? Too many of my history-of-costume books are in storage right now and I just can't seem to recall when they start showing up in the art. Does anyone have this info easily at hand? Thanks! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 06:28:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DBSH7w013951 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:28:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DBRPnV021770 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:28:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DAZvg4097275 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:35:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DAZigY018226; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:35:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DAZdFx018178 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:35:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A45523DE03B0; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:28:37 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 02:35:35 -0800 Message-ID: <000901c736fe$8f252dc0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1d096427-6832-4f6c-9d09-197d3512340d X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A8C21D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:28:16 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A friend of mine has a lovely poster of a girl (1700's)wearing an apron, with the top rectangle pinned on. Don't know about the bottom part. Sharon -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Lauren Walker Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 3:58 PM To: h-costume h-costume Subject: [h-cost] Aprons Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know when women began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? Too many of my history-of-costume books are in storage right now and I just can't seem to recall when they start showing up in the art. Does anyone have this info easily at hand? Thanks! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 07:17:42 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DCHgAU023646 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:17:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DCGpXF014029 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:17:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DAlBPL098251 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:47:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DAlAPm025609; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:47:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d21.mx.aol.com (imo-d21.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DAl6ix025492 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:47:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-d21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c7f.4b05954 (40521) for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:46:57 -0500 (EST) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:46:55 EST Subject: RE: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5017 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a4623220-b66e-4404-8c19-df33a2ffa22b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A8CDB3.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:17:40 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Check out bridal fabrics. They aren't all white and ivory these days, and some of the patterns are surprizingly historical (in look anyway). Plus, bridal no longer means just expensive silk :o) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 08:00:31 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DD0Rh9024390 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 08:00:31 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DCxath029501 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 08:00:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DCxKsq012515 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:59:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DCxJIa020676; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:59:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DCxCxR020549 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:59:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.47]) by mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 13 Jan 2007 12:59:06 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAACZmqEXUSnIvk2dsb2JhbACNPQEBAgcOBwYd Received: from 88-107-104-136.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.104.136]:1715 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1H5iTN-0006aQ-EX for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:59:01 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070113125700.03565f30@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:58:07 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] URL Repost - Re: French Farthingale construction tips? In-Reply-To: <000901c7370f$7a834990$06e73f50@CPQ21932199711> References: <007a01c7358a$cbc1e770$d614a150@CPQ21932199711> <000901c7370f$7a834990$06e73f50@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ac4a0405-aa67-4c5a-8bf8-89d322cea40b X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A8D7B8.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 08:00:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 12:36 13/01/2007, you wrote: >Dear Saragrace, >These were much better. Thankyou for showing. >Boy this is an interresting thing to make. Are you planning on >making as much decoration on the stomacher as the portrait, what is >it going to be made from? >For the cuff laces, how about considering to purchase some of the >lace Ninya Michaela has on her website? They had a lace manufacturer >make a reproduktion renaissance lace. I baught and have 10 meters of >it, for a dress i maybe wil make in the future. Its a nice lace, but >even it looks real, the weight of it is two heavy. But you cant get >it all these days............. > >Bjarne Ninya no longer has any of this lace for sale, but is considering ordering more. Details on her web site. http://www.ninyamikhaila.com/ Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 08:37:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DDbXn2025328 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 08:37:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DDaf7i020098 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 08:37:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DDaBUM016418 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:36:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DDa3Jm046406; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:36:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com (ug-out-1314.google.com [66.249.92.175]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DDa1eV046370 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:36:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mylaar@gmail.com) Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id k40so1029348ugc for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:36:01 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=J9fIjW6e7PSP7hVZCGm8eAvXbXi9hkEqzsiq3bz3Bl3cJFyX7R+jOh6fFFfNF49qcdULLQhObjLdxPxYfeNzQOeAowrL5Kmb1hkZoHpipCUiC2DaCP4aWtY3sIHMNWdQVBmrU/JtlWb1MiEA098058l5esYp4QFw369fkJ04Ee8= Received: by 10.67.22.2 with SMTP id z2mr2426102ugi.1168695360669; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:36:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.67.26.20 with HTTP; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:36:00 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1e6527830701130536r48f14397vd51e4eecd56c93f4@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:36:00 -0600 From: "jordana robinson" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons In-Reply-To: <000901c736fe$8f252dc0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> <000901c736fe$8f252dc0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d99746c2-515a-41c4-91d1-438810a5cd78 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A8E06A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 08:37:31 -0500 (EST) Status: RO is it this? "the chocolate girl" by liotard, circa 1743: http://artchive.com/artchive/L/liotard/chocolate_girl.jpg.html i'm always tempted to recreate that ensemble for halloween or the renaissance fair (i know it's like 100 years out of period, but i don't work there or anything. and i think it would be funny if someone recognized it). On 1/13/07, Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > A friend of mine has a lovely poster of a girl (1700's)wearing an apron, > with the top rectangle pinned on. Don't know about the bottom part. > Sharon _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 09:06:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DE6gIT026318 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:06:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DE5vW7006665 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:06:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DCaUHe010255 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:36:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DCaR3W004772; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:36:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep33.mail.dk (fep33.mail.dk [80.160.76.197]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DCaNU4004653 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:36:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep43.mail.dk ([195.41.46.226]) by fep33.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070113123616.BNEZ9203.fep33.mail.dk@fep43.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:36:16 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.63.231.6]) by fep43.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070113123615.EQSO21862.fep43.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:36:15 +0100 Message-ID: <000901c7370f$7a834990$06e73f50@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <007a01c7358a$cbc1e770$d614a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] URL Repost - Re: French Farthingale construction tips? Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:36:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep43.mail.dk from [80.63.231.6] at Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:36:14 +0100 X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3bba0d87-1cd1-47a1-bc99-677c34d7bb40 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A8E745.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:06:41 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Saragrace, These were much better. Thankyou for showing. Boy this is an interresting thing to make. Are you planning on making as much decoration on the stomacher as the portrait, what is it going to be made from? For the cuff laces, how about considering to purchase some of the lace Ninya Michaela has on her website? They had a lace manufacturer make a reproduktion renaissance lace. I baught and have 10 meters of it, for a dress i maybe wil make in the future. Its a nice lace, but even it looks real, the weight of it is two heavy. But you cant get it all these days............. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "h-costume" Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 3:55 PM Subject: [h-cost] URL Repost - Re: French Farthingale construction tips? > Bjarne, try these. I have changed my settings to text only. Hopefully > they will come across better. > > http://tinyurl.com/y6phle > http://saragrace.us/html/A1_GoldenAgeDressDiary_PAMPics.html > > Saragrace > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 7:14 AM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] French Farthingale construction tips? > > >> Dear Saragrace, >> Your link didnt work for me, is there a chance you could post it again? >> > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 09:22:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DEM8lZ026895 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:22:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DELMZY018711 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:22:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DEKvcj021402 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:20:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DEKuJg077786; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:20:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail8.tpgi.com.au (mail8.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DC5H0N082682 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:05:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed Received: from user4712b7d135 (220-245-217-88-act-pppoe.tpgi.com.au [220.245.217.88]) by mail8.tpgi.com.au (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0DC5FLN015382 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 23:05:16 +1100 Message-ID: <001f01c7370b$160d8060$58d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 23:05:14 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b6962d4a-c0f2-4306-bcd1-f41822c126ea X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A8EAE3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:22:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lauren Walker" To: "h-costume h-costume" Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 10:58 AM Subject: [h-cost] Aprons > Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know when women > began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? Too many > of my history-of-costume books are in storage right now and I just can't > seem to recall when they start showing up in the art. Does anyone have > this info easily at hand? > Thanks! > Lauren > Lauren M. Walker > lauren.walker@comcast.net > This page has a list of medieval and renaissance artworks with aprons http://www.larsdatter.com/aprons.htm the earliest seems to be the Luttrell Psalter like Robin said. HTH Elizabeth -------------------------------------------- Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 09:22:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DEMNIW026906 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:22:23 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DELX9X009009 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:22:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DELAMf021455 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:21:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DEL8Y9077980; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:21:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DCTPNW099376 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 05:29:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep42.mail.dk ([195.41.46.225]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070113122919.YQP9879.fep34.mail.dk@fep42.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:29:19 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.63.231.6]) by fep42.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070113122919.QSKX18380.fep42.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:29:19 +0100 Message-ID: <000401c7370e$7f9faff0$06e73f50@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:29:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep42.mail.dk from [80.63.231.6] at Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:29:14 +0100 X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 38e13ae7-4262-4177-906a-df42227119c8 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A8EAED.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:22:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Another fabric wich isnt that difficult to work with would be Moiré Antique, its usually made of polyester these days, comes in many yummy shades. In one of my catalogues there is a darkblue robe francaise in watered silk, very nice and it would also have the right thickness and stiffnes for this kind of robe. But actually the cotton version i suggested you, looks very nice also. Its an italian robe, used for summer wear. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 11:46 AM Subject: RE: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise > > > > Check out bridal fabrics. > > They aren't all white and ivory these days, and some of the patterns are > surprizingly historical (in look anyway). > > Plus, bridal no longer means just expensive silk :o) > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 11:04:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DG4MLj031046 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:04:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DG3VEe018302 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:04:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DEKJAC021278 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:20:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DEKD9V077147; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 07:20:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DAWnSp016286 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 03:32:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3AB1E0904E6; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:25:47 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 02:32:44 -0800 Message-ID: <000601c736fe$297c8d10$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0DAWnSp016286 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3326483b-7c02-49ba-820f-963798e32793 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A902D3.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:04:20 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Don't know if you are near San Jose, CA, but Fabrics R Us is very low priced, for silks, brocades, fancies. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of AlbertCat@aol.com Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 3:25 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric for robe a la francaise They make some very lovely synthetic taffetas. Try to get one that's not so heavy. Now having said that, I do like some of the oriental satin brocades you find at Jo Ann's.... if you can find one that isn't dragons or bamboo. I've found some with a butter yellow background covered with little multicolor flowers. Also one in coffee with black flowers evenly spread across it. Also a cream one with chrysanthemums. These can be a little heavy but they look very rich. Polyester is not a dreadful as it used to be. Sometimes it looks exactly like silk, though never feels like it. Also chintz...striped or floral....can be perfect. Check the drapery department, but make a huge effort to choose something that doesn't look like curtains [even though many real gowns do]. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 12:11:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DHBQin001174 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:11:30 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DHAeoL019846 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:11:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DHA2mq040926 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:10:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DH9vGQ014921; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:09:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s32.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s32.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.168]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DH9rt0014757 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:09:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.13]) by bay0-omc2-s32.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:09:48 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:09:47 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV3.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:09:43 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: <007a01c7358a$cbc1e770$d614a150@CPQ21932199711> <000901c7370f$7a834990$06e73f50@CPQ21932199711> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:09:53 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:09:53 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Jan 2007 17:09:47.0854 (UTC) FILETIME=[A1134EE0:01C73735] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 17th century Dutch reproduction - was URL Repost X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9b87d417-fae3-4fd1-82eb-a6ccaa6d9a0a X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A91290.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:11:24 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I have looked everywhere for fabric for the bodice - New York, Canada....there really was nothing similar to the black on "rust" embroidery. I have found someone local, new to reproduction costume, who is interested in taking a stab at digitizing the embroidery. I have silk taffeta in approximately the same color for the base fabric. I do intend to do the oak leaf shapes if she can reproduce the embroidery to my satisfaction. She has already reproduced the little scrolly ribbon on the sleeves very well. If that doesn't work, I have purchased enough some silk damask which, while beautiful, is really nothing like the original. As to the lace, I don't think we can afford the handmade lace...pretty limited budget. But I think I can find some stuff which will be adequate. The woman who may be doing the embroidery is also interested in digitizing the lace...I don't know if that will work. She has done some reproduction 16th century lace, but that was in squares..I didn't really care for it. Hopefully I will be able to post what I have done so far...I have the corset completed.., started on the ruff, and have also started to work on the headdress, .now on to the bum-roll! Sg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 5:36 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] URL Repost - Re: French Farthingale construction tips? > Dear Saragrace, > These were much better. Thankyou for showing. > Boy this is an interresting thing to make. Are you planning on making as > much decoration on the stomacher as the portrait, what is it going to be > made from? > For the cuff laces, how about considering to purchase some of the lace > Ninya > Michaela has on her website? They had a lace manufacturer make a > reproduktion renaissance lace. I baught and have 10 meters of it, for a > dress i maybe wil make in the future. Its a nice lace, but even it looks > real, the weight of it is two heavy. But you cant get it all these > days............. > > Bjarne > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 15:52:32 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKqWbg011039 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:52:32 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DKpffb017240 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:52:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DKou6j069695 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:50:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKop7D094372; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:50:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKom2S094332 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:50:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 1410E38B70 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 14:50:48 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 14:51:00 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <001f01c7370b$160d8060$58d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4015e0ff-4dad-4d4d-883f-997344d56c86 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A9465D.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:52:30 -0500 (EST) Status: RO And the Manesse Codex but men. 1340 http://www.tempora-nostra.de/tempora-nostra/manesse.php?id=203&tfl=124 But not the waist tie ones. De -----Original Message----- > Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know when women > began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? Too many > of my history-of-costume books are in storage right now and I just can't > seem to recall when they start showing up in the art. Does anyone have > this info easily at hand? > Thanks! > Lauren > Lauren M. Walker > lauren.walker@comcast.net > This page has a list of medieval and renaissance artworks with aprons http://www.larsdatter.com/aprons.htm the earliest seems to be the Luttrell Psalter like Robin said. HTH Elizabeth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 15:55:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKt44Q011207 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:55:04 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DKsDTi032686 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:55:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DKrwiM070054 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:53:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKrvod096674; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:53:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc12.comcast.net (alnrmhc12.comcast.net [204.127.225.92]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKrsIp096549 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:53:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc12) with SMTP id <20070113205348b1200jnesce>; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:53:48 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <1e6527830701130536r48f14397vd51e4eecd56c93f4@mail.gmail.com> References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> <000901c736fe$8f252dc0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> <1e6527830701130536r48f14397vd51e4eecd56c93f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-Id: <6AA92548-1489-4BBF-85F4-38CFE51C6CB8@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:53:43 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7878817b-5576-4292-ae03-39355da5bb31 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A946F5.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:55:02 -0500 (EST) Status: RO "The Chocolate Girl" is very popular with 18th century re-enactors, who love her jacket and, I think her cap. So if you wore the outfit around any 18th-C folk, they would definitely recognize the picture. Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 13, 2007, at 8:36 AM, jordana robinson wrote: > is it this? "the chocolate girl" by liotard, circa 1743: > http://artchive.com/artchive/L/liotard/chocolate_girl.jpg.html > > i'm always tempted to recreate that ensemble for halloween or the > renaissance fair (i know it's like 100 years out of period, but i > don't work there or anything. and i think it would be funny if > someone recognized it). > > On 1/13/07, Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: >> A friend of mine has a lovely poster of a girl (1700's)wearing an >> apron, >> with the top rectangle pinned on. Don't know about the bottom part. >> Sharon > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 15:57:32 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKvWL4011622 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:57:32 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DKulB2002388 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:57:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DKuQ0D070556 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:56:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKuPKq098723; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:56:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc14.comcast.net (alnrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.225.94]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKuL7j098604 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:56:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc14) with SMTP id <20070113205615b1400rp3gfe>; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:56:15 +0000 In-Reply-To: <001f01c7370b$160d8060$58d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> <001f01c7370b$160d8060$58d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Message-Id: <80FBE7E5-C444-4076-A187-54E9CA2A5F7D@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:56:10 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 230a355c-710b-4240-bb7c-968aa9d0a4d9 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A9478F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:57:30 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Elizabeth, Thank you very much for this link. The illustrations are particularly helpful. Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 13, 2007, at 7:05 AM, Elizabeth Walpole wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lauren Walker" > > To: "h-costume h-costume" > Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 10:58 AM > Subject: [h-cost] Aprons > > >> Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know >> when women began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist >> strings type? Too many of my history-of-costume books are in >> storage right now and I just can't seem to recall when they start >> showing up in the art. Does anyone have this info easily at hand? >> Thanks! >> Lauren >> Lauren M. Walker >> lauren.walker@comcast.net >> > This page has a list of medieval and renaissance artworks with > aprons http://www.larsdatter.com/aprons.htm the earliest seems to > be the Luttrell Psalter like Robin said. > HTH > Elizabeth > -------------------------------------------- > Elizabeth Walpole > Canberra Australia > ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au > http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 15:59:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKxhC6012034 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:59:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DKwrKv020232 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:59:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DKwa6A071067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:58:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKwZ4K000727; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:58:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc13.comcast.net (alnrmhc13.comcast.net [206.18.177.53]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DKwV6n000612 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:58:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc13) with SMTP id <20070113205826b1300333a4e>; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:58:26 +0000 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-Id: <73A90B35-AD70-43D2-9AA6-68ABE63164A8@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:58:21 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5a241273-6e18-4897-9189-024224cfc2ee X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A9480D.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:59:41 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thanks, De. This one is interesting, too. Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 13, 2007, at 3:51 PM, otsisto wrote: > And the Manesse Codex but men. > 1340 > http://www.tempora-nostra.de/tempora-nostra/manesse.php?id=203&tfl=124 > > But not the waist tie ones. > De > > > -----Original Message----- >> Well, here is an utterly flatfooted query from me: Do we know >> when women >> began wearing aprons of the rectangle with waist strings type? >> Too many >> of my history-of-costume books are in storage right now and I >> just can't >> seem to recall when they start showing up in the art. Does anyone >> have >> this info easily at hand? >> Thanks! >> Lauren >> Lauren M. Walker >> lauren.walker@comcast.net >> > This page has a list of medieval and renaissance artworks with aprons > http://www.larsdatter.com/aprons.htm the earliest seems to be the > Luttrell > Psalter like Robin said. > HTH > Elizabeth > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 17:27:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMRgSO014834 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:27:46 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DMQuUl014087 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:27:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DMQINu082457 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:26:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMQ8U1066134; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:26:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-61.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMQ3eG066039 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:26:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B497ABD53E for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:25:58 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:26:25 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Help me ID this mid-east/ asian garment X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 85ff4ff3-e38c-4266-a8df-b39950ed7604 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A95CB0.00C by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:27:40 -0500 (EST) Status: RO From the next Pirates movie: This is being described in the promo literature as "asian inspired". Anyone got a better idea what this embroidered coat is based on? That looks like an embroidered seam line at the back of her shoulder, and an underarm gusset. After that, I'm not sure. http://www.slashfilm.com/images/articles/20070111pirates3photos_5.jpg And I predict a resurgence of shoulder pads and leather bracelets at renfest this year. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 17:37:55 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMboqK015119 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:37:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DMau6F021471 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:37:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DMadT6083803 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:36:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMacp6073776; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:36:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMaZaC073725 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:36:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD4C2A8902D6; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 22:29:32 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 14:36:30 -0800 Message-ID: <001501c73763$4592b140$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: <1e6527830701130536r48f14397vd51e4eecd56c93f4@mail.gmail.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f647e984-6bbf-4cf9-b1fd-c3e00e635767 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A95F08.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:37:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Lovely, but, no. I found the image. If you go to www.allposters.com and put in "young girl with racket and shuttlecock", you will see it. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of jordana robinson Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 5:36 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons is it this? "the chocolate girl" by liotard, circa 1743: http://artchive.com/artchive/L/liotard/chocolate_girl.jpg.html i'm always tempted to recreate that ensemble for halloween or the renaissance fair (i know it's like 100 years out of period, but i don't work there or anything. and i think it would be funny if someone recognized it). On 1/13/07, Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > A friend of mine has a lovely poster of a girl (1700's)wearing an apron, > with the top rectangle pinned on. Don't know about the bottom part. > Sharon _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 17:39:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMdT70015149 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:39:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DMccLR016654 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:39:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DMcLq3084016 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:38:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMcIsh074982; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:38:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMcEq2074919 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:38:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ADAF2A9E02D6; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 22:31:11 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] 17th century Dutch reproduction - was URL Repost Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 14:38:09 -0800 Message-ID: <001601c73763$808c0b20$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0DMcEq2074919 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d89b0778-fa7d-4ad2-b619-0da454a151d9 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A95F6E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:39:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I know there are embroidery machines out there that allow you to "draw" with a stylus onto their screen, for a custom design. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Saragrace Knauf Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 9:10 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] 17th century Dutch reproduction - was URL Repost I have looked everywhere for fabric for the bodice - New York, Canada....there really was nothing similar to the black on "rust" embroidery. I have found someone local, new to reproduction costume, who is interested in taking a stab at digitizing the embroidery. I have silk taffeta in approximately the same color for the base fabric. I do intend to do the oak leaf shapes if she can reproduce the embroidery to my satisfaction. She has already reproduced the little scrolly ribbon on the sleeves very well. If that doesn't work, I have purchased enough some silk damask which, while beautiful, is really nothing like the original. As to the lace, I don't think we can afford the handmade lace...pretty limited budget. But I think I can find some stuff which will be adequate. The woman who may be doing the embroidery is also interested in digitizing the lace...I don't know if that will work. She has done some reproduction 16th century lace, but that was in squares..I didn't really care for it. Hopefully I will be able to post what I have done so far...I have the corset completed.., started on the ruff, and have also started to work on the headdress, .now on to the bum-roll! Sg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 5:36 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] URL Repost - Re: French Farthingale construction tips? > Dear Saragrace, > These were much better. Thankyou for showing. > Boy this is an interresting thing to make. Are you planning on making as > much decoration on the stomacher as the portrait, what is it going to be > made from? > For the cuff laces, how about considering to purchase some of the lace > Ninya > Michaela has on her website? They had a lace manufacturer make a > reproduktion renaissance lace. I baught and have 10 meters of it, for a > dress i maybe wil make in the future. Its a nice lace, but even it looks > real, the weight of it is two heavy. But you cant get it all these > days............. > > Bjarne > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 17:50:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMoLuK015410 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:50:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DMnZgq015069 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:50:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DMn7k3085420 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:49:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMn5gx082707; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:49:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DMn1ML082660 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:49:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0DMrUKg024493 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:53:31 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help me ID this mid-east/ asian garment Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:57:20 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> In-Reply-To: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701131757.20958.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 53076f40-0378-4c1b-8672-fa33b9473013 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A961FF.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:50:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Saturday 13 January 2007 5:26 pm, Dawn wrote: > From the next Pirates movie: > > This is being described in the promo literature as "asian inspired". > Anyone got a better idea what this embroidered coat is based on? That > looks like an embroidered seam line at the back of her shoulder, and an > underarm gusset. After that, I'm not sure. > > http://www.slashfilm.com/images/articles/20070111pirates3photos_5.jpg It looks more Mughal to me than anything else. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 18:05:35 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DN5ZgL015774 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:05:35 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DN4ofJ008700 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:05:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DN4YfD087435 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:04:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DN4Vmq094257; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:04:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.prismnet.com (smtp.prismnet.com [209.198.128.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DN4R1b094137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:04:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from chiara.francesca@gmail.com) Received: from CHESLAPTOP (cpe-76-185-25-114.tx.res.rr.com [76.185.25.114]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp.prismnet.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0DN4Kl6070866 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:04:21 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from chiara.francesca@gmail.com) Message-ID: <05f501c73767$2a8d9730$070ba8c0@CHESLAPTOP> From: "Chiara Francesca" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help me ID this mid-east/ asian garment Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:03:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on smtp.prismnet.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 required=7.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.0 (2005-09-13) on smtp.prismnet.com X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 90c13b6a-6dc5-480b-8e10-9bc24e36b577 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A96592.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:05:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO http://i12.tinypic.com/2qn5jzt.jpg Another view of the same costume. It looks like something the Mongol soldiers would wear. The hat however looks to be from some other period ... Hollywood borrows from everywhere creatively at least. :) Chiara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 4:26 PM Subject: [h-cost] Help me ID this mid-east/ asian garment > From the next Pirates movie: > > This is being described in the promo literature as "asian inspired". > Anyone got a better idea what this embroidered coat is based on? That > looks like an embroidered seam line at the back of her shoulder, and an > underarm gusset. After that, I'm not sure. > > http://www.slashfilm.com/images/articles/20070111pirates3photos_5.jpg > > > And I predict a resurgence of shoulder pads and leather bracelets at > renfest this year. > > > Dawn > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 18:09:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DN9F5S015894 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:09:15 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DN8PgI011339 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:09:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DN82Lp088140 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:08:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DN81WG096981; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:08:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.netspace.net.au (mail-out5.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.92]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DN7wiA096931 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:08:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stilskin@netspace.net.au) Received: from localhost (webmail3.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.166]) by mail.netspace.net.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19E701700A0 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:07:56 +1100 (EST) Received: from 220-253-122-129.VIC.netspace.net.au (220-253-122-129.VIC.netspace.net.au [220.253.122.129]) by webmail.netspace.net.au (IMP) with HTTP for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:07:56 +1100 Message-ID: <1168729676.45a9664c8b061@webmail.netspace.net.au> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:07:56 +1100 From: stilskin@netspace.net.au To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> <1168646983.45a8234790cb0@webmail.netspace.net.au> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.1 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2ccecb3e-05ef-4f09-a618-e7f4212a82d7 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A96669.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:09:13 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Hmm, yes, but, WHEN were they four? ;-) > And could they tie the aprons themselves at that age? > Sorry; end-of-week silliness. I would still like to know, you know, > Who cares when they were four so long as they included chocolate in the cake icing, -C. ------------------------------------------------------------ This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 18:17:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DNH1wC016072 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:17:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0DNGGLj017443 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:16:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0DNFvJJ089450 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:15:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DNFtpw003213; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:15:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d21.mx.aol.com (imo-d21.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0DNFoXx003070 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 16:15:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Cheryldee@aol.com) Received: from Cheryldee@aol.com by imo-d21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d17.45c4b2c (39331) for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:15:36 -0500 (EST) From: Cheryldee@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:15:34 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5358 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] "Asian-inspired" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 17e92204-ddb9-4100-9da7-d665e5f0ba1c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A96840.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:16:59 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This is being described in the promo literature as "asian inspired". > Anyone got a better idea what this embroidered coat is based on? That > looks like an embroidered seam line at the back of her shoulder, and an > underarm gusset. After that, I'm not sure. Looks a lot like stuff from the area around the Caucusus or maybe Carpathian Mountains ie. Romania, Macedonia in terms of muliple buttons and embroidery. The hat looks definitely Mongolian or from that part of the world. Belt and collar also more Asian. My 2 cents. Cheryl Odom _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 20:02:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E12Ljf018749 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:02:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0E11XGp010242 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:02:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0E10oWm007044 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:00:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E10g3I082468; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:00:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2a.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E10d0C082422 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:00:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id F15123455D for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:00:38 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Help me ID this mid-east/ asian garment Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:00:53 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <05f501c73767$2a8d9730$070ba8c0@CHESLAPTOP> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fb8bbedd-34a6-42a0-b760-81a6a828b89e X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A980ED.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:02:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Khalkha man's winter cap http://www.skiouros.net/varia/ncmpr/ncmpr004.htm http://www.skiouros.net/varia/ncmpr/ncmpr006.htm tortsog http://www.skiouros.net/varia/ncmpr/ncmpr008.htm godon http://www.skiouros.net/varia/ncmpr/ncmpr012.htm As for the outfit, it seems to lean towards Mongolian closer to a Barga or Buryat(sp?) woman's winter outfit or a Bayad woman's outfit. But I have not seen any men's with the opening up the center but I am not an expert and so have not seen all garments pertaining to Mongolia. There may be some influence from Dynasty Warriors. http://www.yueying.net/dw/ -----Original Message----- http://i12.tinypic.com/2qn5jzt.jpg Another view of the same costume. It looks like something the Mongol soldiers would wear. The hat however looks to be from some other period ... Hollywood borrows from everywhere creatively at least. :) Chiara ----- Original Message ----- > From the next Pirates movie: > > This is being described in the promo literature as "asian inspired". > Anyone got a better idea what this embroidered coat is based on? That > looks like an embroidered seam line at the back of her shoulder, and an > underarm gusset. After that, I'm not sure. > > http://www.slashfilm.com/images/articles/20070111pirates3photos_5.jpg > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 20:03:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E13eAT018821 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:03:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0E12owr010905 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:03:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0E12RMj007235 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:02:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E12Q0B083578; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:02:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2a.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E10df3082425 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:00:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 66455345C2 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:00:39 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Aprons Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:00:53 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <73A90B35-AD70-43D2-9AA6-68ABE63164A8@comcast.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 946c2f80-3454-4aaa-9623-10b60db0bf71 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45A9813A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:03:39 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Found a retangle apron at the waist in a burgundian site but is did not have the waist band. De -----Original Message----- Thanks, De. This one is interesting, too. Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 20:50:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E1oX9Q020331 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:50:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0E1nm4J027355 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:50:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0E1nU9k012477 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:49:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E1nS0h013598; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:49:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net (tomts10.bellnexxia.net [209.226.175.54]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E1nONR013529 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:49:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from shaneandsheridan@sympatico.ca) Received: from smtp1.sympatico.ca ([209.226.175.203]) by tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.13 201-253-122-130-113-20050324) with SMTP id <20070114014923.WJLK17401.tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:49:23 -0500 X-Mailer: Openwave WebEngine, version 2.8.6.6 (webedge20-101-174-112-20020617)" From: Sheridan To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help me ID this mid-east/ asian garment Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:49:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20070114014923.WJLK17401.tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1af93601-5d87-4810-a525-426eedd5ab4c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A98C3C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:50:31 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Aha! A question I can answer! :0) The coat is not based on anything, it's a Turkish Ottoman style caftan probably bought from a Turkish import shop. I used to find these at garage sales and at second hand clothing stores quite often. I used to have a stunning blue and silver one just like in your picture - except that I outgrew it. *sigh* check here for some pictures (only a few are the coat style): http://www.artemisimports.com/caftans/ Sheridan P. > > From: Dawn > Date: 2007/01/13 Sat PM 05:26:25 EST > To: Historical Costume > Subject: [h-cost] Help me ID this mid-east/ asian garment > > From the next Pirates movie: > > This is being described in the promo literature as "asian inspired". > Anyone got a better idea what this embroidered coat is based on? That > looks like an embroidered seam line at the back of her shoulder, and an > underarm gusset. After that, I'm not sure. > > http://www.slashfilm.com/images/articles/20070111pirates3photos_5.jpg > > > And I predict a resurgence of shoulder pads and leather bracelets at > renfest this year. > > > Dawn > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 21:18:13 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E2I5pV021022 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:18:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0E2HJbf020268 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:18:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0E2GlYW015887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:16:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E2GhJZ031021; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:16:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail1.mx.voyager.net (mail1.mx.voyager.net [216.93.66.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E2Gd9m030962 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:16:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mdcarey@compuserve.com) Received: from mdcarey (d197.as0.cntn.oh.core.com [216.196.3.198]) by mail1.mx.voyager.net (8.13.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id l0E2Fuxt012082 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:16:38 -0500 (EST) From: mdcarey@compuserve.com To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:13:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <45A94B7C.4908.73075AB@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <200701060724.l067OZkt062285@net.indra.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (4.21c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Costume Con 25 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: caaa08fe-6056-4b1d-9ee3-bcde07d01f91 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45A992AF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:18:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I just dropped my reg in the mail. Hey Pierre, count me as going because of Robin! Not that I wouldn't have yearned over it, but the Netherton day is what tipped the balance. I'm even skipping Marcon to free up the vacation days! Mary Piero Carey "we don't have issues, we have subscriptions" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 21:29:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E2TLgU021313 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:29:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0E2SVt8018947 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:29:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0E2S9eR017068 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:28:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E2S8qf037837; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:28:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web81411.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81411.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.139]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l08GI8xJ079513 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 09:18:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ctrvlyfarm@sbcglobal.net) Received: (qmail 8901 invoked by uid 60001); 8 Jan 2007 16:18:03 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=dHcC7FaP33fIkIuRSV14RzHsmhZ1rM2u3bSpa7Nsv8npEeX0dPYvXl18GatFdgWo1rSCKpJlCxaFDLcq8ddG5Fe/9H3EGkMqCMRyJaanJ3n3w0kFfYqWsfUUSPzF4DVIFLdZ5fEIFP8uhMy5bTvA7sbt6oaTqksx2HSz7WygSP8= ; Message-ID: <20070108161803.8899.qmail@web81411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: ItaODnoVM1le_qOIK_8L.BQs47kF7THS42GH6oKJX4sXQ_G_s5TwicK5J4I0xrijYgtOv_186ADsdlfGvSR591RVCr7JGuQpbM1.aLtZWERo4tY90SXIE.cBo6Xtdm6Ki8Y8HhkxwXI- Received: from [68.250.179.38] by web81411.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 08:18:03 PST Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 08:18:03 -0800 (PST) From: REBECCA BURCH To: me MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:28:06 -0700 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Ansel in England X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-UUID: 9e167a2a-8674-4657-be2f-3026aa9e0b11 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45A9954F.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:29:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO He has arrived. Ansel's first blog posting from England can be read here. http://www.livejournal.com/users/me_actor_ug/ I apologize in advance for his pitiful attention to spelling and grammer. Rebecca Burch Center Valley Farm Duncan Falls, Ohio, USA The only twelve steps I'm interested in are the ones between the flat folds and the brocades. --Anonymous Costumer-- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 13 23:44:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E4iEXq024742 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 23:44:16 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0E4hNDH001787 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 23:44:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0E4geBG033797 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:42:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E4gaTG021503; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:42:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp4.mc.surewest.net (qsmtp.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.145]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0E4gWCe021470 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:42:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 31395 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2007 20:37:11 -0800 Received: by simscan 1.1.0 ppid: 31342, pid: 31365, t: 7.3651s scanners: regex: 1.1.0 attach: 1.1.0 clamav: 0.84/m:41/d:2382 spam: 3.0.3 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21.surewest.net) (64.30.124.102) by qsmtp4 with SMTP; 13 Jan 2007 20:37:04 -0800 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070113204013.024cdb08@surewest.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 20:42:05 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons In-Reply-To: <1e6527830701130536r48f14397vd51e4eecd56c93f4@mail.gmail.co m> References: <4870F120-92B9-4543-9B31-F9451BC9501E@comcast.net> <000901c736fe$8f252dc0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> <1e6527830701130536r48f14397vd51e4eecd56c93f4@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.3 (2005-04-27) on qsmtp4.surewest.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.3 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 10a17e07-b82c-4658-9f22-22b339b8b5e2 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45A9B4EB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 23:44:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 05:36 AM 1/13/2007, you wrote: >is it this? "the chocolate girl" by liotard, circa 1743: >http://artchive.com/artchive/L/liotard/chocolate_girl.jpg.html > >i'm always tempted to recreate that ensemble for halloween or the >renaissance fair (i know it's like 100 years out of period, but i >don't work there or anything. and i think it would be funny if >someone recognized it). > I notice that her apron strings seem to be long enough to cross in the back and come to the front to be tied. It's nice to see that the way I like to tie my apron at Sutter's Fort (c. 1846) has long historical roots. Joan Jurancich joanmj@surewest.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 11:37:13 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EGbDbr029013 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:37:13 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EGaKtW007218 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:37:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EGZfgq013358 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:35:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EGZVi0021257; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:35:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EGZRox021120 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:35:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CF7DBD72F for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:35:21 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45AA5BEB.1010100@reddawn.net> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:35:55 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help me ID this mid-east/ asian garment References: <20070114014923.WJLK17401.tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> In-Reply-To: <20070114014923.WJLK17401.tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 249a0169-6cc6-4783-9b26-ec5df6bee3b4 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45AA5C04.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:37:11 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sheridan wrote: > Aha! A question I can answer! :0) > > The coat is not based on anything, it's a Turkish Ottoman style caftan probably bought from a Turkish import shop. I used to find these at garage sales and at second hand clothing stores quite often. I used to have a stunning blue and silver one just like in your picture - except that I outgrew it. *sigh* > > check here for some pictures (only a few are the coat style): > > http://www.artemisimports.com/caftans/ > > Sheridan P. > Thanks! I was getting to that conclusion myself last night, having ruled out Mongolian or Chinese styles. The sleeves and buttons kept saying "turkish" to me, but I hadn't yet found a good source. The hat looks like some Tatar drawings in my Tilke book. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 11:56:00 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EGtxKx029580 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:55:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EGt86v032052 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:55:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EGsgMk016835 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:54:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EGsdML039123; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:54:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from omta14.mta.everyone.net (sitemail2.everyone.net [216.200.145.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EGrv0J038573 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:54:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lalahcatlady@netscape.com) Received: from dm23.mta.everyone.net (bigiplb-dsnat [172.16.0.19]) by omta14.mta.everyone.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27CF541B3B for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 08:53:57 -0800 (PST) X-Eon-Dm: dm23 Received: by resin10.mta.everyone.net (EON-PICKUP) id resin10.45a5b1eb.e397; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 08:53:56 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message-Id: <20070114085356.F3FA838@resin10.mta.everyone.net> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 08:53:56 -0800 From: " Lalah" To: "Historical Costume" X-Eon-Sig: AQI79nRFqmAkYimHIAEAAAAB,131f6c3e953c2ec4e3baec37a28f47b2 X-Originating-Ip: [205.188.117.9] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] American Civil War X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e087ef8e-b348-4b2d-a0ed-58c991c81ebf X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AA606C.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:55:58 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I am making garb for a Civil War enactor's girl friend and his mother is driving me crazy. She has some really weird ideas and since she has been playing with this group for a number of years, I just shut up and do what she wants. However, I made the mistake of putting Fray Check on the buttonhole marks on a blouse and it spread out and it shows badly. Having tried everything I can think of to remove it, I am ready to take the blouse apart and make a new left front. Then it occurred to me that it would be easy to use the left side for buttons and put the buttonholes on the right. My friend went crazy saying they never had the buttonholes on the right. I am so sick of the whole thing that I don't want to do any more research. Does anyone know if the buttonholes HAD to be on the left on women's blouses during the Civil War period? Also what kind of hat would be appropriate? I am not going to make her a fez! Thanks for the help Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _____________________________________________________________ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 11:58:27 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EGwMcU029653 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:58:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EGvZbt029699 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:58:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EGvAhN017411 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:57:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EGvAFA041852; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:57:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0E4tEug028852 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:55:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=radiks.net; b=L/08JZs6GeeSuoU96Cz0Pv3FoQpfcCITbtFvywVSOT6o95L0EppGMiK6MOJw+mlN; h=Received:Message-Id:X-Mailer:Date:To:From:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.81.2.235] (helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H5xOk-0000VZ-71 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 23:55:14 -0500 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20070113224314.03d2ce30@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 22:45:30 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200701140217.l0E2GpMT031112@net.indra.com> References: <200701140217.l0E2GpMT031112@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e5334545a5d4a25b07e8cfd87802764e885669f570808e4e4ad350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.81.2.235 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume-Con 25 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c72d6266-5ba7-4012-a8fb-012bebe75cde X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AA60FF.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:58:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Mary, We'll be very happy to see you at Costume-Con. It's unfortunate, though, that you're skipping Marcon to get more vacation, as we are the Costuming guests this year at Marcon. But we'd rather see you at Costume-Con! Pierre (and Sandy) At 08:17 PM 1/13/2007, you wrote: >Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 21:13:32 -0500 >From: mdcarey@compuserve.com >Subject: [h-cost] Costume Con 25 > >I just dropped my reg in the mail. Hey Pierre, count me as going >because of Robin! Not that I wouldn't have yearned over it, but the >Netherton day is what tipped the balance. I'm even skipping Marcon >to free up the vacation days! > >Mary Piero Carey "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 12:23:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EHNQ5A030383 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:23:26 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EHMeYV027536 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:23:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EHLuTS024766 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:21:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EHLtTU067439; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:21:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EHLoMu067304 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:21:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:25:46 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C73801.06AD0DA7" Subject: RE: [h-cost] American Civil War Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:23:09 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC541@lynx.campus.muc.prv> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC541@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Thread-Topic: [h-cost] American Civil War Thread-Index: Acc3/V6E7lxWNf0jTmK6bJXVh5A2MwAA0rrs References: <20070114085356.F3FA838@resin10.mta.everyone.net> From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Jan 2007 17:25:46.0608 (UTC) FILETIME=[06F34F00:01C73801] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6b063f06-144e-43d9-9c46-44f91dd788d5 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45AA66E0.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:23:24 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C73801.06AD0DA7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Lucky you! I think fezzes are right out. I'm just starting to look into = this myself & would appreciate information, too. I've read that young = women wore hats but older women would wear bonnets & don't know what = constitutes the difference. Thanks for any light anyone can shed. =20 Patty ________________________________ From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com on behalf of Lalah Sent: Sun 1/14/2007 11:53 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] American Civil War I am making garb for a Civil War enactor's girl friend and his mother is = driving me crazy. She has some really weird ideas and since she has = been playing with this group for a number of years, I just shut up and = do what she wants. However, I made the mistake of putting Fray Check on = the buttonhole marks on a blouse and it spread out and it shows badly. = Having tried everything I can think of to remove it, I am ready to take = the blouse apart and make a new left front. Then it occurred to me that = it would be easy to use the left side for buttons and put the = buttonholes on the right. My friend went crazy saying they never had = the buttonholes on the right. I am so sick of the whole thing that I = don't want to do any more research. Does anyone know if the buttonholes = HAD to be on the left on women's blouses during the Civil War period? = Also what kind of hat would be appropriate? I am not going to make her = a fez! Thanks for the help Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _____________________________________________________________ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------_=_NextPart_001_01C73801.06AD0DA7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------_=_NextPart_001_01C73801.06AD0DA7-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 12:27:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EHR1MO030482 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:27:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EHQFAI029857 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:26:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EHPpGn026146 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:25:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EHPoTH071370; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:25:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpout.eastlink.ca (smtpout.eastlink.ca [24.222.0.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EHPkQr071207 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:25:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca) Received: from ip01.eastlink.ca ([24.222.10.5]) by mta01.eastlink.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-4.03 (built Sep 22 2005)) with ESMTP id <0JBV006N5CCOVA20@mta01.eastlink.ca> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:24:24 -0400 (AST) Received: from blk-137-68-3.eastlink.ca (HELO THIRDFLOOR) ([24.137.68.3]) by ip01.eastlink.ca with ESMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:25:27 -0400 Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:25:27 -0400 From: S Paterson Subject: [h-cost] American Civil War To: "'Historical Costume'" Message-id: <001301c73800$fbb81850$6501a8c0@THIRDFLOOR> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ao8CALn2qUUYiUQD/2dsb2JhbAA X-IronPort-AV: i="4.13,186,1167624000"; d="scan'208"; a="79995130:sNHT163121985" X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 23fa00dc-f052-46bd-8e32-1245c312bf0a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AA67B7.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:26:59 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Lalah - victory may be yours I happen to have a copy of Juanita Leisch's 'Who Wore What?' 1861-1865 - (not my period at all but I helped her with a fashion show at Colonial Williamsburg and it was a kind gift) I looked in it for pictures of ladies WITH men and in several photographs I see right-over-left buttoning for women while the men's wear is still left-over-right. Note that: there are an equal number of photographs with the women's wear buttoning left over-right as well, so this could be a transition time Hope this helps Sarah Paterson -----Original Message----- I am making garb for a Civil War enactor's girl friend and his mother is driving me crazy. She has some really weird ideas and since she has been playing with this group for a number of years, I just shut up and do what she wants. However, I made the mistake of putting Fray Check on the buttonhole marks on a blouse and it spread out and it shows badly. Having tried everything I can think of to remove it, I am ready to take the blouse apart and make a new left front. Then it occurred to me that it would be easy to use the left side for buttons and put the buttonholes on the right. My friend went crazy saying they never had the buttonholes on the right. I am so sick of the whole thing that I don't want to do any more research. Does anyone know if the buttonholes HAD to be on the left on women's blouses during the Civil War period? Also what kind of hat would be appropriate? I am not going to make her a fez! Thanks for the help Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 13:02:00 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EI1uwS031377 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:02:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EI14Hv013932 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:01:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EI0QwO037221 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:00:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EI0OS8005166; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:00:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from omta14.mta.everyone.net (sitemail2.everyone.net [216.200.145.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EI0LeP005113 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:00:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lalahcatlady@netscape.com) Received: from dm25.mta.everyone.net (bigiplb-dsnat [172.16.0.19]) by omta14.mta.everyone.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED08A41AA3 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:00:20 -0800 (PST) X-Eon-Dm: dm25 Received: by resin11.mta.everyone.net (EON-PICKUP) id resin11.45a5b214.6150; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:00:20 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message-Id: <20070114100020.F3EC8AC@resin11.mta.everyone.net> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 10:00:20 -0800 From: " Lalah" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] American Civil War X-Eon-Sig: AQI79nRFqm+0q1Sq1QEAAAAB,6d300fafa38df97209781fdd2274300f X-Originating-Ip: [152.163.100.70] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d4456fc6-a249-4251-8a97-461b684ac508 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AA6FE0.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:01:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO THANK YOU! I was sure I had read that somewhere, but couldn't come up with a reference to suit my friend. If the local group has to have their button holes on the left, fine, but it isn't necessary for authenticity. And I simply don't have time to hand sew miles of loopy braid on the skirt and remake the blouse. Don't you love people who come up with complicated designs two weeks before an event? And that's two gowns, not just one. Thanks for the help. Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender --- sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca wrote: From: S Paterson To: "'Historical Costume'" Cc: Subject: [h-cost] American Civil War Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:25:27 -0400 Lalah - victory may be yours I happen to have a copy of Juanita Leisch's 'Who Wore What?' 1861-1865 - (not my period at all but I helped her with a fashion show at Colonial Williamsburg and it was a kind gift) I looked in it for pictures of ladies WITH men and in several photographs I see right-over-left buttoning for women while the men's wear is still left-over-right. Note that: there are an equal number of photographs with the women's wear buttoning left over-right as well, so this could be a transition time Hope this helps Sarah Paterson -----Original Message----- I am making garb for a Civil War enactor's girl friend and his mother is driving me crazy. She has some really weird ideas and since she has been playing with this group for a number of years, I just shut up and do what she wants. However, I made the mistake of putting Fray Check on the buttonhole marks on a blouse and it spread out and it shows badly. Having tried everything I can think of to remove it, I am ready to take the blouse apart and make a new left front. Then it occurred to me that it would be easy to use the left side for buttons and put the buttonholes on the right. My friend went crazy saying they never had the buttonholes on the right. I am so sick of the whole thing that I don't want to do any more research. Does anyone know if the buttonholes HAD to be on the left on women's blouses during the Civil War period? Also what kind of hat would be appropriate? I am not going to make her a fez! Thanks for the help Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _____________________________________________________________ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 13:44:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EIiewP032397 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:44:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EIhoqC004760 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:44:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EIhPbd045088 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:43:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EIhN2J045120; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:43:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpout.eastlink.ca (smtpout.eastlink.ca [24.222.0.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EIhK50045023 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:43:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca) Received: from ip04.eastlink.ca ([24.222.10.20]) by mta01.eastlink.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-4.03 (built Sep 22 2005)) with ESMTP id <0JBV001P3FA8O9F0@mta01.eastlink.ca> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:27:44 -0400 (AST) Received: from blk-137-68-3.eastlink.ca (HELO THIRDFLOOR) ([24.137.68.3]) by ip04.eastlink.ca with ESMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:28:48 -0400 Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:28:48 -0400 From: S Paterson Subject: [h-cost] American Civil War To: "'Historical Costume'" Message-id: <000501c73809$d51b0f50$6501a8c0@THIRDFLOOR> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ao8CAMIEqkUYiUQD/2dsb2JhbAA X-IronPort-AV: i="4.13,186,1167624000"; d="scan'208"; a="81932639:sNHT36168777" X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 34808fc6-0362-4d95-be1a-5485fe8c9af9 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AA79E6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:44:39 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I can scan pics and send if she needs visual proof - but if she is "all that" which she says she is - she likely has a copy of this book as it is a great visual survey of that time, regardless if you agree with the author on construction or not. Sarah -----Original Message----- THANK YOU! I was sure I had read that somewhere, but couldn't come up with a reference to suit my friend. If the local group has to have their button holes on the left, fine, but it isn't necessary for authenticity. And I simply don't have time to hand sew miles of loopy braid on the skirt and remake the blouse. Don't you love people who come up with complicated designs two weeks before an event? And that's two gowns, not just one. Thanks for the help. Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 14:05:48 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJ5iK7000447 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:05:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EJ4wdr020106 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:05:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EJ4FKF049003 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:04:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJ4CPB065176; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:04:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc14.comcast.net (alnrmhc14.comcast.net [206.18.177.54]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJ49A4065053 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:04:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc14) with SMTP id <20070114190404b1400rq2i6e>; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:04:04 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <20070114100020.F3EC8AC@resin11.mta.everyone.net> References: <20070114100020.F3EC8AC@resin11.mta.everyone.net> Message-Id: From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] American Civil War Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:04:02 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5b884abd-f3cd-4278-8d09-3d5456dbf652 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AA7EDA.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:05:42 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 14, 2007, at 1:00 PM, Lalah wrote: > Don't you love people who come up with complicated designs two > weeks before an event? And that's two gowns, not just one. Thanks > for the help. Oh well, you know, they needed all your lead time to come up with a suitably frustrating complicated design! ;-) Lauren Lauren Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 14:13:35 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJDZBE000619 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:13:35 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EJCoQU030499 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:13:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EJCWwC050624 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:12:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJCVpx073651; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:12:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m17.mx.aol.com (imo-m17.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJCRZp073514 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:12:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-m17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.3ac.bac7f55 (57293) for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:12:18 -0500 (EST) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: <3ac.bac7f55.32dbda90@aol.com> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:12:16 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5017 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: american civil war X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b7ad3d4c-42ce-4caa-9eb4-a62314040738 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AA80B2.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:13:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO answer is it depends - for middle and upper classes the modern rules apply (ie different for men and women). for lower classes it's possible that they may have carried on the older tradition of switching sides to increase the life of the garment - generally though I'd stick to the rule if it were me. that said, depending on the role of the person you're making it for, and the style, but it wasn't unheard of for women to wear men's clothing, too. I never rely on photos for this kind of thing as it's so easy for a picture to get reversed when printed, and modern photo editiors don't necessarily realise the importance. it was equally as possible for a photographer at the time to have reversed the image by mistake (ie too many variables). In a message dated 14/01/2007 19:01:47 GMT Standard Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: Lalah - victory may be yours I happen to have a copy of Juanita Leisch's 'Who Wore What?' 1861-1865 - (not my period at all but I helped her with a fashion show at Colonial Williamsburg and it was a kind gift) I looked in it for pictures of ladies WITH men and in several photographs I see right-over-left buttoning for women while the men's wear is still left-over-right. Note that: there are an equal number of photographs with the women's wear buttoning left over-right as well, so this could be a transition time Hope this helps Sarah Paterson _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 14:27:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJRG5V000931 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:27:16 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EJQP6H015191 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:27:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EJPmFE053043 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:25:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJPjLR086316; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:25:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.191]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJPgMD086251 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:25:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynndownward@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so1945547nfe for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:25:41 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=GyyYnLicK90ZaOjtFHBfa9r+jbmLKf9sRwzSR+V2KN0O2eRmAKapJSb9Le+s5YbkV15X0WFtlJQLAGb+jIa5fNAuIX6VXKhAXF7Ud6rrrgFSHGeeA1mDxlIBc8Bvmm+hpZibBNe240KpWPKHjTEmRkwWQJ1o8YmlSgxmvUqwBLI= Received: by 10.49.107.8 with SMTP id j8mr3250518nfm.1168802739628; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:25:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.49.60.16 with HTTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:25:39 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <8296995c0701141125v7276157ax1ab47db24d687a36@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:25:39 -0800 From: "Lynn Downward" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] American Civil War In-Reply-To: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC541@lynx.campus.muc.prv> MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20070114085356.F3FA838@resin10.mta.everyone.net> <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC541@lynx.campus.muc.prv> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e2da591d-2355-4b2d-80a9-acb2cef4b1f5 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AA83E2.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:27:14 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A fez? Where's the logic in that? My understanding is that this is a transitional time for headwear for women as well as for where the buttonholes go. Older women tent to stick with the styles they know from their youth (I bet your mom is wearing the hairdo she wore in the 1960s, just like my mom), so they would most likely wear bonnets. The younger women are seeing that hats are more fashionable than bonnets - and more flattering - and that's what they're wearing. That's not to say that a very fashionable older woman wouldn't wear a hat if it was stylish and flattering, but most older women would have stuck with their bonnets until they couldn't retrim them one more time and then maybe replace it with a hat. And very little girls wore bonnets until they got to about 8-10. LynnD On 1/14/07, Rickard, Patty wrote: > > Lucky you! I think fezzes are right out. I'm just starting to look into > this myself & would appreciate information, too. I've read that young women > wore hats but older women would wear bonnets & don't know what constitutes > the difference. Thanks for any light anyone can shed. > > Patty > > ________________________________ > > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com on behalf of Lalah > Sent: Sun 1/14/2007 11:53 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: [h-cost] American Civil War > > > > I am making garb for a Civil War enactor's girl friend and his mother is > driving me crazy. She has some really weird ideas and since she has been > playing with this group for a number of years, I just shut up and do what > she wants. However, I made the mistake of putting Fray Check on the > buttonhole marks on a blouse and it spread out and it shows badly. Having > tried everything I can think of to remove it, I am ready to take the blouse > apart and make a new left front. Then it occurred to me that it would be > easy to use the left side for buttons and put the buttonholes on the > right. My friend went crazy saying they never had the buttonholes on the > right. I am so sick of the whole thing that I don't want to do any more > research. Does anyone know if the buttonholes HAD to be on the left on > women's blouses during the Civil War period? Also what kind of hat would be > appropriate? I am not going to make her a fez! Thanks for the help > > Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 14:48:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJmesD001468 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:48:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EJlmYh030309 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:48:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EJlL9B057103 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:47:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJlJsY007604; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:47:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.191]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJlGl1007559 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:47:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynndownward@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so1949540nfe for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:47:16 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=papOaqPjg4L5Mg5PfLNgJbdSz2LcR3vmGtEHSKYU9jzcYl9IBol33a4mDR4CWi2n0O6mC4raOS6v5H4io/ULPfH8pU8QZ3EvYUs7kP8hxREzKJCpbO7fQFylUiFvOUmylVd+x0xUKUtzl+xtS+McBYGIMd58t7Z32eBIo45NYxI= Received: by 10.48.4.17 with SMTP id 17mr3302949nfd.1168804029201; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:47:09 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.49.60.16 with HTTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:47:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <8296995c0701141147l6ceeac90q125b128cce606718@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:47:06 -0800 From: "Lynn Downward" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medici mystery revealed In-Reply-To: <000c01c72e69$ba7545c0$6501a8c0@VMAA1> MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <000c01c72e69$ba7545c0$6501a8c0@VMAA1> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 54b93c80-332e-4b0f-a296-0a5b7da22a81 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45AA88E4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:48:39 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I finally read the British Journam of Medicine this article was a report of. Very interesting. However, there are replies to this article on the BMJ website, discounting the science of this article. They claim that the chin hairs and soft tissue used for DNA comparison to the liver might not be Francesco's because when they exhumed him in Dec 2004 there was no soft tissue there. I haven't read all the replies - there were five I think and I don't have the time to read them all until Tuesday at the earliest - but we can't take this new info as gospel. LynnD who works with scientists and knows to check the original article and responses On 1/2/07, Linda Rice wrote: > > Interesting new discoveries about the Medici's: > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/italy/story/0,,1979151,00.html > > ::Linda:: > > (sorry, no relevant costume content, just kinda interesting story) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 14:58:31 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJwV6w001764 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:58:31 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EJvdTj014866 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:58:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EJpURg057970 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:51:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EJpRRQ011705; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:51:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.146.182.96]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0EJpOGs011578 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:51:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katherinejsanders@yahoo.co.uk) Received: (qmail 43330 invoked by uid 60001); 14 Jan 2007 19:51:18 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.co.uk; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Rc3MTKT6UYq2ISE2+XKTwiX7GmzpiRH6eoZfUKge5u/fuA96pVCWvvAPzljkQvY0mGbmpECVw64M+IHLAfR2yFZGZIgzSjzfnJP5SMucVYQZeKjfMB8BrH/4VhbL6fyU46tXIRPzeRdZTWFUgsH4UsQAUiKcUgE19Si4MjsZYWo= ; Message-ID: <20070114195118.43328.qmail@web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.155.204.82] by web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:51:18 GMT Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:51:18 +0000 (GMT) From: katherine sanders To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] re: fabric for robe a la francaise X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 364f3681-dd67-4d50-8774-8b58b8c0c814 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AA8B33.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:58:29 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0EJwV6w001764 Status: RO Many thanks for all the feedback on appropriate fabric: I will hunt out some nice cotton for my own personal use but for the show (eek) will probably get something a bit more flash. I am indeed a slave to the shiny (taffeta) stuff! I found this UK supplier and they have one or two options that I'd appreciate your views on, http://www.fabricland.co.uk/taffetas.htm specifically - the midnight "serpent" taffeta, the embroidered cream taffeta (with pale blue flowers) or, perhaps, the faux silk taffeta gold - or is that embroidery too reekingly modern? I'd like something that at least has a /feel/ of the period... http://snipurl.com/17ho1 in silver perhaps? http://snipurl.com/17hoa not very period in colour maybe but rather lush anyway - thank you again and perhaps I should just get on with it rather than stress about a fabric that I've not even bought yet! ;-) gratefully, Katherine "A positive attitude may not solve all of your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort" - Herm Albright ___________________________________________________________ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 15:02:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EK2nXA001895 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 15:02:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EK24xS017053 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 15:02:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EK1awH059753 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:01:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EK1YUe021647; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:01:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep35.mail.dk (fep35.mail.dk [80.160.76.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EK1T5W021483 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:01:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep41.mail.dk ([195.41.46.142]) by fep35.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070114200124.FKIO22803.fep35.mail.dk@fep41.mail.dk> for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:01:24 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.37]) by fep41.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070114200123.RMKQ20909.fep41.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:01:23 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c73816$d8ee4b80$2543a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20070114195118.43328.qmail@web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: fabric for robe a la francaise Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:01:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep41.mail.dk from [80.161.67.37] at Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:01:21 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9f8ab506-bcb2-402a-8ea0-166f7094c881 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AA8C3C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 15:02:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "katherine sanders" To: I found this UK supplier and they have one or two options that I'd appreciate your views on, http://www.fabricland.co.uk/taffetas.htm specifically - the midnight "serpent" taffeta, the embroidered cream taffeta (with pale blue flowers) or, perhaps, the faux silk taffeta gold - or is that embroidery too reekingly modern? I'd like something that at least has a /feel/ of the period... http://snipurl.com/17ho1 in silver perhaps? What is wrong with the red? Its lovely for a francaise dress! Well at least my 2cents. Bjarne http://snipurl.com/17hoa not very period in colour maybe but rather lush anyway - thank you again and perhaps I should just get on with it rather than stress about a fabric that I've not even bought yet! ;-) gratefully, Katherine "A positive attitude may not solve all of your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort" - Herm Albright ___________________________________________________________ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 16:06:15 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EL6684003655 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:06:11 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0EL5GfB002362 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:06:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0EL4VXd070906 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:04:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EL4Knr079651; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:04:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0EL4G0Z079573 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:04:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from webmail.patriot.net (vanburen.patriot.net [209.249.176.8]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3sarge3) with ESMTP id l0EL48XU008073 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:04:15 -0500 Received: from 72.13.239.193 (SquirrelMail authenticated user aquazoo) by webmail.patriot.net with HTTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:14:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <55404.72.13.239.193.1168809269.squirrel@webmail.patriot.net> In-Reply-To: <3ac.bac7f55.32dbda90@aol.com> References: <3ac.bac7f55.32dbda90@aol.com> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:14:29 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war photos From: aquazoo@patriot.net To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a8b9cb3a-521f-47e6-a635-6c28f4ca8e28 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45AA9B0C.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:06:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > I never rely on photos for this kind of thing as it's so easy for a > picture to get reversed when printed, and modern photo editiors > don't necessarily realise the importance. it was equally as possible > for a photographer at the time to have reversed the image by > mistake (ie too many variables). It's not a mistake. Some 19th century photographic images are not printed to paper; the final product is the photographic plate and it is reversed. This can be seen on some originals where the "US" on the belt buckle is backwards. So a book publisher needs to decide, print these images as they are, or "correct" them to be right reading? Sure, there are cases where anyone along the way can mess it up. Less so these days, when a page goes from computer file to printing plate without as many hands in between. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 16:20:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELKqTa004071 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:20:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ELK1ap022601 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:20:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ELJc4S074054 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:19:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELJb6p094287; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:19:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELJWo8094213 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:19:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=radiks.net; b=p4+y7cce1sZXEOgCQh3SFHz0JV9LS+gFnI9Aaq+Toqx3vsuvTVcjuvDjBDiGv6VC; h=Received:Message-Id:X-Mailer:Date:To:From:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.81.2.235] (helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H6ClI-0008EZ-1I for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:19:32 -0500 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20070114093653.04b6beb0@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 09:37:48 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200701140217.l0E2GpMT031112@net.indra.com> References: <200701140217.l0E2GpMT031112@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e5334545a5d4a25b07e002e27604571b7c5634206d86508d8fd350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.81.2.235 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3790539a-c5ae-4479-8aa9-2af2e1004312 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AA9E81.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:20:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 00:35:23 -0500 >From: "Caryn Sobel" >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: CostumeCon > >year; I hope to see them again--they're great!> > >Thanks, Ann. That's good news! > >My daughter's only "true" historical costume so far for CostumeCon is still >in the research phase--she saw the movie "Hero" and is trying to find what >era the costume might be from (not much from the Qin era so far), if it is >based on a real style. I thought that a wrap-type dress might be quicker to >do when she already has her hands full with the earlier ones, and will give >me something to do a little embroidery with. We'll see how that goes... > >Caryn Caryn, A few words of advice for your daughter. If she is intending to recreate the movie costume it wouldn't be eligible for the Historic Masquerade. The cut off date for historic costumes is: "costume based on clothing that was worn or could have been worn through December 31, 1982." (from the formal rules). It would, however, be completely appropriate for the F/SF masquerade on Saturday night. If, on the other hand, she is using the film for inspiration and wants to create a historically accurate costume from the Qin Dynasty (say what the character would have really worn in the Qin Dynasty) that would be completely appropriate for the Historic masquerade. If you have any questions let me know. You might also contact the Historic Masquerade director, Byron Connell, and ask him. He might over rule me. (I may be co-chair, but these decisions are ultimately the purview of the respective directors and their word is law on these matters.). He can be contacted at: bpconnell@verizon.net Hope this helps. We look forward to seeing your daughter on stage. Pierre P.S., if she's planning this for a Hall Costume, you can disregard all of the above. "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 16:23:46 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELNk4I004158 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:23:46 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ELN02m029555 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:23:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ELMVij074484 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:22:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELMU7O096861; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:22:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from vms042pub.verizon.net (vms042pub.verizon.net [206.46.252.42]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELL9o3095599 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:21:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from r.carnegie@verizon.net) Received: from owner85a4f9e93 ([71.253.224.90]) by vms042.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JBV00BHCNB77TU0@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 15:21:09 -0600 (CST) Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:21:06 -0500 From: "Ron Carnegie" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war photos To: "Historical Costume" Message-id: <00d001c73821$e75e6d70$8742fea9@owner85a4f9e93> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <3ac.bac7f55.32dbda90@aol.com> <55404.72.13.239.193.1168809269.squirrel@webmail.patriot.net> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: aaa69a87-4446-4ae3-8efb-82a5d0745dac X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AA9F34.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:23:44 -0500 (EST) Status: RO As a wetplate photagrapher I can confirm this. Any tintype or ambrotype will be reversed. A albumen print made from a glass should not be. Ron Carnegie ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2007 4:14 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war photos >> I never rely on photos for this kind of thing as it's so easy for a >> picture to get reversed when printed, and modern photo editiors >> don't necessarily realise the importance. it was equally as possible >> for a photographer at the time to have reversed the image by >> mistake (ie too many variables). > > It's not a mistake. Some 19th century photographic images are not > printed to paper; the final product is the photographic plate and it > is reversed. This can be seen on some originals where the "US" on > the belt buckle is backwards. > > So a book publisher needs to decide, print these images as they are, > or "correct" them to be right reading? > > Sure, there are cases where anyone along the way can mess it up. > Less so these days, when a page goes from computer file to printing > plate without as many hands in between. > > -Carol > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 16:26:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELQPqH004312 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:26:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ELPYnN029268 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:26:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ELP3j9075160 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:25:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELP1v8099486; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:25:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELNe2V098054 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:23:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from your1a4d29f243 (ool-45757a12.dyn.optonline.net [69.117.122.18]) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <0JBV004Q5NF7Q630@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:23:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:23:29 -0500 From: monica spence Subject: RE: [h-cost] Medici mystery revealed In-reply-to: <8296995c0701141147l6ceeac90q125b128cce606718@mail.gmail.com> To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2fdc2be6-0308-4bab-ba12-823ac7670bae X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AA9FCE.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:26:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I read that a couple of weeks ago. It is a fascinating discovery-- one way or tjhe other. But Ferdinando has been a suspect since Francesco and Bianca died, so in a way we are back to square one! Monica -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Lynn Downward Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2007 2:47 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medici mystery revealed I finally read the British Journam of Medicine this article was a report of. Very interesting. However, there are replies to this article on the BMJ website, discounting the science of this article. They claim that the chin hairs and soft tissue used for DNA comparison to the liver might not be Francesco's because when they exhumed him in Dec 2004 there was no soft tissue there. I haven't read all the replies - there were five I think and I don't have the time to read them all until Tuesday at the earliest - but we can't take this new info as gospel. LynnD who works with scientists and knows to check the original article and responses On 1/2/07, Linda Rice wrote: > > Interesting new discoveries about the Medici's: > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/italy/story/0,,1979151,00.html > > ::Linda:: > > (sorry, no relevant costume content, just kinda interesting story) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 16:55:42 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELtgv4005199 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:55:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ELsuax013361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:55:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ELsNdF080888 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:54:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELsLZ2025924; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:54:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpout.eastlink.ca (smtpout.eastlink.ca [24.222.0.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ELsHuT025800 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:54:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca) Received: from ip04.eastlink.ca ([24.222.10.20]) by mta01.eastlink.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-4.03 (built Sep 22 2005)) with ESMTP id <0JBV007UZOWKWLG0@mta01.eastlink.ca> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 17:55:32 -0400 (AST) Received: from blk-137-68-3.eastlink.ca (HELO THIRDFLOOR) ([24.137.68.3]) by ip04.eastlink.ca with ESMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 17:54:11 -0400 Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 17:54:12 -0400 From: S Paterson Subject: [h-cost] Re: american civil war To: "'Historical Costume'" Message-id: <000501c73826$86f319e0$6501a8c0@THIRDFLOOR> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ao8CAEc1qkUYiUQD/2dsb2JhbAA X-IronPort-AV: i="4.13,186,1167624000"; d="scan'208"; a="82139082:sNHT39967227" X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=18% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2c26286e-b7b4-4833-8390-2ddb59c3ff03 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AAA6B0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:55:40 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Well, that is why I reviewed the pictures ONLY with men in them as well, and with their buttoning left-over-right since pictures can easily be reversed. (Like I stated in my original email). I have cutting books they tell me how things were tailored for the 19th century so know that men's wear was cut with a left-over-right closure. I have been trained to look for those pesky details, you know, and I do not give advice without due care and attention to detail to the best of my ability. Sarah Paterson -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Debloughcostumes@aol.com Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2007 3:12 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Re: american civil war I never rely on photos for this kind of thing as it's so easy for a picture to get reversed when printed, and modern photo editiors don't necessarily realise the importance. it was equally as possible for a photographer at the time to have reversed the image by mistake (ie too many variables). _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 18:11:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ENBm8b007564 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:11:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ENAvAe010585 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:11:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ENAKaa092782 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:10:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ENABEw086866; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:10:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com (imo-m24.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ENA8iD086761 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:10:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.bd6.e47c5a4 (30740) for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:09:58 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:09:56 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] American Civil War To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5037 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 35b73cbf-4306-4b75-bca1-49eb544cc0f7 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AAB881.007 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:11:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/14/2007 12:28:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca writes: Note that: there are an equal number of photographs with the women's wear buttoning left over-right as well, so this could be a transition time _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 18:13:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0END3dL007674 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:13:03 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ENCCvt011890 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:13:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ENBuWE092995 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:11:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ENBtLF088082; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:11:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m14.mx.aol.com (imo-m14.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ENBpTP087973 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:11:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cbf.5a72167 (30740) for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:11:39 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:11:37 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] American Civil War To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5037 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 16669730-aa01-4033-9bd7-80de5457f3e5 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AAB8CC.006 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:13:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/14/2007 12:28:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca writes: Note that: there are an equal number of photographs with the women's wear buttoning left over-right as well, so this could be a transition time It was indeed a transition time. You see both men's and women's clothes buttoning both ways, in real clothes as well as photographs. (One of the hazards of relying on photographs alone is that the image could be reversed.) One theory is that the gender closings were only standardized as ready-to-wear became widespread, and that was later in the 19th century. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 18:26:02 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ENQ2TV008850 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:26:02 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ENPBve024254 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:26:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ENOmMN095331 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:24:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ENOll2098305; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:24:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ENOgNk098176 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 16:24:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.47]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 14 Jan 2007 23:24:36 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAJpKqkXUSnIvk2dsb2JhbACNPQEBAgcOBwYd Received: from 88-107-104-136.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.104.136]:4017 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1H6EiK-000ATd-Dk for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 23:24:36 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070114231941.035d7b58@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 23:24:29 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] American Civil War/fastening left or right In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a259f254-2219-4a61-823b-49910c331685 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AABBD7.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:26:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 23:11 14/01/2007, you wrote: > >In a message dated 1/14/2007 12:28:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, >sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca writes: > >Note that: there are an equal number of photographs with the women's wear >buttoning left over-right as well, so this could be a transition time > > > >It was indeed a transition time. You see both men's and women's clothes >buttoning both ways, in real clothes as well as photographs. (One of the >hazards of relying on photographs alone is that the image could >be reversed.) One >theory is that the gender closings were only standardized as ready-to-wear >became widespread, and that was later in the 19th century. > I heard a theory that the side clothes fastened on was standardised when cutting with a band saw became popular, along with tailored clothes for women. A band saw could cut many thicknesses of fabric, and often a manufactory would be cutting and making up men's'and women's clothing side by side, unlike a tailor's workshop. Here each section would be made up by a specialist - buttonholer/sleeve maker/pocket setter etc., so confusion was less likely to occur. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 14 22:49:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F3nKZ4016700 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:49:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0F3mTC5004646 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:49:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0F3lhER034239 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 20:47:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F3lY3U077778; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 20:47:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m26.mx.aol.com (imo-m26.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.7]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F1oHn0099151 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 18:50:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m26.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c55.c0de94e (40520) for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 20:50:00 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 20:49:57 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=9% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d10c3281-035b-439e-87b6-30dde3e6c749 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AAF98E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:49:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/14/2007 2:15:36 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, Debloughcostumes@aol.com writes: never rely on photos for this kind of thing as it's so easy for a picture to get reversed when printed, BINGO! I don't think I've ever seen any real garment button left over right for women in the 1860's. Is it a blouse? Can you just create a new placket for the button holes and not have to re-cut the whole left side? Or cover them with a decorated [embroidered?] placket so the buttons or holes don't even show. A fez? What is she? A Zouave? I'd use a bonnet unless she's gonna be out in the sun, and then a wide brimmed low crowned hat [usually sitting straight and level and parallel to the ground]. Also a sorta pill box shaped hat.... but that implies traveling to me. A spoon bonnet was all the rage in the 1860's. Here's a page with some illustrations. _http://www.victorianmillinery.com/Catalog.cfm_ (http://www.victorianmillinery.com/Catalog.cfm) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 00:40:57 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F5equu019918 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 00:40:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0F5e73A029976 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 00:40:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0F5dVxQ048656 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:39:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F5dUNg050127; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:39:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F5dQRF050079 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:39:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1E6521603CA; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:32:22 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] American Civil War Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:39:22 -0800 Message-ID: <000101c73867$84452760$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC541@lynx.campus.muc.prv> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0F5dQRF050079 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 093c548c-b3e0-4c7c-bc5e-970024d017e5 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AB13B7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 00:40:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO maybe put some trim down the front over the holes. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Rickard, Patty Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2007 9:23 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] American Civil War Lucky you! I think fezzes are right out. I'm just starting to look into this myself & would appreciate information, too. I've read that young women wore hats but older women would wear bonnets & don't know what constitutes the difference. Thanks for any light anyone can shed. Patty ________________________________ From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com on behalf of Lalah Sent: Sun 1/14/2007 11:53 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] American Civil War I am making garb for a Civil War enactor's girl friend and his mother is driving me crazy. She has some really weird ideas and since she has been playing with this group for a number of years, I just shut up and do what she wants. However, I made the mistake of putting Fray Check on the buttonhole marks on a blouse and it spread out and it shows badly. Having tried everything I can think of to remove it, I am ready to take the blouse apart and make a new left front. Then it occurred to me that it would be easy to use the left side for buttons and put the buttonholes on the right. My friend went crazy saying they never had the buttonholes on the right. I am so sick of the whole thing that I don't want to do any more research. Does anyone know if the buttonholes HAD to be on the left on women's blouses during the Civil War period? Also what kind of hat would be appropriate? I am not going to make her a fez! Thanks for the help Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _____________________________________________________________ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 01:06:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F660Am020519 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 01:06:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0F65AqR030375 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 01:05:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0F64pjU051998 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 23:04:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F64n0F067391; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 23:04:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web81413.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81413.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0F64kGH067292 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 23:04:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ctrvlyfarm@sbcglobal.net) Received: (qmail 95648 invoked by uid 60001); 15 Jan 2007 06:04:40 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=PR9+gS428YQGKtGzSXrYjCeMr2jehf+Yil+vfHBaSAec1Bx/ar/+WptyHut+omcgbAnd1/PT8B0A1yjUVt32orw8WMRLtW4+b2Sq4yRglk3gHeuupbnIy5Ygof6stMevDN3IBi+MvaDFOLv2fX304ELzWgmhZNpd7Vc9Dgb8feE= ; Message-ID: <20070115060440.95646.qmail@web81413.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: qtdAj4EVM1l1Vt8Xp6AL3ecMK5yOMzgEu_giAbQnqEurT3vDtZeiIrMVp9JGTkLUsA2PTL48Z7s9_1vhrgpdgGgyuI8jN2VexTzkXEQtdXIRAQLN6kA9VxcNgyxbQNYKRMfHkNNIws1dmK8- Received: from [68.252.59.227] by web81413.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:04:40 PST Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:04:40 -0800 (PST) From: REBECCA BURCH To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Shops in York, England X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8696663e-23f8-4a05-85c9-7a314d6e21a2 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AB1996.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 01:05:59 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A while back we were discussing our favorite fabric shops and somebody mentioned they shop in York. My son is there now for six months of study at The University of York and I would like him to check it out. I don't expect he will be able to buy me anything, being on a very, very tight budget, but I would at least like him to take a look. If anybody has any suggestions for places he can go while he is there, it would be greatly appreciated. I've instructed him to buy any postcards that have clothing or portraits on them, but we will see if he remembers. Rebecca Burch Center Valley Farm Duncan Falls, Ohio, USA The only twelve steps I'm interested in are the ones between the flat folds and the brocades. --Anonymous Costumer-- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 02:16:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F7GHaC027882 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 02:16:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0F7FVSQ014863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 02:16:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0F7EwMU059236 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 00:14:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F7ErJM012370; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 00:14:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc15.comcast.net (rwcrmhc15.comcast.net [204.127.192.85]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F7EpO2012259 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 00:14:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from attrembl@bovil.com) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (c-71-198-114-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net[71.198.114.173]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc15) with ESMTP id <20070115071445m15005snabe>; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 07:14:45 +0000 Message-ID: <45AB2A4E.3040309@bovil.com> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 23:16:30 -0800 From: Andrew Trembley User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con References: <000001c73867$83691f40$0200a8c0@bob3pc> In-Reply-To: <000001c73867$83691f40$0200a8c0@bob3pc> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1446d7b5-e384-455f-a978-2f532a55ee3e X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AB2A13.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 02:16:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > Where and when is Costume Con? > Costume-Con 25 St. Louis, MO March 30-April 2, 2007 Costume-Con 26 San Jose, CA April 25-28, 2008 Costume-Con 27 Baltimore, MD May, 2009 Costume-Con 28 To be determined by vote at CC25 in St. Louis Spring, 2010 Current bids: Milwaukee, WI This enough to get you started? andy _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 02:40:58 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F7ewxs004775 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 02:40:58 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0F7e5oJ006958 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 02:40:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0F5dVpR048655 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:39:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F5dScr050105; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:39:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F5dPOP050064 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:39:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1E4521603CA; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:32:20 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:39:22 -0800 Message-ID: <000001c73867$83691f40$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20070114093653.04b6beb0@pop.radiks.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0F5dPOP050064 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d36fd748-b89d-4450-9a1d-3cde89e82742 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AB2FD5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 02:40:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Where and when is Costume Con? -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Pierre & Sandy Pettinger Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2007 7:38 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con >Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 00:35:23 -0500 >From: "Caryn Sobel" >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: CostumeCon > >year; I hope to see them again--they're great!> > >Thanks, Ann. That's good news! > >My daughter's only "true" historical costume so far for CostumeCon is still >in the research phase--she saw the movie "Hero" and is trying to find what >era the costume might be from (not much from the Qin era so far), if it is >based on a real style. I thought that a wrap-type dress might be quicker to >do when she already has her hands full with the earlier ones, and will give >me something to do a little embroidery with. We'll see how that goes... > >Caryn Caryn, A few words of advice for your daughter. If she is intending to recreate the movie costume it wouldn't be eligible for the Historic Masquerade. The cut off date for historic costumes is: "costume based on clothing that was worn or could have been worn through December 31, 1982." (from the formal rules). It would, however, be completely appropriate for the F/SF masquerade on Saturday night. If, on the other hand, she is using the film for inspiration and wants to create a historically accurate costume from the Qin Dynasty (say what the character would have really worn in the Qin Dynasty) that would be completely appropriate for the Historic masquerade. If you have any questions let me know. You might also contact the Historic Masquerade director, Byron Connell, and ask him. He might over rule me. (I may be co-chair, but these decisions are ultimately the purview of the respective directors and their word is law on these matters.). He can be contacted at: bpconnell@verizon.net Hope this helps. We look forward to seeing your daughter on stage. Pierre P.S., if she's planning this for a Hall Costume, you can disregard all of the above. "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 05:22:35 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FAMYsJ002983 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:22:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FALhTr013498 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:22:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FAKVau084625 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:20:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FAKQoq054761; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:20:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m16.mx.aol.com (imo-m16.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.206]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FAKM1t054637 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:20:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.ca6.71ee07b (39329) for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:20:10 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:20:07 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5358 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b5187550-eb08-4264-9bfd-9b0902815cb1 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AB55B7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:22:32 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/14/2007 10:52:37 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, AlbertCat@aol.com writes: don't think I've ever seen any real garment button left over right for women in the 1860's. I have tried in vain to find the published research. But Judith Lopez did a presentation at the International Textiles and Apparel Association sometime in the early 1990s, and I think it was later published. She looked at clothing in museums, not just photographs, and definitely found overlapping both ways. I thought she had looked at men's clothing, too, but I am not as sure about that. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 05:48:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FAmSOZ008456 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:48:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FAlgwp011624 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:48:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FAl483088444 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:47:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FAl3Ho077312; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:47:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web23409.mail.ird.yahoo.com (web23409.mail.ird.yahoo.com [217.146.189.94]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0FAkx6g077146 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:47:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from marquesate@yahoo.co.uk) Received: (qmail 47816 invoked by uid 60001); 15 Jan 2007 10:46:53 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.co.uk; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=whoORPGKx/CZ5i2LCUjvjnQcMpXaVlxAd4+s/PXkDUEb76AGMMP2UF0Xgk+ZKsgd5TrgzmXZ3JAFKiDRxXcBKsjD8n5w/8YYZAoAAT/cg+hVYlzNvgWq8WjtI0kuRSGjbCR5DsaH2itzhSQdakBK4oKFP2LbfIa3LWIW6JWfPMQ= ; Message-ID: <20070115104653.47814.qmail@web23409.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Received: from [137.195.176.11] by web23409.mail.ird.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:46:53 GMT Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:46:53 +0000 (GMT) From: N Kipar Subject: Re: [h-cost] Shops in York, England To: Historical Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0FAkx6g077146 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 24eb3eb5-be78-43fb-b1a5-9eb5cc61e75c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AB5BCE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:48:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi Rebecca, I can't recommend any particular fabric shop, but the one shop I always, always go to, whenever I am in York is Duttons for Buttons. A wonderful haberdashery shop, with endless buttons and most exquisite ones, as well as wonderful trims. Duttons For Buttons 32 Coppergate York YO1 9NR Nicole ----- Original Message ---- From: REBECCA BURCH To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Sent: Monday, 15 January, 2007 6:04:40 AM Subject: [h-cost] Shops in York, England A while back we were discussing our favorite fabric shops and somebody mentioned they shop in York. My son is there now for six months of study at The University of York and I would like him to check it out. I don't expect he will be able to buy me anything, being on a very, very tight budget, but I would at least like him to take a look. If anybody has any suggestions for places he can go while he is there, it would be greatly appreciated. I've instructed him to buy any postcards that have clothing or portraits on them, but we will see if he remembers. Rebecca Burch Center Valley Farm Duncan Falls, Ohio, USA The only twelve steps I'm interested in are the ones between the flat folds and the brocades. --Anonymous Costumer-- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 08:08:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FD8bxA028928 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 08:08:37 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FD7ltT007099 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 08:08:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FD7AC2009297 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 06:07:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FD77E2090697; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 06:07:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0F8Hg8P059980 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 01:17:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.39]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 15 Jan 2007 08:17:36 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAMPHqkXUSnInk2dsb2JhbACNPQEBAgcOBwYd Received: from 88-107-104-136.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.104.136]:1239 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1H6N28-000J01-0H for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 08:17:36 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070115081038.035c5070@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 08:17:36 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] Shops in York, England In-Reply-To: <20070115060440.95646.qmail@web81413.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20070115060440.95646.qmail@web81413.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7a9ca45f-0b3d-4826-9105-c7a4211e4c0a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AB7CA3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 08:08:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 06:04 15/01/2007, you wrote: >A while back we were discussing our favorite fabric >shops and somebody mentioned they shop in York. My son >is there now for six months of study at The University >of York and I would like him to check it out. No fabric shops that I remember. Lots of interesting antique shops, a great shop totally dedicated to everything cat (post it notes, tote bags etc), great food markets and weekend markets of things like Peruvian knitwear, home made jams, etc. But nothing costume orientated that I remember - sorry. >I don't expect he will be able to buy me anything, >being on a very, very tight budget, but I would at >least like him to take a look. > >If anybody has any suggestions for places he can go >while he is there, it would be greatly appreciated. >I've instructed him to buy any postcards that have >clothing or portraits on them, but we will see if he remembers. York has lots of interesting historical buildings, a museum, a railway museum, and there is plenty to see in the local area. I have a vague memory that they have a dress belonging to Queen Victoria in the museum, and if it is there, you can buy a postcard. I have not been to any local museums or art galleries as I usually go for a weekend with the Richard lll Society, and dine in medieval clothing in Barley Hall. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 09:04:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FE45Or030720 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:04:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FE3ErV012030 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:04:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FE2YJL018207 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 07:02:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FE2PNR041500; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 07:02:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smapp04.siteprotect.com (smapp04.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.201]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FE24DH041120 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 07:02:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smapp04.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4166713CEA for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 08:01:57 -0600 (CST) Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "cschmitt@genteelarts.com" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war X-Origin: 65.164.18.144 Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 08:01:57 -0600 Message-Id: <13425.1168869717@genteelarts.com> X-Mailer: SiteMail 5.6 - 65.164.18.144 - cschmitt@genteelarts.com X-Originating-Email: cschmitt@genteelarts.com X-Originating-Ip: 65.164.18.144 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0FE24DH041120 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8c9f6203-6fd4-416d-aae5-6e2f3b193c0f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AB89A2.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:04:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO We've had several dozen original women's garments that closed left-over-right on display at the Conference over the years. Either way is correct; the notes I have in my research indicate left-over-right was slightly more common. 55%-45% or possibly 60%-40%; I don't have my notes at this location. Bonnets are generally worn by mature women for most social occasions: church, visiting, shopping, etc. Hats are generally reserved for outdoor recreational activities: walking, boating, playing croquet or similar games, at a watering place or the seaside. Other hat styles, pork pie, Glengarry, etc., are usually favored by younger women or an older but very fashionable woman. I define "mature" as someone mid-20s or older; or a married woman of any age. As always, there are exceptions based on any number of circumstances. Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 1-4, 2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 09:34:27 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FEYRka031796 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:34:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FEXadJ013401 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:34:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FEX0PM023455 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 07:33:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FEWtK3069387; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 07:32:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FEWoMs069197 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 07:32:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep45.mail.dk ([195.41.46.228]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070115143244.FVCH688.fep34.mail.dk@fep45.mail.dk> for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 15:32:44 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.63.231.38]) by fep45.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070115143244.SCVD119.fep45.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 15:32:44 +0100 Message-ID: <000d01c738b2$1aafa000$26e73f50@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <13425.1168869717@genteelarts.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 15:33:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep45.mail.dk from [80.63.231.38] at Mon, 15 Jan 2007 15:32:43 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8978b9bd-568b-4d34-ac59-aa4e8f79bce0 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AB90C0.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:34:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Its quite interresting with this toppic with the closing front either left or right. When i was thinking how they did in 18th century, in the end where masculine fashions were hip, i had no idea? Do any of you know? Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 3:01 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war > We've had several dozen original women's garments that closed > left-over-right on > display at the Conference over the years. Either way is correct; the notes > I have > in my research indicate left-over-right was slightly more common. 55%-45% > or > possibly 60%-40%; I don't have my notes at this location. > > Bonnets are generally worn by mature women for most social occasions: > church, > visiting, shopping, etc. Hats are generally reserved for outdoor > recreational > activities: walking, boating, playing croquet or similar games, at a > watering place > or the seaside. Other hat styles, pork pie, Glengarry, etc., are usually > favored by > younger women or an older but very fashionable woman. I define "mature" as > someone > mid-20s or older; or a married woman of any age. As always, there are > exceptions > based on any number of circumstances. > > Carolann Schmitt > cschmitt@genteelarts.com > www.genteelarts.com > Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 1-4, 2007 > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 11:36:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FGathR003509 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 11:36:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FGa9lZ007171 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 11:36:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FGZEi8046146 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:35:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FGZ8rU014194; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:35:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp-send.myrealbox.com (smtp-send.myrealbox.com [151.155.5.143]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FGZ4vD014103 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 09:35:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rnweb@myrealbox.com) Received: from rnweb [70.130.179.67] by myrealbox.com with NetMail ModWeb Module; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:35:03 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con 25 From: "R. Netherton" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:35:03 -0600 X-Mailer: NetMail ModWeb Module X-Sender: rnweb MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <1168878903.c7d30f3crnweb@myrealbox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=19% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0FGZ4vD014103 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f43b3c15-512d-4f24-8c77-a5daad8b13a2 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45ABAD79.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 11:36:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Mary wrote: <> I'll look forward to seeing you there! And in case anyone has been trying to reach me: I am offline and out of commission, thanks to power outages here in St. Louis. We have been without power in our home since Saturday; my husband, kids, and I have been staying with relatives. I am just now able to check into the list on a borrowed computer, via an alternate box, but I don't have access to my usual e-mail. I am not looking forward to the quantity of mail I will have to sort through once we do get back home ... not to mention the laundry, and the state of the refrigerator and freezer. At least I can now read the list, and I am reachable at this box for now. --Robin Robin Netherton This is my webmail box. Please reply to . _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 12:37:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FHbfll005797 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:37:45 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FHaoIH028175 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:37:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FHZm0F057197 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:35:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FHZXgu088341; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:35:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d04.mx.aol.com (imo-d04.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FHZRaF088091 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:35:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c16.d1a60c8 (57317) for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:35:12 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:35:10 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8591d907-0f87-41bc-88de-b88f2cebb8ff X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45ABBBB2.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:37:39 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/15/2007 5:21:34 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, AnnBWass@aol.com writes: She looked at clothing in museums, not just photographs, and definitely found overlapping both ways. ******************* I doubt it not. I've not researched it at all, actually. But I had a friend who used to collect vintage, and I can't recall a dress that overlapped left over right. But that's no definitive observation. I wonder how WHAT the garment is affects this. I mean, is one more likely to find jackets that overlap left to right than say a dress or blouse? Jackets were sorta coming into their own in the 1860's after a few decades of domination by the dress with skirt attached. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 13:02:07 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FI279k006618 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:02:07 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FI1Gaw015708 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:02:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FI0gxx062597 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 11:00:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FI0ZjO020107; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 11:00:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FI02hC019538 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 11:00:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from carynsobel@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=RAiPAnFKp1RvtRhldkErhmw5t6aQxNRjk2BJx4EeM6ukH22S1ZK1Tbp4JkiG668C; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [4.157.14.234] (helo=SobelWriting) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H6W7l-00061r-KY for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:00:02 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c738cf$2d9c6b40$ea0e9d04@SobelWriting> From: "Caryn Sobel" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701140217.l0E2GpMT031112@net.indra.com> <6.2.3.4.2.20070114093653.04b6beb0@pop.radiks.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 20:48:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-ELNK-Trace: 251666aee31a72c3c5fbd2bc086b8747239a348a220c2609a013b5b5eb808d6c01f2dd6ca8512a2fa2d4e88014a4647c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 4.157.14.234 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3363e0ad-a7f6-4169-b42f-916c5583aeff X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45ABC16C.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:02:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Pierre, Thanks for that helpful info on the different events! My daughter has been researching, and getting some great help on the F-Costume list, too. She has decided that the Hero outfit will be a Hall Costume. I want the Hero outfit to be "Hero-inspired," but when I interrupted her at college application essays to suggest that, she screamed. Oops. Perhaps after some chocolate she will be open to suggestions. I have become very interested in the period and culture, and am doing some research, but don't want to make this stressful on her. Other than the Fashion Show, I guess we will be non-historic this time (so now I am OT, sorry all). Thanks again--government agencies could definitely take lessons from you CostumeCon folk on helpfulness, friendliness, and efficiency. Best, Caryn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 18:19:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FNIw3B017089 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 18:18:58 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0FNI7Iq023472 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 18:18:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0FNHT3c026232 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 16:17:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FNHIOw084561; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 16:17:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smapp00.siteprotect.com (smapp00.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.205]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0FI0xaY020652 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 11:01:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smapp00.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5FE42E8003 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:00:58 -0600 (CST) Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "cschmitt@genteelarts.com" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: american civil war X-Origin: 65.164.18.144 Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 12:00:58 -0600 Message-Id: <15723.1168884058@genteelarts.com> X-Mailer: Qwest Office WebMail 5.6 - 65.164.18.144 - cschmitt@genteelarts.com X-Originating-Email: cschmitt@genteelarts.com X-Originating-Ip: 65.164.18.144 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0FI0xaY020652 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 797fec50-f21a-45ed-a5bc-a2597bf0878a X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AC0BAF.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 18:18:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >I wonder how WHAT the garment is affects this. I mean, is one more likely to >find jackets that overlap left to right than say a dress or blouse? Jackets >were sorta coming into their own in the 1860's after a few decades of >domination by the dress with skirt attached. I haven't studied enough jackets or other outer garments to make a determination. Almost all of my references are dresses. Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 1-4, 2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 15 19:05:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0G05hG4018417 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:05:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0G04vM0006095 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:05:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0G04P5c034463 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 17:04:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0G04NUZ033157; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 17:04:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m27.mx.aol.com (imo-m27.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.8]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0G04Knp033007 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 17:04:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-m27.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cb5.8d97adb (48624) for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:04:10 -0500 (EST) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:04:07 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5017 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Shops in York, England X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6ea85e91-bada-490d-b7c2-2f013c24dbd0 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AC16A9.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:05:41 -0500 (EST) Status: RO check out the viking loom - see the website at _www.vikingloom.co.uk_ (http://www.vikingloom.co.uk) for the address - I don't know the address, just how to get there, if that makes sense! not a fabric shop, but sells lots of other crafty & embroidery stuff that's really handy. and up the road (away from the minster, and round the corner is a fantastic little bead shop that I don't know the name of (sorry, again I just know how to get there from the station). there is a fabric shop up a kind of alley, but it mostly sells patchwork and modern dress fabrics (yet again I don't have the address - also don't know how to find that one, as have only ever been there once, but perhaps if the place he's staying has a yellow pages or a phone book he could look it up?) also, I'd recommend the regimental museums in york ( _http://www.armymuseums.org.uk/amot-search/default.asp?Category=AMOT&Service=Museum-Display_ (http://www.armymuseums.org.uk/amot-search/default.asp?Category=AMOT&Service=Museum-Disp lay) ) - the dragoon guards has some interesting stuff on the scott antarctic campaign (captain oates was a d.g.) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 01:45:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0G6jjpb029048 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 01:45:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0G6isvC030920 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 01:45:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0G6hs0P086114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:43:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0G6hm55061142; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:43:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0G6hjMr061048 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:43:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos1.cos.agilent.com (relcos1.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.239]) by msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF59E467B for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:43:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.233]) by relcos1.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9F291C25AD for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:43:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosbh02.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.126]) by wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:43:37 -0700 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh02.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:43:36 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: [h-cost] American Civil War Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:43:36 -0700 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D9640222D4C1@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> In-Reply-To: <200701141900.l0EJ0548061058@net.indra.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] American Civil War Thread-Index: Acc4DuLAiVN5yLahRLebMI+h719XegBKjdAA From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2007 06:43:36.0986 (UTC) FILETIME=[A6550FA0:01C73939] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0G6hjMr061048 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c0a23ed1-91ca-4113-b14e-e681e413e1dd X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AC7466.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 01:45:43 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Actually, in my vintage collection (which includes 4 US Civ. War-ish period women's' bodices - could be a bit later, not 100% sure but they're late 60s at the worst) it's pretty evenly split whether it's left-on-top or right-on-top. So I think your idea is perfectly kosher. (I only noticed this when I was using one of the bodices as the basis for my sister's civ. War bodice and realized I'd put the buttons on the wrong side. Then I checked and realized that the vintage bodice put the buttons "on the wrong side" :-) -sunny > I am making garb for a Civil War enactor's girl friend and > his mother is driving me crazy. She has some really weird > ideas and since she has been playing with this group for a > number of years, I just shut up and do what she wants. > However, I made the mistake of putting Fray Check on the > buttonhole marks on a blouse and it spread out and it shows > badly. Having tried everything I can think of to remove it, > I am ready to take the blouse apart and make a new left > front. Then it occurred to me that it would be easy to use > the left side for buttons and put the buttonholes on the > right. My friend went crazy saying they never had the > buttonholes on the right. I am so sick of the whole thing > that I don't want to do any more research. Does anyone know > if the buttonholes HAD to be on the left on women's blouses > during the Civil War period? Also what kind of hat would be > appropriate? I am not going to make her a fez! Thanks for the help _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 06:54:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GBsc7x030170 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:54:39 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GBrmx6004366 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:54:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GBqOdv019696 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 04:52:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GBqHdj094151; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 04:52:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GBqENY094115 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 04:52:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AAC3233104BC; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:45:07 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 03:52:09 -0800 Message-ID: <00b701c73964$c0a8cfb0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <45AB2A4E.3040309@bovil.com> Importance: Normal X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 18f92bc5-b96f-4fd3-9092-cae99b318bd5 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45ACBCCC.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:54:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Oh, Yes, thanks. I live 30 miles from San Jose, so will definitely go in 2008! -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Trembley Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2007 11:17 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > Where and when is Costume Con? > Costume-Con 25 St. Louis, MO March 30-April 2, 2007 Costume-Con 26 San Jose, CA April 25-28, 2008 Costume-Con 27 Baltimore, MD May, 2009 Costume-Con 28 To be determined by vote at CC25 in St. Louis Spring, 2010 Current bids: Milwaukee, WI This enough to get you started? andy _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 10:27:16 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GFRCkK007739 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:27:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GFQLck029698 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:27:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GFPqex051113 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:25:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GFPjwU089740; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:25:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp7.america.net (qsmtp7.america.net [69.60.160.250]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GFPfSb089645 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:25:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladymaggie@justinanimator.com) Received: from [65.125.64.173] (helo=MAX.feccommunications.net) by qsmtp7.america.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H6qBw-0000bh-6s for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:25:40 -0500 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:25:34 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Genie Barrett In-Reply-To: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=11% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Help finding an article? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ae931891-c6c7-4b25-94e2-a2bf1135f59a X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45ACEE9D.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:27:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hello All, I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan and Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 (1973) pp. 109-124. Is there anyone out there that might have a copy? I need it for a bit of research I'm doing and, like usual, I am rather late in doing the research so can't ILL it. Thanks in advance Genie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 12:15:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GHF4Kd010575 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:15:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GHEHIc024646 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:15:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GHDRZb077633 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:13:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GHDFVW015806; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:13:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GFdI2W004746 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:39:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H6qPI-0002a3-D3; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:39:28 -0600 Received: from 160.36.154.221 ([160.36.154.221]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:39:28 -0500 Message-ID: <20070116103928.z96bo3jkkqsksc08@www.goldsword.com> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:39:28 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? 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X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:15:02 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Quoting Genie Barrett : > Hello All, > > I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan and > Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 > (1973) pp. 109-124. > > Is there anyone out there that might have a copy? I need it for a bit > of research I'm doing and, like usual, I am rather late in doing the > research so can't ILL it. > Don't have the journal, but my University generally gets stuff to me in about a week. I know that different libraries are different -- want me to try and get it for you? susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 12:48:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GHm3r6011448 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:48:03 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GHlCHI018384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:48:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GHkhZ7085917 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:46:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GHkZfv056621; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:46:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp1.america.net (qsmtp1.america.net [69.60.160.244]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GHkUVb056504 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:46:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladymaggie@justinanimator.com) Received: from [65.125.64.173] (helo=MAX.feccommunications.net) by qsmtp1.america.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H6sO7-0000Qd-Jj for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:46:23 -0500 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.0.20070116114529.019cb368@justinanimator.com> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:46:15 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Genie Barrett Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? In-Reply-To: <20070116103928.z96bo3jkkqsksc08@www.goldsword.com> References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <20070116103928.z96bo3jkkqsksc08@www.goldsword.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c39daec7-2d16-44cb-889d-014473ec14de X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AD0FA0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:48:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 09:39 AM 1/16/2007, you wrote: >Don't have the journal, but my University generally gets stuff to me >in about a week. I know that different libraries are different -- >want me to try and get it for you? > >susan Wait, I may have access to it elsewhere. I'll let you know if I still need it. Thanks, Maggie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 14:47:06 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GJl2Mc014625 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:47:06 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GJkBMk020629 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:46:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GJjNDb006730 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:45:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GJjF2b003368; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:45:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from kumc-smptin2.kumc.edu (kumc-smtpin2.kumc.edu [169.147.4.23]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GJj5O3003055 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:45:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Ckinsey@kumc.edu) Received: from kumc-mpg3.kumc.edu ([10.120.1.73]) by kumc-smptin2.kumc.edu with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:05:12 -0600 Received: from kumc-smtpout (mithril@localhost) by kumc-mpg3.kumc.edu with ESMTP id l0GJ4gA84076 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:04:42 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from Ckinsey@kumc.edu) Received: from kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu (kumc-smtpout [10.120.1.11]) by kumc-mpg3.kumc.edu ([10.120.1.74]); 16 Jan 2007 13:04:42 -0600 (CST) Received: from KUMC-SMTPOUT-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:05:12 -0600 References: <200701161900.l0GJ08Bd047287@net.indra.com> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:04:51 -0600 Message-ID: <45ACCD68.C9FB.00A6.0@kumc.edu> In-Reply-To: <200701161900.l0GJ08Bd047287@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Help finding an article? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 36d984bf-8de9-4162-b351-f7e12b3daaed X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AD2B83.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:47:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Quoting Genie Barrett : > Hello All, > > I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan and > Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 > (1973) pp. 109-124. > > Is there anyone out there that might have a copy? I need it for a bit > of research I'm doing and, like usual, I am rather late in doing the > research so can't ILL it. > Don't have the journal, but my University generally gets stuff to me in about a week. I know that different libraries are different -- want me to try and get it for you? susan ----- Wait, I may have access to it elsewhere. I'll let you know if I still need it. Thanks, Maggie ------------------------------ Great minds are running down the same track! This has been one of the few things my local ILL has failed to find for me so if anyone does have it, I would really appreciate a copy. Thanks! Catherine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 15:43:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GKh5CU016184 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:43:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GKgA0k025299 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:43:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GKfSUf018977 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:41:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GKfM7C076121; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:41:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GKex1O075627 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:41:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from moreplentyn@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=JfzZrb18M8Qzmrrks6tL2WFb/y/nYe/zlXoyKTSpOCiJJ9dfawEXjpeDPqc8Oijq; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.167.255.247] (helo=boris) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H6v74-0006JI-CI for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:40:58 -0500 Message-ID: <039c01c739ae$a6a396a0$0200a8c0@boris> From: "Carmen Beaudry" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:41:07 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-ELNK-Trace: 1a4a21053b62758bdb287b3a1c9ea9039ef193a6bfc3dd48bd9748ebe8bf92e2a179cdd8d64a023e8483c75118a9a15a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.167.255.247 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c98e1562-fd48-4c7d-8185-7fc92364fc0c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AD38A2.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:43:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Hello All, > > I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan and > Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 (1973) > pp. 109-124. > > Is there anyone out there that might have a copy? I need it for a bit of > research I'm doing and, like usual, I am rather late in doing the research > so can't ILL it. > > Thanks in advance > Genie I had trouble getting this through ILL last year, I finally gave up, so if you find a copy, let me know, please. Melusine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 15:50:15 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GKo7se016357 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:50:11 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GKnGtt008083 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:50:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GKl2Yg020185 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:47:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GKkv6D083078; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:46:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from metis.sjsu.edu (metis.sjsu.edu [130.65.3.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GKkpZ4082804 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:46:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from attrembl@bovil.com) Received: from [130.65.37.136] (sjs-130-65-37-136.sjsu.edu [130.65.37.136]) by metis.sjsu.edu (8.12.10+Sun/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GKkeYa009999 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:46:40 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <00b701c73964$c0a8cfb0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> References: <00b701c73964$c0a8cfb0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Andrew T Trembley Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:46:37 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a69f733e-7236-4144-87ae-d1ad21e1f0a3 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AD3A4C.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:50:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 16, 2007, at 3:52 AM, Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > Oh, Yes, thanks. I live 30 miles from San Jose, so will definitely > go in > 2008! Well, registration is online at and full weekend adult membership is at $75 right now. The price will be going up after CC25 (I think at the end of April, actually). Are you involved with any of the Bay Area costume groups? Do you attend any of the historical costume events or conventions in the area? Just curious... -- andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen http://www.irlm.org/ - mailto:webmaster@irlm.org "Anybody who takes this seriously deserves to" -- Donna Barr _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 17:19:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GMJLTi018678 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:19:26 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GMIVMI000392 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:19:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GMHki8037540 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:17:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GMHaVm081995; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:17:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc14.comcast.net (rwcrmhc14.comcast.net [216.148.227.154]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GMH0Q6081311 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:17:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Colleen.McDonald@comcast.net) Received: from 67.168.178.66 ([67.168.178.66]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc14) with SMTP id <20070116221655m1400357hle>; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:16:55 +0000 Received: from 192.150.22.5 (SquirrelMail authenticated user colleen) by 67.168.178.66 with HTTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:16:55 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <4405.192.150.22.5.1168985815.squirrel@67.168.178.66> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:16:55 -0800 (PST) From: "Colleen McDonald" To: h-costume@indra.com User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4-rc1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] New Margaret Scott book? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fca78d84-6243-4ff4-b8d9-7f9369b5dc16 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45AD4F37.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:19:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi all, I just got an email from Michael Shamansky announcing: Title: Medieval Dress and Fashion Author: SCOTT, MARGARET Price: $60.00 ISBN: 9780712306751 Description: London: British Library, 2007. 27cm., hardcover, ca. 192pp. illus.,most in color. ^Available April 2007^. Has anyone heard early buzz on this book? It's been a while since I've seen anything from Margaret Scott, so I'm curious. Colleen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 17:29:31 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GMTU8F018971 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:29:31 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0GMSeKg014245 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:29:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0GMS9hH039432 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:28:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GMS2l8093525; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:28:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0GMRtTG093310 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:27:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:16546 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1H6wmU-0002cc-Sq for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:27:51 -0600 Message-ID: <008801c739bd$8f25a680$5600a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net><7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <039c01c739ae$a6a396a0$0200a8c0@boris> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:27:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3d0fddd6-1b64-4670-ad9e-442e5e128170 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AD5198.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:29:29 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carmen Beaudry" >> I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan and >> Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 >> (1973) pp. 109-124. I'd be very interested in that, too! -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 19:19:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H0JElh021639 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:19:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0H0ILIO014921 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:19:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H0HST7058281 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:17:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H0HFiQ002460; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:17:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-canoe.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-canoe.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.66]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H0H8mJ002372 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:17:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.238.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.238] helo=faucet.net) by pop-canoe.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H6yUF-0000gC-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:17:08 -0500 Message-ID: <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:15:07 -0600 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c7974051-50df-4430-b067-3ce27f1a500e X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AD6B4D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:19:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I have it. It's not a very good copy, but I do have it. Do you still need it? Melanie Schuessler Genie Barrett wrote: > Hello All, > > I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan and > Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 > (1973) pp. 109-124. > > Is there anyone out there that might have a copy? I need it for a bit > of research I'm doing and, like usual, I am rather late in doing the > research so can't ILL it. > > Thanks in advance > Genie > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 20:37:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H1bPvT023558 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0H1aY4w013400 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H1Zska068948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:35:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H1ZpUm065256; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:35:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H1ZkSH065198 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:35:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from moreplentyn@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=NOhQqKjR7e4J4fjmDai4QyeOgi4ztL+gMN+WBxONbm0ZnzHBMwGs8Mn4UdK3IQ2y; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.167.255.247] (helo=boris) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H6ziM-0006Rv-8r for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:35:46 -0500 Message-ID: <043201c739d7$d6c22cb0$0200a8c0@boris> From: "Carmen Beaudry" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net><7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:35:57 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-ELNK-Trace: 1a4a21053b62758bdb287b3a1c9ea9039ef193a6bfc3dd48658157204187eae396268aad191dafeb85709c4405726f5b350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.167.255.247 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 50ac79ae-f3b8-4686-af1f-13668b7330b8 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AD7DA2.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:37:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Melanie Schuessler" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 5:15 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? >I have it. It's not a very good copy, but I do have it. Do you still need >it? > > Melanie Schuessler > > > Genie Barrett wrote: >> Hello All, >> >> I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan and >> Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 >> (snip) I don't know if she still needs it, but I'd like it. Melusine (moreplentyn@earthlink.net) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 20:58:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H1wUWb024100 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:58:30 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0H1viVe003310 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:58:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H1vQtp071482 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:57:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H1vOWi081246; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:57:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H1vKDd081195 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:57:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H703U-0002Ys-SG; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:57:36 -0600 Received: from 65.13.105.239 ([65.13.105.239]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:57:36 -0500 Message-ID: <20070116205736.lmbckmkxubl8o4k8@www.goldsword.com> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:57:36 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> In-Reply-To: <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32003] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php X-Source-Args: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php /usr/local/cpanel/base/horde/imp/compose.php X-Source-Dir: :/base/horde/imp X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fd820a15-228a-4af5-b901-7face1444c29 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AD8299.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:58:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Quoting Melanie Schuessler : > I have it. It's not a very good copy, but I do have it. Do you still > need it? PDF or paper? susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 21:25:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2PP11024759 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:25:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0H2OYWE004514 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:25:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H2O6TH074846 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:24:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2O4lB000584; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:24:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2O0n3000535 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:24:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m23.in-tch.com [216.166.191.23]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l0H2ArJ12558 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:10:54 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <002401c739df$c4f48d40$17bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200701161900.l0GJ08Bd047287@net.indra.com> <45ACCD68.C9FB.00A6.0@kumc.edu> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Help finding an article? Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:32:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1cc48444-9742-41f5-a11a-b4595553b5e7 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AD88E2.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:25:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I've got a photocopy in my stash somewhere.... --Sue, blissfully lucky to know some *very* good librarians....;o) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 12:04 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: Help finding an article? > Quoting Genie Barrett : > > > Hello All, > > > > I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan > and > > Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 > > (1973) pp. 109-124. > > > > Is there anyone out there that might have a copy? I need it for a > bit > > of research I'm doing and, like usual, I am rather late in doing the > > research so can't ILL it. > > > > Don't have the journal, but my University generally gets stuff to me > in about a week. I know that different libraries are different -- > want me to try and get it for you? > > susan > ----- > > Wait, I may have access to it elsewhere. I'll let you know if I still > need it. > > Thanks, > Maggie > ------------------------------ > > Great minds are running down the same track! This has been one of the > few things my local ILL has failed to find for me so if anyone does have > it, I would really appreciate a copy. > > Thanks! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 21:45:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2j0xt025140 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:45:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0H2iEJQ027481 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:44:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H2heU0077560 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:43:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2hckj014636; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:43:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2hYYI014585 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:43:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA08711 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:31:35 -0600 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:31:35 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Margaret Scott book? In-Reply-To: <4405.192.150.22.5.1168985815.squirrel@67.168.178.66> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5c451ac7-b72f-453e-9e37-56f787d48ee6 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AD8D7E.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:44:58 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Tue, 16 Jan 2007, Colleen McDonald wrote: > I just got an email from Michael Shamansky announcing: > > Title: Medieval Dress and Fashion > Author: SCOTT, MARGARET > Has anyone heard early buzz on this book? It's been a while since I've > seen anything from Margaret Scott, so I'm curious. The last thing I saw by her was an art history paper a few years ago. Haven't heard her name at all otherwise. I'll be looking forward to seeing what's in this. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 21:56:55 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2ut4X025391 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:56:55 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0H2u41T013231 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:56:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H2tjeb079345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:55:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2thh0022861; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:55:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpout.eastlink.ca (smtpout.eastlink.ca [24.222.0.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H2te0S022743 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:55:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca) Received: from ip01.eastlink.ca ([24.222.10.5]) by mta01.eastlink.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-4.03 (built Sep 22 2005)) with ESMTP id <0JBZ009OWS2U15T0@mta01.eastlink.ca> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:54:30 -0400 (AST) Received: from blk-137-68-3.eastlink.ca (HELO THIRDFLOOR) ([24.137.68.3]) by ip01.eastlink.ca with SMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:55:34 -0400 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:55:34 -0400 From: SPaterson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? To: Historical Costume Message-id: <001d01c739e2$f5c92220$6501a8c0@THIRDFLOOR> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ao8CAEofrUUYiUQD/2dsb2JhbAA X-IronPort-AV: i="4.13,198,1167624000"; d="scan'208"; a="83341022:sNHT24041295" X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000703-2, 01/16/2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> <043201c739d7$d6c22cb0$0200a8c0@boris> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=22% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 829d9044-a158-4a03-86a1-90781b154589 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AD9045.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:56:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I would, too please - I thought I had it but I cannot find it. Sarah Paterson ( I used to have a photocopy that did not survive 5 moves) ----- Original Message ----- > > ----- Original Message ----- > >>I have it. It's not a very good copy, but I do have it. Do you still > >>need >>it? >> >> Melanie Schuessler >> >> >> Genie Barrett wrote: >>> Hello All, >>> >>> I am trying to find a copy of Janet Arnold's copy of: "Elizagethan and >>> Jacobean Smocks and Shirts" that is in Waffen-und Kostumkunde Pt. 2 >>> (snip) > > I don't know if she still needs it, but I'd like it. > > Melusine > (moreplentyn@earthlink.net) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 22:22:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H3MOJ4026078 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:22:24 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0H3LXOj008091 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:22:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H3KRtO082775 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:20:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H3KPjD039731; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:20:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp6.america.net (qsmtp6.america.net [69.60.160.249]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H3KLa7039683 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:20:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladymaggie@justinanimator.com) Received: from [65.125.64.173] (helo=MAX.feccommunications.net) by qsmtp6.america.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H71LY-0004Zy-HN for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:20:20 -0500 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.0.20070116211924.0191df30@justinanimator.com> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:20:03 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Genie Barrett Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? In-Reply-To: <20070116205736.lmbckmkxubl8o4k8@www.goldsword.com> References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> <20070116205736.lmbckmkxubl8o4k8@www.goldsword.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=14% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f238a435-1cb8-4a44-8927-c916c94dd5a9 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AD963E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:22:22 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 07:57 PM 1/16/2007, you wrote: >Quoting Melanie Schuessler : > >>I have it. It's not a very good copy, but I do have it. Do you still >>need it? > >PDF or paper? Can you post a PDF for download? That might be fastest, though I know this is a really long article. Genie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 16 22:23:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H3Nj6D026114 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:23:45 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0H3MtdP017227 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:23:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0H3Md51083111 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:22:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H3Mcq2041300; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:22:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0H3MZvW041208 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:22:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from your1a4d29f243 (ool-45757a12.dyn.optonline.net [69.117.122.18]) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <0JBZ007ZDTDCR230@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:22:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:22:20 -0500 From: monica spence Subject: RE: [h-cost] New Margaret Scott book? In-reply-to: To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2f200188-382a-4a73-a904-680d7a7a514c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AD968F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:23:43 -0500 (EST) Status: RO You can pre-order at Barnes and Noble with tax (NY State) it comes to $44. Free shipping too, since it is over $25. Monica -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Robin Netherton Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 10:32 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Margaret Scott book? On Tue, 16 Jan 2007, Colleen McDonald wrote: > I just got an email from Michael Shamansky announcing: > > Title: Medieval Dress and Fashion > Author: SCOTT, MARGARET > Has anyone heard early buzz on this book? It's been a while since I've > seen anything from Margaret Scott, so I'm curious. The last thing I saw by her was an art history paper a few years ago. Haven't heard her name at all otherwise. I'll be looking forward to seeing what's in this. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 07:26:31 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCQPJu004551 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:26:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HCPd6S024587 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:26:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HCP7Jp052563 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:25:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCP1Lc020399; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:25:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-satin.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-satin.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCOt1u020332 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:24:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.119.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.119] helo=faucet.net) by pop-satin.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H79qY-0003vW-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:24:55 -0500 Message-ID: <45AE232F.6060901@faucet.net> Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:22:55 -0600 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> <20070116205736.lmbckmkxubl8o4k8@www.goldsword.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=12% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c26bcf79-bfcc-411b-b72e-25182a82da3a X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AE15C3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:26:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Susan B. Farmer wrote: > Quoting Melanie Schuessler : > >> I have it. It's not a very good copy, but I do have it. Do you still >> need it? > > > PDF or paper? Paper. Melanie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 07:34:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCYKfZ004814 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:34:20 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HCXS5i023033 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:34:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HCWw7x053603 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:32:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCWvvP026420; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:32:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-gadwall.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-gadwall.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCWnn4026306 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:32:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.119.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.119] helo=faucet.net) by pop-gadwall.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H79yD-0003AV-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:32:49 -0500 Message-ID: <45AE2507.4070200@faucet.net> Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:30:47 -0600 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> <20070116205736.lmbckmkxubl8o4k8@www.goldsword.com> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116211924.0191df30@justinanimator.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=11% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4d9c97b2-a7eb-4c81-974d-81084ac422fc X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AE1798.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:34:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Genie Barrett wrote: > > Can you post a PDF for download? That might be fastest, though I know > this is a really long article. Perhaps it's foolish to quibble, but that's rather less legal than making photocopies and sending them out. Giving out copies, I know who they're going to and could argue fair use for educational purposes. Putting it online is simply publishing it without permission. I know it's easier, but... Melanie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 07:35:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCZe8f004850 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:35:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HCYlmk013427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:35:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HCYVoX053950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:34:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCYUH2027693; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:34:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-gadwall.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-gadwall.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HCYRpL027658 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:34:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.119.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.119] helo=faucet.net) by pop-gadwall.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H79zm-0003VQ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:34:27 -0500 Message-ID: <45AE256D.4020307@faucet.net> Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:32:29 -0600 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net><7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> <043201c739d7$d6c22cb0$0200a8c0@boris> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=11% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: caa7c037-047d-4c15-a6b8-4dc6f6ffa764 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AE17E7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:35:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Those who want photocopies mailed to them (for educational purposes :) ), please send your name and address to me privately at melanie@faucet.net. Melanie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 09:14:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HEDxkX012437 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:13:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HED8Lx003120 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:13:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HECSSQ069794 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HECPdp015054; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HECK6F014970 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H7BWU-00043B-OT; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:12:18 -0600 Received: from 65.13.105.239 ([65.13.105.239]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:12:18 -0500 Message-ID: <20070117091218.cnsq98auisgkg48s@www.goldsword.com> Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:12:18 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> <20070116205736.lmbckmkxubl8o4k8@www.goldsword.com> <45AE232F.6060901@faucet.net> In-Reply-To: <45AE232F.6060901@faucet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32003] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php X-Source-Args: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php /usr/local/cpanel/base/horde/imp/compose.php X-Source-Dir: :/base/horde/imp X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7696d43d-818d-435d-a5be-f7e49f82d861 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45AE2EF4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:13:57 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Quoting Melanie Schuessler : > Susan B. Farmer wrote: >> Quoting Melanie Schuessler : >> >>> I have it. It's not a very good copy, but I do have it. Do you still >>> need it? >> >> >> PDF or paper? > > Paper. > If ILL turns up a PDF that will make life simpler for everybody! I don't want you to have to make another paper copy! susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 09:55:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HEtaCV013810 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:55:36 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HEskGl010303 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:55:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HEn3e2075738 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:49:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HEn1t3048238; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:49:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from kalymnos.domenebutikken.no (kalymnos.domenebutikken.no [193.93.128.31]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HALogR027191 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 03:21:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ingridgs@techarea.net) Received: from kalymnos.domenebutikken.no (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by kalymnos.domenebutikken.no (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3sarge1) with ESMTP id l0HAKurX019384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:20:57 +0100 Received: from localhost (ingridgs@localhost) by kalymnos.domenebutikken.no (8.13.4/8.13.4/Submit) with ESMTP id l0HAKuBB019381 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:20:56 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: kalymnos.domenebutikken.no: ingridgs owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:20:56 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ingrid_G=2E_Storr=F8?= X-X-Sender: ingridgs@kalymnos.domenebutikken.no To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding an article? In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.0.20070116211924.0191df30@justinanimator.com> Message-ID: References: <45A95C91.5040509@reddawn.net> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116092250.019e4e60@justinanimator.com> <45AD789B.9050500@faucet.net> <20070116205736.lmbckmkxubl8o4k8@www.goldsword.com> <7.0.1.0.0.20070116211924.0191df30@justinanimator.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII www.domenebutikken.no: Ta gjerne kontakt for mer informasjon. Domenebutikken.no: Found to be clean X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 94057dd1-8722-4ad8-b940-df7065a6aa7f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AE38B6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:55:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Tue, 16 Jan 2007, Genie Barrett wrote: > Can you post a PDF for download? That might be fastest, though I > know this is a really long article. Oh, please do if you can! I've been looking for this as well. :) Ingrid -- This email has been scanned for viruses & spam by Domenebutikken - www.domenebutikken.no Denne e-posten er sjekket for virus & spam av Domenebutikken - www.domenebutikken.no _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 10:58:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HFw1Jb016102 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:58:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HFvANn013977 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:57:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HFuYtr087018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:56:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HFuR2T019316; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:56:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HFuMZn019139 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:56:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c7b.9cc6653 (52371) for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:56:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from MBLK-D29 (mblk-d29.mblk.aol.com [205.188.149.21]) by ciaaol-m01.mx.aol.com (v114_r1.17) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLM019-cc9345ae4715327; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:56:06 -0500 References: <200701152316.l0FNFYeO082770@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:56:05 -0500 In-Reply-To: <200701152316.l0FNFYeO082770@net.indra.com> X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI MIME-Version: 1.0 From: tearoses@aol.com X-MB-Message-Type: User X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 22250 Received: from 68.143.196.38 by MBLK-D29.sysops.aol.com (205.188.149.21) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:56:05 -0500 Message-Id: <8C9086721401FCC-254-10F5@MBLK-D29.sysops.aol.com> X-AOL-IP: 205.188.149.21 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Shops in York, England X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 485105d7-0061-4076-a6d4-a3f91317fe11 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AE4756.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:57:59 -0500 (EST) Status: RO My husband and I went to York on our honeymoon two years ago, and we enjoyed the Castle Museum, which included exhibits about mourning in Victorian England and a clothing exhibit. Those exhibits might not be there anymore, but in the gift shop they had a booklet about two Victorian gowns in their collection. They also had a display of booklets that appeared to be local productions about things like the history of candlemaking or stuff like that. I loved York. We spent two days there and we didn't see half of what there was to see. It was much more enjoyable than London for us. Tea Rose Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:04:40 -0800 (PST) From: REBECCA BURCH Subject: [h-cost] Shops in York, England If anybody has any suggestions for places he can go while he is there, it would be greatly appreciated. I've instructed him to buy any postcards that have clothing or portraits on them, but we will see if he remembers. Rebecca Burch ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 13:20:32 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HIKNXw021144 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:20:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HIJW7F013176 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:20:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HIGdOJ011747 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:19:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HI7D8r059490; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:07:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HI6Skh058774 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:06:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H7FB8-00024v-CR; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:06:30 -0600 Received: from 160.36.154.221 ([160.36.154.221]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:06:30 -0500 Message-ID: <20070117130630.23mwsqfp4wow8kso@www.goldsword.com> Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:06:30 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32003] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php X-Source-Args: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php /usr/local/cpanel/base/horde/imp/compose.php X-Source-Dir: :/base/horde/imp X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] large post X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 66dbe491-5b97-4714-81ab-89ace5fee22d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AE68B4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:20:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I am *so* sorry. I was in the process of fixing the "to" line and the damn thing went to the whole list. You may smite me with limp noodles and everything else. I was *so* hoping that the list stripped attachments. *sigh* *very* red-faced, Susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 15:42:27 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HKgMuD025107 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:42:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HKfTgA006149 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:42:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HKeEED036181 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:40:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HKe3kV024107; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:40:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HKdQpW023486 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:39:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7D6800172; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:32:22 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:39:14 -0800 Message-ID: <002f01c73a77$8d529fb0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0HKdQpW023486 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8f5de644-a172-4efc-9e50-51a350ec35b0 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AE89FB.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:42:20 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I was a Tech theatre major, did some costuming, but really got interested five years ago when I got involved in the Renaissance and Dickens Fairs. The costume requirements are quite strict, so I got much more interested in "authentic" costume vs. "theatrical" costume. When I heard about this list last year, I joined. I'd never heard of the Costume Conventions before. One of the women I recently met is a co-founder (I think) of the Bay Area Costumers Guild, so I am learning more every day. Sharon -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Andrew T Trembley Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 12:47 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con On Jan 16, 2007, at 3:52 AM, Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > Oh, Yes, thanks. I live 30 miles from San Jose, so will definitely > go in > 2008! Well, registration is online at and full weekend adult membership is at $75 right now. The price will be going up after CC25 (I think at the end of April, actually). Are you involved with any of the Bay Area costume groups? Do you attend any of the historical costume events or conventions in the area? Just curious... -- andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen http://www.irlm.org/ - mailto:webmaster@irlm.org "Anybody who takes this seriously deserves to" -- Donna Barr _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 17 18:13:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HND8cd028647 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:13:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0HNCHr3008440 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:13:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0HNBkxq060541 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:11:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HNAwhn079754; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:11:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from py-out-1112.google.com (py-out-1112.google.com [64.233.166.183]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0HNA8cZ078930 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:10:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin@gmail.com) Received: by py-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id b50so8383pyh for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:10:08 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:from:to:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole; b=oEfgSgkiBKbOLoX7IB7fomWGEo/avOVx727rTnqoDQ6puB2WmNzloE0ZX73532nr5mhF+FfHh2bi4PY2E5S50jg2MJYb+YSaZ/xl7ARAJVufyK7J3Vjy86YHzHeeZD0+IaKuhC6KEmGIWiXFWlrQI+oFlDIiwLe5b98rwcUl//A= Received: by 10.35.134.19 with SMTP id l19mr239920pyn.1169075408242; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:10:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from p4audrey ( [10.254.2.204]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id 16sm191810nzo.2007.01.17.15.10.07; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:10:07 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:10:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Nanban trader... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: bf7b5b10-aa94-40ae-bbf1-c15239fa6256 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AEAD51.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:13:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi all! Friends of ours have invited us to join an encampment for a week-long event. They're a Japanese encampment, but were looking to include a couple of Portuguese "outsiders". They're looking for something like the so-called "nanban traders", around 1575-1600. Sooo... I've started looking for info. My first question, of course, is: what would they wear? I can find tons of information on Spain for these years (and gorgeous outfits too), but nothing on Portugal. Well... yes and no. Royalty seems to be interchangeable between Spain and Portugal at the time -- or is this just a case of my having not done enough research yet and getting the wrong impression? In any case, even if I can find portraits of royalty, this does not tell me what traders would be wearing. There is even less information about Macau (which would have been a logical base of operations for what I'm considering). Basically, I'm asking for pointers. If anybody has experience about those subjects and can suggest websites, books, patterns, even efficient Google search word combinations, I'd be very greatful. At present, I'm not turning up much except for a nice Wikipedia article. Which doesn't help me build clothing for two people for a week-long event! Thank you! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 02:42:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I7gJm5022447 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 02:42:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0I7fVJr012671 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 02:42:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0I7eR8A021853 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:40:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I7eIXc042610; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:40:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com (nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.44]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I7eEpI042501 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:40:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.137] Received: from [192.168.1.101] (adsl-69-107-64-137.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.137]) by nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com (8.13.8 out.dk.spool/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0I7e5pJ026720 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:40:05 -0600 Message-ID: <45AF24D5.4060505@frys.com> Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 23:42:13 -0800 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... References: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> In-Reply-To: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=21% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9f14f117-a3bc-48b5-9310-d3bf31f9a816 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AF24AC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 02:42:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > My first question, of course, is: what would they wear? I can find tons > of information on Spain for these years (and gorgeous outfits too), but > nothing on Portugal. Well... yes and no. Royalty seems to be > interchangeable between Spain and Portugal at the time -- or is this > just a case of my having not done enough research yet and getting the > wrong impression? I have a book of namban art, showing these folks thru Japanese eyes. How close to San Francisco do you live? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 03:06:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I86qf2030233 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:06:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0I861HG008611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:06:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0I85ht0024690 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:05:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I85fY7060648; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:05:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.227]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I85dg1060616 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:05:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so87397nzf for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:05:38 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole; b=lR0wiqN7aepCPNr2jApEua9bTccMlOeyVcmF/Wb6wL8HM2RSvuiFdKMQHKKhgx8Jb8McpUhrCpTMkswtJvj8e/zwcTJP9BsTO6JL5Z7t/R8/2mJlCSUO+wtfAICnlGsS1knY39F0clayNaiHLLgewQgI6Zl8XDpHa38tWEkxznQ= Received: by 10.65.191.7 with SMTP id t7mr396183qbp.1169107538644; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:05:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from p4audrey ( [74.56.114.215]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id e16sm395182qba.2007.01.18.00.05.38; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:05:38 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <132401c73ad7$714eae70$0202a8c0@p4audrey> From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> <45AF24D5.4060505@frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:05:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0a0e9543-27b4-4029-b5c7-8964dcd9239b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AF2A69.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:06:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > I have a book of namban art, showing these folks thru Japanese eyes. How > close to San Francisco do you live? Thanks for the offer, but I'm at the other end of the continent :-) Though you've already helped some, by writing "namban" instead of "nanban"... Now to do some more Googling... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 03:14:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8Ehre031484 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:14:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0I8Dqwt019519 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:14:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0I8DYcT025469 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:13:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8DWdG066303; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:13:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8DRXq066230 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:13:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from moreplentyn@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=rWgTx4xEFMfYJHnGI577q+hkf8aY5n4YGmPOZbK9A2MOMtN2xN7Ij8wWMlNwjp2c; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.167.255.247] (helo=boris) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H7SOl-0001Ro-22 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:13:27 -0500 Message-ID: <00c401c73ad8$9517a450$0200a8c0@boris> From: "Carmen Beaudry" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> <45AF24D5.4060505@frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:13:48 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-ELNK-Trace: 1a4a21053b62758bdb287b3a1c9ea9039ef193a6bfc3dd48543ed2c5f4e511f3c7fc9a09327be6d62601a10902912494350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.167.255.247 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4e98887f-486d-4227-93de-85470c96b0ad X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45AF2C40.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:14:41 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... >> My first question, of course, is: what would they wear? I can find tons >> of information on Spain for these years (and gorgeous outfits too), but >> nothing on Portugal. Well... yes and no. Royalty seems to be >> interchangeable between Spain and Portugal at the time -- or is this >> just a case of my having not done enough research yet and getting the >> wrong impression? Here's some artwork from Japan showing the traders. http://gallery.sjsu.edu/encounters/orient/orient-Thumb.00003.html Melusine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 03:23:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8NJEt001811 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:23:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0I8MX4K027255 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:23:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0I8MAA6026355 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:22:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8M97D072320; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:22:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.237]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8M6Ao072285 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:22:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so90230nzf for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:22:05 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole; b=OR5aW5KQ3lW/RDc0Q3xA0yYL9eDu4EIQlMPRYWY3MFSDyTZr+hxebbya1VaXwtxu3cgDd2apJHROioOU47a+xsjqXJWvQ9BcfVXr8aElwgQtewXYEYlXQnZHiiC/a3TebTDh2jmPZObHoAdaCAGKG6pChVEQVCXdpTS/xOggD/U= Received: by 10.64.27.7 with SMTP id a7mr414669qba.1169108525701; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:22:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from p4audrey ( [74.56.114.215]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id f14sm420127qba.2007.01.18.00.22.05; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:22:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <132c01c73ad9$bdb071c0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey><45AF24D5.4060505@frys.com> <00c401c73ad8$9517a450$0200a8c0@boris> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:22:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0069b026-81db-4b41-808c-8a6fc1a6e3ec X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AF2E49.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:23:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Here's some artwork from Japan showing the traders. > > http://gallery.sjsu.edu/encounters/orient/orient-Thumb.00003.html > > Melusine This is cool. I found a whole bunch of images on Wikipedia too. But did you notice there are no women? Not even one! Every time I think I've spotted one, I realize it's just a man in poofy pants. *grumble*... There must have been *some* kind of woman, at *some* point, who came on one of those ships! :-P But thanks! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 03:48:36 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8mWxo003717 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:48:36 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0I8lfG4022639 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:48:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0I8l70E028815 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:47:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8l4hZ088423; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:47:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I8l1Bf088380 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 01:47:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from moreplentyn@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=cCZNNJVZiagLnCIoeI1ypkRIQKUJ8xmU9rSqAtsP18a7MM4IJN7dwRWxvbY/pash; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.167.255.247] (helo=boris) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H7SvE-0002m7-Uf for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:47:01 -0500 Message-ID: <00e201c73add$4597d3f0$0200a8c0@boris> From: "Carmen Beaudry" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:47:22 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-ELNK-Trace: 1a4a21053b62758bdb287b3a1c9ea9039ef193a6bfc3dd48136a8d8120cbd63e0ab33f2bd958ddfe10ec827ca34601a1350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.167.255.247 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Portugese costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 04b83e83-9b62-4d8a-a838-91664134ea4c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AF342D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:48:29 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0I8mWxo003717 Status: RO http://www.jessamynscloset.com/homepage.html A bunch of images and info about Spanish and Portugese costume. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 04:46:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I9jmsv013300 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:45:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0I9j2T7027448 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:45:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0I9iZru035430 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 02:44:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I9iXYP027701; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 02:44:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mf3k.socket.net [216.106.88.98]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0I9iUUQ027672 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 02:44:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 3C5F53D554 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:44:30 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:44:35 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] man's coat X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: cb3b91a6-2d8e-4bbb-a55c-28bc7b27bd8b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AF419E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:45:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thought some would like to see this. http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_32.htm De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 05:28:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IASEPu022440 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:28:18 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IARNoE017509 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:28:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IAQia7040934 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:26:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IAQdXW059913; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:26:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep31.mail.dk (fep31.mail.dk [80.160.76.195]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IAQZC0059770 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:26:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep41.mail.dk ([195.41.46.142]) by fep31.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070118102627.SCSP2913.fep31.mail.dk@fep41.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:26:27 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.144]) by fep41.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070118102627.UKKM20909.fep41.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:26:27 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c73aeb$1e07c620$9043a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] man's coat Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:26:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep41.mail.dk from [80.161.67.144] at Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:26:22 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4874b36e-1638-49f2-a158-1e05a16605f9 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AF4B8B.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:28:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Oh gosh, Thanks for posting :-) Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 10:44 AM Subject: [h-cost] man's coat > Thought some would like to see this. > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_32.htm > > De > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 06:12:03 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IBC2os027971 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:12:02 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IBBBk5021013 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:11:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IBAlqq045606 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:10:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IBAipE088540; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:10:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m23.mx.aol.com (imo-m23.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.4]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IBAfaH088450 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:10:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cf0.769d1c6 (42809) for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:10:33 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:10:31 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] man's coat To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5358 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8ba45949-36b5-4b34-bc40-4b8b16883365 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AF55CF.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:12:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/18/2007 5:28:46 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: Oh gosh, Thanks for posting :-) Will you be making one like it, Bjarne? Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 06:32:18 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IBWDWi000372 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:32:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IBVQq3031445 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:32:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IBUnnt047508 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:30:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IBUlQ6002775; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:30:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep32.mail.dk (fep32.mail.dk [80.160.76.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IBUgnl002696 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:30:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep42.mail.dk ([195.41.46.225]) by fep32.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070118113042.XPTB17942.fep32.mail.dk@fep42.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:30:42 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.144]) by fep42.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070118113041.UMWN18380.fep42.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:30:41 +0100 Message-ID: <000401c73af4$148c78d0$9043a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] man's coat Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:30:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep42.mail.dk from [80.161.67.144] at Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:30:33 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fb198d8d-69fb-44c4-b48c-3495dba9abf8 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AF5A8F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:32:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I am making one like it, off cause not the same pattern. You know the yellow embroidered waistcoat i made? I am making it a matching jacket in shot green and yellow silk taffeta with the same pattern as the waistcoat. Its on my frame right now, have done 6 pattern repeats, and soon have to moove it for the lower part of the jacket. But as always i never have time to make for myself, because people wants me to make their dresses. Have 2 dresses i must finnish before spring. You can see my progress here: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/2006suit.htm I named it as my 2006 embroidery projekt, but look now it is 2007, and its still the same :-( The jacket on the website is made with tambour tecknique, and i cant do it, have tryed but! I do have silk wich would be very suitable for this jacket, but you know, i have promissed myself to finish all my UFO´s before starting new things. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 12:10 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] man's coat > > In a message dated 1/18/2007 5:28:46 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: > > Oh gosh, > Thanks for posting :-) > > > > Will you be making one like it, Bjarne? > > Ann Wass > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 07:03:23 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IC3MGM009242 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:03:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IC2VVO013827 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:03:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IC1vxk052762 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:01:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IC1ub0028747; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:01:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep33.mail.dk (fep33.mail.dk [80.160.76.197]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IC1pke028620 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:01:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep44.mail.dk ([195.41.46.227]) by fep33.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070118120146.HEM14704.fep33.mail.dk@fep44.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:01:46 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.144]) by fep44.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070118120145.UMXK11319.fep44.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:01:45 +0100 Message-ID: <000a01c73af8$6f3ae6a0$9043a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:01:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep44.mail.dk from [80.161.67.144] at Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:01:43 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] ot/cat on a hot tin roof X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8e71ac9c-8ceb-43fa-98e6-2f7c470c51f0 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AF61D7.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:03:20 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Do you know how it is when you know the post wil come to you today with a packet of things you have longed for a long time? I have it like that today. Awaiting a large packet with cotton laces from a scottish lace factory. I have ordered home for more than 700 pounds sterling and i cant get much made today. And then the work you have to do is so tedious and uninterresting. Marking in the rows for crinoline steel in a hoop. This time i want to try and make the hoop with padded panels along the top bones, in order to keep the tension of the side extensions nice and smooth for the skirts. I have looked very close after a fashion print of Galleries des Modes where a millinery lady is delivering goods, amungst other things a hoop wich she carries under her arms. Also the small hoop from V&A has padding, so i guess its ok to do it. When i get my laces, i think i am going to explode of excitement. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 08:33:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IDXqxg015447 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:33:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IDX5dR006914 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:33:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IDWP1Z064836 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:32:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IDWLDT098818; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:32:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s19.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s19.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IDWIII098677 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:32:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.140.119]) by bay0-omc1-s19.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:32:13 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:32:12 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 65.55.140.123 by by135fd.bay135.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:32:08 GMT X-Originating-IP: [198.166.214.5] X-Originating-Email: [estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com] X-Sender: estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <000a01c73af8$6f3ae6a0$9043a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Kelly Grant" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] ot/cat on a hot tin roof Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:32:08 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Jan 2007 13:32:12.0462 (UTC) FILETIME=[0F8554E0:01C73B05] X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: eb444342-6faf-48d9-a95a-d476d91c2280 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AF7711.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:33:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I had that kind of day yesterday...a day of waiting for things to arrive so I could work. Unfortunately, I was at work, so couldn't even work on home projects! Keep plugging along with that hoop, it'll be beautiful when it's done. Kelly An insolent reply from a polite person is a bad sign. Hippocrates (c.460-c.370 bc), Greek physician >From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: >Subject: [h-cost] ot/cat on a hot tin roof >Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:01:47 +0100 > >Do you know how it is when you know the post wil come to you today with a >packet of things you have longed for a long time? >I have it like that today. Awaiting a large packet with cotton laces from a >scottish lace factory. I have ordered home for more than 700 pounds >sterling and i cant get much made today. >And then the work you have to do is so tedious and uninterresting. Marking >in the rows for crinoline steel in a hoop. >This time i want to try and make the hoop with padded panels along the top >bones, in order to keep the tension of the side extensions nice and smooth >for the skirts. >I have looked very close after a fashion print of Galleries des Modes where >a millinery lady is delivering goods, amungst other things a hoop wich she >carries under her arms. Also the small hoop from V&A has padding, so i >guess its ok to do it. >When i get my laces, i think i am going to explode of excitement. > >Bjarne > > > > > > >Leif og Bjarne Drews >www.my-drewscostumes.dk > >http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _________________________________________________________________ Don’t waste time standing in line—try shopping online. Visit Sympatico / MSN Shopping today! http://shopping.sympatico.msn.ca _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 08:55:11 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IDtB4b016315 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:55:11 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IDsP04018131 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:55:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IDrZqX068111 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:53:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IDrUL2018502; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:53:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s12.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s12.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.148]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IDqfvr017682 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:53:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.16]) by bay0-omc2-s12.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:52:36 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 05:52:35 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV6.phx.gbl with DAV; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:52:30 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey><45AF24D5.4060505@frys.com><00c401c73ad8$9517a450$0200a8c0@boris> <132c01c73ad9$bdb071c0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:52:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 Seal-Send-Time: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:52:35 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Jan 2007 13:52:35.0571 (UTC) FILETIME=[E88CF430:01C73B07] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b2cd8481-da75-4da1-8def-6470f8729c29 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AF7C11.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:55:09 -0500 (EST) Status: RO There are a whole bunch of women if you go to the next few pages. Very cool, thank you for sharing! Sg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 1:22 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... > This is cool. I found a whole bunch of images on Wikipedia too. But did > you > notice there are no women? Not even one! Every time I think I've spotted > one, I realize it's just a man in poofy pants. *grumble*... There must > have > been *some* kind of woman, at *some* point, who came on one of those > ships! > :-P > > But thanks! > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 09:41:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IEf5xv018239 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:41:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IEeEGQ014628 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:41:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IEd463076114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:39:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IEcjd0061104; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:38:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IEcEAl060694 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:38:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m123.in-tch.com [216.166.191.123]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l0IEP7J17364 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:25:08 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <001001c73b0f$8214d4e0$7bbfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] man's coat Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:46:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3b3c7c4d-5f77-4943-b8c4-206a62b46b19 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45AF86CE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:41:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO That is very cool! It reminds me a *lot* of the stuff that Bjarne does! --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 2:44 AM Subject: [h-cost] man's coat > Thought some would like to see this. > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_32.htm > > De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 09:48:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IEmJic018520 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:48:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IElRJX024795 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:48:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IEjN8h077209 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:45:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IEjMlj067568; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:45:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net (ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net [166.102.165.166]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IEjIWj067429 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:45:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bmatney@alltel.net) Received: from ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net ([162.40.180.8]) by ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20070118144506.OREE3711.ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net@ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net> for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:45:06 -0600 Received: from emachine_T4155.alltel.net ([162.40.180.8]) by ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20070118144505.CXKZ6240.ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net@emachine_T4155.alltel.net> for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:45:05 -0600 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20070118084314.028b9150@mail.alltel.net> X-Sender: bmatney@mail.alltel.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:44:55 -0600 To: From: Beth and Bob Matney Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] missing digest X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 501e6612-1005-4608-9745-cf4295b79f0d X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AF887F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:48:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO For some reason I'm not getting the H-Costume Digests reliably. The problem began with h-costume Digest, Vol 6, Issue 28 and they have since been coming in random order or missing completely. Could someone send h-costume Digest, Vol 6, Issue 34 to me? Thanks. Beth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 10:10:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IFATGv019541 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:10:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IF9hYZ005625 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:10:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IF9Gcb081935 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:09:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IF9BXC091605; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:09:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.146.182.96]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0IF9627091427 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:09:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katherinejsanders@yahoo.co.uk) Received: (qmail 46539 invoked by uid 60001); 18 Jan 2007 15:09:00 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.co.uk; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=GvsHr9HaIOsPbC2o/uy7CgIZp2CUP3AAGrQgdAEyTIFDEeTnem7frOUJahI6yC95ur+jFz6f4EzQtxpqaGLawXnmPAcsfexXLbuWMqUQeOMO7rrY11gL64DmGeqO762KWL3wRd1jx5V/ZX08mJyzwNldhWKjfszfvbTXcOgZU+E= ; Message-ID: <20070118150900.46537.qmail@web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.155.204.82] by web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:09:00 GMT Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:09:00 +0000 (GMT) From: katherine sanders To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: o/t cat on a hot tin roof X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2dd4f352-8a3a-4374-bb2e-b31bb5845a9d X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45AF8DB7.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:10:27 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0IFATGv019541 Status: RO Dear Bjarne . >This time i want to try and make the hoop with padded panels along the top >bones, in order to keep the tension of the side extensions nice and smooth >for the skirts. >I have looked very close after a fashion print of Galleries des Modes where >a millinery lady is delivering goods, amungst other things a hoop wich she >carries under her arms. Also the small hoop from V&A has padding, so i guess >its ok to do it. Is this on 18C panier? I am intrigued - I am going to make a toile of the french 'panier' shown in Waugh, where she shows two panels (which I presume are the same for front and back) then a sort of triangle which gets made into the waist ties... It's not very clear but she doesn't mention padding! It would make sense though, to keep the sides smooth as you say. >When i get my laces, i think i am going to explode of excitement. >From here in Scotland? Oo - do post a picture when they arrive, it sounds very exciting and today we have snow and rain, so it needs brightening up with something pretty! p.s. I am going to buy the red brocade with silver motifs :-) ___________________________________________________________ What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Yahoo! Mail Championship. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 10:46:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IFjrqi020728 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:45:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IFix7p026269 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:45:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IFiKtx087782 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:44:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IFiEXv026246; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:44:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IFi7fl026040 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:44:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.39]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 18 Jan 2007 15:31:48 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAMokr0XUSnInk2dsb2JhbACNWQECBw4HBxw Received: from 88-107-104-136.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.104.136]:2912 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1H7ZEy-000FVg-BI for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:31:48 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070118153021.03586d08@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:31:48 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: o/t cat on a hot tin roof In-Reply-To: <20070118150900.46537.qmail@web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <20070118150900.46537.qmail@web27206.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 36458e39-2f8f-4688-88aa-cbb8228e5d94 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AF95FC.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:45:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 15:09 18/01/2007, you wrote: >Dear Bjarne . >This time i want to try and make the hoop with padded >panels along the top >bones, in order to keep the tension of the >side extensions nice and smooth >for the skirts. >I have looked very >close after a fashion print of Galleries des Modes where >a >millinery lady is delivering goods, amungst other things a hoop wich >she >carries under her arms. Also the small hoop from V&A has >padding, so i guess >its ok to do it. Is this on 18C panier? I am >intrigued - I am going to make a toile of the french 'panier' shown >in Waugh, where she shows two panels (which I presume are the same >for front and back) then a sort of triangle which gets made into the >waist ties... It's not very clear but she doesn't mention padding! >It would make sense though, to keep the sides smooth as you >say. >When i get my laces, i think i am going to explode of >excitement. >From here in Scotland? Oo - do post a picture when they >arrive, it sounds very exciting and today we have snow and rain, so >it needs brightening up with something pretty! p.s. I am going to >buy the red brocade with silver motifs >Katherine I have a made up pannier from the Waugh pattern if you want any help. E-mail me off list if I can. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 12:03:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IH3FVT023740 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:03:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IH2Onx008723 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:03:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IH1RnA005581 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:01:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IH1Asl012279; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:01:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cluster1.echolabs.net (smtp-out.echolabs.net [216.52.118.200]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IFJDRD001495 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:19:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from basyefelton@floodcity.net) X-Scanned-By: RAE MPP/Cloudmark http://www.messagepartners.com X-Scanned-On: fe2 X-Scanned-By: RAE MPP/Clamd http://www.messagepartners.com Received: from [64.186.88.54] (account basyefelton@floodcity.net) by blade02.cluster1.echolabs.net (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 5.0.13) with HTTP id 576128 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:19:07 -0500 From: "Kirsten Felton" To: h-costume@indra.com X-Mailer: CommuniGate Pro WebUser v5.0.13 Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:19:07 -0500 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200701181354.l0IDsUko019858@net.indra.com> References: <200701181354.l0IDsUko019858@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 19th cen Knitting pattern help X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c3dc1b8a-0836-4faa-a17a-92cdfea6f9ed X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AFA820.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:03:13 -0500 (EST) Status: RO http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/cw/1864sontag.html could someone comment on what yarn would be a good substitute for Zephyr in this pattern? I'm wondering if we are talking something like fingering yarn? Angora? I'm aware this is probably not still available, but what would make a similar garment, not necessarily period correct, but just as pleasing. thanks, kitty _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 12:44:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IHiTVe024990 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:44:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IHhctK015336 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:44:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IHgpZH016503 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:42:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IHgfat059837; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:42:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.227]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IHgZso059726 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:42:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so215759nzf for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:42:34 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole; b=ucvu31in3i4/+TaR+YTy8tMUEEJpl/yvo9UmKrtCG7TEipT+TFEdYc+GAhU6aiTBU8NDIPHCJpzZ2GoP1nEXOiSrrTEGiprQO+nGG6JjlhTMUybTENXhj3Raxq0ifkhBF9eNYgJCjmPCvP8PaTbPqSzkdlKDe6KJKQlw9UBtnQU= Received: by 10.65.224.11 with SMTP id b11mr1310342qbr.1169142153701; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:42:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from p4audrey ( [74.56.114.215]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id q18sm1131339qbq.2007.01.18.09.42.33; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:42:33 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <13b701c73b28$098a07c0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey><45AF24D5.4060505@frys.com><00c401c73ad8$9517a450$0200a8c0@boris><132c01c73ad9$bdb071c0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:42:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f905f801-de84-4637-922e-d77ee2edcc3c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AFB1CA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:44:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hmm... but I need them to be 1600-ish... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 8:52 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... > There are a whole bunch of women if you go to the next few pages. > Very cool, thank you for sharing! > > Sg > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 1:22 AM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... > >> This is cool. I found a whole bunch of images on Wikipedia too. But did >> you >> notice there are no women? Not even one! Every time I think I've spotted >> one, I realize it's just a man in poofy pants. *grumble*... There must >> have >> been *some* kind of woman, at *some* point, who came on one of those >> ships! >> :-P >> >> But thanks! >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 15:19:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IKJEig030566 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:19:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0IKINr9024291 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:19:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0IKHKDD049794 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:17:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IKGpA8037366; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:16:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.117]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0IJlhn7003894 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:47:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Kiloran@worldnet.att.net) Received: from sharplaptop.worldnet.att.net (h-68-164-134-18.lsanca54.dynamic.covad.net[68.164.134.18]) by worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc13) with SMTP id <200701181947351130044r72e>; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 19:47:35 +0000 Message-Id: <6.2.0.14.0.20070118114320.022e9d10@ipostoffice.worldnet.att.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.0.14 Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:47:32 -0800 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Kiloran@worldnet.att.net In-Reply-To: <200701181901.l0IJ0rTi051395@net.indra.com> References: <200701181901.l0IJ0rTi051395@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 6, Issue 37 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c19030f2-1a17-405c-ae1b-4d3985e1c7a4 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45AFD60F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:19:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 11:01 AM 1/18/2007, you wrote: >Message: 4 >Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:19:07 -0500 >From: "Kirsten Felton" >Subject: [h-cost] 19th cen Knitting pattern help >To: h-costume@indra.com >Message-ID: >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed" > > >http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/cw/1864sontag.html > >could someone comment on what yarn would be a good >substitute for Zephyr in this pattern? I'm wondering if >we are talking something like fingering yarn? Angora? >I'm aware this is probably not still available, but what >would make a similar garment, not necessarily period >correct, but just as pleasing. > >thanks, kitty I don't know if this is the same yarn, but it might be a good substitute: http://www.theknitter.com/yarn-yagger-spun-zephyr-wool-silk.html However, I do have a question about the pattern. It seems to start in the middle of the instructions. Row 1 starts with "3 dc". Where's the foundation chain? What do you do the 3 double crochet =in=? It says "repeat to the end of the row" but they never told you how to start the row in the first place. Very confusing. Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 16:20:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ILKjl7032458 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:20:45 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ILJrw7031201 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:20:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ILHr59060449 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 14:17:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ILHac3001481; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 14:17:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from metis.sjsu.edu (metis.sjsu.edu [130.65.3.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ILHUMO001253 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 14:17:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from attrembl@bovil.com) Received: from [130.65.37.136] (sjs-130-65-37-136.sjsu.edu [130.65.37.136]) by metis.sjsu.edu (8.12.10+Sun/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ILHNYa020814 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:17:23 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <002f01c73a77$8d529fb0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> References: <002f01c73a77$8d529fb0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <92A52FD1-B263-4C97-AAFC-DC42266E1EDB@bovil.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Andrew T Trembley Subject: GBACG Open House (was Re: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 13:17:20 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8ff27edc-9347-4492-bf8c-72ee5fa65922 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45AFE47A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:20:43 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 17, 2007, at 12:39 PM, Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > I was a Tech theatre major, did some costuming, but really got > interested > five years ago when I got involved in the Renaissance and Dickens > Fairs. The > costume requirements are quite strict, so I got much more > interested in > "authentic" costume vs. "theatrical" costume. When I heard about > this list > last year, I joined. I'd never heard of the Costume Conventions > before. One > of the women I recently met is a co-founder (I think) of the Bay Area > Costumers Guild, so I am learning more every day. So, on the off chance you didn't know, the Greater Bay Area Costumers Guild is having it's open house on January 28 in San Francisco: andy -- andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen http://www.irlm.org/ - mailto:webmaster@irlm.org "Anybody who takes this seriously deserves to" -- Donna Barr _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 18 18:30:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0INUdub003661 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 18:30:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0INTm1m018668 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 18:30:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0INTBBv082369 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:29:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0INT4vr034341; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:29:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0INSw54034192 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:29:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1111BA0370; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 23:21:53 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: GBACG Open House (was Re: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:28:49 -0800 Message-ID: <000b01c73b58$682f2730$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <92A52FD1-B263-4C97-AAFC-DC42266E1EDB@bovil.com> X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f94ce5d9-e37e-4fb1-8ba1-07253989640d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B002EC.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 18:30:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Oooooh, thanks! S. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Andrew T Trembley Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 1:17 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: GBACG Open House (was Re: [h-cost] Re: "Hero" costume at Costume Con On Jan 17, 2007, at 12:39 PM, Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > I was a Tech theatre major, did some costuming, but really got > interested > five years ago when I got involved in the Renaissance and Dickens > Fairs. The > costume requirements are quite strict, so I got much more > interested in > "authentic" costume vs. "theatrical" costume. When I heard about > this list > last year, I joined. I'd never heard of the Costume Conventions > before. One > of the women I recently met is a co-founder (I think) of the Bay Area > Costumers Guild, so I am learning more every day. So, on the off chance you didn't know, the Greater Bay Area Costumers Guild is having it's open house on January 28 in San Francisco: andy -- andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen http://www.irlm.org/ - mailto:webmaster@irlm.org "Anybody who takes this seriously deserves to" -- Donna Barr _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 01:50:39 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0J6odYR015558 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 01:50:39 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0J6nmgR030495 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 01:50:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0J6nGMF039497 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 18 Jan 2007 23:49:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0J6n7xv042817; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 23:49:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc15.comcast.net (rwcrmhc15.comcast.net [204.127.192.85]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0J6n3fg042737 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 23:49:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc15) with SMTP id <20070119064857m1500bp485e>; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:48:58 +0000 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-Id: <9B6423F6-A45D-4743-928B-FC12FE01D795@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 01:48:54 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Aprons (again) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8776f1f8-1d8b-40c1-a5e5-19a28c451b33 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B06A0C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 01:50:37 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0J6odYR015558 Status: RO It looks like waist-height aprons were often a square of linen with the top corners tied behind the back. In these Manesse Codex aprons, the smiths' aprons look as if they could be tied like napkins around the neck. The seed-sower here in October of The Tres Riches Heures du Duc de Barry http://humanities.uchicago.edu/images/heures/october.jpg is definitely wearing some kind of simple square or rectangle tied round the neck. But this seed-sower seems to have a more constructed version: http://classes.bnf.fr/idrisi/grand/1_04.htm (Peasants in the field in Le Régime des princes) A woman blacksmith and a man in The Holkham Bible Picture Book c. 1327-1335, http://www.bl.uk/learning/images/medieval/year/ large2163.html, seem to have aprons where the napkin has been slashed somehow to provide shoulder straps and waist ties. Does anyone have any thoughts on how these bib aprons might have been shaped or constructed? Thanks for your thoughts. Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 13, 2007, at 3:51 PM, otsisto wrote: > And the Manesse Codex but men. > 1340 > http://www.tempora-nostra.de/tempora-nostra/manesse.php?id=203&tfl=124 > > But not the waist tie ones. > De > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 08:18:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JDIJlm022980 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:18:23 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JDHXYQ028029 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:18:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JDGmx2082136 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:16:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JDGeQo091576; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:16:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com (nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0J3sgvL033858 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 20:54:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.50.166] Received: from [192.168.1.103] (adsl-69-107-50-166.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.50.166]) by nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com (8.13.8 out.dk.spool/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0J3s7k6009197 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 21:54:17 -0600 Message-ID: <45B04168.8070506@frys.com> Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 19:56:24 -0800 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... References: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey><45AF24D5.4060505@frys.com> <00c401c73ad8$9517a450$0200a8c0@boris> <132c01c73ad9$bdb071c0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> In-Reply-To: <132c01c73ad9$bdb071c0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=11% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 67a670be-1fb5-4a1e-9694-419cf4b80451 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B0C4ED.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:18:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO But did > you notice there are no women? Not even one! Every time I think I've > spotted one, I realize it's just a man in poofy pants. *grumble*... > There must have been *some* kind of woman, at *some* point, who came on > one of those ships! :-P I think it was against Japanese law of the time for there to be namban women in Japan. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 08:18:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JDIxYV023016 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:18:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JDIBfo007882 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:18:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JDHsEL082289 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:17:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JDHrWo092384; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:17:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com (nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0J3tjso034495 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 20:55:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.50.166] Received: from [192.168.1.103] (adsl-69-107-50-166.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.50.166]) by nlpi029.sbcis.sbc.com (8.13.8 out.dk.spool/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0J3tBdg021876 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 21:55:20 -0600 Message-ID: <45B041AC.1080008@frys.com> Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 19:57:32 -0800 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... References: <009d01c73a8c$a1bd2af0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> <45AF24D5.4060505@frys.com> <132401c73ad7$714eae70$0202a8c0@p4audrey> In-Reply-To: <132401c73ad7$714eae70$0202a8c0@p4audrey> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=11% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 052977e5-1cef-4c57-815b-0118cc5725bc X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B0C514.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:18:57 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Though you've already helped some, by writing "namban" instead of > "nanban"... Now to do some more Googling... > _____________________________________________ nam ban = southern barbarian viet nam - southern provence _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 08:20:48 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JDKmpF023076 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:20:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JDJvoj026027 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:20:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JDJfdB082816 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:19:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JDJe05094336; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 06:19:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m14.mx.aol.com (imo-m14.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JCYZsG063818 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 05:34:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d48.3c4f1b (43931) for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 07:34:21 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 07:34:19 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] American Civil War To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5358 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 14a10553-b79c-4ce5-aef5-a0456b0b918d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B0C57D.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:20:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I found the reference to Judith Lopez's work on buttonhole closures: a short report, "Buttonholes: Some Differences in Gender-related Front Closures," In Dress, vol. 20, 1993. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 12:23:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JHNmqo032019 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:23:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JHMusj011391 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:23:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JHMHEb017218 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:22:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JHM0Lv012985; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:22:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from outbound-mail.nyc.untd.com (outbound-mail.nyc.untd.com [64.136.20.164]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0JHLtxI012820 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:21:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penhalion@juno.com) Received: from webmail42.nyc.untd.com (webmail42.nyc.untd.com [10.141.27.182]) by smtpout03.nyc.untd.com with SMTP id AABC5B9S6ARJD852 for (sender ); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 09:21:32 -0800 (PST) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: fRRJgEOSsRehnOwCpkfn770uB/LC4nQf6xakUly4c0MlZ2fsPEDtVw== Received: (from penhalion@juno.com) by webmail42.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id MCGC39MG; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 09:21:20 PST Received: from [24.14.76.2] by webmail42.nyc.untd.com with HTTP: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:20:47 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.14.76.2] Mime-Version: 1.0 From: "penhalion@juno.com" Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:20:47 GMT To: h-costume@indra.com X-Mailer: Webmail Version 4.0 Message-Id: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> X-ContentStamp: 1:1:3266499859 X-MAIL-INFO: 5aed2095203d355479b55439b09061c060040db12504451d0c2df569254d3520452d45d5b1b435 X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 10.141.27.182|webmail42.nyc.untd.com|webmail42.nyc.untd.com|penhalion@juno.com X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Looking For Fabric Info X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 196137b9-06e7-4103-884b-8ab2465a7d26 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B0FE70.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:23:46 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0JHNmqo032019 Status: RO I was wondering if the amazingly knowledgable folks on this list could give me some feedback on what eras a woolen fabric would be appropriate for? I have a picture of it posted at my LiveJournal for those interested in taking a look. It's wool, the colors are good for most eras, and the slightly open twill is good for most of the eras I'd want to make. I'm just not sure about the overall look of the fabric. Opinions? http://seamstrix.livejournal.com/ Karen Seamstrix _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 12:59:23 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JHxNRI000600 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:59:23 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JHwaeE017407 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:59:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JHujJH023129 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:56:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JHud7h050460; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:56:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp1.mc.surewest.net (qsmtp.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.145]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0JHuMdH050130 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:56:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 28005 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2007 09:56:14 -0800 Received: by simscan 1.1.0 ppid: 27851, pid: 27917, t: 11.1547s scanners: regex: 1.1.0 attach: 1.1.0 clamav: 0.84/m:42/d:2451 spam: 3.0.3 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21.surewest.net) (64.30.124.102) by qsmtp1 with SMTP; 19 Jan 2007 09:56:02 -0800 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070119095447.025d4b60@surewest.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 09:55:58 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking For Fabric Info In-Reply-To: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> References: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.3 (2005-04-27) on qsmtp1.surewest.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.3 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 58bc95ef-2ac6-4cf0-9c63-feede7e1f279 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B106CD.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:59:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 09:20 AM 1/19/2007, you wrote: >I was wondering if the amazingly knowledgable folks on this list >could give me some feedback on what eras a woolen fabric would be >appropriate for? I have a picture of it posted at my LiveJournal for >those interested in taking a look. It's wool, the colors are good >for most eras, and the slightly open twill is good for most of the >eras I'd want to make. I'm just not sure about the overall look of >the fabric. Opinions? > >http://seamstrix.livejournal.com/ > >Karen >Seamstrix I would not hesitate to use it for 19th century outerwear, but I would not be comfortable using it for, say, Elizabethan. Joan Jurancich joanmj@surewest.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 13:14:57 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JIEvFa001005 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:14:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JIEBq6013137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:14:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JICYm2026234 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 11:12:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JICPVl069178; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 11:12:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from server020.dfw.nationwide.net (server020.dfw.nationwide.net [206.123.129.83]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0JICGvu069003 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 11:12:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 4948 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2007 18:12:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO spamfilter.nationwide.net) (127.0.0.1) by server020.dfw.nationwide.net with SMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:12:13 +0000 Received: from 162.119.64.110 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by spamfilter.nationwide.net with HTTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:12:13 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <2813.162.119.64.110.1169230333.squirrel@spamfilter.nationwide.net> In-Reply-To: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> References: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:12:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking For Fabric Info From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 375f4f46-69b9-4691-817d-e92fe356b5e6 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B10A73.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:14:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO To me, the colors and overall look of the pattern is fine but looking closely at the weave pattern, it looks very modern. Diana > > I was wondering if the amazingly knowledgable folks on this list could > give me some feedback on what eras a woolen fabric would be appropriate > for? I have a picture of it posted at my LiveJournal for those interested > in taking a look. It's wool, the colors are good for most eras, and the > slightly open twill is good for most of the eras I'd want to make. I'm > just not sure about the overall look of the fabric. Opinions? > > http://seamstrix.livejournal.com/ > > Karen > Seamstrix > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- www.RenaissanceFabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" "Become the change you want to see in the world." --Ghandi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 14:05:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJ5PrZ002577 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:05:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JJ4Yl2018733 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:05:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JJ3naq036469 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:03:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJ3Pcn029459; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:03:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJ36s4029092 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:03:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.42) id 1H7z0z-000DEn-7L for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:03:05 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:01:44 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons (again) References: <9B6423F6-A45D-4743-928B-FC12FE01D795@comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <9B6423F6-A45D-4743-928B-FC12FE01D795@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1;format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Turnpike/6.06-U () X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9d0501a6-78be-469d-a015-9896ec9865c2 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B11642.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:05:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO These make me wonder whether the supposedly square / rectangular waist aprons, without a separate waistband, are extended in a similar way to provide ties. You need an extremely large square to be able to just tie the corners around your waist. But it does seem very wasteful if they are cut in one piece as they seem to be. Jean Lauren Walker wrote >It looks like waist-height aprons were often a square of linen with >the top corners tied behind the back. In these Manesse Codex aprons, >the smiths' aprons look as if they could be tied like napkins around >the neck. > >The seed-sower here in October of The Tres Riches Heures du Duc de Barry >http://humanities.uchicago.edu/images/heures/october.jpg is definitely >wearing some kind of simple square or rectangle tied round the neck. > >But this seed-sower seems to have a more constructed version: >http://classes.bnf.fr/idrisi/grand/1_04.htm >(Peasants in the field in Le Régime des princes) > >A woman blacksmith and a man in The Holkham Bible Picture Book c. >1327-1335, http://www.bl.uk/learning/images/medieval/year/ >large2163.html, seem to have aprons where the napkin has been slashed >somehow to provide shoulder straps and waist ties. > >Does anyone have any thoughts on how these bib aprons might have been >shaped or constructed? > >Thanks for your thoughts. >Lauren >Lauren M. Walker >lauren.walker@comcast.net > > > >On Jan 13, 2007, at 3:51 PM, otsisto wrote: > >> And the Manesse Codex but men. >> 1340 >> http://www.tempora-nostra.de/tempora-nostra/manesse.php?id=203&tfl=124 >> >> But not the waist tie ones. >> De >> > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 14:30:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJUAkl003346 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:30:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JJTJ3I006699 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:30:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JJSkHC040679 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:28:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJSd5a058205; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:28:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2a.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJSVe8058019 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:28:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 36DC33547A for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:28:29 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Looking For Fabric Info Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:28:38 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <2813.162.119.64.110.1169230333.squirrel@spamfilter.nationwide.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 12785702-1d53-42e1-94c1-0e08f812e830 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B11C0F.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:30:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I believe that twill can be found in the Nordic culture 1000s. All I can say is the pattern looks feasable. They were creating intricate woven bands, I do not see why they would not be able to create this pattern. Maybe this will help some. http://www.vikingagevessels.org/documents/C_%20Viking%20Womens%20Costume.pdf De -----Original Message----- To me, the colors and overall look of the pattern is fine but looking closely at the weave pattern, it looks very modern. Diana > > I was wondering if the amazingly knowledgable folks on this list could > give me some feedback on what eras a woolen fabric would be appropriate > for? I have a picture of it posted at my LiveJournal for those interested > in taking a look. It's wool, the colors are good for most eras, and the > slightly open twill is good for most of the eras I'd want to make. I'm > just not sure about the overall look of the fabric. Opinions? > > http://seamstrix.livejournal.com/ > > Karen > Seamstrix _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 14:50:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJoiIX003965 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:50:44 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JJnqlI002513 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:50:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JJn7Kj044477 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:49:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJn3Cn080435; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:49:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [216.148.227.151]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJmwbe080272 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:49:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with SMTP id <20070119194852m1100rh52ne>; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:48:52 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: <9B6423F6-A45D-4743-928B-FC12FE01D795@comcast.net> Message-Id: <2AFAC652-0772-4B46-A4B2-55EA689E5917@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons (again) Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:48:49 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7c2b499e-3680-4a3c-94be-949ab5277886 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B120E1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:50:41 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0JJoiIX003965 Status: RO Yes, that's among the problems for me -- if a standard loom width was in the 22 to 36-inch range, well, they are lucky they were skinnier than we are, and that fabric will skew when tugged at the corners. But the woman blacksmith's apron in particular seems to be sort of pulling and draping as if the shoulder straps were originally part of the horizontal somehow. Having just played with a nice 40-inch hemmed linen square I happen to have here, I find that while some of those drapes do happen with it, a lot of the look in the pictures is more bias-y somehow. The straight-cut square makes even more drapes and folds than I'm seeing in the apron pictures. So I wonder if these simple aprons were cut on the diagonal. But the way the bottom hems are straight makes me doubt this. I will be mucking about with linen over the next week or so for other reasons anyway (I have shifts and veils and caps and coifs to make!) and will try some experiments in the apron direction while I am at it. Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 19, 2007, at 2:01 PM, Jean Waddie wrote: > These make me wonder whether the supposedly square / rectangular > waist aprons, without a separate waistband, are extended in a > similar way to provide ties. You need an extremely large square to > be able to just tie the corners around your waist. But it does > seem very wasteful if they are cut in one piece as they seem to be. > > Jean > > Lauren Walker wrote >> It looks like waist-height aprons were often a square of linen >> with the top corners tied behind the back. In these Manesse Codex >> aprons, the smiths' aprons look as if they could be tied like >> napkins around the neck. >> >> The seed-sower here in October of The Tres Riches Heures du Duc de >> Barry >> http://humanities.uchicago.edu/images/heures/october.jpg is >> definitely wearing some kind of simple square or rectangle tied >> round the neck. >> >> But this seed-sower seems to have a more constructed version: >> http://classes.bnf.fr/idrisi/grand/1_04.htm >> (Peasants in the field in Le Régime des princes) >> >> A woman blacksmith and a man in The Holkham Bible Picture Book >> c. 1327-1335, http://www.bl.uk/learning/images/medieval/year/ >> large2163.html, seem to have aprons where the napkin has been >> slashed somehow to provide shoulder straps and waist ties. >> >> Does anyone have any thoughts on how these bib aprons might have >> been shaped or constructed? >> >> Thanks for your thoughts. >> Lauren >> Lauren M. Walker >> lauren.walker@comcast.net >> >> >> >> On Jan 13, 2007, at 3:51 PM, otsisto wrote: >> >>> And the Manesse Codex but men. >>> 1340 >>> http://www.tempora-nostra.de/tempora-nostra/manesse.php? >>> id=203&tfl=124 >>> >>> But not the waist tie ones. >>> De >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > -- > Jean Waddie > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 15:10:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JKAcsW004494 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:10:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JK9q44000724 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:10:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JK97uO048765 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:09:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JK936O002470; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:09:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JI8922063967 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 11:08:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19D0BBE71E for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:08:00 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45B1090C.8070406@reddawn.net> Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:08:12 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking For Fabric Info References: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> In-Reply-To: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 75fb9dd3-84d4-481f-87d2-8adcf4d3d4c8 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B12590.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:10:36 -0500 (EST) Status: RO penhalion@juno.com wrote: > I was wondering if the amazingly knowledgable folks on this list could give me some feedback on what eras a woolen fabric would be appropriate for? I have a picture of it posted at my LiveJournal for those interested in taking a look. It's wool, the colors are good for most eras, and the slightly open twill is good for most of the eras I'd want to make. I'm just not sure about the overall look of the fabric. Opinions? > > http://seamstrix.livejournal.com/ > It's telling me it wants to be one of those little Chanel-inspired suits from about 1965. http://muze.sabanciuniv.edu/english/sergiler/eser_detay.php?eser_id=46&sergi_id=3&k=0 http://honors.umd.edu/HONR269J/projects/petzko/progressive/chanel.jpg Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 15:12:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JKCOpG004541 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:12:24 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JKBPZ0007800 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:12:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JKAxkg049172 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:10:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JKAwuZ004606; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:10:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JJEhp0042087 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:14:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA18868 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:02:56 -0600 Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 14:02:56 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons (again) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7d75ef2a-6da8-47b2-a578-1bf77162f886 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B125ED.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:12:22 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri, 19 Jan 2007, Jean Waddie wrote: > These make me wonder whether the supposedly square / rectangular waist > aprons, without a separate waistband, are extended in a similar way to > provide ties. You need an extremely large square to be able to just > tie the corners around your waist. But it does seem very wasteful if > they are cut in one piece as they seem to be. When I need an apron, I take a linen rectangle (which I normally use as a napkin), tie a ribbon or cord around my waist with the bow in front, fold over the short edge of the napkin by a handsbreadth, and tuck it into the ribbon to hold it across my front. You wouldn't be able to tell from a distance that the ribbon isn't attached. I have no authority for how I do this and wouldn't present it as "authentic," but it works, uses known technology, and looks like the pictures. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 15:13:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JKD1ai004559 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:13:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JKCDiH017828 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:12:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JK6iZx048314 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:06:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JK6bAL099552; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:06:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [216.148.227.153]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JK6VjO099330 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:06:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <20070119200625m13006ir3le>; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:06:25 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> References: <20070119.092120.1712.1038955@webmail42.nyc.untd.com> Message-Id: From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking For Fabric Info Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:06:08 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 64b2d66f-b58f-4eb4-be3b-72c6f49796e4 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B1261D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 15:12:59 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0JKD1ai004559 Status: RO I love checked and patterned wools, so I do not want to be discouraging! On p. 72 of _Woven Into The Earth_, Else Ostegard writes, "In Denmark check weaves can be traced from 2000-year-old ornamental weaves in light and dark check through a fine red and blue checked textile from the slightly later Lonne Heath find to Viking Era check weaves." So you can go WAY back with checks. But this fabric telegraphs 19th century to me, if you can find a Victorian coat or suit for it. BECAUSE I love checked and patterned wools, I would also concur with De that you might use it for some of the Northern and Western European cultures around 1000 or somewhat earlier. There are some three-shed twills with checks and stripes from the first half of the 14th century shown in _Textiles and Clothing_ , and also some references to 10th and 11th century examples -- the earlier ones apparently used different natural colors of wool to get the effect, which I think your palette of browns could emulate. After the 14th century fashions changed, and I'd be hard pressed to place this cloth between then and the Victorians. But that's just my 2¢. Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 19, 2007, at 5:20 PM, penhalion@juno.com wrote: > > I was wondering if the amazingly knowledgable folks on this list > could give me some feedback on what eras a woolen fabric would be > appropriate for? I have a picture of it posted at my LiveJournal > for those interested in taking a look. It's wool, the colors are > good for most eras, and the slightly open twill is good for most of > the eras I'd want to make. I'm just not sure about the overall look > of the fabric. Opinions? > > http://seamstrix.livejournal.com/ > > Karen > Seamstrix > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 18:38:07 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JNc7EO010768 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:38:07 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0JNbG1D011293 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:38:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0JNaKHY046165 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:36:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JNa1Pn015190; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:36:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.89]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0JNZubd015099 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:35:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.42) id 1H83H1-000IZ6-4p for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 23:35:55 +0000 Message-ID: <74kiDlERXVsFJwj+@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 23:35:45 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons (again) References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.06-U () X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9e8d8eaf-9a8f-4dd3-98a3-79ab476fcc88 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B1562C.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:38:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin Netherton wrote > >On Fri, 19 Jan 2007, Jean Waddie wrote: > >> These make me wonder whether the supposedly square / rectangular waist >> aprons, without a separate waistband, are extended in a similar way to >> provide ties. You need an extremely large square to be able to just >> tie the corners around your waist. But it does seem very wasteful if >> they are cut in one piece as they seem to be. > >When I need an apron, I take a linen rectangle (which I normally use as a >napkin), tie a ribbon or cord around my waist with the bow in front, fold >over the short edge of the napkin by a handsbreadth, and tuck it into the >ribbon to hold it across my front. You wouldn't be able to tell from a >distance that the ribbon isn't attached. I have no authority for how I do >this and wouldn't present it as "authentic," but it works, uses known >technology, and looks like the pictures. > >--Robin > I can see that for the narrow ones that hang flat. But can you reproduce the look of the ones that pull and drape, like the Bakery and Buttermaking ones? I find it particularly interesting that these don't seem to tie around the actual waist, but hang lower. -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 19:03:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K03Lrl011142 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:03:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0K02UE0003932 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:03:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0K026c5058384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:02:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K023sK042546; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:02:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.200.169]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0K01w8Q042362 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:02:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from emeraldepona@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 58589 invoked by uid 60001); 20 Jan 2007 00:01:53 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=2b6pVy2ab/9pApizx8LyonJzGaZJVCoFRAxDZS3GfofP8kCFfLgog40LX81gN3ZS9Mbt17cZS3pe8uSl/xJgcRz2Lk4eLBA3KP+JjkphO2Hhn+6QXhjwl74VyvdcB75KKVUIHebyfnIm0GqH+gxxWrblZg6FzMjy0M6bOgf8k6g=; X-YMail-OSG: Qn3UywwVM1nxBBq_BzfwhqT_f3P77cNYUe7yHAJIgIFBz5RTFXSkbJXpAYzwUjSzcinAE87hSKyxadExUKvihdgNKBDoFARG.bzwpCqeO_znu9wtnWqOprQmyrSwGbcq2LRRlw-- Received: from [208.111.206.47] by web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:01:53 PST Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:01:53 -0800 (PST) From: Chris Subject: Re: [h-cost] man's coat To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000601c73aeb$1e07c620$9043a150@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <171985.56225.qm@web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0216d108-9915-41b4-9154-31a805827a79 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B15C16.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:03:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_251.htm http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_32.htm Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: Oh gosh, Thanks for posting :-) Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 10:44 AM Subject: [h-cost] man's coat > Thought some would like to see this. > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_32.htm > > De > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. Dr. Seuss Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. Ralph Waldo Emerson --------------------------------- Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 20:08:15 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K18F7O012045 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:08:15 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0K17SNY002208 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:08:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0K16tSE098435 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:06:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K16o4J094394; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:06:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K16k8N094315 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:06:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA19735 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:55:00 -0600 Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 19:55:00 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Aprons (again) In-Reply-To: <74kiDlERXVsFJwj+@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1c9dcc60-00ce-41e2-a3b6-c40f7db6cc7f X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B16B50.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:08:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri, 19 Jan 2007, Jean Waddie wrote: > I can see that for the narrow ones that hang flat. But can you > reproduce the look of the ones that pull and drape, like the Bakery > and Buttermaking ones? I find it particularly interesting that these > don't seem to tie around the actual waist, but hang lower. No -- I haven't made a thorough study of these. I found one that worked for what I needed on the spot, and stuck with it. It would be interesting to see what someone could come up with after a broader perusal of the sources. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 19 20:42:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K1gEtD012523 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:42:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0K1fTtM002431 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:42:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0K1euwv002756 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:40:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K1eqg6017381; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:40:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.229]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K1eoea017358 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 18:40:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so579772nzf for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:40:50 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=BXJWUysyEfv/98UUdi/m68i7N5pjOaBkC48QgzKSwFoF1zvLn08bjsjwXuRmu5kDElsuPSP8RzFUTD0+vwkufJE9dkbRwetGynOEfnT5cwMUs/HSXRiZ7SjtIpV/reG9HkZwhrC6CVRmfSWVhn78xDccYUl+35O9ZuinFWXTz+s= Received: by 10.65.219.11 with SMTP id w11mr3993570qbq.1169257250171; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:40:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.65.196.15 with HTTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:40:50 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:40:50 -0800 From: Cin To: h-cost Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4d4b50c0-6e6f-4e95-bd83-caecf1a0661d X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B17349.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:42:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >Hmm... but I need them to be 1600-ish... Look thru early ukiyo-e, Japanese colored woodblock prints. The art form was in full swing in 16th c Edo (Tokyo). There is a magnificent ukiyo-e Museum in Tokyo that I spent time at. Wonderful exhibits that changed every few weeks as their hang space was quite small, but the collection was over 12K prints. Ota Memorial Museum of Art. Check out Toyko National Museum, and look thru the painted scrolls, too. If you happen to be in/near SF the DeYoung has a Japanese collection, too. You will also find print of Westerners labeled "Southern Barbarians". Look also for 16th c waterfront views of famous port towns like Yokohama. >>Namban > thanks I think you helped Actually, it's quite common to see Japanese words with "n" or "m" spelled either way when transliterated. Ditto the hard "g" & "k". Eventually the standard spelling gets codified in English. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 01:36:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K6anq2018162 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 01:36:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0K6ZlWS021068 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 01:36:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0K6Z2Vn029740 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 19 Jan 2007 23:35:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K6Ytqu078499; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 23:34:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1b.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0K6YqSF078460 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2007 23:34:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 9A6B238E69 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 00:34:51 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historic Costume" Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 00:35:01 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] lovely 1880s dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 83dc6381-c8de-4ad6-bf27-e0901dc054dd X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B1B843.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 01:36:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO http://www.antiquedress.com/item4691.htm De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 06:22:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KBMIlQ010566 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 06:22:18 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KBLWmQ001970 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 06:22:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KBKewh054467 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 04:20:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KBKUHR050352; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 04:20:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep32.mail.dk (fep32.mail.dk [80.160.76.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KBKQZb050257 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 04:20:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep46.mail.dk ([195.41.46.229]) by fep32.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070120112021.WVSW17942.fep32.mail.dk@fep46.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:20:21 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.222]) by fep46.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070120112020.VXIP15028.fep46.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:20:20 +0100 Message-ID: <001c01c73c84$ff71b4a0$de14a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] lovely 1880s dress Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:20:29 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep46.mail.dk from [80.161.20.222] at Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:20:19 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 23fd4637-c62b-47b2-a73f-b1bc926372af X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B1FB3C.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 06:22:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Lovely dress. The lace is machinemade i think, but lovely anyway. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historic Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 7:35 AM Subject: [h-cost] lovely 1880s dress > http://www.antiquedress.com/item4691.htm > > De > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 08:24:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KDO8Sd024948 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 08:24:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KDNGZE026571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 08:24:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KDMXno067265 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 06:22:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KDMSb4032212; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 06:22:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep31.mail.dk (fep31.mail.dk [80.160.76.195]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KDMOwO032105 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 06:22:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep40.mail.dk ([195.41.46.140]) by fep31.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070120132218.ZHRD2913.fep31.mail.dk@fep40.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:22:18 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.14]) by fep40.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070120132218.VXQG10241.fep40.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:22:18 +0100 Message-ID: <000801c73c96$08ebcaa0$0e43a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:22:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep40.mail.dk from [80.161.67.14] at Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:22:16 +0100 X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] gathering lace X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f7d90321-3fb0-4540-b2bc-d93862f7e411 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B217C5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi, I have a question conserning gathering lace. I "whip" gather laces when i make shirts, for instance. But now i am going to edge sleaves on an anglaise dress with 3 laces. The lace is in 3 widths, same pattern, but 3 widths. I dont think it wil work to put the 3 laces together and gather, because it would not give the right shape. So should i whip gather all 3 laces one at a time? Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 09:03:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KE3PXd026249 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 09:03:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KE2Tkh010782 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 09:03:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KE2254073393 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 07:02:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KE20jt061377; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 07:02:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com (smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com [209.73.179.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0KE1sfM061230 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 07:01:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: (qmail 92566 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2007 14:01:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO IBMTHINKPAD) (rlksm1@verizon.net@72.95.247.124 with login) by smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2007 14:01:49 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: BbbDscAVM1lA7ukqMNJkvTk0oCNYiSVY6JMbtwEcoyhDCirOvUGqYRFgRbHDW8M0OUfKHs.F1qGrKW2s3OePOb9hBdA9Drjo0GsZb280pDDZPoaF_7pz1xw- Message-ID: <000d01c73c9b$81666f80$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000801c73c96$08ebcaa0$0e43a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] gathering lace Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 09:01:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d54c84c8-05a7-43a3-b2a1-23f2f0ccac8f X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B220F5.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 09:03:22 -0500 (EST) Status: RO That is the only way I have been able to do the job with satisfaction...attaching each seperatly. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 8:22 AM Subject: [h-cost] gathering lace > Hi, > I have a question conserning gathering lace. I "whip" gather laces when i > make shirts, for instance. > But now i am going to edge sleaves on an anglaise dress with 3 laces. The > lace is in 3 widths, same pattern, but 3 widths. I dont think it wil work > to put the 3 laces together and gather, because it would not give the > right shape. So should i whip gather all 3 laces one at a time? > > Bjarne > > > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 09:29:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KETUxb026968 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 09:29:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KESdms032236 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 09:29:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KES75Z076474 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 07:28:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KES3B2083535; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 07:28:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep32.mail.dk (fep32.mail.dk [80.160.76.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KBDxL1042529 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 04:14:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep46.mail.dk ([195.41.46.229]) by fep32.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070120111358.WOWJ17942.fep32.mail.dk@fep46.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:13:58 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.222]) by fep46.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070120111358.VXGE15028.fep46.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:13:58 +0100 Message-ID: <000801c73c84$18faaea0$de14a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <171985.56225.qm@web31006.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] man's coat Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:14:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep46.mail.dk from [80.161.20.222] at Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:13:53 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 01ee35c2-90bb-480d-a191-4b7c2e8abe6a X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B22717.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 09:29:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Oh lovely again, many thanks for the link. I just wished someone would show how neat they made the covered buttons on the backside of the buttons. My buttons gets two clumsy. I have the right button moulds made of wood, but it is very difficult to get them nice and flat when you gather all the fabric at the back. I just love the collar! Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 1:01 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] man's coat > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_251.htm > > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_32.htm > > Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Oh gosh, > Thanks for posting :-) > > Bjarne > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "otsisto" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 10:44 AM > Subject: [h-cost] man's coat > > >> Thought some would like to see this. >> http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_32.htm >> >> De >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't > matter and those who matter don't mind. > Dr. Seuss > > Our greatest glory is not in never failing, > but in rising up every time we fail. > Ralph Waldo Emerson > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 12:05:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KH5CKl030333 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:05:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KH4Ke3004548 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:05:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KH3gSY095097 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 10:03:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KH3aUG003250; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 10:03:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep32.mail.dk (fep32.mail.dk [80.160.76.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KH3WDF003190 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 10:03:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep45.mail.dk ([195.41.46.228]) by fep32.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070120170327.LFYN17942.fep32.mail.dk@fep45.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:03:27 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.183]) by fep45.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070120170326.WCVR119.fep45.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:03:26 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c73cb4$ee09d4b0$b743a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000801c73c96$08ebcaa0$0e43a150@CPQ21932199711> <000d01c73c9b$81666f80$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> Subject: Re: [h-cost] gathering lace Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:03:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep45.mail.dk from [80.161.67.183] at Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:03:25 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 75fca566-c94a-4862-93e8-1e0a97e158d3 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B24B94.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 12:05:09 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi, Thanks for your reply, its always the latest method wich is the most attractive isnt it? Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 3:01 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] gathering lace > That is the only way I have been able to do the job with > satisfaction...attaching each seperatly. > > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" > To: > Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 8:22 AM > Subject: [h-cost] gathering lace > > >> Hi, >> I have a question conserning gathering lace. I "whip" gather laces when i >> make shirts, for instance. >> But now i am going to edge sleaves on an anglaise dress with 3 laces. The >> lace is in 3 widths, same pattern, but 3 widths. I dont think it wil work >> to put the 3 laces together and gather, because it would not give the >> right shape. So should i whip gather all 3 laces one at a time? >> >> Bjarne >> >> >> >> >> >> Leif og Bjarne Drews >> www.my-drewscostumes.dk >> >> http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 15:46:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KKk8Dp001478 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 15:46:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KKjMkM018004 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 15:46:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KKiuCr028208 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 13:44:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KKip5p076212; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 13:44:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2a.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KKimpZ076168 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 13:44:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 4AA0435478 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:44:45 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] lovely 1880s dress Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:44:57 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <001c01c73c84$ff71b4a0$de14a150@CPQ21932199711> Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: db19609b-95c7-4073-9a77-278c5de4a119 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B27F62.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 15:46:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO When did machine lace start? De -----Original Message----- Lovely dress. The lace is machinemade i think, but lovely anyway. Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 15:56:58 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KKuuAR001606 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 15:56:56 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KKuAiG023190 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 15:56:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KKtgL2029656 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 13:55:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KKtf1t084402; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 13:55:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KKtaNQ084261 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 13:55:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep44.mail.dk ([195.41.46.227]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070120205530.XWTX14881.fep34.mail.dk@fep44.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:55:30 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.225]) by fep44.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070120205530.WDJS11319.fep44.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:55:30 +0100 Message-ID: <000401c73cd5$5dcff980$e114a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] lovely 1880s dress Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:55:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep44.mail.dk from [80.161.20.225] at Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:55:26 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1ed3b861-7448-4729-a02c-c147c5b0d705 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B281EA.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 15:56:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Already in 18th century they invented a machine for making netting or tulle. and about 1850ies i think they invented machines that imitated bobbin lace. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 9:44 PM Subject: RE: [h-cost] lovely 1880s dress > When did machine lace start? > > De > > -----Original Message----- > Lovely dress. The lace is machinemade i think, but lovely anyway. > > Bjarne > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 16:02:18 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KL2IfB001698 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:02:18 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KL1QmN031945 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:02:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KL0vYT030551 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:00:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KL0uTW088480; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:00:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc14.comcast.net (alnrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.225.94]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KL0rWm088366 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 14:00:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc14) with SMTP id <20070120210047b1400kltn0e>; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:00:47 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) To: h-costume h-costume Message-Id: <247511F0-A991-46B6-894F-825DC60170DB@COMCAST.NET> From: Lauren Walker Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:00:48 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Dove colored X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 711293fe-8d6f-4c34-93ea-8b152e38fbd0 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B28327.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:02:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear knowledgeable ones, A Victorian literature scholar of my acquaintance has asked me what color I think "dove-colored", as used in Little Women, would have been. She always thought white, because of white doves of peace, but I have always assumed a light gray, like the color now called "dove gray". Does anyone have anything definitive on this? Thank you! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 18:48:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KNmOAR004180 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:48:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0KNlWt4027416 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:48:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0KNkoxW050961 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:46:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KNkiiT001477; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:46:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0KKNrSo060721 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 13:23:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from your1a4d29f243 (ool-45757a12.dyn.optonline.net [69.117.122.18]) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <0JC600CFLON66I70@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 15:23:33 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 15:23:30 -0500 From: monica spence In-reply-to: <000601c73cb4$ee09d4b0$b743a150@CPQ21932199711> To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Belgium 1890 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 577bef7e-fd60-4440-bc27-5d2bfa7530c3 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B2AA14.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:48:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi All-- A friend is writing a novel set in Bruges,Belgium in 1890. She needs some help on clothing of the time and location. Can anyone help? Her main character is an 18 year old male. She also has: A 16 year old female. A 63 year old female. Wealthy. Aristocratic. Various men in their 30s and 40s. Most of my characters are middle income. She has got a politician and an art dealer who are closer to wealthy. 1890s, Bruges, Belgium, which probably had a lot of Dutch influence. She has looked at sites of Victorian clothing, but she is not sure how much of that applied to Northern Europe. Thanks an awful lot. Monica _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 19:04:27 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L04R2W004314 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:04:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L03fWF008259 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:04:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L03KQK053308 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:03:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L03JIe012137; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:03:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L03G1c012099 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:03:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.146.144.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.146.144]) by pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H8QB0-0005Se-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:03:15 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v749.3) In-Reply-To: <247511F0-A991-46B6-894F-825DC60170DB@COMCAST.NET> References: <247511F0-A991-46B6-894F-825DC60170DB@COMCAST.NET> Message-Id: From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dove colored Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:03:30 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.749.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d3575d91-ca98-4de9-b737-1ed75e2ba71b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B2ADDD.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:04:25 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0L04R2W004314 Status: RO Nothing definitive from me, but I always assumed it was a soft taupe, like a mourning dove. Since I call the mourning doves that come to my feeders "the girls," I guess this would be especially appropriate for Little Women... ;•} --Ruth Anne Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer On Jan 20, 2007, at 4:00 PM, Lauren Walker wrote: > Dear knowledgeable ones, > A Victorian literature scholar of my acquaintance has asked me what > color I think "dove-colored", as used in Little Women, would have > been. She always thought white, because of white doves of peace, > but I have always assumed a light gray, like the color now called > "dove gray". Does anyone have anything definitive on this? > Thank you! > Lauren > Lauren M. Walker > lauren.walker@comcast.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 19:19:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0JUec004401 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:19:30 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L0Iih8007427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:19:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L0IM2k055064 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:18:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0ILZP021585; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:18:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mf3k.socket.net [216.106.88.98]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0IIE5021559 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:18:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 2D9963D91A for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:18:18 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Dove colored Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:18:32 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <247511F0-A991-46B6-894F-825DC60170DB@COMCAST.NET> Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0adcf36c-fe1c-470a-b9b5-5245f207f41e X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B2B164.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:19:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In the 1960s there was a color, Dove white which was a white with a hint of gray, though I have been told a white with a barely hint of pink which doesn't make sense to me. It was associated with turtle doves. Dove gray usually was a light gray, in association with the gray part of the Mourning doves (usually has a peach colored breast). This is my understanding of it but this is word of mouth handed down and not scholarly research. De -----Original Message----- Dear knowledgeable ones, A Victorian literature scholar of my acquaintance has asked me what color I think "dove-colored", as used in Little Women, would have been. She always thought white, because of white doves of peace, but I have always assumed a light gray, like the color now called "dove gray". Does anyone have anything definitive on this? Thank you! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 19:20:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0KUqv004411 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:20:30 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L0Jh8o007824 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:20:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L0JNT8055163 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:19:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0JMiU022206; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:19:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mf3k.socket.net [216.106.88.98]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0JJCS022174 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:19:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id E50F53D83B for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:19:18 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] lovely 1880s dress Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:19:33 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <000401c73cd5$5dcff980$e114a150@CPQ21932199711> Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 43c638ac-d1af-4df2-bc5a-bfa41ed819d6 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B2B19F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:20:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thank you. I had no idea it was that early. De -----Original Message----- Already in 18th century they invented a machine for making netting or tulle. and about 1850ies i think they invented machines that imitated bobbin lace. Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 19:47:58 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0lwqI004655 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:47:58 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L0kxDW014141 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:47:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L0kZeR058042 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:46:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0kXjD038209; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:46:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com (ug-out-1314.google.com [66.249.92.172]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0kVQp038174 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:46:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katybishop64@gmail.com) Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id k40so836591ugc for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:46:30 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=VWhYBXKJGtcnhtQMIM74Iw/ebI1QFU8DlIlxeydf6sGIbwNUk6l7yXecqogKRUNrt1dj1S72+1BZr5liO1ofgmG03OZaIy3PQh1UB63tVvtG5Tx30QCKRyET4fZZQ1+Z+QvKDg6FT4WHEOSs9tqsOEAn0WbO+ccL3XuxZ9zuQn8= Received: by 10.82.116.15 with SMTP id o15mr3525697buc.1169340390390; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:46:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.184.5 with HTTP; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:46:30 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3586f5070701201646n37367067se8f36c082e9ea17b@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:46:30 -0500 From: "Katy Bishop" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dove colored In-Reply-To: <247511F0-A991-46B6-894F-825DC60170DB@COMCAST.NET> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <247511F0-A991-46B6-894F-825DC60170DB@COMCAST.NET> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7244499e-6c61-46bf-abb7-1eba50e455b3 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B2B803.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:47:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I always thought of it as grey but.... for early 20th century, I have a silk floss booklet: "Richard'sons Standard Colors, sewing silk and Button Hole Twist" 1909 4 pages of silk floss samples, about 375 of them, with names, includes an incert for shades of the 1909 season. They have a color called "dove" and it is a medium brown. Some of my favorite color names: Dregs of Wine (deep wine color) Naiad (pale green) Tally Ho (light brown/ochre) Lizard (a deep green) Katy On 1/20/07, Lauren Walker wrote: > Dear knowledgeable ones, > A Victorian literature scholar of my acquaintance has asked me what > color I think "dove-colored", as used in Little Women, would have > been. She always thought white, because of white doves of peace, but > I have always assumed a light gray, like the color now called "dove > gray". Does anyone have anything definitive on this? > Thank you! > Lauren > Lauren M. Walker > lauren.walker@comcast.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 19:49:51 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0nlYa004677 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:49:51 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L0muN2015487 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:49:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L0mV4U058157 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:48:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0mTd5039285; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:48:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L0mOdC039232 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:48:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.146.144.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.146.144]) by pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H8Qsh-0004FQ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:48:23 -0500 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v749.3) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-Id: <79BCE8E5-D2A1-4E94-AD44-15437E54D161@mindspring.com> From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dove colored Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:48:39 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.749.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 67e55c26-a461-4c66-85a6-c0e648bea92f X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B2B878.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:49:45 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ...but mourning doves aren't gray. They're taupe (on the grayer or browner side depending partly on the light), with iridescent pinky- taupe or peachy-taupe breasts. This iridescence is, I believe, more prominent on the male. I'd expect that this color would have been very popular with Victorians--as it is with me, I'd LOVE to have a gown of that soft taupe color especially if it were trimmed in peach! (and dark dots on the train or around the hem?) --Ruth Anne http://www.backyardbirdcam.com/gallery/mourning-dove.htm On Jan 20, 2007, at 7:18 PM, otsisto wrote: > In the 1960s there was a color, Dove white which was a white with a > hint of > gray, though I have been told a white with a barely hint of pink which > doesn't make sense to me. It was associated with turtle doves. > Dove gray usually was a light gray, in association with the gray > part of the > Mourning doves (usually has a peach colored breast). This is my > understanding of it but this is word of mouth handed down and not > scholarly > research. > > De > > > -----Original Message----- > Dear knowledgeable ones, > A Victorian literature scholar of my acquaintance has asked me what > color I think "dove-colored", as used in Little Women, would have > been. She always thought white, because of white doves of peace, but > I have always assumed a light gray, like the color now called "dove > gray". Does anyone have anything definitive on this? > Thank you! > Lauren > Lauren M. Walker > lauren.walker@comcast.net > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 20:28:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L1S5xq004958 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 20:28:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L1RJAn002554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 20:28:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L1QqA3062362 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:26:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L1Qmam061016; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:26:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.191]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L1QjaM060986 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 18:26:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katybishop64@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so982419nfe for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:26:44 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=tY25fyNywuNcunMxg/54E5rRhlA2FWNpcEijW+PCWTY4RLAsWmvmPOOZuaKgzVtc67P05mmu1Qpm1d/6zngzwCwwHTsbTLi4IWSH09zqqU2yrWhqePOScZzdP3amy2Ahx+OmpFOL1iWNCLS4V6w/BxVAzcd1JlLv8o2iqx2NiWY= Received: by 10.82.153.5 with SMTP id a5mr3579714bue.1169342803530; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:26:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.184.5 with HTTP; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:26:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3586f5070701201726w3a41493are832cfd63875a542@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 20:26:43 -0500 From: "Katy Bishop" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dove colored In-Reply-To: <79BCE8E5-D2A1-4E94-AD44-15437E54D161@mindspring.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <79BCE8E5-D2A1-4E94-AD44-15437E54D161@mindspring.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3bbc2d5f-c176-4416-8004-57177661be83 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B2C177.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 20:28:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I guess that fits in with the brown shade of the silk sample. It's a very pretty brown, darker than I think of as a mourning dove. Katy On 1/20/07, Ruth Anne Baumgartner wrote: > ...but mourning doves aren't gray. They're taupe (on the grayer or > browner side depending partly on the light), with iridescent pinky- > taupe or peachy-taupe breasts. This iridescence is, I believe, more > prominent on the male. I'd expect that this color would have been > very popular with Victorians--as it is with me, I'd LOVE to have a > gown of that soft taupe color especially if it were trimmed in peach! > (and dark dots on the train or around the hem?) > --Ruth Anne > > http://www.backyardbirdcam.com/gallery/mourning-dove.htm > On Jan 20, 2007, at 7:18 PM, otsisto wrote: > > > In the 1960s there was a color, Dove white which was a white with a > > hint of > > gray, though I have been told a white with a barely hint of pink which > > doesn't make sense to me. It was associated with turtle doves. > > Dove gray usually was a light gray, in association with the gray > > part of the > > Mourning doves (usually has a peach colored breast). This is my > > understanding of it but this is word of mouth handed down and not > > scholarly > > research. > > > > De > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > Dear knowledgeable ones, > > A Victorian literature scholar of my acquaintance has asked me what > > color I think "dove-colored", as used in Little Women, would have > > been. She always thought white, because of white doves of peace, but > > I have always assumed a light gray, like the color now called "dove > > gray". Does anyone have anything definitive on this? > > Thank you! > > Lauren > > Lauren M. Walker > > lauren.walker@comcast.net > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 20 21:40:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L2eADj005554 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:40:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L2dIuN002004 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:40:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L2cnHD071135 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:38:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L2cj70000492; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:38:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from centrmmtao03.cox.net (centrmmtao03.cox.net [70.168.83.81]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L2ceMt000421 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 19:38:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from fernsandnettles@cox.net) Received: from eastrmimpo01.cox.net ([68.1.16.119]) by centrmmtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.03 201-2131-130-104-20060516) with ESMTP id <20070121023834.CPZU13993.centrmmtao03.cox.net@eastrmimpo01.cox.net> for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:38:34 -0500 Received: from oemuserba0f5be ([70.160.72.213]) by eastrmimpo01.cox.net with bizsmtp id Ded31W00Y4c6E3q0000000; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:37:04 -0500 Message-ID: <004e01c73d05$413b13b0$d548a046@oemuserba0f5be> From: "Norayn" To: "H-costume-indra" Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:38:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=18% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] As a courtesy .. .. .. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 45ac7726-ff2a-4ccf-9503-85a8af017e18 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B2D257.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:40:08 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0L2eADj005554 Status: RO "Unto my friends and all the noble and gentle folk to whom this message comes, Greeting and Salutation. Let it be known amongst the Land, that as of this day 20 Ianuarii , I, until now known as Norayn of The Wood, from the great lands of the Kingdom of Atlantia ,shall henceforth be known as Vederun (Frederun),in conformity with the rules and usages of the Current Middle Ages." Vrederun _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 00:06:11 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L562ue007468 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 00:06:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L55BFm009615 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 00:05:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L54M1d086396 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 22:04:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L54IV0073806; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 22:04:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2a.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L54F91073780 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 22:04:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 80EA53541B for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 23:04:14 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Dove colored Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 23:04:28 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-reply-to: <79BCE8E5-D2A1-4E94-AD44-15437E54D161@mindspring.com> Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f70936f1-c740-4cba-bdb5-00780bc81772 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B2F487.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 00:06:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Around here they're a bit gray, kind of like this picture. http://persweb.wabash.edu/facstaff/phillipj/mourning-dove2.jpg but these pictures they look more in the taupe and brown range as the common color http://tinyurl.com/2o7lm4 So we must have unique and non conformist mourning doves around here. :) De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 00:21:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L5L92S007683 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 00:21:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L5KIp5023390 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 00:21:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L5JqA9087674 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 22:19:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L5JkfA081526; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 22:19:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2a.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L5JgpO081493 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 22:19:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 540F8351CC for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 23:19:42 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 23:19:57 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-reply-to: <004e01c73d05$413b13b0$d548a046@oemuserba0f5be> Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE:OT As a courtesy .. .. .. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 80611299-5af8-42af-832b-8e77c05c681f X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B2F812.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 00:21:07 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Ummm. that is nice. Congratulations! Just a friendly note, this is not a SCA list. It is a "Mundane" list, so half to two thirds on this list have no clue as to what you are talking about except that it has to do with SCA. This part sounds as if you were forced to change. "..in conformity with the rules and usages of the Current Middle Ages." I hope that it isn't so, as it is a volunteer organization. You should be encouraged to find a "period" name but not forced. Hope you enjoy your new name. A extra little note: SCA also does Renaissance and pre- Middle ages. De SCA aka: Delis Alms SCA alt.persona: Fiordelisia Dragano da Parma -----Original Message----- "Unto my friends and all the noble and gentle folk to whom this message comes, Greeting and Salutation. Let it be known amongst the Land, that as of this day 20 Ianuarii , I, until now known as Norayn of The Wood, from the great lands of the Kingdom of Atlantia ,shall henceforth be known as Vederun (Frederun),in conformity with the rules and usages of the Current Middle Ages." Vrederun _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 01:37:18 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L6bBKs008601 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 01:37:15 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0L6aPda023061 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 01:37:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0L6ZrZ9093633 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 20 Jan 2007 23:35:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L6Znm2018095; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 23:35:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from spyder.suffolk.lib.ny.us (spyder.suffolk.lib.ny.us [209.139.6.27]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0L6ZiDL018021 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2007 23:35:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bchamber@suffolk.lib.ny.us) Received: from bcimpnoz0qs8p0 (nat-pri-118-ppp.suffolk.lib.ny.us [209.139.110.118]) (Authenticated sender: bchamber@spyder.suffolk.lib.ny.us) by spyder.suffolk.lib.ny.us (Postfix) with ESMTP id B724B1FC829 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 01:35:33 -0500 (EST) From: "Beth Chamberlain" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 01:35:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Thread-Index: Acc9Jlw1t4p6RTjdTEuM/SqCHSwu2w== Message-Id: <20070121063533.B724B1FC829@spyder.suffolk.lib.ny.us> X-SuffolkWeb-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-SuffolkWeb-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-SuffolkWeb-MailScanner-From: bchamber@suffolk.lib.ny.us X-Spam-Status: No X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] knit bonnet - 1857 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5cc85f78-4e68-42c2-8a23-93a2b0880cc1 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B309E9.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 01:37:09 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Does anyone happen to know where this was originally published? I've tried Godey's but I didn't see it. http://cgi.ebay.com/Antebellum-Victorian-Civil-Knitted-Bonnet-Pattern-1857_W 0QQitemZ130069174468QQihZ003QQcategoryZ83930QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Thanks Beth Chamberlain _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 08:29:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LDT9UH027035 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 08:29:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0LDSHFu027871 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 08:29:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0LDRKIp028570 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 06:27:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LDRFK7052175; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 06:27:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp101.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com (smtp101.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com [209.73.179.139]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0LDRBqF052074 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 06:27:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: (qmail 8501 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2007 13:27:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO IBMTHINKPAD) (rlksm1@verizon.net@72.95.161.63 with login) by smtp101.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2007 13:27:02 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: Df.LqAYVM1mXrcI_Lx0ZTFbW_QeQWJkmLJFCNNUjZkj9iFrvJQ5Rv.emWF3ydHziShsQMaXPsqjqNki5VzFpjpLAoiE8ab7TohEQ5dM21OQ7jOH55R7G6JnQ0rsi_uvMyg-- Message-ID: <003401c73d5f$cff29ec0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20070121063533.B724B1FC829@spyder.suffolk.lib.ny.us> Subject: Re: [h-cost] knit bonnet - 1857 Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 08:26:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-Servercave-Metrics: net.indra.com 1183; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 713c005b-70a1-4a4e-b075-8e1997d05ee2 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B36A71.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 08:29:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Beth, has it occurred to you to askthe seller that question? The pattern looks familar to me but as you have already checked Godeys, have you tried Peterson's, or Arthur's? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beth Chamberlain" To: "'Historical Costume'" Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 1:35 AM Subject: [h-cost] knit bonnet - 1857 > Does anyone happen to know where this was originally published? I've tried > Godey's but I didn't see it. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/Antebellum-Victorian-Civil-Knitted-Bonnet-Pattern-1857_W > 0QQitemZ130069174468QQihZ003QQcategoryZ83930QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem > > > > Thanks > > Beth Chamberlain > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 09:13:38 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LEDc8X027700 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 09:13:38 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0LEClTg020141 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 09:13:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0LECUtG033845 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 07:12:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LECSDC081418; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 07:12:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s18.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s18.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.90]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LECQBI081324 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 07:12:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.20]) by bay0-omc1-s18.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 06:12:20 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 06:12:20 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV10.phx.gbl with DAV; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 14:12:18 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "h-costume" , "TheRenaissanceTailor" Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 07:12:31 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 07:12:31 -0700 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Jan 2007 14:12:20.0742 (UTC) FILETIME=[2A34F260:01C73D66] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 265ea12f-c7ac-4b1b-bf49-4f85fadf6dd2 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B374DF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 09:13:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Just thought I'd share a discovery with you. Frustrated by all my marking pencils which, either disappear too soon, don't fit into a regular sharpener, fall apart as soon as you try to apply pressure or sharpen them - I tried some of my Crayola Erasable colored pencils. These work really well (I was using the yellow). I am marking over 23 yards of trim placement - they show up on silk taffeta, and erase (even after ironing!) without leaving a mark. The "lead" is strong enough to hold up to repeated sharpening, keep the point well and don't break at the slightest pressure. Of course I would try a test on anything new, and with any of the other colors. Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 09:34:42 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LEYbfV028032 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 09:34:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0LEXkwP015058 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 09:34:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0LEXL0B035686 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 07:33:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LEXIee095627; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 07:33:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.89]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LEWx0V095301 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 07:33:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.162.42]) by bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 06:32:53 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 06:32:54 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.162.200 by by108fd.bay108.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 14:32:50 GMT X-Originating-IP: [70.224.234.237] X-Originating-Email: [robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com] X-Sender: robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com From: "RobinandKelly Dorman" To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 09:32:50 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Jan 2007 14:32:54.0036 (UTC) FILETIME=[094EAD40:01C73D69] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Book Opinion X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ee3ec1a6-fe4e-4c6a-b3b2-a60cefb4db10 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B379CA.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 09:34:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Someone mentioned receiving the following book as part of the h-costume gift exchange: "Everlasting: The Flower in Fashion and Textiles" (fabric, lace, and beautiful garments) It sounds as if it fits in perfectly with a topic I've been researching for several years, basically the effect of the study of botany primarily by women on both clothing and home fashion. I found the book online, but shipping is more than three times the cost of the book! It would be really helpful to have the opinion of someone who's actually seen the book as to the content before I order. Thanks, Kelly Dorman Backward Glances www.backwardglances.net _________________________________________________________________ FREE online classifieds from Windows Live Expo – buy and sell with people you know http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwex0010000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://expo.live.com?s_cid=Hotmail_tagline_12/06 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 10:03:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LF3SMK028540 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 10:03:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0LF2bG5011198 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 10:03:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0LF2Mua038271 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 08:02:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LF2Kto013869; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 08:02:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LF2HPn013839 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 08:02:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H8eD9-0002jL-56; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 09:02:23 -0600 Received: from 65.13.105.239 ([65.13.105.239]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 10:02:23 -0500 Message-ID: <20070121100223.469ayn0n6hessskw@www.goldsword.com> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 10:02:23 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Book Opinion References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32003] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php X-Source-Args: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php /usr/local/cpanel/base/horde/imp/compose.php X-Source-Dir: :/base/horde/imp X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0LF2HPn013839 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 821b61d6-13b4-457e-8464-f41ad7e76296 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B3808D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 10:03:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Quoting RobinandKelly Dorman : > Someone mentioned receiving the following book as part of the h-costume > gift exchange: > > "Everlasting: The Flower in Fashion and Textiles" (fabric, lace, and > beautiful garments) > > It sounds as if it fits in perfectly with a topic I've been researching > for several years, basically the effect of the study of botany > primarily by women on both clothing and home fashion. I must have missed the original post -- and I'm not finding the book at all. Having said that, I don't know what aspect of "clothing and home fashion" you're looking for, but have you seen Thomasina Beck's books on Floral Embroideries? The Embroiderers Garden, Gardens of Silver and Gold, and The Embroiderers Flowers are the 3 titles that come to mind off the top of my head. Susan, botanist ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 17:29:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LMTdvI006281 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 17:29:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0LMSrhl011214 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 17:29:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0LMSCLY006253 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:28:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LMRxKV046899; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:28:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from server024.dfw.nationwide.net (server024.dfw.nationwide.net [206.123.129.87]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0LMRSKM046504 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:27:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 1459 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2007 22:27:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO spamfilter.nationwide.net) (127.0.0.1) by server024.dfw.nationwide.net with SMTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:27:28 +0000 Received: from 66.92.250.25 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by spamfilter.nationwide.net with HTTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 14:27:28 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1783.66.92.250.25.1169418448.squirrel@spamfilter.nationwide.net> In-Reply-To: <004e01c73d05$413b13b0$d548a046@oemuserba0f5be> References: <004e01c73d05$413b13b0$d548a046@oemuserba0f5be> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 14:27:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [h-cost] As a courtesy .. .. .. From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=15% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2e1a3d72-50a5-48d7-b8d7-ed391600e4d5 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B3E925.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 17:29:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO With all due respect, your announcement is off-topic. Let's stick to costuming-related items, please :~) Diana > "Unto my friends and all the noble and gentle folk to whom this message > comes, Greeting and Salutation. > > Let it be known amongst the Land, that as of this day 20 Ianuarii , I, > until now known as Norayn of The Wood, from the great lands of the Kingdom > of Atlantia ,shall henceforth be known as Vederun (Frederun),in conformity > with the rules and usages of the Current Middle Ages." > > > Vrederun > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- www.RenaissanceFabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" "Become the change you want to see in the world." --Ghandi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 17:53:18 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LMrI9V006705 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 17:53:18 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0LMqQCf003010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 17:53:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0LMpoXq009196 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:51:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LMpdsf062610; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:51:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s1.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s1.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LMpYxw062489 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:51:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.162.49]) by bay0-omc2-s1.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 14:51:27 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 14:51:27 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.162.200 by by108fd.bay108.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:51:23 GMT X-Originating-IP: [70.224.234.237] X-Originating-Email: [robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com] X-Sender: robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com From: "RobinandKelly Dorman" To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 17:51:23 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Jan 2007 22:51:27.0312 (UTC) FILETIME=[AF025D00:01C73DAE] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Re:Book Opinion X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c776344b-8d79-4062-a5a2-2d9c266f60b1 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B3EEAA.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 17:53:15 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >I must have missed the original post -- and I'm not finding the book at >all. Having said that, I don't know what aspect of "clothing and home >fashion" you're looking for, but have you seen Thomasina Beck's books on >Floral Embroideries? The Embroiderers Garden, Gardens of Silver and Gold, >and The Embroiderers Flowers are the 3 titles that come to mind off the >top of my head. >Susan, botanist Actually, I misspoke; it's a catalogue for an exhibit, which is described here: http://www.ngv.vic.gov.au/everlasting/ My interest arose during the research phase of a group project, a presentation of subjects typically taught in American ladies academies during the antebellum and Civil War period. As a scientist in "real" life, I choose a scientific subject - botany. I soon found it was a much larger topic then I has anticipated and surprisingly controversial. The following quote is exemplifies what I'm interested in: "Look at the chair on which your friend is sitting, at the carpet beneath your feet, at the paper on the walls, at the curtains which shut out the wintery landscape, at the table near you, at the clock, the candlesticks, nay, the very fire-irons-or it may be the iron mouldings upon your stove-at the picture-frames, the book-case, the table-covers, the work-box, the inkstand, in short, all of the trifling knick-knacks in the room, and on all these you may see, in bolder or fainter lines. a thousand proofs of the debt we owe to the vegetable world, not only for so many of the fabrics themselves, but also for the beautiful forms, and colors, and ornaments we seek to imitate, branches and stems, leaves and tendrils, flowers and fruits, nuts and berries, are everywhere the models.... The most durable and costly materials the earth holds in her bosom, stone and marble, gold, silver, and gems, have been made to assume, in a thousand imposing or graceful forms, the lines of the living vegetation. How many of the proudest works of art would be wanting, if there had been no grace and dignity in trees, no beauty in leaves and flowers! Susan Fenimore Cooper "Rural Hours by a Lady" 1854 Of course, flowers and vegetation have been used as inspiration in both clothing and home textiles for eons, but there is a definate connection between botany becoming an acceptable pursuit for women and the "blossoming" of realistic floral forms as decoration during the Victorian period. Regards, Kelly Dorman Backward Glances www.backwardglances.net _________________________________________________________________ FREE online classifieds from Windows Live Expo – buy and sell with people you know http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwex0010000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://expo.live.com?s_cid=Hotmail_tagline_12/06 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 18:20:55 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LNKt59007083 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:20:55 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0LNK4s7017507 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:20:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0LNJef0012812 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 16:19:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LNJc7d080901; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 16:19:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.239]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LNJaXu080865 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 16:19:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon.nevin@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so876834nzf for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:19:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:x-mailer:date:to:from:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type; b=EKIEFa74B5IccmAuxH9xhEYn78XDX7xY25lV1v9ZmbuBNKz2zVOythJ7wWc9sb1kRBCijJM7rLTwRO2/78QoRC6EhacntDGS1RXSQiWaULIKZQlvhBU1aThOSRgPDs0HMdQg0zAZTLDYFq3zXjVzOGcJyUtYE/YGu1xekpqMMwQ= Received: by 10.65.23.3 with SMTP id a3mr6396176qbj.1169421575874; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:19:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from koid-gath.gmail.com ( [124.180.108.23]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id q17sm5897911qbq.2007.01.21.15.19.33; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:19:35 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <6.2.1.2.0.20070122095357.01cefa80@pop.gmail.com> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.1.2 Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 10:21:09 +1100 To: Historical Costume From: Sharon Nevin Subject: Re: [h-cost] Book Opinion In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 882d35cd-00f3-41a9-b392-679162bc627d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B3F524.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:20:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 01:32 AM 22/01/2007, you wrote: >Someone mentioned receiving the following book as part of the h-costume >gift exchange: > >"Everlasting: The Flower in Fashion and Textiles" (fabric, lace, and >beautiful garments) > >It sounds as if it fits in perfectly with a topic I've been researching >for several years, basically the effect of the study of botany primarily >by women on both clothing and home fashion. I found the book online, but >shipping is more than three times the cost of the book! I'm assuming you found it at the NGV site. I always found their postage prices to be some what inflated. Postage and Packaging should be around au$5.00 unregistered for it to be sent overseas given it's weight and size. > It would be really helpful to have the opinion of someone who's actually > seen the book as to the content before I order. The first 3 pages are intro to the exhibition itself. Then there are 8 pages on specific garments with one garment per page. Most of that page is taken up by a photograph of the garment (not the entire garment just a detailed shot) followed bya paragraph with details on the garment as well as a sentance or two on the more generalised history of that garment style. Finally there is a 9-page essay (including photos) on the Flower in Fashion and Textiles by Dr Peter McNeil, Head of the School of Art History and Theory at the univeristy of NSW. This does have 8 footnotes so is not unreferenced as such. It does cover from the Renaissance onwards so covers a lot of time in very short space and does make brief references to developments in horticulture. There are a few more pages of photos and a listing of garments in the exhibition. I found it an interesting read combining the subjects but 1600s onwards is not my forte for historic costuming and so a lot of the information presented in the booklet was new to me. It may be a bit basic as you have background knowledge here already. The photography is good. The only garment shown in full is an elizabethan coif, the rest are detail shots. To answer you question I don't think it would be worth paying that much for shipping for the book. If you have non-credit card paypal I could pick you up a copy if you are interested (email me off list if so please). Hope that helps Sharon Nevin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 18:57:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LNvmU5007554 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:57:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0LNuv2f009126 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:57:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0LNuAWH017308 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 16:56:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LNu60a005605; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 16:56:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0LNu2Lw005567 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 16:56:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m1.in-tch.com [216.166.191.1]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l0LNgqJ09096 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 16:42:53 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <003201c73db8$ef07efa0$01bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <004e01c73d05$413b13b0$d548a046@oemuserba0f5be> <1783.66.92.250.25.1169418448.squirrel@spamfilter.nationwide.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] As a courtesy .. .. .. Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 17:04:47 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8ab8dbbe-8be6-4feb-a8a2-8932b80cabf3 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B3FDC9.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:57:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO She actually spammed a bunch of lists I'm on with this, and I don't know that *any* of them were exclusively SCA.... I'd have just deleted them, but I get those lists as digests.... --Sue, working on ideas for weaving her own belt for a Norman gown.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 3:27 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] As a courtesy .. .. .. > With all due respect, your announcement is off-topic. Let's stick to > costuming-related items, please :~) > > Diana > > > > "Unto my friends and all the noble and gentle folk to whom this message > > comes, Greeting and Salutation. > > > > Let it be known amongst the Land, that as of this day 20 Ianuarii , I, > > until now known as Norayn of The Wood, from the great lands of the Kingdom > > of Atlantia ,shall henceforth be known as Vederun (Frederun),in conformity > > with the rules and usages of the Current Middle Ages." _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 20:08:46 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M18b9m008302 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:08:41 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0M17kK1011677 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:08:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0M17HgT026301 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:07:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M17Bqj050580; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:07:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M178mt050500 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:07:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H8neW-0005gw-EE; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 19:07:16 -0600 Received: from 65.13.105.239 ([65.13.105.239]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:07:16 -0500 Message-ID: <20070121200716.rb88i0oxnzocc4co@www.goldsword.com> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:07:16 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:Book Opinion References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32003] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php X-Source-Args: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php /usr/local/cpanel/base/horde/imp/compose.php X-Source-Dir: :/base/horde/imp X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 17b4e7e9-53fc-43b3-a149-2c85e69d0dc9 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B40E62.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:08:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Quoting RobinandKelly Dorman : > > The following quote is exemplifies what I'm interested in: > *wonderful quote snipped* > > Susan Fenimore Cooper "Rural Hours by a Lady" 1854 Yeah. I *want* that book. She has a wonderful essay on Trillium in there. :-) > > Of course, flowers and vegetation have been used as inspiration in both > clothing and home textiles for eons, but there is a definate connection > between botany becoming an acceptable pursuit for women and the > "blossoming" of realistic floral forms as decoration during the > Victorian period. What kind of science do you do, if I can be nosey? If you want, we can go off-list ... Did you know Beatrix Potter was a lichenologist? susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 21 22:44:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M3iOwF010197 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:44:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0M3hcmS027248 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:44:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0M3gv3u044152 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:42:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M3gqJ3041095; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:42:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d22.mx.aol.com (imo-d22.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.208]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M3gnKb040993 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:42:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c41.e0469f0 (48552) for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:42:34 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:42:32 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dove colored To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5e31f494-dcdc-493a-ac17-d68330650e27 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B432EA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:44:22 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/21/2007 12:05:09 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, otsisto@socket.net writes: So we must have unique and non conformist mourning doves around here. :) *************** Of course not all individual mourning doves are the same color. But "dove" is more than likely a pale grey on the warm side....towards pink or peach [as opposed to yellow]. I have a "Godet Americanized Paris Fashions, 1863" print of a "Dove" jacket with a pale pink silk skirt. The jacket is a pale ,warm grey-pink. Of course these are hand colored so....it's still an interpretation. But gloves are often referred to a "dove" and are usually depicted as pale grey. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 22 00:11:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M5Bd80011235 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 00:11:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0M5AmGE016778 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 00:11:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0M5ACro052595 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:10:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M5A8Rk093290; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:10:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.235]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M5A4CY093257 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:10:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so936195nzf for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 21:10:04 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=NZytxVz7/5JSYxrFBQIEeLs2jGjHkFn85O/Sg3OZArhpBH28hL2TaPl9ITEn7uZRa8jMrKmenIoO0rvuxd9beSNCLiQnNxfydWbHxzz8YAvVsVgFp1enbyIwEw+RaoUMt/asEcew4RRZlVokmIzRkb2fNYE7pgH76kzDt7KnmUA= Received: by 10.65.191.7 with SMTP id t7mr6754073qbp.1169442604153; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 21:10:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.65.196.1 with HTTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 21:10:03 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 21:10:03 -0800 From: Cin To: h-cost MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: ...as a courtesy X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: bb4d90ee-d3e6-4316-be9b-10fbcec584d3 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B44758.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 00:11:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This is a costume list... please dont post your SCA stuff here unless it is costume related. If we all posted off topic things this list would be rapidly cease being the delightful & useful source of information that many of us have found it to be. The irony of the subject line did provoke a wry smile. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 22 02:38:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M7cD18026009 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 02:38:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0M7bLdC001423 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 02:38:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0M7afte065905 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 00:36:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M7aUVH076480; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 00:36:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.230]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0M7aSLj076448 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 00:36:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i1so963451nzh for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 23:36:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:from:to:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole; b=fPsIb8gK+JnBzk8QkbKDOcHAdtRVDEqw4nObBfB8Z2/n8YPP+jnP2DiE6e1BCx6ay+A6336nDosnJCGProLvjZgThPkwXfy+uqib3BX5AhE+NwP5zA2zskEUDjXWGh//gZdH8HKFE6dh9C2g+4eZ3nvKv8Eq8m5n+771IPGHDjw= Received: by 10.65.103.17 with SMTP id f17mr6938608qbm.1169451387278; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 23:36:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from p4audrey ( [74.56.114.215]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id q16sm3779403qbq.2007.01.21.23.36.26; Sun, 21 Jan 2007 23:36:27 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <12c401c73df8$064fdf30$0202a8c0@p4audrey> From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 02:36:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Nanban trader... again! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5e1aa614-2272-440d-aa10-6ab07ec9351b X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B469B1.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 02:38:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi again! I'm kind of stuck. I've found a lot of very interesting images of Namban traders. For example: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/86/NanbanGroup.JPG or this, from the Costume museum http://www.iz2.or.jp/english/fukusyoku/busou/33.htm Both those sources are Japanese, BTW. They're a little later than what I'm aiming for, but I'm still curious about one thing: I can't find images of Europeans from European sources, wearing the long poufy pants. Short ones, yes, down to about just below the knee. Longer, no. Maybe I'm just not looking in the right places. I've looked at all my portrait and pattern books covering the period, as well as on the Web, and I still can't find them. It's not in Alcega, Arnold or Waugh, and it's not in my books about Renaissance portraits. It's not even in Peackock, who can sure make up some funky stuff sometimes! Maybe I'm just not looking late enough? But even later on, high boots were so popular that pants seem to stay around knee-length. I'm just curious. I'm aiming at 1580-1600, maybe even earlier, so I doubt the poufy pants and straight-waisted jackets are correct (higher waists and long points seemed to be fashionable at the time). But those images got me wondering... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 22 14:26:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0MJQjRa021531 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 14:26:45 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0MJPwTL032148 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 14:26:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0MJPDJH061860 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:25:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0MJP3aX086705; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:25:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep35.mail.dk (fep35.mail.dk [80.160.76.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0MJObGN086181 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 12:24:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep42.mail.dk ([195.41.46.225]) by fep35.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070122192432.RPWU7428.fep35.mail.dk@fep42.mail.dk> for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:24:32 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.133]) by fep42.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070122192432.XNQK18380.fep42.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:24:32 +0100 Message-ID: <006501c73e5a$fbb1c9e0$8543a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:24:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep42.mail.dk from [80.161.67.133] at Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:24:26 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: daeb7485-62ab-40af-9ab3-99aca509ab82 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B50FC6.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 14:26:42 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi Saragrace, I dont know these collours, but how do you erase the mark on the fabric? Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "h-costume" ; "TheRenaissanceTailor" Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 3:12 PM Subject: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! > Just thought I'd share a discovery with you. Frustrated by all my marking > pencils which, either disappear too soon, don't fit into a regular > sharpener, fall apart as soon as you try to apply pressure or sharpen > them - I tried some of my Crayola Erasable colored pencils. > > These work really well (I was using the yellow). I am marking over 23 > yards of trim placement - they show up on silk taffeta, and erase (even > after ironing!) without leaving a mark. The "lead" is strong enough to > hold up to repeated sharpening, keep the point well and don't break at the > slightest pressure. > > Of course I would try a test on anything new, and with any of the other > colors. > > > Sg > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 22 19:51:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N0p5Ze028024 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 19:51:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0N0oEFe002350 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 19:51:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0N0nYDH011169 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 17:49:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N0nRMk003142; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 17:49:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m16.mx.aol.com (imo-m16.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.206]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N0nNU9003015 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 17:49:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-m16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d3f.7e3eb7 (43933) for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 19:49:07 -0500 (EST) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 19:49:05 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] As a courtesy .. .. .. To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5017 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9c58739c-61eb-4578-8acc-1e0e9e929011 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B55BC6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 19:51:03 -0500 (EST) Status: RO so..... could somebody please tel those of us in the real(ish) world what it means??? debbie (ps - no offence to any sca members, and with tongue slightly in cheek) In a message dated 22/01/2007 19:03:06 GMT Standard Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: With all due respect, your announcement is off-topic. Let's stick to costuming-related items, please :~) Diana > "Unto my friends and all the noble and gentle folk to whom this message > comes, Greeting and Salutation. > > Let it be known amongst the Land, that as of this day 20 Ianuarii , I, > until now known as Norayn of The Wood, from the great lands of the Kingdom > of Atlantia ,shall henceforth be known as Vederun (Frederun),in conformity > with the rules and usages of the Current Middle Ages." > > > Vrederun > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 22 20:44:22 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N1iMw3028979 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:44:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0N1hVsi023828 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:44:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0N1hBQH017348 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:43:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N1h97P042119; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:43:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from server020.dfw.nationwide.net (server020.dfw.nationwide.net [206.123.129.83]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0N1h6Cd042082 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:43:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 17556 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2007 01:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO spamfilter.nationwide.net) (127.0.0.1) by server020.dfw.nationwide.net with SMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 01:43:05 +0000 Received: from 162.119.64.110 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by spamfilter.nationwide.net with HTTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 17:43:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <52824.162.119.64.110.1169516585.squirrel@spamfilter.nationwide.net> In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 17:43:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [h-cost] As a courtesy .. .. .. From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 50e1779d-34f8-43a7-9d2e-5bd057afbc44 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B56843.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:44:20 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > > so..... > > could somebody please tel those of us in the real(ish) world what it > means??? > > debbie She's letting people know that she has changed her SCA name. And I was sorta hoping she would come forth and apologize for spamming the various lists with this announcement. My advice is: NEVER e-mail your whole address book without double-checking :~) Diana -- www.RenaissanceFabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" "Become the change you want to see in the world." --Ghandi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 22 21:00:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N20BP3029190 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 21:00:15 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0N1xKi4003678 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 21:00:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0N1wlET019059 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:58:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N1wixF053042; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:58:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N1weYU052993 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:58:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-8.15) id AA1BA00402; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 01:51:23 +0000 From: "Sharon Collier" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Nanban trader... again! Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 17:58:28 -0800 Message-ID: <005401c73e91$fa9b4bd0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <12c401c73df8$064fdf30$0202a8c0@p4audrey> Importance: Normal X-CommKal-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude for spam and viruses. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0N1weYU052993 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3ee8241d-a04b-478a-9f90-81d1e9ed22d1 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B56BF8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 21:00:09 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I remember reading that Japan was closed to outsiders until relatively recently (1800's). Only the Portuguese traded with them, in only one area. Maybe look in Portuguese sources. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Audrey Bergeron-Morin Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 11:36 PM To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Nanban trader... again! Hi again! I'm kind of stuck. I've found a lot of very interesting images of Namban traders. For example: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/86/NanbanGroup.JPG or this, from the Costume museum http://www.iz2.or.jp/english/fukusyoku/busou/33.htm Both those sources are Japanese, BTW. They're a little later than what I'm aiming for, but I'm still curious about one thing: I can't find images of Europeans from European sources, wearing the long poufy pants. Short ones, yes, down to about just below the knee. Longer, no. Maybe I'm just not looking in the right places. I've looked at all my portrait and pattern books covering the period, as well as on the Web, and I still can't find them. It's not in Alcega, Arnold or Waugh, and it's not in my books about Renaissance portraits. It's not even in Peackock, who can sure make up some funky stuff sometimes! Maybe I'm just not looking late enough? But even later on, high boots were so popular that pants seem to stay around knee-length. I'm just curious. I'm aiming at 1580-1600, maybe even earlier, so I doubt the poufy pants and straight-waisted jackets are correct (higher waists and long points seemed to be fashionable at the time). But those images got me wondering... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 22 22:01:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N31n0g030107 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 22:01:53 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0N30v5E013629 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 22:01:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0N305Xx025685 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:00:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N301mN094221; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:00:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.239]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N2xxLA094177 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 19:59:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so1209339nzf for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:59:59 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:from:to:references:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole; b=lg9i0nqr/PwK39V6XmIy3OKeKtIueuRdzQ4+Oem21G99xL2HkgJnZOVq/R/5q1C5IRSRllmZs2+YNMqZuybvztZ6LeamszvhxcK2U9/N78qW9cx1yAyYXB9/lQZDsWPnd9RAslouf0H6Q8MzvEgj28+s0lBmf8wt9TJJ1cf3CJg= Received: by 10.65.237.1 with SMTP id o1mr8795809qbr.1169521198934; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:59:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from p4audrey ( [74.56.114.215]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id e10sm8219410qbe.2007.01.22.18.59.58; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 18:59:58 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <01e901c73e9a$923040b0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <005401c73e91$fa9b4bd0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... again! Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 21:59:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 54f2a978-535c-4537-82c6-ea919407221d X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B57A69.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 22 Jan 2007 22:01:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >I remember reading that Japan was closed to outsiders until relatively > recently (1800's). Only the Portuguese traded with them, in only one area. > Maybe look in Portuguese sources. The Portuguese arrived in Japan in the 1540s or 1560s, not totally certain. Japan had closed its borders to China, but not to other trading countries. There were the Portuguese and the Dutch, mainly, at the time, because the Spanish were too busy conquering South America ;-P That is, until Japan closed its borders completely around 1650 - then they only allowed the Dutch to do trade, and only in some very specific places. In any case, Portugal and Spain were under the same rule for a while somewhere around 1600, give or take about 50 years (and then became independant again), so the royalty must have been wearing the same thing, which should have trickled down to the lower classes. If you look at Portuguese and Spanish paintings of royalty at the time, they really are wearing almost the same thing. Alcega might be portraying the higher classes, but he does NOT portray royalty. This is stated quite clearly in the introduction. So, in 1585, the poufy pant thing was not happening in his part of Spain at least. In any case, Spanish OR Portuguese, I am totally unable to find anything even resembling long poufy pants. Anywhere but on Japanese representations of European traders. Also, finding Portuguese sources is another challenge. I didn't find much out there about Portuguese fashion in the Renaissance... especially not for the merchant class! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 08:28:54 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NDSr1O006697 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:28:53 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0NDS2ej030015 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:28:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NDRS2b086872 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 06:27:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NDRKBB097649; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 06:27:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc3-s18.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s18.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.218]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NDRCAX097504 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 06:27:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.27]) by bay0-omc3-s18.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 05:27:06 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 05:27:06 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV17.phx.gbl with DAV; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:27:05 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: <006501c73e5a$fbb1c9e0$8543a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 06:27:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 06:27:24 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Jan 2007 13:27:06.0197 (UTC) FILETIME=[2D09C050:01C73EF2] X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 601a32f1-b375-42d5-b8ef-fab83ce9ee76 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B60D62.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:28:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Each pencil has an eraser attached to the top end of the pencil...but I am sure any other eraser would work too. http://www.dickblick.com/zz205/84/ Sg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 12:24 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! Hi Saragrace, I dont know these collours, but how do you erase the mark on the fabric? Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 10:02:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NF2eAN008573 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:02:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0NF1s3P006963 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:02:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NF15hG001693 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:01:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NF0wIQ082018; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:00:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.186]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NF0X4h081489 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 08:00:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katybishop64@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so286925nfe for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 07:00:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=SYVojQRgqRSJYbBjI6ujPdlGxS04OC8Hwm1W2tT49ml1VdLWKTC/1tMJk3L7BhWrl9LzLEkQX1qBGxr9IeCBwubT2NDXNF8+gkptZ0hXWTb6uA53B5+AnQKde9x/LUU2ezLsv3oxPkRnETwiZjipCnOocALFbhXDOtmr/YsEW00= Received: by 10.82.105.13 with SMTP id d13mr158632buc.1169564426603; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 07:00:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.184.5 with HTTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 07:00:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3586f5070701230700j6bde2932iae96cd1768c42a41@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:00:26 -0500 From: "Katy Bishop" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Fwd: [h-cost] 19th cen Knitting pattern help In-Reply-To: <1941e47f0701190838i5348d2efp126151351814e4d4@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline References: <200701181354.l0IDsUko019858@net.indra.com> <3586f5070701181608x36b874afi7c939119cf19bdbc@mail.gmail.com> <1941e47f0701190838i5348d2efp126151351814e4d4@mail.gmail.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0NF0X4h081489 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e5649f70-95c6-4b71-99b7-bef76e21ffb2 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B62362.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:02:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A friend of mine, Silvana Siddali, has been researching mid-19th century kittting patterns, so I asked her about the knitting yarn in question. She has also produced some really nice volumes, with a friend, reproducing period knitting patterns with reconstructed instructions called "Knitting a la Mode: and "Knit Two a la Mode." The original patterns are all from La Mode Illustree 1860-1865. I have just added her books to my website: http://www.vintagevictorian.com/Ordering.html Silvana's reply about yarn and knitting resources follows the original h-costume post. Katy >Original post: >http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/cw/1864sontag.html >could someone comment on what yarn would be a good >substitute for Zephyr in this pattern? I'm wondering if >we are talking something like fingering yarn? Angora? >I'm aware this is probably not still available, but what >would make a similar garment, not necessarily period >correct, but just as pleasing ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Silvana Siddali Date: Jan 19, 2007 11:38 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] 19th cen Knitting pattern help To: Katy Bishop First of all, here's an excellent link for anyone who is interested in reproducing 19th century knitting patterns authentically: http://www.raggedsoldier.com/knitting_1.pdf I'm on a lot of historic / victorian / civil war era knitting lists, and I can tell you that there's a great deal of discussion about zephyr yarn. Although there are currently zephyr yarns being produced today, some experts say that they're not really perfect repros of mid-19th century yarns. However, Halcyon makes a really lovely zephyr yarn that I believe works very well, both in terms of texture and fineness: http://www.halcyonyarn.com/Yarn_pages/yarn027.html This is a wool-silk blend. Colleen Formby, who has done extensive research in this area, has said that period zephyr yarn was probably all-wool. In any event, I would say that a very fine pure wool, either fingering or sock weight, would work with a pattern calling for zephyr. Angora wasn't used in this country, not for knitting anyway, not during the civil war era. I've found some evidence that Parisian ladies were experimenting with angora wool (at least that's what I think right now); they called it soie de lapin. To the best of my knowledge, american women didn't knit with angora or mohair until much later in the 19th century. One other thing -- I highly recommend these knitting reference cards for people attempting to reproduce period knitting: http://www.raggedsoldier.com/ You might have to get onto the site itself to search for them under craft supplies, since there doesn't seem to be a direct link. They are very useful -- I always take them with me when I shop for yarn or needles. Hope this helps! Regards, Silvana On 1/18/07, Katy Bishop wrote: > Hi, this was posted on h-costume, any thoughts? If I sent in an > answer I could also plug your booklets. > > Katy > > Specific quote from the original pattern: > > "In the front of the number we give a very beautiful pattern, in > colors, for a Crocheted Sontag, Shawl Pattern. > Materials. – 3 oz. scarlet double zephyr; 3 oz. black; 2 oz. white. " > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Kirsten Felton > Date: Jan 18, 2007 10:19 AM > Subject: [h-cost] 19th cen Knitting pattern help > To: h-costume@indra.com > > > > http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/cw/1864sontag.html > > could someone comment on what yarn would be a good > substitute for Zephyr in this pattern? I'm wondering if > we are talking something like fingering yarn? Angora? > I'm aware this is probably not still available, but what > would make a similar garment, not necessarily period > correct, but just as pleasing. > > thanks, kitty > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > -- > Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian > vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com > Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. > Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 13:34:22 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NIYMbF014000 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:34:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0NIXUM1030936 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:34:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NIWhpO039810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:32:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NIWUBd026627; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:32:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m25.mx.aol.com (imo-m25.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.6]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NIWPth026420 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:32:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-m25.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c1d.ea552d6 (60470) for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:32:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mblk-d15 (mblk-d15.mblk.aol.com [205.188.149.7]) by ciaaol-m02.mx.aol.com (v114_r1.17) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLM023-ec3645b654a673; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:32:06 -0500 References: <200701201322.l0KDMSXA032223@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:32:06 -0500 In-Reply-To: <200701201322.l0KDMSXA032223@net.indra.com> X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI MIME-Version: 1.0 From: tearoses@aol.com X-MB-Message-Type: User X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 22250 Received: from 68.143.196.38 by mblk-d15.sysops.aol.com (205.188.149.7) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:32:06 -0500 Message-Id: <8C90D33EB0F9654-2B0-20A2@mblk-d15.sysops.aol.com> X-AOL-IP: 205.188.149.7 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: aprons X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5c81ec55-9a7a-4db1-a6a1-750e2f56dd77 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B654FA.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:34:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sorry I'm a little late commenting on this subject, but Brueghel (Flemish 1530s-40s) portrays aprons that seem to be a big rectangle of linen tucked into a belt. http://tinyurl.com/2ded6x I have a book with a really good copy of this painting and other Brueghels, and up close you can see the women have tiny little narrow belts that seem to be leather. Some women wear more than one belt. Their aprons are usually tucked into a belt or sometimes their overskirts are flipped up and tucked into the belt, although I don't know if that's in lieu of an apron or just to show off the contrasting lining. Hope this helps, Tea Rose ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 15:15:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NKF7jB018756 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:15:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0NKEGTF018382 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:15:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NKDM7x057629 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:13:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NKDAWh046969; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:13:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep31.mail.dk (fep31.mail.dk [80.160.76.195]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NKCfeJ046398 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:12:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep40.mail.dk ([195.41.46.140]) by fep31.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070123201205.OMZU3513.fep31.mail.dk@fep40.mail.dk> for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:12:05 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.187]) by fep40.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070123201205.YKNA10241.fep40.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:12:05 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c73f2a$ce8a1280$bb43a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <006501c73e5a$fbb1c9e0$8543a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:12:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep40.mail.dk from [80.161.67.187] at Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:11:57 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 56bca32d-b48d-42cf-9a81-7572b9b4c47d X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B66C98.006 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:15:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi Saragrace, Thanks for the informations. I thoaght perhaps it could be usefull with marking embroidery patterns, but it wont be good if you have to erase it with a rubber, would spoil the embroidery. But i see that it would be a great help for trim marks, as you said. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! > Each pencil has an eraser attached to the top end of the pencil...but I am > sure any other eraser would work too. > > http://www.dickblick.com/zz205/84/ > > Sg > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 12:24 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! > > > Hi Saragrace, > I dont know these collours, but how do you erase the mark on the fabric? > > Bjarne > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 15:46:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NKkn0l019323 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:46:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0NKk1Kw007359 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:46:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NKiuqA061539 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:44:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NKieif083057; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:44:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc11.comcast.net (sccrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.200.81]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NKiUOU082720 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:44:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc11) with SMTP id <2007012320442301100ncm5oe>; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:44:23 +0000 In-Reply-To: <000601c73f2a$ce8a1280$bb43a150@CPQ21932199711> References: <006501c73e5a$fbb1c9e0$8543a150@CPQ21932199711> <000601c73f2a$ce8a1280$bb43a150@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Message-Id: From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:44:22 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 25b246e9-7ea4-4fa7-bbb5-2b2a01ff8747 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B67409.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:46:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Bjarne, et al: What *do* you use to mark embroidery patterns, and how do you get the marks to go away afterwards? Thanks! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 23, 2007, at 3:12 PM, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Hi Saragrace, > Thanks for the informations. > I thoaght perhaps it could be usefull with marking embroidery > patterns, but it wont be good if you have to erase it with a > rubber, would spoil the embroidery. But i see that it would be a > great help for trim marks, as you said. > > Bjarne > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" > > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:27 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! > > >> Each pencil has an eraser attached to the top end of the >> pencil...but I am sure any other eraser would work too. >> >> http://www.dickblick.com/zz205/84/ >> >> Sg >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" >> >> To: "Historical Costume" >> Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 12:24 PM >> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! >> >> >> Hi Saragrace, >> I dont know these collours, but how do you erase the mark on the >> fabric? >> >> Bjarne >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 17:20:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NMKbXQ021430 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:20:41 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0NMJjGH007257 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:20:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NMIjCL076020 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:18:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NMIcll085445; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:18:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NJaXuu004709 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 12:36:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.42) id 1H9RRU-000HGJ-9R for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:36:29 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:35:09 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: aprons References: <200701201322.l0KDMSXA032223@net.indra.com> <8C90D33EB0F9654-2B0-20A2@mblk-d15.sysops.aol.com> In-Reply-To: <8C90D33EB0F9654-2B0-20A2@mblk-d15.sysops.aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.06-U () X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=9% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 74f68a69-0fa6-46aa-9272-c36f8d342d47 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B68A01.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:20:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I have come across modern "traditional" costumes in France, probably based on 19th century, where they roll the overskirt up and to the back and tuck it into the waistband. I was told this was originally to keep it clean, effectively using the linen/cotton underskirt instead of an apron. Jean tearoses@aol.com wrote > Sorry I'm a little late commenting on this subject, but Brueghel >(Flemish 1530s-40s) portrays aprons that seem to be a big rectangle of >linen tucked into a belt. > > http://tinyurl.com/2ded6x > > I have a book with a really good copy of this painting and other >Brueghels, and up close you can see the women have tiny little narrow >belts that seem to be leather. Some women wear more than one belt. >Their aprons are usually tucked into a belt or sometimes their >overskirts are flipped up and tucked into the belt, although I don't >know if that's in lieu of an apron or just to show off the contrasting >lining. > > Hope this helps, > Tea Rose > > >________________________________________________________________________ >Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and >security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from >across the web, free AOL Mail and more. >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 17:24:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NMOfo8021538 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:24:41 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0NMNsrM031099 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:24:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NMMQru076893 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:22:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NMMLUd089858; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:22:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NKvXGS097735 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:57:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:14808 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1H9Shz-0005EA-DW for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:57:35 -0600 Message-ID: <013e01c73f31$17fdb9c0$5600a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <006501c73e5a$fbb1c9e0$8543a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:57:26 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3061f48e-36f5-4950-94bc-a09114e14b30 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B68AFB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:24:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I've been using normal (read: cheap) colored pencils to mark dark & black fabric for a while, and haven't had any trouble. A normal pencil eraser will erase them, but I can generally just rub real hard with my finger. I've had no problem getting the marks to just wash out, though... of course, that may depend on fiber, and I haven't tried it on too wide a range of fabrics, but it washed out of wool and silk perfectly well! The marks last much longer than a chalk pencil mark would, but they're still not quite durable enough for say, a large detailed embroidery motif. At least, _I_ can't use them that way, since I rarely use a hoop and therefore get my fingers all over the fabric, wearing off the marks. If I see the erasable ones for sale, I'll probably try them, though. =} -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 17:29:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NMTeVb021668 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:29:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0NMSRdA000754 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:29:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0NMRnZj077972 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:27:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0NMPfi7093634; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:25:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nlpi001.sbcis.sbc.com (nlpi001.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0N3LRmo007403 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 20:21:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.82.84] Received: from [192.168.1.103] (adsl-69-107-82-84.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.82.84]) by nlpi001.sbcis.sbc.com (8.13.8 out.dk.spool/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0N3L3s3018255 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2007 21:21:03 -0600 Message-ID: <45B57F92.6060305@frys.com> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 19:22:58 -0800 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... again! References: <005401c73e91$fa9b4bd0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> <01e901c73e9a$923040b0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> In-Reply-To: <01e901c73e9a$923040b0$0202a8c0@p4audrey> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=27% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 79df496f-7a2d-44e2-af44-b68ddd5eac04 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B68C0B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:29:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > In any case, Spanish OR Portuguese, I am totally unable to find anything > even resembling long poufy pants. Anywhere but on Japanese > representations of European traders. So if the event is mostly Japanese, I'd go with the Japanese representations of the namban, and cross-dress if I was a biological female playing a namban. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 19:22:54 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0O0Mnsg025452 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:22:54 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0O0M3fV010776 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:22:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0O0KgFB094263 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:20:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0O0KYPS004959; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:20:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0O0KVuH004852 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:20:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:15913 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1H9VsQ-0006iq-60 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:20:34 -0600 Message-ID: <017201c73f4d$71f6f470$5600a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <006501c73e5a$fbb1c9e0$8543a150@CPQ21932199711> <013e01c73f31$17fdb9c0$5600a8c0@compaqub> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:20:23 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] marking embroidery designs (was: Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ae32d1b6-e681-4c9e-bafa-506e668af36c X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B6A6AB.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:22:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO For all but black fabric, I use thin-line water-soluble ink pens. For really fine lines or when the ink just keeps bleeding, I use a soft graphite pencil; it washes out just fine. For black fabrics, I haven't found anything I'm really happy with yet, but for my next project (beading rather than embroidery, but same problem) I plan to try heavy duty solvy--it's a sort of an interfacing that dissolves in water, but is thick/durable enough to mark on with pen. (Made by Sulky.) I'll draw the design on that, then bead through it into the fabric, then dunk & dry it. Hope it goes well! Other thinks I've tried on black fabric are putting normal iron-on interfacing on the back, with the design already drawn on, and then just embroidering from the back side. It works well for simple stuff/stitches, but it can get tedious really quickly. I've also gone the back interfacing route, but instead of embroidering from the back, basted the outlines of the design and then removed the interfacing before embroidering. It works well enough, but I haven't been able to get as much detail in the basted design as I'd like. For simple or narrow designs, a colored pencil works well for me. -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 23 23:18:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0O4I0hU030793 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 23:18:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0O4HA2w030117 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 23:17:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0O4GZuA025453 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:16:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0O4GSXg073911; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:16:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ruby.spiritone.com (ruby.spiritone.com [216.99.193.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0O4GNCV073860 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:16:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by ruby.spiritone.com (8.13.6/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0O4GJbn002025 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:16:22 -0800 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "H-Costume" Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:18:18 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1896 Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] FW: Polistampa - 'Moda a Firenze 1540-1580' Reprint X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: db1eef11-884a-4835-bd81-cf8b3fe495c5 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B6DDC9.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO e-mail message from POLISTAMPA -----Original Message----- From: promo@polistampa.com [mailto:promo@polistampa.com] Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 3:51 AM To: promo@polistampa.com Subject: Polistampa - 'Moda a Firenze 1540-1580' P O L I S T A M P A ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Via Santa Maria 27/r · 50125 Firenze Tel. 055 2337702 - fax info/ufficio stampa 055 229430 E-mail: info@polistampa.com Via Livorno 8/31 · 50142 Firenze Tel. 055 7326272 - fax ammin./magazz. 055 7377428 E-mail: redazione@polistampa.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- Gentile Cliente, siamo lieti di informarLa che nel prossimo mese di marzo sarà ristampato uno dei più pregiati volumi editi da Polistampa: < A href="http://www.polistampa.com//asp/sl.asp?id=3653" target=blank>Moda a Firenze 1540-1580. Frutto della lunga e accurata ricerca di due note studiose di storia del tessuto e del costume, interamente illustrato a colori, tradotto in un ottimo inglese, questo grande volume ha riscosso molto successo in Italia e all'estero. Esaurito da due mesi, sarà ristampato in marzo per essere in libreria ad aprile 2007. Può prenotare il libro già da adesso con lo sconto del 20%. Cordiali saluti, Antonio Pagliai Ufficio Promozione POLISTAMPA promo@polistampa.com Sconto 20% Stampa ottimizzata Bruna Niccoli / Roberta Orsi Landini Moda a Firenze 1540-1580 Lo stile di Eleonora di Toledo e la sua influenza II edizione / II edition In reprint, available only from April 2007 You can book it with 20% discount Italian-English texts, including: Eleonora di Toledo Duchess of Tuscany in history and legend; Eleonora's style; Costume in the Medici ceremonies; The clothes that have survived; The individual garments; Tailors and embroiderers; Florentine textile production; The wardrobe of Eleonora di Toledo; etc. (source: artbooks.com). © Firenze: Pagliai Polistampa 2005, 32cm., cloth, 252 pp., ca. 120 plates, most in color, ? 58,00, ISBN: 8883048679 ______________________________________ In ristampa, disponibile solo da aprile 2007 Prenotabile con lo sconto del 20% Firenze, 1539: l'arrivo di Eleonora da Toledo, figlia del viceré di Napoli e giovane sposa di Cosimo de' Medici, port a in città un clima nuovo. La moda fiorentina, ancora sotto l'influenza del moralismo del Savonarola, si apre, grazie allo stile della duchessa, al gusto internazionale. Ma, pur essendo amante del lusso e delle novità che giungono dalle principali corti europee, Eleonora è attenta a non urtare la suscettibilità dei suoi sudditi attraverso un'eccessiva ostentazione. Adotta uno stile sobrio, in cui elementi della tradizione si combinano con le novità, modello di misura ed armonia per le successive sovrane di Firenze. Il guardaroba della duchessa, ricostruito sui documenti d'archivio, quasi nella sua completezza, permette un'analisi accurata di ogni singolo capo di vestiario, visivamente individuato nella ritrattistica coeva; di ogni capo si segue l'evoluzione di foggia e di gusto nel corso di quarant'anni circa. Testi in italiano e in inglese Pagliai·Polistampa I edizione: maggio 2005; I ristampa: marzo 2007 © 2005, cm 24x31, pp. 256, ill. col., cart., € 58,00 ISBN: 88-8304-867-9 Collana: Pagliai Polistampa / Cataloghi d'arte, 50 Settore: TL6 / Moda Altri settori: A1 / Storia dell'arte, A4 / Arti minori, DSU1 / Storia Rassegna stampa: Eleonora Style (Maria Novella Batini, «Toscana Qui») Alla moda di Eleonora (Elettra Gullè, «Toscana Tascabile») Firenze nel '500 La moda secondo Eleonora (Silvia Gigli, «Informatore») Moda a Firenze, lo stile di Eleonora (Rebecca Romoli, «Toscan a Oggi») Il volume Moda a Firenze 1540-1580 dell'editore Polistampa: uno spaccato nella moda e nel costume italiani (senza firma, «MarketPress») Lettera da Firenze (Pier Francesco Listri, «Il Giornale») Eleonora di Toledo. Un libro ricostruisce l'abbigliamento e lo stile della moglie di Cosimo I (Domenico Del Nero, «Il Giornale») La 'zampata' di Eleonora di Toledo, graduchessa di Toscana (Sandra Salvato, «La Nazione») Un libro su Eleonora di Toledo, l'aristocratica che fece moda (Alessandro Guasti, «Metropoli») Zeppe e pantaloni alla pescatora di una stilista del Cinquecento (Letizia Cini, «La Nazione») Calzoni al ginocchio e scarpe con la zeppa, la moda del XVI secolo a Firenze (senza firma, «Adnkronos») La moda del ’500 attraverso lo stile di Eleonora di Toledo (senza firma, «Nove da Firenze») Eventi correlati: Presentazione del libro Moda a Firenze 1540-1580 Moda a Firenze 1540-1580 Lo stile di Eleonora di Toledo e la sua influenza Qualora desiderasse non ricevere più informazioni editoriali o altra posta dalla ns. Casa Editrice, è sufficiente che risponda a questo messaggio inserendo la parola RIMUOVI in ‘oggetto’. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 05:27:54 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OARp2B019167 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:27:51 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0OAR2QL005949 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:27:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0OAPR7c067960 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 03:25:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OAPHEA017592; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 03:25:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OAPDMv017456 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 03:25:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.d01.7dedcd9 (30739) for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:24:59 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:24:56 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Nanban trader... again! To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5358 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c9b5e664-b7a7-4d12-bae9-e5de79b9f074 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B73476.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:27:48 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/23/2007 7:27:05 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: So if the event is mostly Japanese, I'd go with the Japanese representations of the namban, and cross-dress if I was a biological female playing a namban. Sounds like the best plan to me, too. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 07:43:26 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OChQKk012455 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 07:43:26 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0OCgYdU013577 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 07:43:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0OCfkhG083482 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:41:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OCfggI021861; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:41:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web39614.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web39614.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.106.45]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0OCfc1c021722 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:41:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from tania_gr17@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 36673 invoked by uid 60001); 24 Jan 2007 12:41:33 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=MJgqWgJMXd13WFaY1u3W3gCSRKbdAAMSjBaEBbOdLDBubrBm2Uwn6KJ6SLJXt0BNg+5zmBhyC3Yr71zJ9piIhobfCzFjAC3ruCekOq6osLTTGHwudRswhK2lCqJ2Om+OAgtZciePaXgX9MPeAgifs+1PRJV9dtok0qlRkqWYsgc=; X-YMail-OSG: h.m.KrEVM1mTM2GpCtqbg6GqWpscBvfWC8XTsjDZaW6DipVYR8_JA6oTfUJ5mOI_kidKFqxYp69V_qJCtjPdF2AT.na9NwjyxgkJeDuMzrdOoGFzX4I- Received: from [62.79.63.35] by web39614.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 04:41:33 PST Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 04:41:33 -0800 (PST) From: Tania Gruning To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <002401c739df$c4f48d40$17bfa6d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <41596.32342.qm@web39614.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Help finding online resource X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 92f84d70-7f6a-43a8-8b35-91a205096b27 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B7543A.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 07:43:23 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hiya all. I have tried to search the archive, but have been unable to locate this resource. It is a online archive with out of print and antique books scanned in, that you can download in txt or pdf. The books are all on womens concerns: Sewing, embroidery, householdmanagement, childcare and some other miscellanious things. The archive is hosted by a large university, and the archive currently have 1000's of books starting from around 1750 and forward. Unfortunately I had a major computer crash which completely fried my harddrives, so no chance of recovering bookmarks ;-) Hope this is enough information for you to be able to find what i mean Tania (in snowy Denmark) --------------------------------- Bored stiff? Loosen up... Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 09:59:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OEx7Nq017347 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 09:59:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0OEwFGG005479 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 09:59:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0OEvZmm001172 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 07:57:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OEvO8P042169; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 07:57:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep30.mail.dk (fep30.mail.dk [80.160.76.194]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OEbHTi021696 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 07:37:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep41.mail.dk ([195.41.46.142]) by fep30.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070124143711.CTLH2255.fep30.mail.dk@fep41.mail.dk> for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:37:11 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.133]) by fep41.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070124143711.YXQM20909.fep41.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:37:11 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c73fc5$2b6c1800$8514a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <006501c73e5a$fbb1c9e0$8543a150@CPQ21932199711><000601c73f2a$ce8a1280$bb43a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Crayola Erasable Colored Pencils -work great! Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:37:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep41.mail.dk from [80.161.20.133] at Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:37:03 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6579bb78-4d47-43dc-9b63-ee61836a7711 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B77407.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 09:59:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Lauren, I use a sharp pencil, og the kind with long sticks of crayon you refil your pencil with, i think its 0,5 mm. As i always embroider to the edge of the pattern, the thread wil cover the pencil line, and therefore it is no problem with it. Thats my way of doing it! Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 15:30:58 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OKUwjs028966 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:30:58 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0OKU9C8029513 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:30:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0OKT6hQ050621 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 13:29:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OKSoAh001189; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 13:28:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.wightman.on.ca (server01.gorrie.wightman.ca [216.110.227.151]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0OJul11063996 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 12:56:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix, from userid 99) id E28F3849C5; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:56:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from MAIN (dsl-v45-216-110-230-37.wightman.ca [216.110.230.37]) by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71DE2849B7 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:56:42 -0500 (EST) From: "Five Rivers Chapmanry" To: Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:56:44 -0500 Organization: Five Rivers Message-ID: <000101c73ff1$c5ee5e70$6400a8c0@MAIN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <200701241901.l0OJ0vTq099918@net.indra.com> Importance: Normal X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on server01.gorrie X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-100.0 required=5.0 tests=USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100 autolearn=disabled version=3.0.1 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0OJul11063996 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: marking embroidery designs X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 08cbf405-345e-447d-b55a-8fa10705b0eb X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B7C1D1.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:30:55 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi, Lauren, The idea is you don't make the embroidery marks go away; completely unnecessary. The idea that these should disappear is entirely a modern convention, as historically embroidery marks were made with ink. This is not something about which I trouble myself. I just make sure my embroidery is good enough to cover the marks. Just as the professionals of history. End of story. :-) Speaking of which, I've just finished doing a restoration and addition to a lovely vintage cotton voile christening gown. I am ever so pleased. Hope to have pics and story of it up on the website in the next week or two. Regards, Lorina Five Rivers Chapmanry purveyors of quality hand-crafted cooperage, embroidery supplies; fine, original textile, pen and ink, and watercolour art. Soon to come: books by Lorina Stephens 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 18:25:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ONPe73000962 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 18:25:44 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ONOmMn003488 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 18:25:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ONNIXE080010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 16:23:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ONNESP095208; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 16:23:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31510.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31510.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.198.139]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0ONNAS6095059 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 16:23:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bella_lucia_da_verona@yahoo.com.au) Received: (qmail 10548 invoked by uid 60001); 24 Jan 2007 23:23:05 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com.au; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Message-ID; b=tw03TsF355/a4K37QWGVEH+U1VkoxRuLcHOZ0uP8htA/P4oFBxaC/PqYuKzyTMHSiKVuQ6hDzTRgHxRqpuzwIze6P+9JyOjECoI4oB44OQ/K+rtAz8Q1BEKSzus9lhLaU73V4el0pHDljjMmxsko/CeLht8LlvhMkyh57dgjyiw=; X-YMail-OSG: Wzs6xgcVM1mekzKYIaoWuP_wsvJb2BNEUF2j_ENwperP.RCzmxB7CFYYQMLLL3A.yDRGT6J7.8iQcE.CWXD.ENrQqIry893mP2R64mdrqbidyDyKNrS0dhe9c19jgcRBj9EENkymm5qHy4lMQD994WX7jZK6BYBn Received: from [121.44.78.222] by web31510.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:23:05 PST X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/368.3 YahooMailWebService/0.6.132.7 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 15:23:05 -0800 (PST) From: Bella Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding online resource To: Historical Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <273963.10399.qm@web31510.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=12% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: af26f5f6-c727-4205-8b50-d037b42bcab5 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B7EAC0.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 18:25:37 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0ONPe73000962 Status: RO Hello Tania, is this what you're looking for? http://www.cs.arizona.edu/patterns/weaving/books.html Bella ----- Original Message ---- From: Tania Gruning To: Historical Costume Sent: Wednesday, 24 January, 2007 11:11:33 PM Subject: [h-cost] Help finding online resource Hiya all. I have tried to search the archive, but have been unable to locate this resource. It is a online archive with out of print and antique books scanned in, that you can download in txt or pdf. The books are all on womens concerns: Sewing, embroidery, householdmanagement, childcare and some other miscellanious things. The archive is hosted by a large university, and the archive currently have 1000's of books starting from around 1750 and forward. Unfortunately I had a major computer crash which completely fried my harddrives, so no chance of recovering bookmarks ;-) Hope this is enough information for you to be able to find what i mean Tania (in snowy Denmark) Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 19:31:18 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P0VEY4002800 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:31:18 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0P0UMUx030506 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:31:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0P0TgPP088111 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 17:29:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P0TVPo057056; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 17:29:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bookworm.suffolk.lib.ny.us (bookworm.suffolk.lib.ny.us [209.139.6.81]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P0TR4F056985 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 17:29:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bchamber@suffolk.lib.ny.us) Received: from localhost (bchamber@localhost) by bookworm.suffolk.lib.ny.us (8.12.8/8.12.6) with SMTP id l0P0Sdi9012480 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:28:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:28:39 -0500 (EST) From: Chamberlain X-Sender: bchamber@bookworm To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding online resource In-Reply-To: <41596.32342.qm@web39614.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e097b721-55c7-4b72-9296-e438f5b7e1a9 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B7FA1E.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:31:11 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm at work and don't have my bookmarks on this computer. My first guesses would be: Home Economics Archive from Cornell http://hearth.library.cornell.edu/ or Making of America (a group of universities) http://www.hti.umich.edu/m/moagrp/ Hope that helps, Beth Chamberlain On Wed, 24 Jan 2007, Tania Gruning wrote: > Hiya all. > > I have tried to search the archive, but have been unable to locate this resource. > > It is a online archive with out of print and antique books scanned in, that you can download in txt or pdf. > > The books are all on womens concerns: Sewing, embroidery, householdmanagement, childcare and some other miscellanious things. > > The archive is hosted by a large university, and the archive currently have 1000's of books starting from around 1750 and forward. > > Unfortunately I had a major computer crash which completely fried my harddrives, so no chance of recovering bookmarks ;-) > > Hope this is enough information for you to be able to find what i mean > > Tania (in snowy Denmark) > > > --------------------------------- > Bored stiff? Loosen up... > Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 20:07:45 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P17eID003834 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:07:41 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0P16ksF003367 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:07:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0P16GtJ092169 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 18:06:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P16Efi085885; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 18:06:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P0fJJ8066746 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 17:41:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H9sg6-0003D4-LE; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 18:41:22 -0600 Received: from 65.13.105.239 ([65.13.105.239]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:41:22 -0500 Message-ID: <20070124194122.le8hcffpbpg8wcsk@www.goldsword.com> Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:41:22 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help finding online resource References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32003] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php X-Source-Args: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php /usr/local/cpanel/base/horde/imp/compose.php X-Source-Dir: :/base/horde/imp X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d55f528e-c9e0-456a-8c8c-54f636875d5a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B802A9.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > On Wed, 24 Jan 2007, Tania Gruning wrote: > >> Hiya all. >> >> I have tried to search the archive, but have been unable to locate >> this resource. >> >> It is a online archive with out of print and antique books scanned >> in, that you can download in txt or pdf. >> >> The books are all on womens concerns: Sewing, embroidery, >> householdmanagement, childcare and some other miscellanious things. >> >> The archive is hosted by a large university, and the archive >> currently have 1000's of books starting from around 1750 and forward. This isan't that big of an archive, but it's the only one that I know of. http://inky.library.yale.edu/medwomen/whichbook.html susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 22:31:27 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P3VRXD008032 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:31:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0P3UZaV010912 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:31:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0P3Txak009713 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:29:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P3Tl6E092415; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:29:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from centrmmtao06.cox.net (centrmmtao06.cox.net [70.168.83.78]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P3Th59092278 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 20:29:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyanne@quik.com) Received: from eastrmimpo02.cox.net ([68.1.16.120]) by centrmmtao06.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.03 201-2131-130-104-20060516) with ESMTP id <20070125032937.CEJU13510.centrmmtao06.cox.net@eastrmimpo02.cox.net> for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:29:37 -0500 Received: from ANNESCOMPUTER ([70.160.213.140]) by eastrmimpo02.cox.net with bizsmtp id FFVZ1W01432JwDy0000000; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:29:36 -0500 From: "Anne Moeller" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] RE: marking embroidery designs Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:29:33 -0500 Message-ID: <00b001c74031$0810ea90$0200a8c0@ANNESCOMPUTER> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <000101c73ff1$c5ee5e70$6400a8c0@MAIN> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Thread-Index: Acc/96wWiHEvFN5MToWlGybkNhEmnwAOR/LA X-DCC-wuwien-Metrics: net.indra.com 1290; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=9% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8eb35fdd-ac59-42cb-8b09-7c7bcb655202 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B8245B.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:31:24 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thank you for that comment. I was wondering why everyone was so concerned about the markings. I just assumed the lines are always covered by thread. Anne -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Five Rivers Chapmanry Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:57 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] RE: marking embroidery designs Hi, Lauren, The idea is you don't make the embroidery marks go away; completely unnecessary. The idea that these should disappear is entirely a modern convention, as historically embroidery marks were made with ink. This is not something about which I trouble myself. I just make sure my embroidery is good enough to cover the marks. Just as the professionals of history. End of story. :-) Speaking of which, I've just finished doing a restoration and addition to a lovely vintage cotton voile christening gown. I am ever so pleased. Hope to have pics and story of it up on the website in the next week or two. Regards, Lorina Five Rivers Chapmanry purveyors of quality hand-crafted cooperage, embroidery supplies; fine, original textile, pen and ink, and watercolour art. Soon to come: books by Lorina Stephens 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.17.8/649 - Release Date: 1/23/2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 24 23:39:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P4dC4U009997 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:39:16 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0P4cLK1005292 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:39:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0P4bmg5016922 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 21:37:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P4bh43037945; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 21:37:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P4bdTf037896 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 21:37:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=radiks.net; b=Pvqiz5w7MDZ+RqnM5kcXfWecGk//dcpg5APXssLYkTBNRmi2IadQy8iugwXePlKJ; h=Received:Message-Id:X-Mailer:Date:To:From:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.81.2.235] (helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1H9wMk-0001ba-Mn for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:37:38 -0500 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20070124223151.02807340@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:37:28 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200701241901.l0OJ0vTq099918@net.indra.com> References: <200701241901.l0OJ0vTq099918@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e539b8433f83ae4dfc96355619a66b02564e16b3921752e310a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.81.2.235 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: using Solvy X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d998ac32-3bb7-49f9-9277-f7ab5f608566 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B8343D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:39:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO With Solvy, especially the heavy duty stuff - gently tear away the majority of the Solvy, leaving only the bits under the thread. This makes it much easier to get it all out of the fabric. Also, store it in a sealed zip bag, as humidity will make it sticky and unusable. Finally, save all your scraps. You can dissolve them in water, and use in a spray bottle or with a paintbrush for temporary stabilization of fabric for hooping, applying trim, or whatever. HTH, Sandy At 01:01 PM 1/24/2007, you wrote: >Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:20:23 -0600 >From: "E House" >Subject: [h-cost] marking embroidery designs > >For black fabrics, I haven't found anything I'm really happy with >yet, but for my next project (beading rather than embroidery, but >same problem) I plan to try heavy duty solvy--it's a sort of an >interfacing that dissolves in water, but is thick/durable enough >to mark on with pen. (Made by Sulky.) I'll draw the design on >that, then bead through it into the fabric, then dunk & dry >it. Hope it goes well! > >-E House "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 00:05:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P55ebV010644 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 00:05:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0P54si5016868 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 00:05:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0P54UEf019185 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:04:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P54TxW054624; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:04:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0P54P0D054547 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 22:04:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:18947 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1H9wmi-0007Vo-E0 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:04:30 -0600 Message-ID: <01da01c7403e$455e33a0$5600a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00b001c74031$0810ea90$0200a8c0@ANNESCOMPUTER> Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: marking embroidery designs Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:04:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="windows-1250"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 201e5794-6441-492c-992e-08db00706ef4 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B83A76.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 00:05:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Anne Moeller" > I was wondering why everyone was so concerned > about the markings. Several reasons! First, I can stitch _more_ exactly than I can mark, which means that I may have to choose between a graceful line of embroidery, and covering my marks completely. Second, I generally create my own embroidery designs, and it's a frequent occurence for me to change my mind halfway through about what I want the design to look like. Third, many methods of marking can bleed into the nearby fabric, especially when the embroidered piece is washed, and I generally want my embroidered pieces to be washable. (And fourth, unlike the Victorian era, in my period messy stitching was considered perfectly acceptable!) -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 08:30:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PDULTY022898 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 08:30:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PDTTPM029126 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 08:30:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PDNgjI069472 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 06:23:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PDNU7L094118; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 06:23:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web39601.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web39601.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.106.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0PDNQDD093983 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 06:23:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from tania_gr17@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 51830 invoked by uid 60001); 25 Jan 2007 13:23:21 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=0w0K0TX8ed0FagAnM8ErqHaWz0iiEkA5JwLXWkr+dT4bOL3qMTNTVc18SX+/Z5+Y5UD4+0xueH/Ov8Joky2PlMgPtUvEpvXSQhFMPy+Q2OdFFxqJBHqCIvHU8eeBqUs6XSGwb+fXkw9Lr76VsC6E99Dwae07jTCmEAqv8FKWAHs=; X-YMail-OSG: DDZpZOgVM1kEQg.pe.gD.Wv.HJK.oESPLxhNl4f28skkkkp8cXaC8BdBaXhYLvzumiO1Yv0zkdCGDEBbPEYhM5ONvw-- Received: from [62.79.63.35] by web39601.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 05:23:20 PST Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 05:23:20 -0800 (PST) From: Tania Gruning To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20070124194122.le8hcffpbpg8wcsk@www.goldsword.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <994850.51598.qm@web39601.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Thanks (finding online archive) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 009b78e9-5370-440b-b47b-71f862149672 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B8B0B9.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 08:30:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thanks a lot for the answers. It was the HEART archive I was looking for, but the other two resources are wonderful too, and I look forward to looking them through. Knew someone on this list would be able to help Tania (In cold snowy Denmark, and so happy frost has finally come, on account of mosquitoes next summer) "Susan B. Farmer" wrote: > On Wed, 24 Jan 2007, Tania Gruning wrote: > >> Hiya all. >> >> I have tried to search the archive, but have been unable to locate >> this resource. >> >> It is a online archive with out of print and antique books scanned >> in, that you can download in txt or pdf. >> >> The books are all on womens concerns: Sewing, embroidery, >> householdmanagement, childcare and some other miscellanious things. >> >> The archive is hosted by a large university, and the archive >> currently have 1000's of books starting from around 1750 and forward. This isan't that big of an archive, but it's the only one that I know of. http://inky.library.yale.edu/medwomen/whichbook.html susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Never miss an email again! Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. Check it out. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 13:04:23 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PI4FNx032443 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:04:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PI3S4M015941 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:04:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PI2FW9020252 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:02:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PI1loK090735; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:01:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PI1fI8090605 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:01:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.73] (209-148-118-73.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.73]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id l0PI1dpu024658 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 10:01:40 -0800 Message-ID: <45B8F087.9000405@lavoltapress.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 10:01:43 -0800 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Restringing job X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: edba1311-2047-4991-b855-3d381f2a5c43 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B8F0F0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:04:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I have a long, 1920s style crystal bead necklace that needs restringing. I hired someone before and they totally screwed up the job. If anyone is interested in doing it, please email me. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 13:15:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PIFJPO000468 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:15:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PIEXFY004468 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:15:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PIDuOq023738 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:13:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PIDqOh005253; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:13:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PIDiDv005087 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:13:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=KRcrvJjezsKva9wZqbR0+5AruncoS5Mqfizo3Hr65tKtoOKdIuiTX4Do/dFK0Qiy; h=Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:To:Subject:Mime-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [209.86.224.28] (helo=mswamui-blood.atl.sa.earthlink.net) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1HA96V-0000E6-FF for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:13:44 -0500 Received: from 4.245.146.247 by webmail.atl.earthlink.net with HTTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:13:42 -0500 Message-ID: <32001464.1169748823210.JavaMail.root@mswamui-blood.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:13:42 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: ruthanneb@mindspring.com To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Restringing job Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: EarthLink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-ELNK-Trace: 3ad22d0308f02f3c21b586f7ff62647d40683398e744b8a4376eeecb4922785d1d5bdb08ce049a58350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 209.86.224.28 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2a9a78cb-cb69-411f-bdac-d1c48e453a77 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B8F389.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:15:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO My sister used to work for a jeweler and did a lot of stringing of beads and pearls. She says she might be interested but would need more details. She's in Arizona--you can e-mail her at HelenB2002@msn.com if you want to pursue! --Ruth Anne Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer -----Original Message----- >From: Lavolta Press >Sent: Jan 25, 2007 1:01 PM >To: h-costume@indra.com >Subject: [h-cost] Restringing job > >I have a long, 1920s style crystal bead necklace that needs restringing. > I hired someone before and they totally screwed up the job. If anyone >is interested in doing it, please email me. > >Fran >Lavolta Press >http://www.lavoltapress.com >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 14:03:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PJ3OF6002158 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:03:24 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PJ2WEo027058 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:03:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PJ1qQ0032708 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:01:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PJ1ZLh061588; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:01:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.153]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0PJ1QFa061210 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:01:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 40803 invoked by uid 60001); 25 Jan 2007 19:01:15 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=H4gX6FiEuqF8syM07fnhBEI7L7O7eGv9cMJhtOWYmSKA8HZY0dLPT+dTRQbyyqcX2oHvqfQqFFQG6F8MujgqHUqe8Xs1jQU4QZDfFOQ+DT5nIqfrU8XY9pHiN4y0+bRLifD6GNSeFnmjmDCl/+seA9nYMSw0PR655CsPhotjPZE=; X-YMail-OSG: tGxefD4VM1mNIyVkISqgbNph8gYfLfjmvhA5nfWxlTj9CG3_5t780YQWQ0C0VW3mai6AypnzWP9PetvS1JzxdMC8SbtzDkBUBraeD9g4xT0wuElFOS4- Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:01:15 PST Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 11:01:15 -0800 (PST) From: Zuzana Kraemerova To: h-costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <456994.40778.qm@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] pattern webpage X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ee2421fc-0bc0-4957-bcb4-2a4835cabfdd X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B8FEC8.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:03:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi, I've just found a German webpage which has the largest collection of patterns (historical, fantasy and others) I ever saw being sold by just one company. The patterns come from smaller pattern making companies such as ageless patterns, mantua maker etc. The only disadvantage is that it's all in German (and thereby all shipping from Gemany). There it is: http://www.kostuem-kram.de/modules.php?warp=categories&group=2&kid=52ed34f42d7bf217e144e2dc77980c05 I just wanted to let you know:-)) Zuzana --------------------------------- Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 14:30:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PJUlrg003119 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:30:47 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PJTtOr032537 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:30:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PJTI2R037688 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:29:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PJTBAK094398; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:29:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com (smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com [209.73.179.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0PJT39s094193 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:29:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: (qmail 7485 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2007 19:28:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO IBMTHINKPAD) (rlksm1@verizon.net@72.95.245.130 with login) by smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2007 19:28:57 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: xBUFyOwVM1kKku_2OCXoFeNF1jgnf18rUKbwFHxKnhvkQO7.c5fbA_uVftYrWJo6kasw0ZpTpNJmK3_impu9NCtvCmuStQdkeyFsdw3Iq2djVOCwNKY2lPE- Message-ID: <002501c740b7$0794bed0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" To: "H-Costume" Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:28:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] craft books X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2ad7b16a-0986-4cc6-8e56-e26359f81a2b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B90533.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:30:44 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I just got a nice packet of How-to books from Crafters super sale. Great reference stuff. Beginner's guide to GOLDWORK (Chamberlin) Elegant ribbon work (Gibb) Ribbon Embroidery and Stump Work (Di van Niekerk) The last two put me in the mind of what Bjarne so delights us with..Now for time to try to work some of this out...so many good ideas and so little time. Lots of pictures and good explanation on setting up the fram ,transferring pattern, and manipulating the needle and other tools.. Sort of what is under discussion now? Kathleen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 14:47:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PJlTOb003770 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:47:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PJkcnG023443 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:47:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PJk7Wc040319 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:46:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PJk4HU013791; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:46:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep31.mail.dk (fep31.mail.dk [80.160.76.195]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PJjxLd013596 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:46:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep45.mail.dk ([195.41.46.228]) by fep31.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070125194554.PVIO3513.fep31.mail.dk@fep45.mail.dk> for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:45:54 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.249]) by fep45.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070125194553.BGQ119.fep45.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:45:53 +0100 Message-ID: <001f01c740b9$7e865a10$f943a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002501c740b7$0794bed0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> Subject: Re: [h-cost] craft books Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:46:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep45.mail.dk from [80.161.67.249] at Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:45:50 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 912c28ea-c514-4db2-9de3-28649fa19d37 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B9091E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:47:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Kathleen, Congratulations with your new books. I am sure something important and beautifull wil come to life, when you get your mind to do something with it. Its many things that kick you in the right directions, books and other things. One of the major things that gave me a real kick was the australian embroidery magazine Inspirations. I subscribed for it for 2 years, and also got a lot of their back issues. I dont subscribe for it anymore, because its almost the same style wich goes on with their issues, and i was only interrested to learn some things from them. But they surely was a big inspiration for me. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" To: "H-Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 8:28 PM Subject: [h-cost] craft books >I just got a nice packet of How-to books from Crafters super sale. Great >reference stuff. > Beginner's guide to GOLDWORK (Chamberlin) > Elegant ribbon work (Gibb) > Ribbon Embroidery and Stump Work (Di van Niekerk) The last two put me in > the mind of what Bjarne so delights us with..Now for time to try to work > some of this out...so many good ideas and so little time. Lots of > pictures and good explanation on setting up the fram ,transferring > pattern, and manipulating the needle and other tools.. Sort of what is > under discussion now? > > Kathleen > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 15:06:02 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PK5wqs004554 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:05:58 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PK57mm014737 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:05:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PK4Jww042930 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:04:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PK4GW1033618; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:04:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PK4Cuq033454 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:04:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88DDBBF3FE for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:04:06 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45B90D45.5010301@reddawn.net> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:04:21 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] craft books References: <002501c740b7$0794bed0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> In-Reply-To: <002501c740b7$0794bed0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 10f1b25e-2aa4-4151-b4f7-8c3cebf46af3 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B90D73.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:05:55 -0500 (EST) Status: RO LLOYD MITCHELL wrote: > I just got a nice packet of How-to books from Crafters super sale. > Great reference stuff. What is that? A web site? I've been looking for a new hobby, and some cheap books would be great! Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 15:16:30 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PKGURk004900 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:16:30 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PKFh4Z008155 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:16:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PKF2BZ044584 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:15:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PKEunB045508; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:14:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web23402.mail.ird.yahoo.com (web23402.mail.ird.yahoo.com [217.146.189.87]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0PKEn0a045262 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 13:14:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from marquesate@yahoo.co.uk) Received: (qmail 72554 invoked by uid 60001); 25 Jan 2007 20:14:43 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.co.uk; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=U4WO2qG5aXj7vsac6w9dzmZ/WwrIvPgIsqB8Vg8Ad/P/tS8bOMWr1SB7Fy13w1gGCXigcMhMVkMi7dJMmS8EL+2zPLh4Yf5r3KWcHOEy/VmzdtL1/pHonGkk7EXw2O47vjffgHbwy3caapfEgmcoeuLdHnEE+Vf0KN9uOsm/mQY=; X-YMail-OSG: INMVOnwVM1l3L2AaNW7pnfL.BHhxgoL99YXdFv.G9Rt5wCXUjpjJ2Uc1ySNDV8uqHMULRJgz3oCE5BozHsSHdWbTQYnKtOC3Bg9oscURho5es4V4fmTjlVu.3vbN4XwZ4aMJn0I.sCOv Received: from [83.105.84.119] by web23402.mail.ird.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:14:43 GMT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/368.3 YahooMailWebService/0.6.132.7 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:14:43 +0000 (GMT) From: N Kipar Subject: Re: [h-cost] pattern webpage To: Historical Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Message-ID: <719007.72539.qm@web23402.mail.ird.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0PKEn0a045262 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 81fc3a04-89b8-4445-a2c2-dc5e7b8972a7 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45B90FEF.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:16:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'd like to add, since I have dealt several times with this company, that the owner is absolutely wonderful, bending over backwards, and the prices are cheaper than in the UK and that includes shipping. I am now buying my patterns from them despite being in the UK. I cannot recommend them enough. Nicole ----- Original Message ---- From: Zuzana Kraemerova To: h-costume Sent: Thursday, 25 January, 2007 7:01:15 PM Subject: [h-cost] pattern webpage Hi, I've just found a German webpage which has the largest collection of patterns (historical, fantasy and others) I ever saw being sold by just one company. The patterns come from smaller pattern making companies such as ageless patterns, mantua maker etc. The only disadvantage is that it's all in German (and thereby all shipping from Gemany). There it is: http://www.kostuem-kram.de/modules.php?warp=categories&group=2&kid=52ed34f42d7bf217e144e2dc77980c05 I just wanted to let you know:-)) Zuzana --------------------------------- Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 16:19:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PLJLXD007272 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:19:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PLISrP015497 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:19:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PLHZL4054116 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:17:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PLHJ9W014213; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:17:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com (smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com [209.73.179.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0PLHF0c014077 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:17:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: (qmail 50654 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2007 21:17:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO IBMTHINKPAD) (rlksm1@verizon.net@72.95.251.60 with login) by smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2007 21:17:09 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: B3uNci0VM1mOUqWwG2rF6RGsA7QHw4pyLBdMtQCb0ZMC79VHMWw5OKHLCvigaciEJzX04lSwTugbM8GyttQsFMPngu08GC1W1Kl36uuOLMq.R5CF27tdHOiVWuMzwYE0Qg-- Message-ID: <002001c740c6$266e65e0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002501c740b7$0794bed0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> <45B90D45.5010301@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] craft books Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:16:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3db2d50c-e00a-4eb0-ad29-aa255cdafee7 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B91EA5.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:19:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO The company specializes in craft books and stuff for all sorts of interests...textiles, beading,tolecraft, ceramics, knitting and such. They can be found at www.crafterschoice.com. I have been a suscriber for many years . Every once and a while they do a blowout sale...buy one at club price and add any you like to the list at 50% off. I have found many great titles that add to my costume crafting lore. Like Pieceworks magazine, they bring old master methods and means right to my work table. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 3:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] craft books > LLOYD MITCHELL wrote: > >> I just got a nice packet of How-to books from Crafters super sale. Great >> reference stuff. > > What is that? A web site? I've been looking for a new hobby, and some > cheap books would be great! > > > Dawn > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 16:26:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PLQnQu007542 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:26:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0PLPweq019487 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:26:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0PLPPZi055184 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:25:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0PLPML1022956; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:25:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com (smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com [209.73.179.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0PLPIkv022779 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:25:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: (qmail 62595 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2007 21:25:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO IBMTHINKPAD) (rlksm1@verizon.net@72.95.251.60 with login) by smtp102.vzn.mail.dcn.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2007 21:25:12 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: Z4VDfm0VM1nVwXXF1ParWUznKplO1FjPoy5kCx3Udnn_pVAwoxHrWQxdq6V8zHcwvTqSMcZGzZVN3sTlbqlRtcOktL9E1bums1G3CNxkotRLuNDIi4wqxI0- Message-ID: <002301c740c7$454f4140$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002501c740b7$0794bed0$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> <001f01c740b9$7e865a10$f943a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] craft books Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:24:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7e405a4c-2141-41b5-beee-43f88aee5616 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B92066.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:26:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Thank you for your encouragement. I am in the last days of finishing the "Ditchley" gown for a 22" doll and am mostly pleased. I made about 200 beaded motiffs with 'rubies' and pearls, mounted on dime-sized golden lace and attached them as appliques in as near the same as one can count and surmise what cannot be seen on the gown of the portrait. I was surprised at Hunnicut's description of the one she did for ER...she mounted only the ones that would be seen by the camera. La. Now I understand why! Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 2:46 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] craft books > Dear Kathleen, > Congratulations with your new books. I am sure something important and > beautifull wil come to life, when you get your mind to do something with > it. > Its many things that kick you in the right directions, books and other > things. > One of the major things that gave me a real kick was the australian > embroidery magazine Inspirations. I subscribed for it for 2 years, and > also got a lot of their back issues. I dont subscribe for it anymore, > because its almost the same style wich goes on with their issues, and i > was only interrested to learn some things from them. > But they surely was a big inspiration for me. > > Bjarne > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "LLOYD MITCHELL" > To: "H-Costume" > Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 8:28 PM > Subject: [h-cost] craft books > > >>I just got a nice packet of How-to books from Crafters super sale. Great >>reference stuff. >> Beginner's guide to GOLDWORK (Chamberlin) >> Elegant ribbon work (Gibb) >> Ribbon Embroidery and Stump Work (Di van Niekerk) The last two put me in >> the mind of what Bjarne so delights us with..Now for time to try to work >> some of this out...so many good ideas and so little time. Lots of >> pictures and good explanation on setting up the fram ,transferring >> pattern, and manipulating the needle and other tools.. Sort of what is >> under discussion now? >> >> Kathleen >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 21:20:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q2Knle016825 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 21:20:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0Q2JtKs012016 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 21:20:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0Q2Ivaj093391 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 19:18:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q2Ipge069988; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 19:18:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from server018.dfw.nationwide.net (server018.dfw.nationwide.net [206.123.129.81]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0Q2IlCf069933 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 19:18:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 2110 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2007 00:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO D1V3BRB1) (67.174.246.110) by server018.dfw.nationwide.net with SMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 00:56:44 +0000 From: "Diana Habra" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 16:56:42 -0800 Message-ID: <000201c740e4$d8f00c00$0d00a8c0@D1V3BRB1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcdAyAhJfoQahIxEQYyRh7344KCf4gAHEiEg In-Reply-To: <002301c740c7$454f4140$2f01a8c0@IBMTHINKPAD> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=17% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Need Help X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: eba23c3a-7263-47bb-81d6-505391d64a83 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B9654B.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 21:20:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hello list, Does anyone out there have a link to color descriptions that they could share? I am looking to find out what the color "dove gray" really is. I thought I knew but now I am not so sure. Is it a light gray with a blue tone or light gray with a pinkish-brown tone (kind of closer to taupe)? Also, which color would you most likely want to use for Victorian costuming and/or men's suits? Thanks! Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Jan 25 22:00:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q2xvmi018022 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 21:59:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0Q2x5qa032665 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 21:59:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0Q2wdg0097556 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 19:58:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q2wbIK097005; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 19:58:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q2wXiv096948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 19:58:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.112] (209-148-118-112.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.112]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id l0Q2wVjE028729 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 18:58:32 -0800 Message-ID: <45B96E5B.5010706@lavoltapress.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 18:58:35 -0800 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need Help References: <000201c740e4$d8f00c00$0d00a8c0@D1V3BRB1> In-Reply-To: <000201c740e4$d8f00c00$0d00a8c0@D1V3BRB1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ae7c5c1b-4f70-480f-b571-f93c8d7aa41c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B96E79.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 21:59:54 -0500 (EST) Status: RO The unabridged _Oxford English Dictionary_ describes dove grey as "a warm grey with a tone of pink or purple." Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier names were often applied to the same old colors. Color was a marketing point, and fabric manufacturers dreamed up exotic color names like "moon on the desert." In other words, the OED definition may be about as close to an exact definition as you ever get. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Diana Habra wrote: > Hello list, > > Does anyone out there have a link to color descriptions that they could > share? > > I am looking to find out what the color "dove gray" really is. I thought I > knew but now I am not so sure. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 01:00:24 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q60FY7022888 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:00:19 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0Q5xNk8011247 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:00:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0Q5wfMo013633 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 25 Jan 2007 22:58:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q5wUG3012324; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 22:58:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q5wOcv012242 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2007 22:58:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA08474 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 00:47:06 -0600 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 00:47:05 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Seeking early edition of Norris X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 40be0023-5b6a-4a1b-a2d1-d94f28e53f6f X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B998BB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:00:12 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Does anyone on the list have in their own collection a copy of the original editions of Herbert Norris's "Costume & Fashion," vol. 2 (Senlac to Bosworth, 1066-1485) -- as opposed to the Dover reprint? I need to compare a passage in two printings: 1927 and 1931. The Dover reprint is supposedly a republication of the 1927 edition, but the quote I'm looking at very likely refers to another work that wasn't published till 1928. Thus my quandary. I need to know which of them was drawing on the other, and that means figuring out when Norris first made his statement. I can probably get one via ILL, but I don't think I can get both simultaneously. If necessary, I'll start running around to the local university libraries, but I thought I'd try here first. If it turns out the quote is in only one volume, I can try to ILL that from here. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 03:38:37 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q8cWNe020709 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 03:38:36 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0Q8beoR000719 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 03:38:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0Q8Zpk1025354 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:35:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q8ZjP2004783; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:35:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from vms048pub.verizon.net (vms048pub.verizon.net [206.46.252.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q8ZflG004728 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 01:35:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hdpinto@verizon.net) Received: from HELENPINTO ([71.126.41.222]) by vms048.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JCG00ILUVT77266@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 02:34:57 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 03:34:15 -0500 From: "Helen Pinto" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking early edition of Norris To: "Historical Costume" , "Robin Netherton" Message-id: <004201c74124$c73b5150$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 68ba5031-1ba5-4912-b090-904294a1ffd0 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45B9BDD4.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 03:38:29 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I have a facsimile (pre-photocopies) made by a friend at the Library of Congress in the early 70's. There is no date on the frontispiece, but it was published by J M Dent and Sons, Ltd, London, and the preface by Norris is dated 1924. What do you need? -Helen/Aidan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historic Costume List" Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 1:47 AM Subject: [h-cost] Seeking early edition of Norris > > Does anyone on the list have in their own collection a copy of the > original editions of Herbert Norris's "Costume & Fashion," vol. 2 (Senlac > to Bosworth, 1066-1485) -- as opposed to the Dover reprint? > > I need to compare a passage in two printings: 1927 and 1931. > > The Dover reprint is supposedly a republication of the 1927 edition, but > the quote I'm looking at very likely refers to another work that wasn't > published till 1928. Thus my quandary. I need to know which of them was > drawing on the other, and that means figuring out when Norris first made > his statement. > > I can probably get one via ILL, but I don't think I can get both > simultaneously. If necessary, I'll start running around to the local > university libraries, but I thought I'd try here first. If it turns out > the quote is in only one volume, I can try to ILL that from here. > > --Robin > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 04:08:36 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q98XpD023155 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 04:08:33 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0Q97k2A019288 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 04:08:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0Q97NcR027882 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 02:07:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q97LtG025145; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 02:07:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q97Gqn025097 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 02:07:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.21188281; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:06:57 0000 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id l0Q96ue12740.; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:06:56 GMT Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:06:56 +0000 Message-Id: <45B9C4A202000014000C9CC1@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:06:42 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help References: <000201c740e4$d8f00c00$0d00a8c0@D1V3BRB1> <45B96E5B.5010706@lavoltapress.com> In-Reply-To: <45B96E5B.5010706@lavoltapress.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=40% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 113683a1-69de-4880-a82c-4ab396a5eb86 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45B9C4E2.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 04:08:30 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor >>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: >Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed >from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier >names were often applied to the same old colors. I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a dark purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter pinkish-purple. ______________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 07:43:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QChPeU030377 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:43:25 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QCgX2e001975 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:43:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QCfqm2049831 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:41:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QCfjrJ072439; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:41:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QCfOMm072212 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 05:41:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA09389 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:30:08 -0600 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:30:07 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking early edition of Norris In-Reply-To: <004201c74124$c73b5150$2f01a8c0@HELENPINTO> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: bab29323-34e5-495c-8ab9-cb83aae179db X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45B9F739.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:43:22 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Fri, 26 Jan 2007, Helen Pinto wrote: > I have a facsimile (pre-photocopies) made by a friend at the Library of > Congress in the early 70's. There is no date on the frontispiece, but > it was published by J M Dent and Sons, Ltd, London, and the preface > by Norris is dated 1924. I've written Helen privately. If anyone has the 1931 edition of vol. 2, which was an update of the earlier volume republished as part of a larger series, please let me know. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 09:42:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QEgmbN001824 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:42:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QEfsbT014956 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:42:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QEeOhP065793 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:40:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QEeKM6072255; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:40:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0Q9MKVR034795 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 02:22:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.47]) by mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 26 Jan 2007 09:22:13 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAAZXuUXUSnIvk2dsb2JhbACOQwEBAgcOBwcc Received: from 88-107-34-126.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.34.126]:1707 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1HANHh-00087q-Gu for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:22:13 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126091933.03591598@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:22:15 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help In-Reply-To: <45B9C4A202000014000C9CC1@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.u k> References: <000201c740e4$d8f00c00$0d00a8c0@D1V3BRB1> <45B96E5B.5010706@lavoltapress.com> <45B9C4A202000014000C9CC1@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e10d4dbf-71d1-4ea4-9731-81f1b02af1ef X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BA1332.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:42:45 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 09:06 26/01/2007, you wrote: >Kate Bunting >Librarian and 17th century reenactor > > >>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: > >Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed > >from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier > >names were often applied to the same old colors. > >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a dark >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter >pinkish-purple. I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name association she knew - I didn't! Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 09:55:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QEtlZN002225 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:55:47 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QEsuAu026406 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:55:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QEsNX9068044 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:54:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QEsKo8086576; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:54:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QEsEFp086426 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:54:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:58:15 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:58:16 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996D8E@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126091933.03591598@suziclarke.co.uk> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help thread-index: AcdBWLBhUMae87X9ROaBUgObwXq5LAAAUisg From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Jan 2007 14:58:15.0635 (UTC) FILETIME=[68510230:01C7415A] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0QEsEFp086426 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 4df4bc0e-37fb-43bd-8a5c-965fd99e5543 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA1640.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:55:44 -0500 (EST) Status: RO American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 4:22 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help At 09:06 26/01/2007, you wrote: >Kate Bunting >Librarian and 17th century reenactor > > >>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: > >Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed > >from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier > >names were often applied to the same old colors. > >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a dark >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter >pinkish-purple. I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name association she knew - I didn't! Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 10:04:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QF4xtg002465 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:04:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QF46A7002356 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:04:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QF36aP069559 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:03:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QF31JM096118; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:03:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.197]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QF2ui2095906 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:02:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from your1a4d29f243 (ool-45757a12.dyn.optonline.net [69.117.122.18]) by mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <0JCH0038YDSH6510@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:02:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:02:42 -0500 From: monica spence Subject: RE: [h-cost] Need Help In-reply-to: <45B96E5B.5010706@lavoltapress.com> To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5d42242f-7e99-4b41-bb19-ef109b742fba X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BA1866.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:04:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Colors are still subjective in the fashion world--- today it might be deep purple and next season aubergine. It is difficult to tell just what some shades looked like, if only because the dyes are no longer used or available. Monica -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Lavolta Press Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 9:59 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need Help The unabridged _Oxford English Dictionary_ describes dove grey as "a warm grey with a tone of pink or purple." Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier names were often applied to the same old colors. Color was a marketing point, and fabric manufacturers dreamed up exotic color names like "moon on the desert." In other words, the OED definition may be about as close to an exact definition as you ever get. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Diana Habra wrote: > Hello list, > > Does anyone out there have a link to color descriptions that they could > share? > > I am looking to find out what the color "dove gray" really is. I thought I > knew but now I am not so sure. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 10:13:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFD83U002697 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:13:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QFCGrP015668 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:13:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QFBiOm071254 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:11:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFBgxp006433; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:11:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFBd83006296 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:11:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m126.in-tch.com [216.166.191.126]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id l0QEwKJ15028 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:58:21 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <001801c7415d$7f044a20$7ebfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996D8E@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:20:20 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c5108c19-8b1b-4088-9cd2-dcfebb6c8a60 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA1A50.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:13:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm American, as well, and, like Patty, always thought of "ultramarine" as a slightly greenish darkish blue (like a bright navy with a hint of green to it). If I remember to put "aubergine" through my mental translation program, and think "oh, yeah...that's equivalent to eggplant," I wouldn't think of it as anything but a really strong, dark purple. Dunno about the generational thing--maybe the yahoos who are coming up with new names for next season's "in colors" are running out of ideas? ;o) --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 7:58 AM Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help > American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue > for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > > Patty > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] > On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke > Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 4:22 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help > > At 09:06 26/01/2007, you wrote: > > > >Kate Bunting > >Librarian and 17th century reenactor > > > > >>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: > > >Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed > > >from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier > > >names were often applied to the same old colors. > > > >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a dark > >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a > >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter > >pinkish-purple. > > I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler > aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as > they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American > companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name > association she knew - I didn't! > > Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 10:13:33 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFDSOZ002721 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:13:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QFCbWo032616 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:13:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QFBVAb071221 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:11:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFBSkQ006196; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:11:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFBKe2005962 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:11:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.39]) by mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 26 Jan 2007 15:08:52 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAFuouUXUSnInk2dsb2JhbACORAEBAgcOBwUe Received: from 88-107-34-126.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.34.126]:3490 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1HASh8-0005V3-3A for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:08:50 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126150443.0359f008@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:08:52 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help In-Reply-To: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996D8E@lynx.campus.muc.p rv> References: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126091933.03591598@suziclarke.co.uk> <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996D8E@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7e66a53f-5df3-4da6-8895-14aebc87f37c X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BA1A65.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:13:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 14:58 26/01/2007, you wrote: >American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue >for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > >Patty > Could be - I was old enough to be this lady's mother. According to my small dictionary - too lazy to heave out the O.E.D. - ultramarine is a blue pigment. The thread I bought was not blue! > >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a dark > >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a > >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter > >pinkish-purple. > >I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler >aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as >they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American >companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name >association she knew - I didn't! > >Suzi > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 10:20:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFKiXk002961 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:20:44 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QFJnFn024844 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:20:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QFJLFI072829 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:19:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFJIiB014343; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:19:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (webmail.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFJEJ5014139 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:19:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:23:15 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:23:14 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996DBE@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126150443.0359f008@suziclarke.co.uk> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help thread-index: AcdBXQkGSSFUZykVQ0q4qA6qOjeXYwAALxYg From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Jan 2007 15:23:15.0578 (UTC) FILETIME=[E65A25A0:01C7415D] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0QFJEJ5014139 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 3d5958dc-d417-4036-84dc-250e8b52542f X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA1C19.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:20:41 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I believe that ultramarine was originally made from lapis lazuli & would be similar in color. Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 10:09 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help At 14:58 26/01/2007, you wrote: >American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue >for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > >Patty > Could be - I was old enough to be this lady's mother. According to my small dictionary - too lazy to heave out the O.E.D. - ultramarine is a blue pigment. The thread I bought was not blue! > >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a dark > >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a > >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter > >pinkish-purple. > >I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler >aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as >they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American >companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name >association she knew - I didn't! > >Suzi > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 10:25:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFPr7L003124 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:25:53 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QFP1iW014627 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:25:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QFNDsn073763 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:23:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFNBZG018610; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:23:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFN7uW018443 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:23:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:27:08 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:27:07 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996DC5@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126150443.0359f008@suziclarke.co.uk> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help thread-index: AcdBXQkGSSFUZykVQ0q4qA6qOjeXYwAARO+w From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Jan 2007 15:27:08.0483 (UTC) FILETIME=[712CA130:01C7415E] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0QFN7uW018443 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0c3aad34-5b89-4919-8183-07851bf4a5ca X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BA1D4E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:25:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Just checked my small dictionary - ultramarine was named because the pigment came from over the sea, not because it looked like the sea as I had thought, so there was an ultramarine blue, an ultramarine purple & even an ultramarine yellow. Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 10:09 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help At 14:58 26/01/2007, you wrote: >American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue >for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > >Patty > Could be - I was old enough to be this lady's mother. According to my small dictionary - too lazy to heave out the O.E.D. - ultramarine is a blue pigment. The thread I bought was not blue! > >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a dark > >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a > >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter > >pinkish-purple. > >I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler >aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as >they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American >companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name >association she knew - I didn't! > >Suzi > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 11:02:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QG28gh004275 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:02:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QG1LTJ013512 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:02:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QFlcbX078153 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:47:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFlQrw042511; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:47:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ruby.spiritone.com (ruby.spiritone.com [216.99.193.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFlGPs042333 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:47:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by ruby.spiritone.com (8.13.6/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0QFlEPV011379 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:47:15 -0800 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Seeking early edition of Norris Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 07:49:05 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1896 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c0f1b5ac-5cbd-408b-970d-23df81ff3b88 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA25D1.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:02:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Robin, I have an original bound copy. I'm just heading for work. If no one else comes back to you first, I should be about to get it to you in about 9 hours. Regina Romsey (AnTir) > > > Does anyone on the list have in their own collection a copy of the > original editions of Herbert Norris's "Costume & Fashion," vol. 2 (Senlac > to Bosworth, 1066-1485) -- as opposed to the Dover reprint? > > I need to compare a passage in two printings: 1927 and 1931. > > The Dover reprint is supposedly a republication of the 1927 edition, but > the quote I'm looking at very likely refers to another work that wasn't > published till 1928. Thus my quandary. I need to know which of them was > drawing on the other, and that means figuring out when Norris first made > his statement. > > I can probably get one via ILL, but I don't think I can get both > simultaneously. If necessary, I'll start running around to the local > university libraries, but I thought I'd try here first. If it turns out > the quote is in only one volume, I can try to ILL that from here. > > --Robin > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 11:02:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QG2Sf2004290 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:02:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QG1eGo010566 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:02:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QFne6g078653 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:49:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFnbkZ045171; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:49:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFnXRn045071 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:49:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.173.227.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.173.227]) by pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1HATKW-00058B-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:49:33 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v749.3) In-Reply-To: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996D8E@lynx.campus.muc.prv> References: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996D8E@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:49:51 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.749.3) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e2650f89-a9ef-419f-87e0-378440d76c43 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BA25E4.006 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:02:25 -0500 (EST) Status: RO "Ultramarine," like many other colors (magenta, Prussian blue, "midnight blue," apricot, burnt sienna, ocher, even lavender), was described definitively and permanently for me in my youth by my big set of Crayola crayons. And Patty's description definitely squares with Crayola. --Ruth Anne Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer p.s. The Crayola color "flesh" has been long since re-named. Lucky, that--I didn't know ANYBODY who was that color, but clearly it did imply that dark-skinned people were an aberration as far as the color of their "flesh" was concerned, and I'm glad that notion has been obliterated! Significantly, though, I never can remember what the new name is.... On Jan 26, 2007, at 9:58 AM, Rickard, Patty wrote: > American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue > for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > > Patty > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] > On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke > Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 4:22 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help > > At 09:06 26/01/2007, you wrote: > > >> Kate Bunting >> Librarian and 17th century reenactor >> >>>>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: >>> Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed >>> from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier >>> names were often applied to the same old colors. >> >> I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a >> dark >> purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a >> recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter >> pinkish-purple. > > I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler > aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as > they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American > companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name > association she knew - I didn't! > > Suzi > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 11:03:46 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QG3k7m004337 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:03:46 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QG2xjR015758 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:03:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QFvda6080034 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:57:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFvbRE054779; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:57:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.wightman.on.ca (server01.gorrie.wightman.ca [216.110.227.151]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QFvWF7054640 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 08:57:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix, from userid 99) id 0D28E84A74; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:57:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from MAIN (dsl-v45-216-110-230-37.wightman.ca [216.110.230.37]) by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6EDD84AF5 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:57:21 -0500 (EST) From: "Five Rivers Chapmanry" To: Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:57:27 -0500 Organization: Five Rivers Message-ID: <000401c74162$afacb400$6400a8c0@MAIN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200701261241.l0QCfk3V072449@net.indra.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on server01.gorrie X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-100.0 required=5.0 tests=USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100 autolearn=disabled version=3.0.1 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: pattern webpage X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c0db00cd-ca37-4067-b61b-3edaa994dc48 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA2633.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:03:43 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Plainly you never visited our site when we used to carry historical sewing patterns. Used to carry 22 different lines, covering 500 AD through 1950. Alas, they're almost all gone now. What remains is at 75% discount. Regards, Lorina Five Rivers Chapmanry purveyors of quality hand-crafted cooperage, embroidery supplies; fine, original textile, pen and ink, and watercolour art. Soon to come: books by Lorina Stephens 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 11:11:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QGBHZp004615 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:11:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QGAPtV009061 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:11:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QG9eI8082285 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:09:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QG9RTP069639; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:09:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m26.mx.aol.com (imo-m26.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.7]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QG9Fj6069258 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:09:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m26.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c69.a38b8b2 (57293) for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:08:55 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:08:53 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many rep=10% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c58216ed-48ec-48ae-b06f-60691d13a6ca X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BA27F1.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:11:14 -0500 (EST) Status: RO A lot of these color names...ultramarine blue, ochre, sienna, burnt sienna, umber, burnt umber, cadmium red, cadmium yellow, alizarin crimson.... I learned when I was painting in oils. They also come up in watercolors and gauche. Obviously the names are derived from what was ground up to make pigments way back when painting was a guild profession, and supposedly the hues were the same from batch to batch of pigment. Sorta like a color-match system. So if a fresco painter in Milan writes to his fellow painter in Florence and talks about using "burnt umber", everyone knows exactly what color he means. I had a scene painting teacher from Germany once who told us the only colors you needed to paint any scene were: lead white, alizarin crimson, ultramarine blue, and ochre. Period. He made us paint a pastoral setting with only these colors. It actually works, but you definitely get an "old world" muted look. Nowadays there are so many colors made so many different ways it can be mind boggling. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 13:03:56 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QI3qQ6008255 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:03:56 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QI33rk018004 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:03:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QI203O003137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:02:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QI1qRY008944; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:01:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QI1jEu008712 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:01:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:05:46 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:05:45 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996ECC@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help thread-index: AcdBY9zAV6WOQ6l9QD25bT3PTPIFdAAEKRqA From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Jan 2007 18:05:46.0625 (UTC) FILETIME=[9A6DD710:01C74174] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0QI1jEu008712 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5bddacd0-347f-43da-91b4-eb1f80dd0af0 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BA4257.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:03:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Ruth Anne Baumgartner Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 10:50 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help "Ultramarine," like many other colors (magenta, Prussian blue, "midnight blue," apricot, burnt sienna, ocher, even lavender), was described definitively and permanently for me in my youth by my big set of Crayola crayons. And Patty's description definitely squares with Crayola. --Ruth Anne Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer p.s. The Crayola color "flesh" has been long since re-named. Lucky, that--I didn't know ANYBODY who was that color, but clearly it did imply that dark-skinned people were an aberration as far as the color of their "flesh" was concerned, and I'm glad that notion has been obliterated! Significantly, though, I never can remember what the new name is.... peach Patty On Jan 26, 2007, at 9:58 AM, Rickard, Patty wrote: > American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue > for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > > Patty > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] > On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke > Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 4:22 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help > > At 09:06 26/01/2007, you wrote: > > >> Kate Bunting >> Librarian and 17th century reenactor >> >>>>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: >>> Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed >>> from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier >>> names were often applied to the same old colors. >> >> I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a >> dark >> purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a >> recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter >> pinkish-purple. > > I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler > aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as > they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American > companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name > association she knew - I didn't! > > Suzi > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 14:23:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJNlsf011827 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:23:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QJMuh5020210 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:23:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QJL2mM018211 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:21:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJKjgg099273; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:20:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc15.comcast.net (sccrmhc15.comcast.net [204.127.200.85]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJKZ6Y099028 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:20:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc15) with SMTP id <2007012619203201500fduf8e>; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:20:32 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996ECC@lynx.campus.muc.prv> References: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996ECC@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Message-Id: <1C6D92AF-8232-46EA-BCA3-CCF7A29C3608@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:20:32 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 1174ad0f-3b94-49a2-9566-ba545e9f8cf0 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BA5510.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:23:45 -0500 (EST) Status: RO About color names in fashion -- there are actually official arbiters of color names. Many years ago I did an article on The Color Association, which each season releases a forecast booklet with named swatches of colors that will be used in fashion, home decoration, etc. for the coming season. The names are what fashion will call those colors in the appropriate season, and the forecasts exist so you can buy a peach sweater in one store and a peach skirt in another and have them match. I just found this article, which talks about the Color Association and bunch of other color forecasting organizations. http:// jscms.jrn.columbia.edu/cns/2006-05-02/willhite-colorforecast I think when I did my article, Color Association was the only one, as it is the oldest -- since 1915. http://www.colorassociation.com/ According to the Web site, they have extensive archives and a color library. They also offer a couple of books that I just put on my own wish list: The Color Compendium by Augustine Hope and Margaret Walch $40 hardcover This is the first comprehensive, illustrated encyclopedia entirely devoted to color. This extraordinary reference covers the full range of color-related subjects, including their scientific, technical, artistic, and historical aspects. and Living Colors : A Designer's Guide to 80 Essential Palettes from Ancient to Modern Times by Margaret Walch and Augustine Hope $35 hardcover A consummate guide to color, this indispensable, spiralbound volume displays 80 color schemes--drawn from a variety of different mediums, from architecture and apparel to paintings and pottery, across a range of historical periods--each individually presented, described, and illustrated in a handy, gatefold format, with representative four- color images and actual printed chips for matching against the project at hand. From the dominant reds of ancient Egyptian ochers to the psychedelic palettes of the sixties, Living Colors will inspire professionals and laypeople alike in choosing colors for a multitude of uses. Both are available by mail from the Color Association. More info: http://www.colorassociation.com/site/books.html Since they started in 1915, they probably do have resources back into at least late Victorian. Enjoy! Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 26, 2007, at 1:05 PM, Rickard, Patty wrote: > > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] > On Behalf Of Ruth Anne Baumgartner > Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 10:50 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help > > "Ultramarine," like many other colors (magenta, Prussian blue, > "midnight blue," apricot, burnt sienna, ocher, even lavender), was > described definitively and permanently for me in my youth by my big > set of Crayola crayons. And Patty's description definitely squares > with Crayola. > --Ruth Anne Baumgartner > scholar gypsy and amateur costumer > p.s. The Crayola color "flesh" has been long since re-named. Lucky, > that--I didn't know ANYBODY who was that color, but clearly it did > imply that dark-skinned people were an aberration as far as the color > of their "flesh" was concerned, and I'm glad that notion has been > obliterated! Significantly, though, I never can remember what the new > name is.... > > > peach > > Patty > > > On Jan 26, 2007, at 9:58 AM, Rickard, Patty wrote: > >> American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue >> for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, >> thing? >> >> Patty >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume- >> bounces@indra.com] >> On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke >> Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 4:22 AM >> To: Historical Costume >> Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help >> >> At 09:06 26/01/2007, you wrote: >> >> >>> Kate Bunting >>> Librarian and 17th century reenactor >>> >>>>>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: >>>> Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names >>>> changed >>>> from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, >>>> trendier >>>> names were often applied to the same old colors. >>> >>> I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a >>> dark >>> purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a >>> recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter >>> pinkish-purple. >> >> I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler >> aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as >> they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American >> companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name >> association she knew - I didn't! >> >> Suzi >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 14:34:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJYYq8012197 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:34:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QJXgCC001780 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:34:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QJWUIf020341 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:32:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJWRDj012854; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:32:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc16.comcast.net (alnrmhc16.comcast.net [204.127.225.96]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJWKCd012612 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:32:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc16) with SMTP id <20070126193214b16004bopne>; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:32:14 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996ECC@lynx.campus.muc.prv> References: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996ECC@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Message-Id: <9DA82774-C5BB-4CAF-83E2-E0F5FF2B4859@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Subject: PS:Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:32:13 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 768da6b3-d0c1-4089-bb08-a825a83dcc50 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BA5796.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:34:31 -0500 (EST) Status: RO PS: So, yes, in case it was driving you crazy -- there really IS an organized conspiracy to make color names confusing. ;-) Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 14:37:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJbTuq012291 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:37:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QJacH4026933 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:37:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QJa53V021023 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:36:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJa2Lu016888; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:36:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cgp.netins.net (f1phy.netins.net [167.142.228.65]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJZsXD016692 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:35:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from landofoz@netins.net) X-netINS-MPP: scanned Received: from [67.55.167.82] (account landofoz@netins.net HELO denise8541f2db) by cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0.13) with ESMTPA id 1214623439 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:34:18 -0600 Message-ID: <035c01c74180$fc51b120$52a73743@denise8541f2db> From: "Land of Oz" To: "Historical Costume" References: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996ECC@lynx.campus.muc.prv> <1C6D92AF-8232-46EA-BCA3-CCF7A29C3608@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:34:23 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: be2c0aba-eb8b-44ff-a4e4-6215cc8e9e2f X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BA5846.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:37:26 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > and the forecasts exist so you can buy a peach sweater in one store and > a peach skirt in another and have them match. hahahahahaahhhhaaaaaaa! Nice in theory, but I've *never* seen it happen. At least not in the stores where I shop. Maybe in couture shopping...I couldn't say. Denise B Iowa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 14:54:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJs4iq012779 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:54:04 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QJrBi4023002 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:54:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QJkxZZ022791 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:46:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJkq8I028624; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:46:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc11.comcast.net (alnrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.225.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QJki2H028379 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:46:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc11) with SMTP id <20070126194638b11000vnf8e>; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:46:38 +0000 In-Reply-To: <035c01c74180$fc51b120$52a73743@denise8541f2db> References: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996ECC@lynx.campus.muc.prv> <1C6D92AF-8232-46EA-BCA3-CCF7A29C3608@comcast.net> <035c01c74180$fc51b120$52a73743@denise8541f2db> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Message-Id: From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:46:36 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5cf2cf8c-4f9c-4061-a338-f5c9b450b001 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA5C28.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:54:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Yeah, I know -- but *theoretically* if the peach were called "Georgia Bloom" in both stores, or whatever, then they would match. I don't think the restriction goes as high as couture, though -- it does get down into ready-to-wear, but if you're like me and you buy on sale a lot, you don't know what season's clothes you're actually buying, for starters. The proliferation of color forecasters has probably changed things, too. Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net On Jan 26, 2007, at 2:34 PM, Land of Oz wrote: >> and the forecasts exist so you can buy a peach sweater in one >> store and a peach skirt in another and have them match. > > > hahahahahaahhhhaaaaaaa! > > Nice in theory, but I've *never* seen it happen. At least not in > the stores where I shop. Maybe in couture shopping...I couldn't say. > > Denise B > Iowa > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 15:04:07 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QK3sNf013063 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:03:54 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QK331A008848 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:03:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QK16QG025284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:01:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QK124e043738; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:01:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QK0oFn043432 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:00:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-9.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.48]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 26 Jan 2007 19:54:14 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAI7suUXUSnIwk2dsb2JhbACORgEBAgcOBwUe Received: from 88-107-34-126.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.34.126]:4280 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-9.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1HAX6v-0009CC-9p for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:51:45 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126195230.03599b08@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:54:15 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help In-Reply-To: References: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996ECC@lynx.campus.muc.prv> <1C6D92AF-8232-46EA-BCA3-CCF7A29C3608@comcast.net> <035c01c74180$fc51b120$52a73743@denise8541f2db> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 73b37722-14b8-45f3-8e0d-13b2e5e6418c X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BA5E77.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:03:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 19:46 26/01/2007, you wrote: >Yeah, I know -- but *theoretically* if the peach were called "Georgia >Bloom" in both stores, or whatever, then they would match. I don't >think the restriction goes as high as couture, though -- it does get >down into ready-to-wear, but if you're like me and you buy on sale a >lot, you don't know what season's clothes you're actually buying, for >starters. The proliferation of color forecasters has probably changed >things, too. >Lauren >Lauren M. Walker >lauren.walker@comcast.net Here in the U.K. I am wearing "amethyst" pants, "mauve" sweater, and "aubergine" cardigan, and they all match. Not only that, they nearly match the "ultramarine" thread that started all this!! Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 15:34:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKY1Ql013900 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:34:05 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QKXCEo008144 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:33:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QKWKSa029635 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:32:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKWBKq075685; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:32:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from eastrmmtao01.cox.net (eastrmmtao01.cox.net [68.230.240.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QGIahE081683 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:18:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyanne@quik.com) Received: from eastrmimpo01.cox.net ([68.1.16.119]) by eastrmmtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.03 201-2131-130-104-20060516) with ESMTP id <20070126161831.UISP23750.eastrmmtao01.cox.net@eastrmimpo01.cox.net> for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:18:31 -0500 Received: from ANNESCOMPUTER ([70.160.213.140]) by eastrmimpo01.cox.net with bizsmtp id FsJT1W00532JwDy0000000; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:18:30 -0500 From: "Anne Moeller" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:18:26 -0500 Message-ID: <003101c74165$9bb8cb70$0200a8c0@ANNESCOMPUTER> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: <001801c7415d$7f044a20$7ebfa6d8@pavilion> thread-index: AcdBXGki9EfDKptXRkWYS9gv6hIBWQACPcbw X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=9% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 284e7c06-340b-48c2-9a64-1356f19db4b8 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA658A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:33:58 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >I'm American, as well, and, like Patty, always thought of "ultramarine" as >a >slightly greenish darkish blue (like a bright navy with a hint of green to >it). If I remember to put "aubergine" through my mental translation >program, and think "oh, yeah...that's equivalent to eggplant," I wouldn't >think of it as anything but a really strong, dark purple. These are the descriptions I am familiar with Anne -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.17.12/653 - Release Date: 1/26/2007 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 15:36:28 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKaRiK013969 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:36:27 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QKZdo0011188 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:36:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QKZ6He030031 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:35:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKZ4bv078740; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:35:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QHjKcY089473 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:45:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.39]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 26 Jan 2007 17:39:58 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAOrMuUXUSnInk2dsb2JhbACOQwEBAgcOBwUe Received: from 88-107-34-126.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.34.126]:3747 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1HAV2m-000LvO-Jy for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:39:20 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126173757.035e8890@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:39:12 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help In-Reply-To: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996DC5@lynx.campus.muc.p rv> References: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126150443.0359f008@suziclarke.co.uk> <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996DC5@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 42c36055-cfbe-4e4c-8f05-d7b9a9c8af91 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA661B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:36:24 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 15:27 26/01/2007, you wrote: >Just checked my small dictionary - ultramarine was named because the >pigment came from over the sea, not because it looked like the sea as I >had thought, so there was an ultramarine blue, an ultramarine purple & >even an ultramarine yellow. > >Patty Oh, now I'm really confused - I think my olours come from paints like others have mentioned. (Ultramarine being blue like lapis lazuli!) Suzi >At 14:58 26/01/2007, you wrote: > >American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue > >for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > > > >Patty > > > >Could be - I was old enough to be this lady's mother. According to my >small dictionary - too lazy to heave out the O.E.D. - ultramarine is >a blue pigment. The thread I bought was not blue! > > > >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a >dark > > >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a > > >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter > > >pinkish-purple. > > > >I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler > >aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as > >they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American > >companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name > >association she knew - I didn't! > > > >Suzi > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 15:36:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKabMw013982 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:36:37 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QKZk4w009575 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:36:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QKYU58029922 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:34:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKYQ7v078006; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:34:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QHDL93049120 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 10:14:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claning@igc.org) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=igc.org; b=jzYpBEwsxqAX+LfHmu09S8OB9iGZZ05ALA+7rjTxSnMIL33maKGdWkGt766yR0Ax; h=Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:To:Subject:Mime-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [209.86.224.50] (helo=mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1HAUdN-0000Yn-Rb for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:13:06 -0500 Received: from 72.18.240.11 by webmail.atl.earthlink.net with HTTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 12:13:05 -0500 Message-ID: <30345522.1169831585792.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:13:05 -0800 (GMT-08:00) From: Chris Laning To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: EarthLink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-ELNK-Trace: 295639c8be741617f84080ff3e30f22c8561eee8f5b636a14decd1862525a5bd350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 209.86.224.50 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a3313ac6-638a-4e30-88fd-1f11e9e0c272 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BA6622.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:36:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Kate wrote: >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a dark >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter >pinkish-purple. I used to have a housemate who was a professional seamstress, and who got a lot of her business from weddings. She has a story of a bride who ordered her attendants' dresses in advance (as one does) and chose the color from a small color chip. When the dresses arrived, the bride _and_ the bridesmaids all said "Eeeeeeeuuuuuuwwwww!" because no one had really visualized the color correctly from that small sample, and the color was "aubergine" --exactly the dark, slightly greenish purple of an eggplant..... So my housemate got the job of making three bridesmaids' dresses in two weeks from some OTHER color. She also commented that brides who intend to make their own dresses are the seamstress' best friend, because either they run out of time or they buy $50 per yard lace and are afraid to cut into it. On the color descriptions angle, I know Penny Ladnier used to work on color names -- have you tried her website to see if any of her work is posted? ____________________________________________________________ 0 Chris Laning | + Davis, California http://paternoster-row.org - http://paternosters.blogspot.com ____________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 15:38:07 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKc78x014028 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:38:07 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QKbF1a012959 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:38:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QKaoM5030201 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:36:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKajbU080349; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:36:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QIQpjZ037443 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 11:26:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.42) id 1HAVmk-000EFP-8G for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 18:26:50 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 18:25:50 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help References: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996D8E@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.06-U () X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=10% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 36350558-a2a1-4ad0-88f0-df143fef7452 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA667B.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:38:04 -0500 (EST) Status: RO My husband does model wargaming, and I'm always entertained by the names of the paints, shaded specifically for the different armies' uniforms and camouflage designs. "Israeli desert pink" is a favourite! Jean Ruth Anne Baumgartner wrote >"Ultramarine," like many other colors (magenta, Prussian blue, >"midnight blue," apricot, burnt sienna, ocher, even lavender), was >described definitively and permanently for me in my youth by my big >set of Crayola crayons. And Patty's description definitely squares >with Crayola. >--Ruth Anne Baumgartner >scholar gypsy and amateur costumer >p.s. The Crayola color "flesh" has been long since re-named. Lucky, >that--I didn't know ANYBODY who was that color, but clearly it did >imply that dark-skinned people were an aberration as far as the color >of their "flesh" was concerned, and I'm glad that notion has been >obliterated! Significantly, though, I never can remember what the new >name is.... > >On Jan 26, 2007, at 9:58 AM, Rickard, Patty wrote: > >> American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue >> for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? >> >> Patty >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] >> On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke >> Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 4:22 AM >> To: Historical Costume >> Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help >> >> At 09:06 26/01/2007, you wrote: >> >> >>> Kate Bunting >>> Librarian and 17th century reenactor >>> >>>>>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: >>>> Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed >>>> from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier >>>> names were often applied to the same old colors. >>> >>> I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a >>>dark >>> purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a >>> recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter >>> pinkish-purple. >> >> I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler >> aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as >> they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American >> companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name >> association she knew - I didn't! >> >> Suzi >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 15:44:51 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKipK3014208 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:44:51 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QKi472021783 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:44:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QKhY8Y031319 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:43:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKhUdm087272; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:43:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKhPhN087086 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:43:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:47:26 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:47:22 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996FA2@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help thread-index: AcdBY9zAV6WOQ6l9QD25bT3PTPIFdAAJzRLg From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Jan 2007 20:47:26.0735 (UTC) FILETIME=[302529F0:01C7418B] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0QKhPhN087086 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9bb036f7-249f-4992-b0f4-c46b6bf0e13c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA6814.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:44:48 -0500 (EST) Status: RO That's probably because I, too, was imprinted by Crayola! Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Ruth Anne Baumgartner Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 10:50 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help "Ultramarine," like many other colors (magenta, Prussian blue, "midnight blue," apricot, burnt sienna, ocher, even lavender), was described definitively and permanently for me in my youth by my big set of Crayola crayons. And Patty's description definitely squares with Crayola. --Ruth Anne Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer p.s. The Crayola color "flesh" has been long since re-named. Lucky, that--I didn't know ANYBODY who was that color, but clearly it did imply that dark-skinned people were an aberration as far as the color of their "flesh" was concerned, and I'm glad that notion has been obliterated! Significantly, though, I never can remember what the new name is.... On Jan 26, 2007, at 9:58 AM, Rickard, Patty wrote: > American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue > for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > > Patty > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] > On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke > Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 4:22 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help > > At 09:06 26/01/2007, you wrote: > > >> Kate Bunting >> Librarian and 17th century reenactor >> >>>>> Lavolta Press 26/01/2007 02:58 >>> wrote: >>> Bear in mind that the meanings of many Victorian color names changed >>> from fashion season to fashion season; and also, different, trendier >>> names were often applied to the same old colors. >> >> I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a >> dark >> purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a >> recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter >> pinkish-purple. > > I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler > aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as > they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American > companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name > association she knew - I didn't! > > Suzi > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 15:52:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKqfaL014417 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:52:41 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QKpopO019153 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:52:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QKnIVw032070 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:49:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKn4sn093085; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:49:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (webmail.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKmqqr092820 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:48:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:52:53 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:52:51 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B01996FA8@lynx.campus.muc.prv> In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070126173757.035e8890@suziclarke.co.uk> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help thread-index: AcdBiiNJFfmOFNT3SsK7/Ykx/xuXpwAARjRg From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Jan 2007 20:52:53.0795 (UTC) FILETIME=[F3168F30:01C7418B] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0QKmqqr092820 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b193df08-5a6c-4e8d-9841-7b9f605cba82 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BA69E6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:52:38 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sorry to confuse the issue - it's just that the ultramarine (not the color) means beyond or on the other side of (ultra) the sea (marine) so that a pigment or mineral (lapis) that came from afar might be called ultramarine regardless of the color. We seem to have shortened ultramarine blue to just ultramarine (maybe to correspond to infrared & ultraviolet). Patty -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 12:39 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help At 15:27 26/01/2007, you wrote: >Just checked my small dictionary - ultramarine was named because the >pigment came from over the sea, not because it looked like the sea as I >had thought, so there was an ultramarine blue, an ultramarine purple & >even an ultramarine yellow. > >Patty Oh, now I'm really confused - I think my olours come from paints like others have mentioned. (Ultramarine being blue like lapis lazuli!) Suzi >At 14:58 26/01/2007, you wrote: > >American here - ultramarine was strong darkish slightly greenish blue > >for me -when I was a girl - maybe a generational, not national, thing? > > > >Patty > > > >Could be - I was old enough to be this lady's mother. According to my >small dictionary - too lazy to heave out the O.E.D. - ultramarine is >a blue pigment. The thread I bought was not blue! > > > >I find this is still true. Here in the UK "aubergine" is usually a >dark > > >purple (the colour of what you Americans call eggplants), but in a > > >recent catalogue I've seen the name applied to a lighter > > >pinkish-purple. > > > >I was buying cotton thread yesterday, and the "mauve/purple/paler > >aubergine" thread was called "Ultramarine." Now when I was a girl, as > >they say, ultramarine was a strong darkish bright blue. My American > >companion said that the purple-ish colour was a colour/name > >association she knew - I didn't! > > > >Suzi > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 15:59:38 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKxcCG014629 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:59:38 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QKwpVT007231 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:59:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QKvV4a033184 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:57:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKvSBV002077; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:57:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net (tomts43.bellnexxia.net [209.226.175.110]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QKvJwj001906 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 13:57:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from shaneandsheridan@sympatico.ca) Received: from smtp1.sympatico.ca ([209.226.175.62]) by tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.13 201-253-122-130-113-20050324) with SMTP id <20070126205718.LFJG11361.tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:57:18 -0500 X-Mailer: Openwave WebEngine, version 2.8.6.6 (webedge20-101-174-112-20020617)" From: Sheridan To: Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:57:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20070126205718.LFJG11361.tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] OT, but someone might be interested... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 8c05393d-ddef-4bea-8bd3-f3793613bb6b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA6B8B.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:59:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi folks! The animation studio I work for is hosting a short film competition, for both live action and animation. We're a Canadian company - but the competition is open to international entrants. If anyone is interested drop me a line and I'll send you the propaganda/details rather than spamming the list. :0) Have a good weekend! Sheridan P _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 17:33:46 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QMXjLi017521 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:33:45 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QMWw0q023838 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:33:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QMVWeC046742 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:31:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QMVOKx095761; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:31:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web33907.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web33907.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.185]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0QMVKe4095604 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:31:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wildthangstreasures@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 79506 invoked by uid 60001); 26 Jan 2007 22:31:12 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=IrKCY0yVxATJMz0O9kUgCNv70Mop5bhMwstJEou/9QHs/K5aIJJOIgzIJlwXSe8rIKuByVrIo42cRTqCksKZUiReHcHmMsv6CWsWJ34h65RZjpZ5AJX9nHErxEIrSg5klFDzAUj4evjI59UNoFfY/SDuoeR+irfvLyJ7ap8GWNk=; X-YMail-OSG: wCoTR0AVM1laA_8_0GkYjsvxpyChKsgntywFe.GKOCCO6EgljiQ7j93BXQkHquU5Kd17zF27KVUZKc3R6zVzkDswzWVTTsgUgklPY76if1fDNNCVIPFjdTOWS82qBoLzyNW36D6qogyN6OM- Received: from [70.187.50.220] by web33907.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:31:12 PST Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:31:12 -0800 (PST) From: "Voncile W. Dudley" Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT, but someone might be interested... To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20070126205718.LFJG11361.tomts43-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <647928.78647.qm@web33907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d261671b-a0ef-4423-bb91-3134ea9fbeda X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA819B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:33:42 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Please send...thanks. Lady Von Sheridan wrote: Hi folks! The animation studio I work for is hosting a short film competition, for both live action and animation. We're a Canadian company - but the competition is open to international entrants. If anyone is interested drop me a line and I'll send you the propaganda/details rather than spamming the list. :0) Have a good weekend! Sheridan P _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lady Von http://www.wildthangstreasures.com --------------------------------- The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Jan 26 17:39:39 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QMdcqG017665 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:39:38 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0QMclg0030545 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:39:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0QMcAOS047543 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:38:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QMc8f8002207; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:38:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0QMc4lh002083 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 15:38:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cf2.819a1ed (29679) for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:37:54 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:37:52 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e0f5935f-8a91-403a-893d-9808011114ac X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BA82F7.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:39:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/26/2007 3:02:03 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, suzi@suziclarke.co.uk writes: Here in the U.K. I am wearing "amethyst" pants, "mauve" sweater, and "aubergine" cardigan, and they all match. Not only that, they nearly match the "ultramarine" thread that started all this!! Suzi ************* LOL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 02:01:25 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0R71LKl029623 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 02:01:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0R70SZS001084 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 02:01:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0R6xoZL003649 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 26 Jan 2007 23:59:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0R6x6Hj045802; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 23:59:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0R6wjEJ045608 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2007 23:58:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1HAhWL3rZs-0007Au; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 01:58:44 -0500 Message-ID: <005f01c741e0$8f4e1f90$6400a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <30345522.1169831585792.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Colour names Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 01:58:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Provags-ID2: V01U2FsdGVkX1+3O8Ys5R+gdCS/AzNgkyeGp2zgihdoH+5y+chW1pc0cWSjhMNcPSBjX4Te9O+QzSAKG2gMkz0q3td/gbor/PxvsjWSANviSEla6MXXtw20GA== X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=14% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f0130b16-2e41-41db-950c-f1370b44d1ca X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BAF88C.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 02:01:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I will be doing research of fashion color usage for a long, long time. I have made a database with my documentation of color names, trends, usage and definitions at www.fcdatabase.com . You can view the bibliography and lists of the color names used for given years at no charge on the site. The Fashion Color Database is part of our online Library. To view the actual color name database, you need to be a subscriber to our Library. At this moment there are over 2,100 entries in the database. As for dove gray or dove grey: "Names of Colors and Their Meaning" Sears & Roebuck Catalog, 1929, defines dove gray as: "gray with rose tint, one shade lighter than shadow." Documentation for the color: Dove-grey: ELIZABETHAN COSTUMES FROM 1550-1580 Dove-gray: ***STERN'S CATALOGUE OF FRENCH GOWNS, 1915 ***Sears Catalog, 1929 Dove-color: Feb. 1856: Peterson's Magazine, teenager girl's walking dress I have the color used in many, many other publications but just don't have those in the database yet. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 09:30:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0REUhFx003949 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:30:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RETu5m009122 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:30:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RETCIc057750 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 07:29:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RESSmX080939; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 07:29:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s14.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s14.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RERbJw080226 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 07:28:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.11]) by bay0-omc2-s14.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 06:27:32 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 06:27:32 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV1.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 14:27:28 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "h-costume" , "TheRenaissanceTailor" , Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 07:27:58 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 07:27:58 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jan 2007 14:27:32.0306 (UTC) FILETIME=[48051320:01C7421F] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Construction Thoughts on Surcoat/Outergown? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d030049b-5072-4fbb-8014-a79e20f31093 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BB61E4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:30:40 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi again, I got such good suggestions on the bum roll, I thought I'd solicit some more ideas on the construction of the surcoat or outer gown (OG) on this outfit. http://saragrace.us/html/A1_GoldenAgeDressDiary_PAMPics.html My quandaries with this OG are this. 1.) Is that a collar lying on her shoulder? This is best seen in the first picture in the second row. 2.) How is the front of the OG made to lie so snuggly against her torso? (in the second and third pictures you can see a little gap between the coat and the bodice.) 3.) How does it transition from the close fit in front to the all the extra fabric in back? 4.) What would it look like in back? You can see extra fabric sweeping away from the shoulder/nape - is it constructed like a sack gown? 5.) Is the OG too long, hence the little fold of fabric at the waistline about an inch past the opening? Love to hear your ideas -sorry for all the cross posts. Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 11:48:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RGmH22007428 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 11:48:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RGlL7G003541 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 11:48:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RGkeCQ085747 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:46:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RGkGHn015927; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:46:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RGjgUR015096 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:46:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A68ACBF753 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:45:34 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45BB81CD.4010903@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:46:05 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Construction Thoughts on Surcoat/Outergown? References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0cd5af52-9882-4a16-91c5-f493ec9c51c1 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BB821D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Saragrace Knauf wrote: > Hi again, I got such good suggestions on the bum roll, I thought I'd solicit > some more ideas on the construction of the surcoat or outer gown (OG) on > this outfit. http://saragrace.us/html/A1_GoldenAgeDressDiary_PAMPics.html > > My quandaries with this OG are this. > > 1.) Is that a collar lying on her shoulder? This is best seen in the first > picture in the second row. I honestly can't tell from that pic. :( There's two versions of an overgown/surcoat in one of Janet Arnold's books. Margo's Historic Patterns offers a "comfort gown" pattern. Mantua Maker has a "Spanish loose gown". Reconstructing History offers both a "loose gown" and a "kirtle& gown" pattern. And I'm pretty sure Alcega had more than one version. Any of those should give you an idea of cut and construction. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 12:17:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHHKET008234 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:17:20 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RHGSfr029148 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:17:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RHFs5d090523 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:15:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHFN79047354; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:15:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHEmFD046575 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:15:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep45.mail.dk ([195.41.46.228]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070127171442.BMZY9852.fep34.mail.dk@fep45.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:14:42 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.141]) by fep45.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070127171442.BELZ119.fep45.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:14:42 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c74236$b1ee7350$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:15:04 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep45.mail.dk from [80.161.67.141] at Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:14:36 +0100 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 998e2447-63f0-417f-860e-7eb1b8594a44 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BB88EC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:17:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear list, I am soon finnishing the anglaise dress. Working on the skirts now. Underskirt is made of 2 widths of silk taffeta 140 cm wide and i have calculated the same for the overskirt. But as i have made my embroideries on the fronts, i would have to make a center back seam, wich i dont think would be propper.(on the overskirts) So i figured to cut away some of the fabric on the embroidered pannels and then add a center back piece. What do you think? The entire dress is handstitched all together, except for the bone channels in the stays, the first gown made with handstitching alone. ever. You can see some of the progress here: http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/anglaise.htm Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 12:27:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHRHLs008549 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:27:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RHQNI8003711 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:27:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RHQ23N092034 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:26:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHPVaT057934; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:26:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s9.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s9.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.81]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHNILi055506 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:24:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.140.18]) by bay0-omc1-s9.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:23:13 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:23:12 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 24.222.250.203 by BAY135-DAV8.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:23:09 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.222.250.203] X-Originating-Email: [estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com] X-Sender: estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com From: "kelly grant" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45BB81CD.4010903@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Construction Thoughts on Surcoat/Outergown? Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:23:08 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jan 2007 17:23:12.0671 (UTC) FILETIME=[D29122F0:01C74237] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 68999d3c-dd4f-478d-9ef1-b14db8283d1b X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BB8B3F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:27:14 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Saragrace Knauf wrote: > >> more ideas on the construction of the surcoat or outer gown (OG) on this >> outfit. http://saragrace.us/html/A1_GoldenAgeDressDiary_PAMPics.html >> >> My quandaries with this OG are this. >> >> 1.) Is that a collar lying on her shoulder? This is best seen in the >> first picture in the second row. My two cents CDN? I don't think this type of coat would have a falling band stlye of collar. I am of the belief that it would have a high 'half' collar, that would be full height in the back and disapear towards the front, to allow lacing of the ruff, or supportasse for a falling band collar of linen. I have yet to see a falling band collar made of the same fabric as the garment, but I am open to being proven wrong on this one. Both Norah Waugh's "Cut of Women's Clothes" and Janet Arnold's "Patterns of Fashion" have this type of surcoat pattern in them, from original garments...I would go with those two references first and foremost, beyond going and looking at the garments yourself. I'll be cutting one of these soon for myself, I'd love to see finished garment pics of yours when you are done! Kelly _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 12:42:13 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHgDUf009032 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:42:13 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RHfKjw004412 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:42:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RHewJS094237 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:40:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHdqST073504; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:40:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s29.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s29.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.101]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHdIaM072808 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:39:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.19]) by bay0-omc1-s29.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:39:12 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:39:12 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV9.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:39:10 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45BB81CD.4010903@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Construction Thoughts on Surcoat/Outergown? Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:39:40 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:39:40 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jan 2007 17:39:12.0789 (UTC) FILETIME=[0ED78450:01C7423A] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 996960af-a04f-4229-94dd-837f052eca39 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BB8EC1.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:42:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm familiar with the common resources on the standard 16th century surcoat/loose gown constructions and this isn't quite like that. It could even be called a Schaube - note that it has it's own sleeves, not the very common large draping ones. Algacea has a mourning gown that is similar in that it has a full back like this -it looks very much like a sack dress when made up, -it laces up under the 'sack' but has a full false front. It may even be less of a construction as a "treatment" discussion. I am trying to avoid giving any of my opinions on how it was made because I didn't want to influence any free thoughts. I've not seen very many other paintings where the sitter is actually standing such that you can see the way the gown drapes in back. If anyone has seen any paintings where the backs of such a gown can be seen - I'd sure like to see them. There are many pictures in this period of a black over gown which fits tightly all the way around. Thank you for your thougts. Sg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 9:46 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Construction Thoughts on Surcoat/Outergown? > There's two versions of an overgown/surcoat in one of Janet Arnold's > books. Margo's Historic Patterns offers a "comfort gown" pattern. Mantua > Maker has a "Spanish loose gown". Reconstructing History offers both a > "loose gown" and a "kirtle& gown" pattern. And I'm pretty sure Alcega > had more than one version. Any of those should give you an idea of cut > and construction. > > > > Dawn > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 12:46:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHkYus009186 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:46:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RHjem3009821 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:46:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RHjEpM094817 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:45:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHil2h078310; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:45:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc3-s12.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s12.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.212]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHhiIx077181 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:44:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.12]) by bay0-omc3-s12.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:43:38 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:43:38 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV2.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:43:38 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000f01c74236$b1ee7350$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:44:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:44:08 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jan 2007 17:43:38.0415 (UTC) FILETIME=[AD2AD3F0:01C7423A] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0da5b145-41d0-465a-a81a-12b56c402059 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BB8FC6.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:46:31 -0500 (EST) Status: RO The stays are just beautiful - as is the rest of the gown. Not being real familiar with the construction, of these gowns - why do you say the center back seam would be inappropriate - yet a center back panel would be okay? Sg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 10:15 AM Subject: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. > Dear list, > I am soon finnishing the anglaise dress. Working on the skirts now. > Underskirt is made of 2 widths of silk taffeta 140 cm wide and i have > calculated the same for the overskirt. > But as i have made my embroideries on the fronts, i would have to make a > center back seam, wich i dont think would be propper.(on the overskirts) > So i figured to cut away some of the fabric on the embroidered pannels and > then add a center back piece. > What do you think? > The entire dress is handstitched all together, except for the bone > channels > in the stays, the first gown made with handstitching alone. ever. > > You can see some of the progress here: > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/anglaise.htm > > Bjarne > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 12:57:41 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHveOn009504 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:57:41 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RHunqs023053 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:57:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RHt8Ns096195 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:55:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHs67C087839; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:55:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from server018.dfw.nationwide.net (server018.dfw.nationwide.net [206.123.129.81]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0RHrav3087367 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:54:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 10489 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2007 17:53:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO D1V3BRB1) (67.174.246.110) by server018.dfw.nationwide.net with SMTP; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:53:35 +0000 From: "Diana Habra" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Colour names Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 09:53:32 -0800 Message-ID: <007501c7423c$0fb9bc10$0d00a8c0@D1V3BRB1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 Thread-Index: AcdB4SSMDAhn76LZREKRoHShGH63ZwAWnrvA In-Reply-To: <005f01c741e0$8f4e1f90$6400a8c0@momlaptop> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 02d3845b-95db-46ab-94f8-fa4894b9ff89 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BB9261.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:57:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Penny, Thank you very much! Your description matches what I thought but I needed to validate my memory. And between the bluish gray and the rosy gray I had, the rosy one was a nicer color and better on the skin than the other one. Thanks again, Diana -- www.RenaissanceFabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" "Be the change you want to see in the world" --Ghandi -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Penny Ladnier Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 10:59 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Colour names As for dove gray or dove grey: "Names of Colors and Their Meaning" Sears & Roebuck Catalog, 1929, defines dove gray as: "gray with rose tint, one shade lighter than shadow." _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 12:58:01 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHw1NO009516 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:58:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RHvE5I017995 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:57:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RHunsn096383 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:56:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHtsD3089569; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:56:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep35.mail.dk (fep35.mail.dk [80.160.76.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RHtoK4089397 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:55:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep41.mail.dk ([195.41.46.142]) by fep35.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070127175544.CSWR1607.fep35.mail.dk@fep41.mail.dk> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:55:44 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.67.141]) by fep41.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070127175544.BDHR20909.fep41.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:55:44 +0100 Message-ID: <000501c7423c$6fe99b00$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000f01c74236$b1ee7350$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:56:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep41.mail.dk from [80.161.67.141] at Sat, 27 Jan 2007 18:55:40 +0100 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0771d5d9-fe4f-46a4-bb61-d0602c732b38 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BB927A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 12:57:58 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Well it is because the bodice has a sharp v point in the bodice at the back, and i thoaght it would look better, if the skirt dont have a seam there.......... dont know? Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 6:44 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. > The stays are just beautiful - as is the rest of the gown. Not being real > familiar with the construction, of these gowns - why do you say the center > back seam would be inappropriate - yet a center back panel would be okay? > > Sg > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" > To: > Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 10:15 AM > Subject: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. > > >> Dear list, >> I am soon finnishing the anglaise dress. Working on the skirts now. >> Underskirt is made of 2 widths of silk taffeta 140 cm wide and i have >> calculated the same for the overskirt. >> But as i have made my embroideries on the fronts, i would have to make a >> center back seam, wich i dont think would be propper.(on the overskirts) >> So i figured to cut away some of the fabric on the embroidered pannels >> and >> then add a center back piece. >> What do you think? >> The entire dress is handstitched all together, except for the bone >> channels >> in the stays, the first gown made with handstitching alone. ever. >> >> You can see some of the progress here: >> http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/anglaise.htm >> >> Bjarne >> >> >> >> Leif og Bjarne Drews >> www.my-drewscostumes.dk >> >> http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 15:34:53 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RKYqK6013663 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:34:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RKY0tE024799 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:34:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RKXK8f017909 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:33:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RKXCdG031012; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:33:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp4.clear.net.nz (smtp4.clear.net.nz [203.97.37.64]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RKX9fd030951 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:33:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyadele@paradise.net.nz) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (202-78-152-208.cable.telstraclear.net [202.78.152.208]) by smtp4.clear.net.nz (CLEAR Net Mail) with ESMTP id <0JCJ00KLQNR50Z30@smtp4.clear.net.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:33:08 +1300 (NZDT) Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:33:06 +1300 From: Adele de Maisieres Subject: Re: [h-cost] Construction Thoughts on Surcoat/Outergown? In-reply-to: To: Historical Costume Message-id: <45BBB702.1070703@paradise.net.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a8e4d982-9e7c-4772-8841-2d5471041da7 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BBB738.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:34:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Saragrace Knauf wrote: > http://saragrace.us/html/A1_GoldenAgeDressDiary_PAMPics.html > > 1.) Is that a collar lying on her shoulder? This is best seen in the first > picture in the second row. > I believe so, yes-- I think it's probably cut with a raised neckline at the front and a half collar band at the back. Sorry, I realise that's not a very illuminating explanation-- I think Janet Arnold has a good description and pics, though. > 2.) How is the front of the OG made to lie so snuggly against her torso? > (in the second and third pictures you can see a little gap between the coat > and the bodice.) > Possibly a combination of pins and artistic license... > 3.) How does it transition from the close fit in front to the all the extra > fabric in back? > > 4.) What would it look like in back? You can see extra fabric sweeping away > from the shoulder/nape - is it constructed like a sack gown? > I believe it's done by pleating the back fabric. I'm afraid I don't have any resources for this at hand, but I think there may be examples of both a yoke section with pleated fabric below, and of the fullness of the back simply pleated and stitched flat over the shoulder area. -- Adele de Maisieres ----------------------------- Habeo metrum - musicamque, hominem meam. Expectat alium quid? -Georgeus Gershwinus ----------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 15:44:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RKiln0013893 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:44:47 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RKi0bu028531 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:44:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RKcPZe018739 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:38:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RKcOvf035115; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:38:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RKcJ8k034993 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:38:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-relay-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.11]) by mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 27 Jan 2007 20:38:13 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Ao8CAG9Hu0XUSnIL/2dsb2JhbAA Received: from [88.107.34.126] (port=3188 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-relay-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.66 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1HAuJR-0008do-0j for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 20:38:13 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070127202701.01210d68@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 20:28:22 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. In-Reply-To: <000501c7423c$6fe99b00$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711> References: <000f01c74236$b1ee7350$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711> <000501c7423c$6fe99b00$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Antivirus-Scanner: Scanned with ClamAV X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2e66aac9-6d06-44a4-90aa-61347c4a6495 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BBB990.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:44:44 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 17:56 27/01/2007, you wrote: >Well it is because the bodice has a sharp v point in the bodice at >the back, and i thoaght it would look better, if the skirt dont have >a seam there.......... >dont know? > >Bjarne There are three dresses in Janet Arnold with similar backs, and at least two, if not all three, have centre back seams. It actually makes life easier if you are splitting the fabric to hang down inside. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Jan 27 16:15:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RLFlpZ014741 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 16:15:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0RLExDD010071 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 16:15:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0RLEbZ8025313 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 14:14:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RLEVdp063073; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 14:14:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.225]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0RLETqo063052 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 14:14:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from henderson.sharon@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so1071831nzf for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:14:29 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=usBSHL7hAuzqEW69OoW3+kcOAQYUa9a85GVCKkLiG4axW7ZV1ipYNVIbC0arJ+ymMWA5BgiXwRtuIaBUhsgHqt2jODrJgcSHwRintWwPH1t8z/mv866uLqTij2EYE/gpWvGiG1fxSrmMXxWv7SStRLdrc1LKYab5VtmiWHPXFSQ= Received: by 10.114.185.8 with SMTP id i8mr142538waf.1169932468815; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:14:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.114.154.10 with HTTP; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:14:28 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 16:14:28 -0500 From: "Sharon Henderson" To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: question about robe anglaise X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 39592fe8-aad2-4eae-a4e6-2e8ca9dbbba3 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BBC0D3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 16:15:44 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Bjarne, Can I just say that your work is absolutely GORGEOUS???? WOW! What a beautiful project this is shaping up to be! Thank you for sharing the link--I am very inspired! (I'm inspired by a lot here, but lately have wanted to make a nice new gown in something different for me... *g*) Just beautiful. I look forward to seeing the finished product! Meli, Fairfax, VA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 00:47:00 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0S5l0jJ026571 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 00:47:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0S5k8bl003941 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 00:46:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0S5jaRV080516 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:45:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0S5jVCB081818; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:45:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0S5jR0H081785 for ; Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:45:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from [71.197.12.37] (helo=momlaptop) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrelayus1) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1HB2qz0VLq-00079r; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 00:45:26 -0500 Message-ID: <006001c7429f$8018a300$6400a8c0@momlaptop> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <007501c7423c$0fb9bc10$0d00a8c0@D1V3BRB1> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Colour names Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 00:45:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Provags-ID2: V01U2FsdGVkX1/EgPEPRbLHMr0QqvyHWgJu1FBDbaWODtHY8iwTwGVUAiH+aOpq/IGdBAAP8iQ5Feivi/TltMfGIhc8Hyj7A7TAYcPOE/r6m6v4rxMTiJPNRg== X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=14% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 62c56f0b-a31d-4fed-b4aa-e6df50d51c9d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BC38A0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 00:46:57 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Your welcome Diana. I am sorry for not responding sooner. I have had a very busy week. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 05:09:13 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SA99Kt007358 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 05:09:13 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SA8HGV011795 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 05:09:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SA7g0U003467 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 03:07:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SA7W3m033529; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 03:07:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep30.mail.dk (fep30.mail.dk [80.160.76.194]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SA7Qfh033373 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 03:07:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep44.mail.dk ([195.41.46.227]) by fep30.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070128100717.XTBE27791.fep30.mail.dk@fep44.mail.dk> for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:07:17 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.211]) by fep44.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070128100717.BJEE11319.fep44.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:07:17 +0100 Message-ID: <000d01c742c4$2a5427d0$d314a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000f01c74236$b1ee7350$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711><000501c7423c$6fe99b00$8d43a150@CPQ21932199711> <7.0.1.0.2.20070127202701.01210d68@suziclarke.co.uk> Subject: Re: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:07:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep44.mail.dk from [80.161.20.211] at Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:07:12 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2d77784b-2d6c-471c-9418-1e3e64b90f51 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BC7611.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 05:09:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Suzi, This is really embarrasing for me, why on earth didnt i look in my books, didnt think of that. Well it must be my aestaetic, who told me not to. But off cause it is easyer to split down the skirt at the v point when there is a seam. Thanks and blush Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Suzi Clarke" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 9:28 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. > At 17:56 27/01/2007, you wrote: >>Well it is because the bodice has a sharp v point in the bodice at the >>back, and i thoaght it would look better, if the skirt dont have a seam >>there.......... >>dont know? >> >>Bjarne > > There are three dresses in Janet Arnold with similar backs, and at least > two, if not all three, have centre back seams. It actually makes life > easier if you are splitting the fabric to hang down inside. > > Suzi > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 09:34:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SEY2ZE017381 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:34:06 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SEXEYE017364 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:33:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SEWSIb024937 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 07:32:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SEWLbD090268; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 07:32:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (mail.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SEWINr090218 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 07:32:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.180] (pm5-180.eos.net [205.133.149.180]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id l0SEWGWr016580 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:32:17 -0500 (EST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 10:14:36 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200701271430.l0REU1nk082184@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: color names X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 41abeee8-6267-4fd2-9805-5d2ce33a15a9 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BCB42A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:33:59 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I din't know anything about the Color Association, but I'm very familiar witht the Color Marketing Group. They are a hilarious bunch who call themselves "forecasters." They claim to go around the world forecasting color trends. Well, they DO go around thew world, it's the forecasting they claim . The forecasters travel around looking at the colors of what they thimk will be big design trends -- Asian stuff, for instance, or high-tech gadgets. Then they compile lists of colors found in these things and name them all. Then all the car companies, furniture companies, etc., buy the lists because if you produce things that don't go with everyone else's colors, yours won't sell. The thing is that these forecasts are for several years out, not for the next year, so they have to stretch hard to do their forecasts -- or so they believe. I've always thought that they were very a very sophisticated group of extortionists, and maybe they are, but talk to any of them and you will find they are vehement about their mission and their "forecasting" abilities. They really seem to believe they are divining trends, not just choosing whatever they feel like (which is what I think they do). I also once interviewed someone from the Pantone Institute, which is run by the Pantone company that puts together formulas for inks. She told me, very seriously, that green was the first color to appear in the universe. Those color people are a funny lot! Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 12:16:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SHG4k7021164 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:16:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SHFH6O027884 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:16:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SHEfbD040864 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 10:14:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SHEZNK090860; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 10:14:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d04.mx.aol.com (imo-d04.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SHEVSX090727 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 10:14:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c52.e7034f0 (43933) for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:14:18 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:14:16 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color names To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: YES X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2c248eb2-bc13-49ad-a8af-8d1c58a8f488 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BCDA26.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:16:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/28/2007 9:33:44 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, gailscott@eos.net writes: Those color people are a funny lot! ******************** Thank you! As if you can forecast color trends years in advance. It, I suppose, never occurs to them that they themselves and their so called forecasts actually cause the color to become the latest trend....by projecting it will be. The fashion industry is listening, y'know. And of course some colors are safe, like say black. When has...or will...black ever be out of style? I remember in the 80's purple was supposed to be all the rage. Lots of clothes were made up in purple and I'm sure are still in warehouses to this day, unsold. About the only thing, I think, one could predict is if bright saturated tones will be in or muted colors. But for individual colors...please! To each his own. Of course scientifically, no one even knows if we see the same colors as others. My brain interprets a certain wave length of electro-magnetic energy as green, but there's no way of knowing if your brain interprets it the same. We both call whatever we see at that wave length green, but do we "see" in our mind's eye the same thing? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 13:02:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SI2qAf022419 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:02:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SI203U000592 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:02:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SI1MmH046031 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:01:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SI1DLV023997; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:01:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s7.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s7.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.143]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SGT7hP061332 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:29:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.15]) by bay0-omc2-s7.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 08:29:01 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 08:29:01 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV5.phx.gbl with DAV; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:28:57 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "h-costume" , "TheRenaissanceTailor" , Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:29:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:29:30 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Jan 2007 16:29:01.0814 (UTC) FILETIME=[6B517960:01C742F9] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 37f22db4-a573-4c02-ab99-d8219409e71e X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BCE518.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:02:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm not sure what I should do here. This bodice http://tinyurl.com/343la7 is sort of a practice bodice. It is made from flocked fake silk taffeta (barf - but it was the closest fabric I have found to give the right look.) I found it at the last minute about a week ago at Jo Annes - it just happened to match the silk taffeta of the skirt almost exactly. I am in the process of having another embroidered to match the embroidery in the actual picture. http://tinyurl.com/3bdc27 Annnnnyyyway - the question: I may have to use the practice bodice if the other doesn't work out or is not done in time for the presentation. The other bodice will require a peplum of sorts to which all the leaves are attached. I did the same here and then experimented with no tabs, all the tabs in the same pattern, and finally tabs made from "cabbage" - random pieces of fabric. Part of me wants to leave it without tabs, because it looks fussy to me. But many of the bodices had these whacky shaped tabs, and the original obviously did too......sigh....decisions, decisions. What is your vote? Thanks for your opinions! Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 13:24:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SIOUoY022960 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:24:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SINh7E020958 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:24:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SINEMm049807 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:23:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SINAup041356; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:23:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SIN6fu041217 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:23:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos1.cos.agilent.com (relcos1.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.239]) by msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF21D1DF0E for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:23:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com [130.29.153.221]) by relcos1.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1A3C1C25A5 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:23:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from wcosbh03.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.128]) by wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:22:59 -0700 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh03.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:22:59 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 11:22:57 -0700 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D96402373D8E@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> In-Reply-To: <200701271915.l0RJFZvu066456@net.indra.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. Thread-Index: AcdCSAfXrYYvtzwyQT20+eDmmECJzQAvGLCQ From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Jan 2007 18:22:59.0502 (UTC) FILETIME=[56E5DCE0:01C74309] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0SIN6fu041217 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: ab61f370-993c-4539-ae29-a4ad0bebf5af X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BCEA2F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:24:27 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi Bjarne! I've recently done a c1776 robe anglaise, which is ~20 years before your dress, so take my references with a grain of salt. >From a brief flip though my documentation binder, it seems very common to have side-back seams in the skirt - which fall approximately mid-way between the side seam and the CB area. (Center back seams for the skirt were unusual, but I did find one example.) It is my conjecture that the standard skirt construction was 5 fabric widths: 2 for the front and side and one full width for the center back. Here are the useful sources I had: 1) The closed robe in _Fitting and Proper_ has 2 side/side-back seams on each side of the skirt between the CB and the seam where on an open robe the front opening would start. Note, this dress, unlike yours, has the CB of the bodice in one piece with the CB skirt panel. 2) The open robe anglaise on page 24 of _Fitting and Proper_ also has 2 seams in the skirt between the CF opening and the CB. Again, note that this dress, unlike yours, has the CB of the bodice in one piece with the CB skirt panel. 3) 1770-85 Polonaise gown on page 37 of _Patterns of Fashion_ - has separate CB bodice and skirt panels. This is the only instance I found with a CB seam in the skirt. 4) None of the robe anglaise with separate back bodice and back skirt panels (for the 1776 era) in _Costume in Detail_ have center back seams - Bradfield's seam line notations imply that their construction is the same 5 panel skirt construction described above. 5) The 1775-85 dress on page 40 of _Patterns of Fashion_ also has the 5 panel construction without CB skirt seam. Hope this helps, -s _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 14:41:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJfPAA024856 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:41:29 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SJeX6e006271 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:41:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SJdv7d059148 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:39:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJdr8j096197; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:39:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep34.mail.dk (fep34.mail.dk [80.160.76.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJdnlu096112 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:39:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep48.mail.dk ([195.41.46.231]) by fep34.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070128193939.MNLE9852.fep34.mail.dk@fep48.mail.dk> for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:39:39 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.63.231.140]) by fep48.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070128193939.BVRZ1080.fep48.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:39:39 +0100 Message-ID: <000b01c74314$204e2e70$8ce73f50@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:40:09 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep48.mail.dk from [80.63.231.140] at Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:39:33 +0100 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b8e10ee6-8575-4de4-9200-f892ca6a609c X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BCFC31.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:41:22 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Saragrace, How wonderfull it comes by. I vote for this: http://saragrace.us/images/GoldenAge/MainGown/images/IMG_0612_jpg.jpg Symmetry is so important with this, so i think that is the best sollution. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "h-costume" ; "TheRenaissanceTailor" ; Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 5:29 PM Subject: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? > I'm not sure what I should do here. This bodice http://tinyurl.com/343la7 > is sort of a practice bodice. It is made from flocked fake silk taffeta > (barf - but it was the closest fabric I have found to give the right > look.) I found it at the last minute about a week ago at Jo Annes - it > just happened to match the silk taffeta of the skirt almost exactly. I am > in the process of having another embroidered to match the embroidery in > the actual picture. http://tinyurl.com/3bdc27 > > Annnnnyyyway - the question: > > > I may have to use the practice bodice if the other doesn't work out or is > not done in time for the presentation. > > The other bodice will require a peplum of sorts to which all the leaves > are attached. I did the same here and then experimented with no tabs, all > the tabs in the same pattern, and finally tabs made from "cabbage" - > random pieces of fabric. > > Part of me wants to leave it without tabs, because it looks fussy to me. > But many of the bodices had these whacky shaped tabs, and the original > obviously did too......sigh....decisions, decisions. > > What is your vote? Thanks for your opinions! > > Sg > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 14:54:47 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJslBt025158 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:54:47 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SJrtJl023678 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:54:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SJrRwp060507 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:53:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJrCFV005561; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:53:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-06.texas.rr.com (ms-smtp-06.texas.rr.com [24.93.47.45]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJqrPn005338 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:53:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sclark935@austin.rr.com) Received: from Main (cpe-66-68-188-221.austin.res.rr.com [66.68.188.221]) by ms-smtp-06.texas.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0SJqqb0006929 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:52:52 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <036801c74315$e41bcd70$ddbc4442@Main> From: "Susan" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000b01c74314$204e2e70$8ce73f50@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:52:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 57944697-f8f2-4004-9997-e6cc08c2c5a6 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BCFF53.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:54:44 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm going to second Bjarne's vote; I like these tabs the best, and think that the bodice needs tabs. Susan in Austin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 1:40 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? > Dear Saragrace, > How wonderfull it comes by. I vote for this: > http://saragrace.us/images/GoldenAge/MainGown/images/IMG_0612_jpg.jpg > Symmetry is so important with this, so i think that is the best sollution. > > Bjarne > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Saragrace Knauf" > To: "h-costume" ; "TheRenaissanceTailor" > ; > Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 5:29 PM > Subject: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? > > >> I'm not sure what I should do here. This bodice http://tinyurl.com/343la7 >> is sort of a practice bodice. It is made from flocked fake silk taffeta >> (barf - but it was the closest fabric I have found to give the right >> look.) I found it at the last minute about a week ago at Jo Annes - it >> just happened to match the silk taffeta of the skirt almost exactly. I am >> in the process of having another embroidered to match the embroidery in >> the actual picture. http://tinyurl.com/3bdc27 >> >> Annnnnyyyway - the question: >> >> >> I may have to use the practice bodice if the other doesn't work out or is >> not done in time for the presentation. >> >> The other bodice will require a peplum of sorts to which all the leaves >> are attached. I did the same here and then experimented with no tabs, all >> the tabs in the same pattern, and finally tabs made from "cabbage" - >> random pieces of fabric. >> >> Part of me wants to leave it without tabs, because it looks fussy to me. >> But many of the bodices had these whacky shaped tabs, and the original >> obviously did too......sigh....decisions, decisions. >> >> What is your vote? Thanks for your opinions! >> >> Sg >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 14:57:37 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJvbtf025227 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:57:37 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SJuoHW020187 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:57:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SJtCTF060724 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:55:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJtB0i006986; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:55:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SJt7Oi006925 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:55:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.42) id 1HBG7G-000JWh-8Z for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:55:06 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:53:47 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: [h-cost] Re: color names (getting OT) References: <200701271430.l0REU1nk082184@net.indra.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.06-U () X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=11% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9dfda52d-a428-484c-b134-91c0e8b7019b X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BD0002.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:57:34 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Gail & Scott Finke wrote > > >I also once interviewed someone from the Pantone Institute, which is run by >the Pantone company that puts together formulas for inks. She told me, very >seriously, that green was the first color to appear in the universe. > >Those color people are a funny lot! > >Gail Finke > I know there are linguistic studies that aim to show the cognitive importance, if you like, of different colours by the order in which languages develop them. You have to work on words for colours that are not linked to the description of an object - orange or aubergine, for example, just say "the colour of that thing". But all languages have words for light and dark, black and white. I'm pretty sure the next one is red, then green and blue interchangeably. So if a language has a word for either green or blue, it must also have a word for red - if it has no word for red, it can't have a word for green or blue. I seem to remember it goes a bit random after that. So green may have been the first colour to appear, but red is the most important one to identify and tell your friends about! Actually .... wouldn't there be volcanoes before plants? ;-) Jean -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 15:01:34 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SK1Y9X025324 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:01:34 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SK0gNf026626 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:01:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SK0I0u061279 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:00:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SK0GRt010526; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:00:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from alnrmhc11.comcast.net (alnrmhc11.comcast.net [206.18.177.51]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SK0BXp010401 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:00:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [192.168.1.4] (c-71-196-218-99.hsd1.co.comcast.net[71.196.218.99]) by comcast.net (alnrmhc11) with SMTP id <20070128200006b11000t63ee>; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:00:06 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: References: <200701271430.l0REU1nk082184@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color names (getting OT) Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:00:05 -0700 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6a8b10da-0ff0-41a1-b5d4-ec86e45965ae X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BD00EB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:01:31 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Did anyone else hear the story on NPR yesterday about color? Apparently a lot of cultures don't have more than 2 or 3 words for different colors. Sylrog On Jan 28, 2007, at 12:53 PM, Jean Waddie wrote: > Gail & Scott Finke wrote >> >> >> I also once interviewed someone from the Pantone Institute, which is >> run by >> the Pantone company that puts together formulas for inks. She told >> me, very >> seriously, that green was the first color to appear in the universe. >> >> Those color people are a funny lot! >> >> Gail Finke >> > > I know there are linguistic studies that aim to show the cognitive > importance, if you like, of different colours by the order in which > languages develop them. You have to work on words for colours that > are not linked to the description of an object - orange or aubergine, > for example, just say "the colour of that thing". But all languages > have words for light and dark, black and white. I'm pretty sure the > next one is red, then green and blue interchangeably. So if a > language has a word for either green or blue, it must also have a word > for red - if it has no word for red, it can't have a word for green or > blue. I seem to remember it goes a bit random after that. > > So green may have been the first colour to appear, but red is the most > important one to identify and tell your friends about! > > Actually .... wouldn't there be volcanoes before plants? ;-) > > Jean > > > -- > Jean Waddie > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 15:03:22 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SK3LQ4025358 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:03:22 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SK2UTp015872 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:03:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SK2CKF061532 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:02:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SK2Asv011950; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:02:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc3-s24.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s24.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.224]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SK24HJ011784 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:02:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from laswa@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.133.116]) by bay0-omc3-s24.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:01:59 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:01:59 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 65.55.133.123 by by128fd.bay128.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:01:58 GMT X-Originating-IP: [75.50.250.157] X-Originating-Email: [laswa@hotmail.com] X-Sender: laswa@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: From: "zelda crusher" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:01:58 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Jan 2007 20:01:59.0018 (UTC) FILETIME=[2B2014A0:01C74317] X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1049; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f77cf9a9-b550-4470-b06d-be7444eba9bc X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BD0156.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:03:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I like the original tabs. Face it, the whole look is fussy, so it fits. Laurie >From: "Saragrace Knauf" >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: "h-costume" , "TheRenaissanceTailor" >, > >Subject: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? >Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:29:30 -0700 > >I'm not sure what I should do here. This bodice http://tinyurl.com/343la7 >is sort of a practice bodice. It is made from flocked fake silk taffeta >(barf - but it was the closest fabric I have found to give the right look.) >I found it at the last minute about a week ago at Jo Annes - it just >happened to match the silk taffeta of the skirt almost exactly. I am in the >process of having another embroidered to match the embroidery in the actual >picture. http://tinyurl.com/3bdc27 > >Annnnnyyyway - the question: > > >I may have to use the practice bodice if the other doesn't work out or is >not done in time for the presentation. > >The other bodice will require a peplum of sorts to which all the leaves are >attached. I did the same here and then experimented with no tabs, all the >tabs in the same pattern, and finally tabs made from "cabbage" - random >pieces of fabric. > >Part of me wants to leave it without tabs, because it looks fussy to me. >But >many of the bodices had these whacky shaped tabs, and the original >obviously >did too......sigh....decisions, decisions. > >What is your vote? Thanks for your opinions! > >Sg > > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _________________________________________________________________ Check out all that glitters with the MSN Entertainment Guide to the Academy Awards® http://movies.msn.com/movies/oscars2007/?icid=ncoscartagline2 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 16:20:00 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLJu3l027215 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:20:00 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SLJ9KO024906 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:19:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SLIWxg069360 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:18:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLISYN063928; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:18:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.206.25]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0SLIPHF063856 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:18:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 74280 invoked by uid 60001); 28 Jan 2007 21:18:19 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=Z34/E87brvPXiOuzeD6cFdZA16L0G9Nucu0gxBHvDi6ZHOBY0Y1nBmg7nmTxJ8DdXW3w6DvgpZAvaBNyrgvXxsEi5J0LpsFJAQGznHiVCLmwGOITB7yqjZxiJqsfVDt8AYY4/8heylJZVbyoWgxu7/bzW1VM8jxlNZsj4Ta9Ug0=; X-YMail-OSG: uRa.INQVM1lwcEclToNBAs_GgspYGlvHrX_gMqW2b7.jJLrVc7J9GuJUSQ6XZVfsxA-- Received: from [76.175.234.146] by web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:18:19 PST Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:18:19 -0800 (PST) From: MaggiRos Subject: RE: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <672510.73582.qm@web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=9% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 66a55c51-cf7a-4560-8ab8-0f081793e72d X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BD134D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:19:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Add my vote for tabs. It just looks more complete. MaggiRos --- zelda crusher wrote: > I like the original tabs. Face it, the whole look > is fussy, so it fits. > > Laurie > > > >From: "Saragrace Knauf" > >Reply-To: Historical Costume > >To: "h-costume" , > "TheRenaissanceTailor" > >, > > > >Subject: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? > >Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 09:29:30 -0700 > > > >I'm not sure what I should do here. This bodice > http://tinyurl.com/343la7 > >is sort of a practice bodice. It is made from > flocked fake silk taffeta > >(barf - but it was the closest fabric I have found > to give the right look.) > >I found it at the last minute about a week ago at > Jo Annes - it just > >happened to match the silk taffeta of the skirt > almost exactly. I am in the > >process of having another embroidered to match the > embroidery in the actual > >picture. http://tinyurl.com/3bdc27 > > > >Annnnnyyyway - the question: > > > > > >I may have to use the practice bodice if the other > doesn't work out or is > >not done in time for the presentation. > > > >The other bodice will require a peplum of sorts to > which all the leaves are > >attached. I did the same here and then experimented > with no tabs, all the > >tabs in the same pattern, and finally tabs made > from "cabbage" - random > >pieces of fabric. > > > >Part of me wants to leave it without tabs, because > it looks fussy to me. > >But > >many of the bodices had these whacky shaped tabs, > and the original > >obviously > >did too......sigh....decisions, decisions. > > > >What is your vote? Thanks for your opinions! > > > >Sg > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _________________________________________________________________ > Check out all that glitters with the MSN > Entertainment Guide to the Academy > Awards® > http://movies.msn.com/movies/oscars2007/?icid=ncoscartagline2 > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 16:44:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLi3D1027801 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:44:03 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SLhAkG024158 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:44:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SLgmhB071763 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:42:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLgkwY080142; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:42:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.89]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLggAC080064 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:42:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.17]) by bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:42:37 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:41:38 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV7.phx.gbl with DAV; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:41:35 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: <672510.73582.qm@web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:42:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:42:09 -0700 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Jan 2007 21:41:38.0486 (UTC) FILETIME=[172A7D60:01C74325] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] The Tabs Have it! Was: To Tab or not to Tab? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 461a5b5b-f928-4279-ab87-8cf566e17860 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BD18EE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:44:00 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Sounds like the symmetrical tabs have it. Thanks! ----- Original Message ----- From: "MaggiRos" To: Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 2:18 PM Subject: RE: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? > Add my vote for tabs. It just looks more complete. > > MaggiRos > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 16:46:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLkKbg027872 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:46:20 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SLjSXb002805 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:46:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SLj423072096 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:45:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLj3Ac081565; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:45:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc12.comcast.net (sccrmhc12.comcast.net [204.127.200.82]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLixUx081456 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:45:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from goofy4@comcast.net) Message-Id: <200701282145.l0SLixUx081456@net.indra.com> Received: from stuckis.comcast.net (c-71-207-16-152.hsd1.pa.comcast.net[71.207.16.152]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc12) with SMTP id <200701282144530120026bc0e>; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:44:54 +0000 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.1.0.9 Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:45:14 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Dianne & Greg Stucki Subject: Re: [h-cost]Colour names, was Need Help In-Reply-To: <30345522.1169831585792.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa. earthlink.net> References: <30345522.1169831585792.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 39e27857-c9e4-48d7-97ce-612e50eba19f X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BD1979.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:46:17 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 12:13 PM 1/26/2007, you wrote: >So my housemate got the job of making three bridesmaids' dresses in >two weeks from some OTHER color. I hope she charged them a hefty rush fee! Dianne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 16:53:59 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLrx4f028062 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:53:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SLrD2D005952 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:53:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SLqElY072751 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:52:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLqCmQ086287; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:52:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m20.mx.aol.com (imo-m20.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLq9kv086198 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:52:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.cc7.9505117 (41811) for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:51:52 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:51:50 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color names (getting OT) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=9% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: b7769d82-2c23-49f0-b252-48778a296fa9 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BD1B49.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:53:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/28/2007 2:56:10 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk writes: Actually .... wouldn't there be volcanoes before plants? ;-) And a sky and an ocean before there was any life. Blue anyone? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 16:55:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLsxkR028098 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:54:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0SLsCJE006312 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:54:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0SLrkig072925 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:53:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SLrjG7087268; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 14:53:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (root@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net [71.162.243.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0SKfjmt039132 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:41:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id l0SKlajp014342 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:47:36 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:50:09 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.5 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200701281550.09212.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: dc4bdf75-b959-4574-80f5-b50b9ec82228 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BD1B84.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 16:54:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Sunday 28 January 2007 3:01 pm, zelda crusher wrote: > I like the original tabs. Face it, the whole look is fussy, so it fits. I'm with the rest. The inspiration portrait had tabs, and I think the look would be slightly off without them; it's just a naturally "fussy" look. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 19:06:43 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T06hcU031434 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:06:43 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0T05pGO011307 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:06:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0T05DO7084877 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 17:05:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T052RN068097; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 17:05:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cgp.netins.net (f2phy.netins.net [167.142.229.65]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T04ffv067801 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 17:04:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from landofoz@netins.net) X-netINS-MPP: scanned Received: from [67.55.167.82] (account landofoz@netins.net HELO denise8541f2db) by cgpf2.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0.13) with ESMTPA id 1196667684 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:04:33 -0600 Message-ID: <041401c74339$13bbcc60$52a73743@denise8541f2db> From: "Land of Oz" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color names Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:04:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a4254c70-d7b7-44aa-bb81-2e535afd9494 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BD3A5F.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:06:39 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Of course scientifically, no one even knows if we see the same colors as > others. My brain interprets a certain wave length of electro-magnetic > energy as > green, but there's no way of knowing if your brain interprets it the same. > We > both call whatever we see at that wave length green, but do we "see" in > our > mind's eye the same thing? Oh, you bet! You should hear me go round and round with my daughter... "it's green" "no, it's blue" "green" "blue" GREEN BLUE! Usually, it's not even one of those wishy-washy turquoise or aqua colors, but we both see them differently. Neither of us is color blind, either. As for color vision itself, I've read that humans are able to distinguish more finely between shades of green than for any other color. The reason postulated was that as evolving herbivores/gatherers recognizing shades of green was more important for survival than other colors. Individuals with finely developed green discrimination presumably ate better. Denise Iowa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 20:28:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T1S06j001210 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:28:04 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0T1R7CZ001283 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:27:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0T1QLkH093046 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:26:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T1QE6L018026; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:26:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m17.mx.aol.com (imo-m17.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T1QAi2017950 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:26:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c9a.8b9cafc (40521) for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:26:03 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:26:01 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color names [Waaaaay OT] To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: cde2a01e-c68d-427b-b3eb-5c053ec1d0aa X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BD4D6C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:27:56 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/28/2007 7:06:22 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, landofoz@netins.net writes: Usually, it's not even one of those wishy-washy turquoise or aqua colors, but we both see them differently. Neither of us is color blind, either. As for color vision itself, I've read that humans are able to distinguish more finely between shades of green than for any other color. The reason postulated was that as evolving herbivores/gatherers recognizing shades of green was more important for survival than other colors. Individuals with finely developed green discrimination presumably ate better. Interesting. I was just reading about how the early mammals that survived after the demise of the dinosaurs and evolved into us [creationists....grow up!] were nocturnal and therefore had not so great color vision. More than likely, not great vision at all, like many nocturnal mammals today. Indeed many mammals today have bad eyesight. Your dog or cat see in very limited ways. Our color vision had to be "regained". Birds on the other hand did not have to go thru this evolutionary change since they more than likely came from dinosaurs that survived. Anyway, we as humans have 3 types of cones, the nerve endings that see color. [rods see contrast] Nocturnal animals sometime have only one or two. [but lots of rods!] Simplified, we have a blue cone, a green one and a red one. The gene for the blue cone is on our 7th chromosome so everybody gets one....well two, one from each parent. But the red and green genes are right next to each other on the x chromosome. And actually the red one "sees" into the green area and the green one "sees" into the red. It is thought one derives from the other during our evolution...which helps explain why they are next to each other and see into each other's areas. We see hues by the interaction of the 3 cones. All 3 are always involved. Theoretically, Richard Dawkins suggests, you could electrically stimulate just say the blue cone and see a super pure blue not to be seen in nature. Cool! Also, birds and I think animals like octopi and squid and some insects have 4 different cones...blue, red, green, and....what? These creatures can see very well indeed Also, there are 2 ways to be color-blind. The green cone or the red cone can be improperly copied and because the y chromosome in the male has no back up pair, like women do on their other x chromosome, the man is color-blind...red-green color-blind. The other way is for 2 red cones to appear or 2 green. Again with no back up pair, the man is again color-blind. This 2 of the same kind is really rare I think. Women who are as unfortunate to have 2 faulty sets of Red/green cones on each x chromosome will be color-blind. I love science! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 21:04:23 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T24NwU002030 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:04:23 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0T23aCf020453 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:04:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0T23AWD096610 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:03:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T238vC040660; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:03:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc15.comcast.net (sccrmhc15.comcast.net [63.240.77.85]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T235Rl040579 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:03:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc15) with SMTP id <2007012902025901500fbsfae>; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 02:03:00 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color names [Waaaaay OT] Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:03:05 -0500 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fce23d9b-3b5a-4eae-b7ff-0c9e4b9944ed X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BD55F8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:04:19 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 28, 2007, at 8:26 PM, AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 1/28/2007 7:06:22 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > landofoz@netins.net writes: > > Usually, it's not even one of those wishy-washy turquoise or aqua > colors, > but we both see them differently. Neither of us is color blind, > either. > > As for color vision itself, I've read that humans are able to > distinguish > more finely between shades of green than for any other color. The > reason > postulated was that as evolving herbivores/gatherers recognizing > shades of > green was more important for survival than other colors. > Individuals with > finely developed green discrimination presumably ate better. > I wonder if that's why shades of green seem to clash more than any other? Two blues that don't match can often look okay together; but the greens drive me crazy, because so many look terrible side-by- side. Is it just because we can see more fine variations? Lauren _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 21:16:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T2GL0O002296 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:16:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0T2FYgt027168 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:16:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0T2FBJN097844 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:15:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T2F9eN047979; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:15:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T2F6Rm047873 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 19:15:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:19:07 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C7434B.DABB9C48" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: color names (getting OT) Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:18:32 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC551@lynx.campus.muc.prv> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC551@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Re: color names (getting OT) thread-index: AcdDFwjpaLo8j+TeQ/Oz2LE7tLGGiwANLzCD References: <200701271430.l0REU1nk082184@net.indra.com> From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Jan 2007 02:19:07.0696 (UTC) FILETIME=[DADE5300:01C7434B] X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 165d3e85-4492-44df-98e3-c0f626dc8caa X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BD58C6.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:16:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C7434B.DABB9C48 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable But no people to make words before plants. =20 Patty ________________________________ From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com on behalf of Jean Waddie Sent: Sun 1/28/2007 2:53 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Re: color names (getting OT) Gail & Scott Finke wrote > > >I also once interviewed someone from the Pantone Institute, which is = run by >the Pantone company that puts together formulas for inks. She told me, = very >seriously, that green was the first color to appear in the universe. > >Those color people are a funny lot! > >Gail Finke > I know there are linguistic studies that aim to show the cognitive importance, if you like, of different colours by the order in which languages develop them. You have to work on words for colours that are not linked to the description of an object - orange or aubergine, for example, just say "the colour of that thing". But all languages have words for light and dark, black and white. I'm pretty sure the next one is red, then green and blue interchangeably. So if a language has a word for either green or blue, it must also have a word for red - if it has no word for red, it can't have a word for green or blue. I seem to remember it goes a bit random after that. So green may have been the first colour to appear, but red is the most important one to identify and tell your friends about! Actually .... wouldn't there be volcanoes before plants? ;-) Jean -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------_=_NextPart_001_01C7434B.DABB9C48 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------_=_NextPart_001_01C7434B.DABB9C48-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Jan 28 23:44:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T4htMr006383 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 23:43:59 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0T4h8uA006445 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 23:43:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0T4gG9t016920 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:42:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T4g8q3043614; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:42:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0T4g4p9043572 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:42:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=radiks.net; b=knOyTAmVRvkLiKBgf4gr9Ytutj/2kWA56cs5PGRyJJpB1FZEkn70Z3QmFkqecOWP; h=Received:Message-Id:X-Mailer:Date:To:From:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.81.2.235] (helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1HBOLD-0005ar-PB for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 28 Jan 2007 23:42:04 -0500 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20070128223621.0574b530@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 22:41:44 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200701290203.l0T239Yh040672@net.indra.com> References: <200701290203.l0T239Yh040672@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e53e09d0e0b1ffcb0a6f6b4d9b3aa1a93fdbba287e25e53deea350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.81.2.235 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Color perception [Waaaaay OT] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: c7e22ece-eabc-4b91-98d7-85df7a878980 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BD7B5C.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 28 Jan 2007 23:43:52 -0500 (EST) Status: RO And I once had a co-worker (male) who was both red-green AND blue-yellow color blind. We had to come up with creative ways to describe things, as he pretty much saw things in greyscale. His wife labeled all his clothes so things would match, and he wore lots of neutrals (black and khaki). Sandy At 08:03 PM 1/28/2007, you wrote: >Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 20:26:01 EST >From: AlbertCat@aol.com >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color names [Waaaaay OT] > >Simplified, we have a blue cone, a green one and a red one. The >gene for the blue cone is on our 7th chromosome so everybody gets >one....well two, one from each parent. But the red and green genes >are right next to >each other on the x chromosome. And actually the red one >"sees" into the green >area and the green one "sees" into the red. We see hues by >the interaction of the >3 cones. All 3 are always involved. --snip-- > Also, there are 2 ways to be color-blind. The green cone or the > red cone can >be improperly copied and because the y chromosome in the male has no back up >pair, like women do on their other x chromosome, the man is >color-blind...red-green color-blind. The other way is for 2 red >cones to appear or 2 green. >Again with no back up pair, the man is again color-blind. This 2 of the same >kind is really rare I think. Women who are as unfortunate to have 2 faulty >sets of Red/green cones on each x chromosome will be color-blind. > >I love science! "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 07:49:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TCnoiH013283 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 07:49:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0TCmwQc019113 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 07:49:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0TCmHp6065535 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 05:48:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TCmAGI034921; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 05:48:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TCm7kC034866 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 05:48:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-8.15) id AB5A136803A6; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:40:58 +0000 From: "Sharon Collier" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: color names [Waaaaay OT] Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 04:48:07 -0800 Message-ID: <001001c743a3$b9b7a8e0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 In-Reply-To: X-CommKal-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude for spam and viruses. X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0TCm7kC034866 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0faba908-dcdd-4f35-abbb-3451535e0565 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BDED3A.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 07:49:47 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Some very few, (only women), are able to see not only the normal colors, using red-blue-green cones, but an "additional" color cone is in their eyes. This enables them to see different shades of green. To most of us, two colors of green would be identical, but to them, the two would appear very different. Maybe you are one of those "4 color" people. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Lauren Walker Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 6:03 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color names [Waaaaay OT] On Jan 28, 2007, at 8:26 PM, AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 1/28/2007 7:06:22 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > landofoz@netins.net writes: > > Usually, it's not even one of those wishy-washy turquoise or aqua > colors, > but we both see them differently. Neither of us is color blind, > either. > > As for color vision itself, I've read that humans are able to > distinguish > more finely between shades of green than for any other color. The > reason > postulated was that as evolving herbivores/gatherers recognizing > shades of > green was more important for survival than other colors. > Individuals with > finely developed green discrimination presumably ate better. > I wonder if that's why shades of green seem to clash more than any other? Two blues that don't match can often look okay together; but the greens drive me crazy, because so many look terrible side-by- side. Is it just because we can see more fine variations? Lauren _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 14:19:12 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TJJCqi022466 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 14:19:12 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0TJIGTK027855 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 14:19:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0TJHQWh037135 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:17:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TJGc4Z034496; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:16:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TJGJKi033978 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:16:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC0F4BFA54 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:16:09 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45BE482B.6080408@reddawn.net> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:16:59 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7f86017a-cad2-4862-b79d-48f72425887e X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BE487C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 14:19:09 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I'm trying to figure out the dimensions for a late 17th or early 18th century man's cravat. I've got plenty of sources that say they tied around the neck in various ways, but not much else. Does anyone know how wide and how long the cloth is? Would it be wide enough to fold one or more times, or would it be worn as a single thickness? Did they wrap from the back and tie in front like a scarf, or were they wrapped across the throat in front, around the back, and then tied in front? Does anyone know of any photos of extant cravats other than the one in _Cut of Men's Clothes_? (And I think that one is just the lace ends, anyway, it looks far too short to tie around anything, but there's no indication of size or scale, so who can tell.) Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 15:00:09 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TK05ig023277 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:00:09 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0TJx8OM030295 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:00:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0TJwTOF046496 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:58:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TJvrVE081064; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:58:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m25.mx.aol.com (imo-m25.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.6]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TJuwoP079931 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:57:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m25.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.caa.993a332 (58435) for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 14:56:42 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 14:56:39 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1049; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=8% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 9c442f4b-b7c4-4c32-b310-eb920fa98066 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BE520F.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:00:02 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/29/2007 2:19:19 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, dawn@reddawn.net writes: I'm trying to figure out the dimensions for a late 17th or early 18th century man's cravat. ************ It is my understanding that it is a square of silk, which is then folded in various ways on the diagonal over a stock to support it, which is boned canvas or leather. This is where the wrapped up to the chin and bottom of the ears look comes from. The pointed ends of this square folded on the bias is what you see tied at the front of the neck....or sometimes they are tied or just crossed in front and brought to the braces and pinned there....under the waistcoat of course so you never see that. I think in some instances they can even be brought around under the arms and tied in the back! So the length can be quite long....it would equal the diagonal of the square. If you take a square yard, you get quite a long length on the diagonal from corner to corner. But it could even be bigger than a yard. As time progresses the folding changes to be more of a long strip [like in the 1840's] and then actually it is cut as a long bias strip....or on the straight like a ribbon by the 1860's. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 17:16:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TMG9wd026333 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:16:13 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0TMFH4D010715 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:16:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0TME5tD072357 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:14:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TMDsVU020272; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:13:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.23]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TKWZ0S017198 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:33:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-9.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.48]) by mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 29 Jan 2007 20:27:03 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAFLovUXUSnIwk2dsb2JhbACOTwEBAQEHDgcGHQ Received: from 88-107-34-126.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.34.126]:2614 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-9.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1HBd2u-000GFU-Iz for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:24:08 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070129202323.03601c38@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:26:43 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0031a692-a0e5-466b-9c75-215bb3f045b7 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BE71F5.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:16:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 19:56 29/01/2007, you wrote: > >In a message dated 1/29/2007 2:19:19 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >dawn@reddawn.net writes: > >I'm trying to figure out the dimensions for a late 17th or early 18th >century man's cravat. > > >************ > >It is my understanding that it is a square of silk, which is then folded in >various ways on the diagonal over a stock to support it, which is boned >canvas or leather. This is where the wrapped up to the chin and >bottom of the ears >look comes from. The pointed ends of this square folded on the bias is what >you see tied at the front of the neck....or sometimes they are tied or just >crossed in front and brought to the braces and pinned there....under the >waistcoat of course so you never see that. I think in >some instances they can even >be brought around under the arms and tied in the back! So the length can be >quite long....it would equal the diagonal of the square. If you >take a square >yard, you get quite a long length on the diagonal from corner to corner. But >it could even be bigger than a yard. >As time progresses the folding changes to be more of a long strip [like in >the 1840's] and then actually it is cut as a long bias strip....or on the >straight like a ribbon by the 1860's. No, no that is late 18th or early 19th century cravats. Early 18th century are just a length of fabric, usually about 60" long and as wide as you choose, in a very fine muslin or linen. You wrap it round, usually once only, tie in a loose knot, and often poke one end through a buttonhole, known as a Steinkirk, after a battle. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 17:37:08 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TMb81k026821 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:37:08 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0TMaG6g032682 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:37:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0TMZk12077684 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:35:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TMZe0P043858; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:35:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mail.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TMZbdq043739 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:35:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.bea.aaa8afa (58435) for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:35:22 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:35:20 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 rep=6% Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2ca550c4-84ef-48f6-bdb3-dd28ee795935 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BE76E0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:37:05 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/29/2007 5:15:31 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, suzi@suziclarke.co.uk writes: No, no that is late 18th or early 19th century cravats. Oops! I was skimming and just saw the "18" and thought 1800's. And it never occurred to me to call 18th century stocks a "cravat"...though I suppose that's OK. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 18:29:29 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TNTOAk027927 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:29:28 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0TNSW7Y021150 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:29:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0TNRgOf087837 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 16:27:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0TNRXL9095980; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 16:27:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web23401.mail.ird.yahoo.com (web23401.mail.ird.yahoo.com [217.146.189.86]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0TNRRQu095795 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 16:27:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from marquesate@yahoo.co.uk) Received: (qmail 28521 invoked by uid 60001); 29 Jan 2007 23:27:21 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.co.uk; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=4TkCMZ0KGfEr41fh0o+4fN3+v39HGR04Xq+scBj6khglV7J9ZuXBDA62mZ1zOZN+jHisx/nnE8t3WBf3oZGFRYl2GJHfeqlVidcDQFNDYUSYw2DvxSg7RVoa6uIffl8PnEcEiDzJrtfsm+LKJ7jXEQH/3HoAqUeskW26SbyfZwc=; X-YMail-OSG: OfK7JzsVM1l406B1X4KDgTO_A8kw7qPoxdOyuHJvribzz.x4IJyxcky.y.GY_LlBQh4uCAV8IYJGJqeaH0MtNryhhAiAM2YmuffIDE7H9no4xJhSAPe3_L7dADmxRHg7wfnGw_8EDU.I Received: from [83.105.84.119] by web23401.mail.ird.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 23:27:21 GMT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/368.3 YahooMailWebService/0.6.132.7 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 23:27:21 +0000 (GMT) From: N Kipar Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats To: Historical Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Message-ID: <504955.28337.qm@web23401.mail.ird.yahoo.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id l0TNRRQu095795 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 03019e95-e181-4e64-9832-91fd95f4684e X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BE8320.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:29:21 -0500 (EST) Status: RO The steenkirk was particularly fashionable in the 1690s but I wouldn't wear the cravat like that after 1700 and certainly not for the War of the Spanish Succession. Choose as fine a linen as you can, roll hem it, and choose a width and length that is comfortable. Preferrably folded lengthwise. You might also want to think about possible shaping of the ends, and of course needle lace. You'll find a few examples on my site: http://www.kipar.org/period-galleries/galleries_1700e.html http://www.kipar.org/period-galleries/galleries_1700p.html Nicole ----- Original Message ---- From: Suzi Clarke To: Historical Costume Sent: Monday, 29 January, 2007 8:26:43 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats At 19:56 29/01/2007, you wrote: > >In a message dated 1/29/2007 2:19:19 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >dawn@reddawn.net writes: > >I'm trying to figure out the dimensions for a late 17th or early 18th >century man's cravat. > > >************ > >It is my understanding that it is a square of silk, which is then folded in >various ways on the diagonal over a stock to support it, which is boned >canvas or leather. This is where the wrapped up to the chin and >bottom of the ears >look comes from. The pointed ends of this square folded on the bias is what >you see tied at the front of the neck....or sometimes they are tied or just >crossed in front and brought to the braces and pinned there....under the >waistcoat of course so you never see that. I think in >some instances they can even >be brought around under the arms and tied in the back! So the length can be >quite long....it would equal the diagonal of the square. If you >take a square >yard, you get quite a long length on the diagonal from corner to corner. But >it could even be bigger than a yard. >As time progresses the folding changes to be more of a long strip [like in >the 1840's] and then actually it is cut as a long bias strip....or on the >straight like a ribbon by the 1860's. No, no that is late 18th or early 19th century cravats. Early 18th century are just a length of fabric, usually about 60" long and as wide as you choose, in a very fine muslin or linen. You wrap it round, usually once only, tie in a loose knot, and often poke one end through a buttonhole, known as a Steinkirk, after a battle. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 19:40:19 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U0eD8w029320 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:40:17 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0U0dJPj027490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:40:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0U0cb8b003384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:38:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U0cVrY063993; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:38:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (mail.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U0cRkR063905 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:38:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.180] (pm5-180.eos.net [205.133.149.180]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id l0U0c1Wr012893 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:38:14 -0500 (EST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:20:06 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200701290203.l0T239Yh040672@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: color X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 820f3e7d-0bc2-41b2-9eec-e5a9f59f4cfb X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BE93B7.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:40:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Jean wrote: > > I know there are linguistic studies that aim to show the cognitive > importance, if you like, of different colours by the order in which > languages develop them. You have to work on words for colours that are > not linked to the description of an object - orange or aubergine, for > example, just say "the colour of that thing". But all languages have > words for light and dark, black and white. I'm pretty sure the next one > is red, then green and blue interchangeably. So if a language has a > word for either green or blue, it must also have a word for red - if it > has no word for red, it can't have a word for green or blue. I seem to > remember it goes a bit random after that. > > So green may have been the first colour to appear, but red is the most > important one to identify and tell your friends about! > > Actually .... wouldn't there be volcanoes before plants? ;-) > > Jean Linguistic studies aside, the woman was talking about which color was created (or evolved) first and she said it was green because of plants. No color before plants. Even if you don't think of black and white as colors, I thought that yellow must have come first (sunlight). And of course as you say red and orange -- fire, volcanoes, etc. But she was adamant on green. Gail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 20:56:15 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U1uBhU030827 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:56:15 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0U1tEEP012534 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:56:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0U1sXqi016830 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:54:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U1sRSs023253; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:54:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com (nz-out-0506.google.com [64.233.162.239]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U1sOdw023219 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:54:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id m7so1639894nzf for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:54:24 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=roJTc6k2tt5VJlt9Wgm1ksgULyLqVvc+GJvp+JKwO5QALK7LnoZzbI+GVKLpiqvudHe7l1eRTMCTx4px/MKdXadii4J3rAdFfU/m6egvVxknIATHq7h/bgHuPSjxJLk3Wb4ITU3I0Z6+ZOrs0y8VFtR4hUNJ+HSOuMc7OXssB3c= Received: by 10.65.177.6 with SMTP id e6mr11008871qbp.1170122062543; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:54:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.65.196.15 with HTTP; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:54:22 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:54:22 -0800 From: Cin To: h-cost MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Color perception [Waaaaay OT] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: d8e2a798-a5e0-4529-960f-7cc861c8ec63 X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 45BEA582.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:56:08 -0500 (EST) Status: RO >I once had a co-worker (male) who was both red-green AND >blue-yellow color blind. We had to come up with creative ways to So's my father, the fine arts photography major. My mom always approved his suit & tie selections. You could always tell when my folks were having a tiff. Daddy would come home from work badly matched! >describe things, as he pretty much saw things in greyscale. His wife >labeled all his clothes so things would match, and he wore lots of >neutrals (black and khaki). My very good friend who is blind uses a system we invented for her clothes. We call it GrrMonsters (after the old children's line - GrrAnimals). We just use all ribbons in varying widths and textures (pico edge, grosgrain, satin, double face satin). So, all pico-edge 1/4" ribbon GrrMonsters go together. The monster mostly indicates the color scheme. Mummy is those neutrals & beiges. Kraken is the deep sea colors like aquamarine. Nyarlathotep is jungle green & coral. Now to add some h-costume content: I finally got pictures of my early Stuart gown and the crazy wig when I wore it this weekend. http://new.photos.yahoo.com/hysteria95126/album Look for the Stuart gown album. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 22:22:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3MmY3032612 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:22:49 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0U3Luch028260 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:22:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0U3LPEi034813 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:21:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3LMZu092424; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:21:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3LIrK092335 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:21:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c69.a7d8782 (57317) for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:21:08 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:21:06 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5359 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: eecf65d2-62c3-49b1-a422-85ac546bbcdd X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BEB9D4.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:22:45 -0500 (EST) Status: RO In a message dated 1/29/2007 7:39:37 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, gailscott@eos.net writes: first and she said it was green because of plants I believe the earliest form of chlorophyll was red. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 22:39:42 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3dgIL000600 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:39:42 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0U3cr1v013329 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:39:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0U3cPt0036490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:38:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3cNh9004514; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:38:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52208.mail.yahoo.com (web52208.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.131]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l0U3cK6q004422 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:38:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from childishwhims@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 78276 invoked by uid 60001); 30 Jan 2007 03:38:14 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=an8eW86HJ0bd+lq8uM7w4BifIRB7/hXXUtYMRk/49cSkCia8f1vkZ/jxbhkLvhX/ESTo3zZZYk5Umt9i0eViM3K+u5ivwPRNC8l3M/QemmH9/hY54yYd8bOjeTPOwRjVvqfV0aJJhYCo9Hq3X6N9uqsiIM6PrYWXZ0+sfSoFSoM= ; Message-ID: <20070130033814.78274.qmail@web52208.mail.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: MCf1lKwVM1klOBYLpYtdASG9LSy1p4gWseTt2hCtBzbSZFwx71dgBcCNOIhm2ZzKyDA9NPlrJFj7C3yuyRXiUGyiUqMU2dc.1cbd4SyAPn1gk50Vh5ls Received: from [64.136.49.226] by web52208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:38:14 PST X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/368.3 YahooMailWebService/0.6.132.7 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:38:14 -0800 (PST) From: Teena Robertson Subject: Re: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? To: Historical Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 2af15dc0-4920-431e-98f6-646a8768b610 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BEBDCD.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:39:39 -0500 (EST) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id l0U3dgIL000600 Status: RO I don't respond on here very often but I personally like it better with the tabs. Teena R. ----- Original Message ---- From: Saragrace Knauf To: h-costume ; TheRenaissanceTailor ; thefrazzledfrau@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 10:29:30 AM Subject: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? I'm not sure what I should do here. This bodice http://tinyurl.com/343la7 is sort of a practice bodice. It is made from flocked fake silk taffeta (barf - but it was the closest fabric I have found to give the right look.) I found it at the last minute about a week ago at Jo Annes - it just happened to match the silk taffeta of the skirt almost exactly. I am in the process of having another embroidered to match the embroidery in the actual picture. http://tinyurl.com/3bdc27 Annnnnyyyway - the question: I may have to use the practice bodice if the other doesn't work out or is not done in time for the presentation. The other bodice will require a peplum of sorts to which all the leaves are attached. I did the same here and then experimented with no tabs, all the tabs in the same pattern, and finally tabs made from "cabbage" - random pieces of fabric. Part of me wants to leave it without tabs, because it looks fussy to me. But many of the bodices had these whacky shaped tabs, and the original obviously did too......sigh....decisions, decisions. What is your vote? Thanks for your opinions! Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ____________________________________________________________________________________ Cheap talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. http://voice.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 22:43:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3heb1000702 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:43:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0U3gmY3014623 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:43:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0U3gNwM036895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:42:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3gMOk007204; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:42:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from vms044pub.verizon.net (vms044pub.verizon.net [206.46.252.44]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3gIXR007144 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:42:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dragonmatchlock@verizon.net) Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([72.83.98.167]) by vms044.mailsrvcs.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JCN00G72WY8YVW5@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 21:42:11 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:42:05 -0500 From: "David S. Mallinak" Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats In-reply-to: <45BE482B.6080408@reddawn.net> To: Historical Costume Message-id: <45BEBE8D.3010104@verizon.net> Organization: Red Dragon Bridge Enterprises, Ltd. MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <45BE482B.6080408@reddawn.net> User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 233a9a0b-ba2d-4b65-8a26-2876c6a1747c X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BEBEB8.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:43:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dawn wrote: > I'm trying to figure out the dimensions for a late 17th or early 18th > century man's cravat. I've got plenty of sources that say they tied > around the neck in various ways, but not much else. Does anyone know > how wide and how long the cloth is? Would it be wide enough to fold > one or more times, or would it be worn as a single thickness? Did they > wrap from the back and tie in front like a scarf, or were they wrapped > across the throat in front, around the back, and then tied in front? > > Does anyone know of any photos of extant cravats other than the one in > _Cut of Men's Clothes_? (And I think that one is just the lace ends, > anyway, it looks far too short to tie around anything, but there's no > indication of size or scale, so who can tell.) It has been a long time since I read it, but its: Collars, Stocks, and Cravat by Doriece Colle Rodale Press, Inc. 1972 72840 005 7 Your humble and obedient servant, David S Mallinak _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Jan 29 22:48:58 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3msHB000830 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:48:54 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0U3m77i005502 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:48:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0U3ljqn037339 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:47:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3lhqg010577; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:47:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com (nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com [207.115.36.44]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U3ld7r010454 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:47:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.63.224] Received: from [192.168.1.103] (adsl-69-107-63-224.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.63.224]) by nlpi015.sbcis.sbc.com (8.13.8 out.dk.spool/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0U3l4j4028316 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 21:47:05 -0600 Message-ID: <45BEC065.604@frys.com> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 19:49:57 -0800 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? References: <20070130033814.78274.qmail@web52208.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20070130033814.78274.qmail@web52208.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=21% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 5ebfb62c-396a-4e9d-bb93-139c5af01a7f X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BEBFF7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:48:51 -0500 (EST) Status: RO > Part of me wants to leave it without tabs, because it looks fussy to me. But > many of the bodices had these whacky shaped tabs, and the original obviously > did too......sigh....decisions, decisions. > > What is your vote? Thanks for your opinions! They're stupid, but leave them on. It looks even more stupid without them, IMHO. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 08:14:44 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDEeLR009209 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:14:44 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UDDk0R022639 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:14:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UDD9gX096020 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:13:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDD0wc082326; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:13:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (jaguar.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDCtDg082203 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:12:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:16:57 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C74470.EB16A2E8" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: color Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:14:14 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC557@lynx.campus.muc.prv> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC557@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Re: color thread-index: AcdEB6gsVwlv1DvvRh6XmyIqMGRPbAAaOHkS References: From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2007 13:16:57.0639 (UTC) FILETIME=[EB336B70:01C74470] X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: cacf1981-9bc7-4892-86d7-79179457d897 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BF448B.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:14:36 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C74470.EB16A2E8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Are there colors if there's nothing to "see" them? No oxygen before = plants. (Theology aside - and back to the tree falling in the forest = making or not making a sound) =20 Patty ________________________________ From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com on behalf of Gail & Scott Finke Sent: Mon 1/29/2007 7:20 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Re: color=20 Jean wrote: > > I know there are linguistic studies that aim to show the cognitive > importance, if you like, of different colours by the order in which > languages develop them. You have to work on words for colours that = are > not linked to the description of an object - orange or aubergine, for > example, just say "the colour of that thing". But all languages have > words for light and dark, black and white. I'm pretty sure the next = one > is red, then green and blue interchangeably. So if a language has a > word for either green or blue, it must also have a word for red - if = it > has no word for red, it can't have a word for green or blue. I seem = to > remember it goes a bit random after that. > > So green may have been the first colour to appear, but red is the most > important one to identify and tell your friends about! > > Actually .... wouldn't there be volcanoes before plants? ;-) > > Jean Linguistic studies aside, the woman was talking about which color was created (or evolved) first and she said it was green because of plants. = No color before plants. Even if you don't think of black and white as = colors, I thought that yellow must have come first (sunlight). And of course as = you say red and orange -- fire, volcanoes, etc. But she was adamant on = green. Gail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------_=_NextPart_001_01C74470.EB16A2E8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------_=_NextPart_001_01C74470.EB16A2E8-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 08:17:04 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDH4OZ009280 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:17:04 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UDGAJr021502 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:17:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UDFRG5096275 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:15:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDFQFR084060; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:15:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from webmail.muc.edu (webmail.muc.edu [199.18.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDFNhX083939 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:15:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from RICKARPA@muc.edu) Received: from lynx.campus.muc.prv ([172.16.100.248]) by webmail.muc.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:19:26 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C74471.43B8A460" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: color Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:18:59 -0500 Message-ID: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC558@lynx.campus.muc.prv> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: <18037059078CE14C97E74A4F59DD7B1B9EC558@lynx.campus.muc.prv> Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Re: color thread-index: AcdEHmAbks4sWunjQ8yV5yFi/NqRUAAUtPQ7 References: From: "Rickard, Patty " To: "Historical Costume" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2007 13:19:26.0310 (UTC) FILETIME=[43D0D060:01C74471] X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a281fb05-3382-4f14-96c9-d719e6a8910f X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BF451A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:17:01 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C74471.43B8A460 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Wouldn't that be hemoglobin? ________________________________ From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com on behalf of AlbertCat@aol.com Sent: Mon 1/29/2007 10:21 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color=20 In a message dated 1/29/2007 7:39:37 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,=20 gailscott@eos.net writes: first and she said it was green because of plants I believe the earliest form of chlorophyll was red. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------_=_NextPart_001_01C74471.43B8A460 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------_=_NextPart_001_01C74471.43B8A460-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 08:42:14 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDgEZc009834 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:42:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UDfQHB025417 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:42:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UDf1Ln099454 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:41:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDexaZ003643; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:40:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep35.mail.dk (fep35.mail.dk [80.160.76.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UDetZ9003536 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 06:40:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep41.mail.dk ([195.41.46.142]) by fep35.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070130134049.RVEV7593.fep35.mail.dk@fep41.mail.dk> for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:40:49 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.161.20.199]) by fep41.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070130134049.DDZS20909.fep41.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:40:49 +0100 Message-ID: <001901c74474$52a63d70$c714a150@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45BE482B.6080408@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:41:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep41.mail.dk from [80.161.20.199] at Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:40:43 +0100 X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e8f14868-b597-464b-8e57-e67d9d33690c X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BF4B07.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:42:10 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Dear Dawn. If you have a nice lace, you can make a short cravat wrapped arround a necktie or stock. They used to love needle laces in those days, especially venetian needlelaces, wich are rather thick and stiff. Sew the lace to a piece of linnen, same width as your lace and then catch it over a longer necktie. Do you understand my meaning? Bjarne . ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 8:16 PM Subject: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats > I'm trying to figure out the dimensions for a late 17th or early 18th > century man's cravat. I've got plenty of sources that say they tied around > the neck in various ways, but not much else. Does anyone know how wide and > how long the cloth is? Would it be wide enough to fold one or more times, > or would it be worn as a single thickness? Did they wrap from the back and > tie in front like a scarf, or were they wrapped across the throat in > front, around the back, and then tied in front? > > Does anyone know of any photos of extant cravats other than the one in > _Cut of Men's Clothes_? (And I think that one is just the lace ends, > anyway, it looks far too short to tie around anything, but there's no > indication of size or scale, so who can tell.) > > > > > Dawn > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 09:48:21 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UEmL1Y011291 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:48:21 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UElC1t020849 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:48:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UEfA30011815 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 07:41:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UEf64G065546; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 07:41:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UEf2fQ065468 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 07:41:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=ffHud5GyXlSbTAEVeCt6C+yu0HMB602UipuQK5MGK9RAPUVPDbwXuZOAQG/4LSFl; h=Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:To:Subject:Mime-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [209.86.224.27] (helo=mswamui-billy.atl.sa.earthlink.net) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1HBuAQ-0004f4-3X for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:41:02 -0500 Received: from 12.39.255.227 by webmail.atl.earthlink.net with HTTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:41:01 -0500 Message-ID: <22567100.1170168062125.JavaMail.root@mswamui-billy.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:41:01 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: ruthanneb@mindspring.com To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: EarthLink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-ELNK-Trace: 3ad22d0308f02f3c21b586f7ff62647d40683398e744b8a43ebad592c6006b34c3ea7b24fbd5b375548b785378294e88350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 209.86.224.27 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 08602545-c2aa-478e-9093-7c9560138e5a X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BF5A81.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:48:18 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I like the tabs too. At first I thought I preferred the "cabbage" tabs, but on reflection the matching tabs seem better, although a little dark because of the fabric design. Yes, fussy, but in a really interesting--you could almost say "witty"--way! --Ruth Anne Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer -----Original Message----- >From: Teena Robertson >Sent: Jan 29, 2007 10:38 PM >To: Historical Costume >Subject: Re: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? > >I don't respond on here very often but I personally like it better with the tabs. > Teena R. > > >----- Original Message ---- >From: Saragrace Knauf >To: h-costume ; TheRenaissanceTailor ; thefrazzledfrau@yahoogroups.com >Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 10:29:30 AM >Subject: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? > > >I'm not sure what I should do here. This bodice http://tinyurl.com/343la7 >is sort of a practice bodice. It is made from flocked fake silk taffeta >(barf - but it was the closest fabric I have found to give the right look.) >I found it at the last minute about a week ago at Jo Annes - it just >happened to match the silk taffeta of the skirt almost exactly. I am in the >process of having another embroidered to match the embroidery in the actual >picture. http://tinyurl.com/3bdc27 > >Annnnnyyyway - the question: > > >I may have to use the practice bodice if the other doesn't work out or is >not done in time for the presentation. > >The other bodice will require a peplum of sorts to which all the leaves are >attached. I did the same here and then experimented with no tabs, all the >tabs in the same pattern, and finally tabs made from "cabbage" - random >pieces of fabric. > >Part of me wants to leave it without tabs, because it looks fussy to me. But >many of the bodices had these whacky shaped tabs, and the original obviously >did too......sigh....decisions, decisions. > >What is your vote? Thanks for your opinions! > >Sg > > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > >____________________________________________________________________________________ >Cheap talk? >Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. >http://voice.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 10:21:40 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UFLe12012024 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 10:21:40 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UFKpXt009765 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 10:21:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UFJ2je018329 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:19:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UFIxSJ007260; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:18:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-36.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UFIsAa007169 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 08:18:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13978BFBF4 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:18:51 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45BF6212.5030901@reddawn.net> Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:19:46 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Christmas gift exchange References: <1e6527830612271700i16ef537ejb71c4998b9c74b57@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <1e6527830612271700i16ef537ejb71c4998b9c74b57@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-Servercave-Metrics: net.indra.com 1183; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 6eb07161-5b63-4448-a855-caabf6c10e71 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BF6253.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 10:21:37 -0500 (EST) Status: RO jordana robinson wrote: > i haven't received anything yet, but i'm hoping it is there when i go > back to work next tuesday! > -jordana > __________________ Jordana, Did you get your package? Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 13:08:52 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UI8qx5016471 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 13:08:52 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UI7wqx001318 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 13:08:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UI6TuV053575 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 11:06:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UI6CaQ016175; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 11:06:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UI656o016063 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 11:06:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA24124 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 12:55:07 -0600 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 12:55:07 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Recent book: 18th c. calico trade X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 23bfc34b-3f67-47eb-a41d-06428151d972 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BF897E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 13:08:49 -0500 (EST) Status: RO My librarian friend alerted me to this: Vicente, Marta V. Clothing the Spanish Empire : families and the calico trade in the early modern Atlantic world / Marta V. Vicente. (The Americas in the early modern Atlantic world) Palgrave Macmillan. 1403972265. 9781403972262. R2-623549. 2006. US. USD65.00 http://www.palgrave-usa.com/catalog/product.aspx?isbn=1403972265 --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 14:00:17 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UJ0Gfx018554 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:00:16 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UIxOZf003146 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:00:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UIwioP062467 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 11:58:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UIwYUT082630; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 11:58:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.189]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UIwRfu082456 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 11:58:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mylaar@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so293452nfe for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 10:58:26 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=jj3ZRRm6zcVVCIpTiTin/NerWepVT0qlQXmDAk/NBIb9EbtTJ/qIIu6rZWOkRBFecjVL72AlDk3WiTfq5EV1eLdtQWKFRyHLn3Okuwfepi0qE1tgGB7aN9L0lN7IjpCnts2jQhJ6QlO88/pKQwDNWGhAyYA39064n/2M93RKHw8= Received: by 10.48.14.4 with SMTP id 4mr1257125nfn.1170183506476; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 10:58:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.67.26.20 with HTTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 10:58:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1e6527830701301058r2a13312dm9b8867aa6a1cb87d@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 12:58:26 -0600 From: "jordana robinson" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Christmas gift exchange In-Reply-To: <45BF6212.5030901@reddawn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <1e6527830612271700i16ef537ejb71c4998b9c74b57@mail.gmail.com> <45BF6212.5030901@reddawn.net> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 132d326a-0060-428e-a0d6-010a39c780a2 X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45BF958C.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:00:13 -0500 (EST) Status: RO yes, i did eventually get it. i'm sorry that i forgot to update the list. thanks for organizing the swap. On 1/30/07, Dawn wrote: > jordana robinson wrote: > > > i haven't received anything yet, but i'm hoping it is there when i go > > back to work next tuesday! > > -jordana > > __________________ > > Jordana, > > Did you get your package? > > > Dawn > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 14:28:15 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UJSEDg019216 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:28:14 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UJRRlZ005957 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:28:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UJQbfT066861 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 12:26:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UJQTlo015092; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 12:26:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep30.mail.dk (fep30.mail.dk [80.160.76.194]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UJQNvH014848 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 12:26:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from fep43.mail.dk ([195.41.46.226]) by fep30.mail.dk (InterMail vM.7.05.02.01 201-2174-114-102-20060817) with ESMTP id <20070130192615.JSLA5700.fep30.mail.dk@fep43.mail.dk> for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 20:26:15 +0100 Received: from CPQ21932199711 ([80.164.110.124]) by fep43.mail.dk (InterMail vG.2.02.00.00 201-2161-120-101-20051020) with ESMTP id <20070130192615.RKPI21862.fep43.mail.dk@CPQ21932199711> for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 20:26:15 +0100 Message-ID: <002601c744a4$9accb220$7c6ea450@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D96402373D8E@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 20:26:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at fep43.mail.dk from [80.164.110.124] at Tue, 30 Jan 2007 20:26:11 +0100 X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1049; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 0932a217-59e4-4a1a-9d04-a70a40021929 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BF9C1F.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:28:11 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Hi, Thanks for your feedbacks about this. As there are examples with both, ill stick to the center back seam after all. That is the easyest to do, as i have 2 embroidered pieces each 140 cm wide. Thanks again. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 7:22 PM Subject: [h-cost] question about robe anglaise. > Hi Bjarne! > > I've recently done a c1776 robe anglaise, which is ~20 years before your > dress, so take my references with a grain of salt. > >>From a brief flip though my documentation binder, it seems very common to >>have side-back seams in the skirt - which fall approximately mid-way >>between the side seam and the CB area. > (Center back seams for the skirt were unusual, but I did find one > example.) It is my conjecture that the standard skirt construction was 5 > fabric widths: 2 for the front and side and one full width for the center > back. > > Here are the useful sources I had: > > 1) The closed robe in _Fitting and Proper_ has 2 side/side-back seams on > each side of the skirt between the CB and the seam where on an open robe > the front opening would start. Note, this dress, unlike yours, has the CB > of the bodice in one piece with the CB skirt panel. > > 2) The open robe anglaise on page 24 of _Fitting and Proper_ also has 2 > seams in the skirt between the CF opening and the CB. Again, note that > this dress, unlike yours, has the CB of the bodice in one piece with the > CB skirt panel. > > 3) 1770-85 Polonaise gown on page 37 of _Patterns of Fashion_ - has > separate CB bodice and skirt panels. This is the only instance I found > with a CB seam in the skirt. > > 4) None of the robe anglaise with separate back bodice and back skirt > panels (for the 1776 era) in _Costume in Detail_ have center back seams - > Bradfield's seam line notations imply that their construction is the same > 5 panel skirt construction described above. > > 5) The 1775-85 dress on page 40 of _Patterns of Fashion_ also has the 5 > panel construction without CB skirt seam. > > Hope this helps, > -s > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 16:05:58 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UL5rZJ021077 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:05:57 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UL4xDO023814 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:05:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UL45AG081869 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:04:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UL3vdN026086; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:03:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from relay2.netspeed.com.au (relay4.netspeed.com.au [202.78.47.24]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UL3mIF025893 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:03:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from garden@netspeed.com.au) Received: from netspeed.com.au (unverified [202.78.47.28]) by NSmailstor (SurgeMail 3.8f) with ESMTP id 9993519-1803867 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:03:33 +1100 Received: from [192.168.0.4] (unverified [210.11.146.213]) by NSmailstor (SurgeMail 3.8g) with ESMTP id 89500378-1803868 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 07:54:51 +1100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) In-Reply-To: <45BEBE8D.3010104@verizon.net> References: <45BE482B.6080408@reddawn.net> <45BEBE8D.3010104@verizon.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: garden@netspeed.com.au Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:03:46 +1100 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-X-Authenticated-User: garden@netspeed.com.au X-X-SpamDetect: : 0.000000 X-Info: aspam skipped due to (g_smite_skip_auth) X-IP-stats: Incoming Last 0, First 3, in=18, out=0, spam=0 Known=true ip=210.11.146.213 X-Originating-IP: 210.11.146.213 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 07f12e1c-d5fa-4ce8-a683-1c72d589221b X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BFB2FB.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:05:50 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Its a little late, but Late Georgian Costume: The tailors Friendly Instructor (1822) By J Wyatt and The Art of Tying the Cravat (1828) By H Le Blanc is available from Lacis if you're interested. I make my linen cravats 55" long and 10" wide. Cheers, Aylwen Garden http://www.regencyreproductions.com http://www.earthlydelights.com.au On 30/01/2007, at 2:42 PM, David S. Mallinak wrote: > Dawn wrote: >> I'm trying to figure out the dimensions for a late 17th or early >> 18th century man's cravat. I've got plenty of sources that say >> they tied around the neck in various ways, but not much else. Does >> anyone know how wide and how long the cloth is? Would it be wide >> enough to fold one or more times, or would it be worn as a single >> thickness? Did they wrap from the back and tie in front like a >> scarf, or were they wrapped across the throat in front, around the >> back, and then tied in front? >> >> Does anyone know of any photos of extant cravats other than the >> one in _Cut of Men's Clothes_? (And I think that one is just the >> lace ends, anyway, it looks far too short to tie around anything, >> but there's no indication of size or scale, so who can tell.) > It has been a long time since I read it, but its: > Collars, Stocks, and Cravat > by Doriece Colle > Rodale Press, Inc. 1972 > 72840 005 7 > > Your humble and obedient servant, > David S Mallinak > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 16:50:39 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ULocUM021977 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:50:38 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0ULnnuR013872 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:50:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ULnF8u088472 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:49:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ULn66r074540; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:49:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0U6nUU4024189 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2007 23:50:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from heather.jones@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=c3Bwy7/M+yY+xdIv4NEzHAlD5u8bUS2NTCibDemt7Iuz30DcZPtDzZkJ2jWl3PeR; h=Received:Mime-Version:In-Reply-To:References:Content-Type:Message-Id:Content-Transfer-Encoding:From:Subject:Date:To:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.234.160] (helo=[10.0.1.3]) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1HBmo6-0004vW-Ch for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 01:49:30 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <78CABB09-9E42-4822-9D44-84CFEB86BADA@earthlink.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: color Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:51:38 -0800 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-ELNK-Trace: c920284270743d76aa459df8244ac33774bf435c0eb9d478e09d0e0b1ffcb0a6f5a45c8ed9800de9fba79e80a465c6ca350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.234.160 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: da5fb1b7-7d4d-4a8a-8550-8d2dfec2cdcb X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45BFBD7D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:50:35 -0500 (EST) Status: RO On Jan 29, 2007, at 7:21 PM, AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 1/29/2007 7:39:37 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > gailscott@eos.net writes: > > first and she said it was green because of plants > > > I believe the earliest form of chlorophyll was red. The amusing thing in this philosophical exercise is that color _categories_ don't have any objective existence -- they are an epiphenomenon of the physiological structure of light-perceiving organs. To clarify: light wavelengths have objective existence, but the concept that a particular range of wavelengths, albeit with fuzzy boundaries, constitutes the color "red" or "green" is a function of the particular sensitivities of retinal cells. Before the existence of eyes and brains, there were no color categories to precede or follow each other. Heather _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 18:03:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UN2xv5023925 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 18:03:03 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UN2AIS008543 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 18:02:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0UN1ZHx099737 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:01:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UN1PtO054565; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:01:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-61.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UN1KwM054398 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:01:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC627BFCD2 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 17:01:14 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <45BFCE72.305@reddawn.net> Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 17:02:10 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] speaking of lace X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: e8304245-98ed-4d4f-9c23-73b621109d66 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BFCE74.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO This story on traditional handmade Polish lace caught my eye. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6312429.stm "Artisans who used to create gowns and altar cloths for customers such as the late Pope now craft G-strings and other lingerie for sale all over the world. They say the underwear is quicker to make and easier to sell than traditional goods such as tablecloths. " I'm sorry to see the traditional demand is down, but glad to know they can find a modern market rather than let the craft die. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 18:50:20 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0UNoA8S025217 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 18:50:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0UNnHOF027125 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 18:50:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0ULnBdI088456 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:49:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ULn0dp074359; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:49:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0ULluug073363 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:48:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-9.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.48]) by mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 30 Jan 2007 21:40:38 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAN5Lv0XUSnIwk2dsb2JhbACOUAEBAQcOBwUe Received: from 88-107-34-126.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.34.126]:2805 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-9.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1HC0g2-000HFb-Ot for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:38:06 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070130213926.0360a340@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:40:36 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] early 18th century cravats In-Reply-To: References: <45BE482B.6080408@reddawn.net> <45BEBE8D.3010104@verizon.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: a09c9209-7926-4ae5-a263-83beb9d2bd42 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45BFD97E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 18:50:07 -0500 (EST) Status: RO At 21:03 30/01/2007, you wrote: >Its a little late, but >Late Georgian Costume: >The tailors Friendly Instructor (1822) By J Wyatt >and >The Art of Tying the Cravat (1828) >By H Le Blanc > >is available from Lacis if you're interested. I make my linen cravats >55" long and 10" wide. Wrong period - not even Regency by the time these books were published. I have them too - not really suitable for early 18th century at all. Suzi >>>I'm trying to figure out the dimensions for a late 17th or early >>>18th century man's cravat. I've got plenty of sources that say >>>they tied around the neck in various ways, but not much else. Does >>>anyone know how wide and how long the cloth is? Would it be wide >>>enough to fold one or more times, or would it be worn as a single >>>thickness? Did they wrap from the back and tie in front like a >>>scarf, or were they wrapped across the throat in front, around the >>>back, and then tied in front? >>> >>>Does anyone know of any photos of extant cravats other than the >>>one in _Cut of Men's Clothes_? (And I think that one is just the >>>lace ends, anyway, it looks far too short to tie around anything, >>>but there's no indication of size or scale, so who can tell.) >>It has been a long time since I read it, but its: >> Collars, Stocks, and Cravat >> by Doriece Colle >> Rodale Press, Inc. 1972 >> 72840 005 7 >> >>Your humble and obedient servant, >>David S Mallinak >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Jan 30 21:58:05 2007 Return-Path: Received: from psyche.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0V2vuQU028944 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:58:01 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psyche.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0V2v95M012980 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:57:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0V2uKd5028321 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 19:56:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0V2theo093898; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 19:55:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (mail.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0V2tVQs093728 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 19:55:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.153] (pm5-153.eos.net [205.133.149.153]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id l0V2tWWr028805 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:55:33 -0500 (EST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 22:37:42 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] re: to tab or not to tab X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 198d5d33-83a6-4b40-b8f1-29bca0d46a07 X-Miltered: at psyche with ID 45C00585.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (psyche.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:57:53 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I don't know what is supposed to look stupid here. I like the tabs. And I like the ones that don't match better than the ones that do -- the matchy ones look "costumey" to me and the random ones look more real. Oh well, I may be tacky but I guess I'm period! Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 31 08:34:32 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VDYWra004650 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:34:32 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0VDXinu018695 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:34:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0VDXCmg003883 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 06:33:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VDWD0s094554; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 06:33:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s10.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s10.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.146]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VDVCe9093501 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 06:32:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.55.138.22]) by bay0-omc2-s10.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2668); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 05:31:07 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 05:31:07 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 216.160.217.110 by BAY133-DAV12.phx.gbl with DAV; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 13:31:04 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.160.217.110] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "Historical Costume" References: <45BFCE72.305@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] speaking of lace Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 06:31:44 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.50.0034.2000 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 06:31:44 -0700 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Jan 2007 13:31:07.0244 (UTC) FILETIME=[10049AC0:01C7453C] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: f6244c19-f9e6-4dbd-809f-ee8664cddb6f X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45C09AB8.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:34:28 -0500 (EST) Status: RO Reminds me a little of the "accessories" discussion a while back. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 4:02 PM Subject: [h-cost] speaking of lace > This story on traditional handmade Polish lace caught my eye. > >snip > > I'm sorry to see the traditional demand is down, but glad to know they > can find a modern market rather than let the craft die. > > > > Dawn > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 31 10:22:49 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VFMiZ4006599 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:22:48 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0VFLqF0023078 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:22:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0VFKKO6020828 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:20:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VFJxQ7010696; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:19:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net (ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net [166.102.165.166]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VFJuCc010539 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 08:19:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bmatney@alltel.net) Received: from ispmxaamta08-gx.windstream.net ([162.40.180.86]) by ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20070131151949.TTUG3711.ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net@ispmxaamta08-gx.windstream.net> for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 09:19:49 -0600 Received: from emachine_T4155.alltel.net ([162.40.180.86]) by ispmxaamta08-gx.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20070131151948.QGRE2834.ispmxaamta08-gx.windstream.net@emachine_T4155.alltel.net> for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 09:19:48 -0600 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20070131085401.026ac030@mail.alltel.net> X-Sender: bmatney@mail.alltel.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 09:19:44 -0600 To: From: Beth and Bob Matney Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Romanesque costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 01a69b12-b6b9-4f6a-971d-705aefbd4135 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45C0B410.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:22:41 -0500 (EST) Status: RO I am considering ordering a photocopy of Romanesque-Byzantine Elements in French and English Dress 1050-1180 by Jennifer Harris. Univ. Manchester Ph.D Thesis (1977) Has anyone seen/read this Thesis? I am not able to ILL this in the US, so a copy would have to be ordered from the Univ. of Manchester... and it's a bit pricey. A short article based on it was in Costume (Journal of the Costume Society) number 21 (1987) pp 4-15 "'Thieves, Harlots and Stinking Goats': Fashionable Dress and Aesthetic Attitudes in Romanesque Art". Thanks. Beth Matney _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 31 10:46:11 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VFk7MV007068 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:46:07 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l0VFjFfG007370 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:46:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l0VCxAnm099377 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 05:59:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VCwLf1063869; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 05:59:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0V4WIMP063222 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:32:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA25760 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:21:22 -0600 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:21:21 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] New info on CostumeCon X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: fad32147-d898-4add-b6fc-ab57f6f3e217 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45C0B98B.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:46:04 -0500 (EST) Status: RO This may be of interest to you if: -- You're attending CostumeCon on a one-day membership for Saturday, March 31, the day of the Netherton lectures (or considering doing so); or -- You'd like to come for the lectures, but you think a one-day membership is a little too expensive for five lectures and one day of con activities; or -- You're within easy driving range and would just like a peek into what CostumeCon is like. If so, you might be interested to know that one-day memberships are FREE for Friday. Friday is a slower day, as it doesn't have one of the big shows (like Saturday and Sunday do). But there's still plenty to keep you busy: some panels, an extensive dealer's room, and the Friday Night Social, to name just a few. And lots of costumers wandering around, chatting, hanging out in hospitality, etc. So, those of you who are coming Saturday for my lectures can get an extra day of con activity if you want it. And if you're not interested in the lectures but do want to see what a CostumeCon is like, you can get a taste of it just by showing up on Friday. (If you're coming for the whole con, you've got Friday through Monday already!) Con info here: http://www.cc25.net/start.htm Click the news link or the site map for a quick overview of various elements of the con. Lecture info here: http://www.cc25.net/netherton.htm You can forward this message at will. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 31 23:18:50 2007 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l114IoxP022718 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:18:50 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l114I2hD017332 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:18:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l114H6b0055810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 21:17:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l114Gpke054822; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 21:16:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l0VIjd1S065323 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 11:46:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from camelothorse@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=KSrvp5G1XJAY5MBjd27PBZBmESmU3siYj81VssW7Ucm1dCF9kR8P2hm9LNzNPotY; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:References:Subject:Date:Organization:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [4.231.149.18] (helo=camelot01) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1HCKSf-0007Go-O9 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 13:45:38 -0500 From: "Diane Maynard" To: "'Historical Costume'" References: Subject: RE: [h-cost] To Tab or not to Tab? Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 12:45:41 -0600 Organization: Camelot Horse Center Message-ID: <000001c74568$032f5f20$1295e704@camelot01> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcdDBpRINlGl7GT/Sj6FxlWPCIa18QCX4lAg In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-ELNK-Trace: 7d3e56efc2551607917237dadff7bf594d2b10475b571120f136563d7e0966f9675ee67fe6ee72a1750af0004208d4f4350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 4.231.149.18 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 861b8187-8bba-4347-8f33-bd20e66d5d8b X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 45C169FA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:18:46 -0500 (EST) Status: RO -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Saragrace Knauf Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 10:30 AM OMG !! I am laughing so hard. I was on short time frame and bought this same material (at 60% off at JoAnn's) to throw together a quick Elizabethan. I did not have enough of the flocked material to make the long Spanish sleeves I wanted to add so, I found (by pure luck) the perfect match to the background material (at of all places--Hobby Lobby) and used that with cut velvet trim to tie the theme back into the main flocked material. I have NEVER had so many compliments and got stopped every 10 feet at our local Faire for photos. Everyone went crazy over that fabric. I have to say, that it did look rich and wonderful when the light hit it. As to YOUR outfit--I like the tabs. Diane I'm not sure what I should do here. This bodice http://tinyurl.com/343la7 is sort of a practice bodice. It is made from flocked fake silk taffeta (barf - but it was the closest fabric I have found to give the right look.) I found it at the last minute about a week ago at Jo Annes - it just happened to match the silk taffeta of the skirt almost exactly. I am in the process of having another embroidered to match the embroidery in the actual picture. http://tinyurl.com/3bdc27 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Jan 31 23:50:10 2007 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l114oApV023329 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:50:10 -0500 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l114nNqD031748 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:50:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l114n1Wo059535 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 21:49:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l114mvR3078394; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 21:48:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l114modA078325 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 21:48:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=radiks.net; b=Nt8EXFEc7BINzDgQ9+5AQood7FUIrk5yWQ0cGX6satT/+gY6rwlbCyyT0ljNkArj; h=Received:Message-Id:X-Mailer:Date:To:From:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Mime-Version:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.81.2.235] (helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1HCTsQ-0007TK-7H for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:48:50 -0500 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20070131224309.00b93890@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 22:48:19 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200701311911.l0VJ7mGt093303@net.indra.com> References: <200701311911.l0VJ7mGt093303@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e53e09d0e0b1ffcb0a614e3eb1ccc77c059504028115c108831350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.81.2.235 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.7, clamav-milter version 0.88.7 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: New info on CostumeCon X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-UUID: 7e2240a3-382f-4c1f-b323-19ea055755f6 X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 45C17153.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:50:06 -0500 (EST) Status: RO One correction, Robin - The free membership for Friday (one-day) does not include the Friday Night Social. There is a $5.00 event fee for that event if you are not a full weekend member, as this is a catered by the hotel event. I don't think this is mentioned on the website - I'll drop a hint to fix that.... Sandy (wife of co-chair Pierre) At 01:11 PM 1/31/2007, you wrote: >Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:21:21 -0600 (CST) >From: Robin Netherton >Subject: [h-cost] New info on CostumeCon > >This may be of interest to you if: > > -- You're attending CostumeCon on a one-day membership for Saturday, >March 31, the day of the Netherton lectures (or considering doing so); or > > -- You'd like to come for the lectures, but you think a one-day >membership is a little too expensive for five lectures and one day of con >activities; or > > -- You're within easy driving range and would just like a peek into what >CostumeCon is like. > >If so, you might be interested to know that one-day memberships are FREE >for Friday. Friday is a slower day, as it doesn't have one of the big >shows (like Saturday and Sunday do). But there's still plenty to keep you >busy: some panels, an extensive dealer's room, and the Friday Night >Social, to name just a few. And lots of costumers wandering around, >chatting, hanging out in hospitality, etc. > >(If you're coming for the whole con, you've got Friday through Monday >already!) > >Con info here: >http://www.cc25.net/start.htm > >Lecture info here: >http://www.cc25.net/netherton.htm > >--Robin "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume