From: Gretchen Miller Date: Mon, 5 Jun 1995 18:01:53 -0400 (EDT) Subject: H-Costume Digest, Volume 318, 6/5/95 The Historic Costume List Digest, Volume 318, June 5, 1995 Send items for the list to h-costume@andrew.cmu.edu (or reply to this message). Send subscription/deletion requests and inquiries to h-costume-request@andrew.cmu.edu Enjoy! ------------------------------ Topics: English wool and woollens Bi-corn hats Costumes in Braveheart QEI's corset and drawers Wideawakes Source of silk brocade Reference for 11-12th C headdress ISO: Info on medieval shoes/shoemaking/leatherworking ISO: Twill linen and silk velvet Women artists ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 1 Jun 1995 10:36:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Teresa Shannon Subject: On the revolution of british wool My first posting of May 31st to this costume group involved questions about wool vs. worsteds and the finding of fine woolens to potentially recreate some medieval english costumes with. As I am not a weaver, draper etc., my knowledge of wool fibers, yarns, and weaves is non-existant. My meagre understanding has been gleaned from the following sources which I will quote, paraphrase and summarize to the efficacy of this group's already vast information and resources, in the hope that my plea for overseas or domestic wool of a suitable type for English fourteenth century costuming is met with the greatest understanding. The following information comes from: Articles: Hartwell, R.M. "A Revolution in the Character and Destiny of British Wool," _Textile History and Economic History: Essays in Honour of Miss Julia deLacy Mann_ Eds. N.B. Harte and K.C. Ponting. Manchester University Press, 1973. Coleman, D.C. "Textile Growth," ibid. Book: Lloyd, T.H. The English Wool Trade in the Middle Ages. Cambridge University Press, 1977 Other authors are quoted in these works, namely Cunningham's The Growth of English Industry and Commerce; my favorite J.E. Thorold Rogers History of Agricultural Prices in England; Whitwell's English Monasteries and the Wool Trade in the Thirteenth Century; Eileen Power's Ford Lectures "The Wool Trade in English Medieval History" etc. Regarding the breeds of sheep in England: Wool had been a staple money-making export for Britain from the late twelfth century onwards, although examples of fine English wool appear on the continent in Charlemagne's reign with much praise. Still by the end of the eighteenth century wools importance declined and this was grudgingly admitted when it became obvious that cotton was replaing wool as the country's staple export. During 1750-1850 the relative percentage of wool contributing to the GNP of the British Isles convincingly brought about a revolution in the character of British wool. Farmers, by selective breeding and improved husbandry changed the 'coat of the sheep' and its body for meat with resulting economic consequences. Eileen Power wrote, "What we might have learned about breeds and their locations, has been blurred by the meddling of scientific breeders of modern times....to the historian he [breeders] is an archiconoclast who defaced an irreplaceable collection of walking documents." Great Britain today still has more breeds of sheep than any other country, but before the breed-changing, there were many more with each location having a breed suited to the climate and herbage. The traditional distinction of the breeds of sheep are between short- and long-wooled breeds, or between shee whose fleeces were suitable for woollens and those suitable for worsteds--and between lowland, down and hill breeds. "Since short wool was used for woollens and long wool for worsteds, it was easy enough to declare, as did Lord Somerville, that 'all breeds of sheep in the Kingdom may be arranged into two classes; those which shear short, or clothing, and those, which shear long, or coming wool'." The connection between length of wool and location (lowland, down and hill breeds) can, in general, also be made with long-woolled sheep mostly located in the rich lowlands of the east, and short-woolled in the midland area and the southern downs. "It is probable that the original sheep of Great Britain were short-woolled, and certainly short-woolled sheep dominated British wool supplies before the modification of breeds." Unfortunately the short-woolled breeds, that wool that gave England her supremacy in Europe before the Revolution, was changed most by breeding programs and have now disappeared or have all been severly 'modified'. The breeding revolution consisted mainly of the lengthening and coarsening of British fleeces. In the early eighteenth century the most important short-wool breeds were: the Old Norfolk (of Norfolk, Suffolk and Cambridgeshire) the Penistone (Yorkshire, Lancashire and Derbyshire), the Old Wiltshire (Wistshire, north Devon, Somerset, Buckinghashire and Berkshire) the Berkshire Knot or Old Berkshire (South Midlands) the old Hampshire.... See D. Low, "On the Domesticated Animals of the British Isles" (1845) for a general discussion of breeds. All the above were changed or supersceded by the progress of the South Down (sheep breed). In the long run the South Down did not extend far beyond the chalk downs, but elsewhere left a lasting imprint on almost all the short-woolled sheep of England. Of the old breed which servived the most important were: the Ryeland, Morfe Common of Shropshire, the old Norfold blackfaced horned upland breed, the Old Dorset, with the new breeds being a mixture of all but the Ryland and the South down with some additional breeds. Of the long-haired breeds whose habitat was the rich lowland pasture of eastern England, there were two main groups, originally. LThe lighter Teeswater, and the Leicester type of the inland valleys; and the heavier long-woolled Lincoln and Romney type. The best known breeds in the eighteenth century were Lincoln, Leicester, Romney Marsh... texts say that all these distinct breeds disappeared or were crossed out of existence. The lighter long wools lost to the heavier, but generally far outweighted the short-wools. The hill and mountain sheep were not part of so a vigorous a breeding program. They produce long fibred coarse wool. The most common hill sheep was the blackfaced Mountain or Heath. Main mountain sheep in England were the Lonk, Rough Fell, Swaledale, Gritstone,etc. The Welsh had distince breeds. The Cheviot, native to Northumberland was originally a short-woolled sheep but was improved after 1790 and gradually replaced the blackfaced sheep in Scotland. The Old Norfolk Horned disappeared completely phased out by the South Down. The result of the breeding changed English wool for the worst. witnesses declare that 'the new system is incompatible with the growth of fine wool,' and that English wool had deteriorated 'for the purpose of making superfine cloth'. Youatt, basing conclusions on writing and observations of 40 years stated in 1846 'it is therefore clear,m that high feeding is incompatible with the production of fine wool'. In increasing the size of short-woolled sheep and the weight of the fleece, they had sacrificed quality of wool. The rapid growth of the worsted industry after 1820 ensured the demand for British long wool as the short wool became inferior to the best imports. For medieval times, woolens and raw wool were generally exported. The Italians traded gold and silver cloths of Milan, velours of Florence, and velvets from Lucca (along with fruits, spices, dyes, and oil) for English woollen cloths, especially the smaller and lighter types known as kerseys, some worsteds, linens, and fustians manufactured in the Netherlands (from English raw materials) and tin and lead. If you want to talk amounts of wool prices, embargoes its all there, although more follow up might be possible on earlier breeds. Certain scab epidemics in the late thirteeth century caused wool prices to be driven up and it seems the Italians compete vigorously with the Flemish for English wool, the poorer and cheaper quality coming from Scotland and Wales. So there is my misunderstanding of worsteds vs woollens. The articles indicate that English short-wool is a rarety, that the fineness of the wool has been destroyed by the breeding process and that we currently get long coarse wool from England, and that worsteds, which appear to be very different that woollens (a distinction I erroneously transferred to cloth) are the primary export now a days. So english wool isn't what it used to be. Perhaps Australian, spanish or italian short-wool sheeps that produce fine fibers can fill in the gap? Merinos were attempted to be bred in England with much failure. What other short-wool sheep or even some long-haired breeds that produce extremely fine wool, not suitable for worsteds in the sense of these articles? Any other information or advice would be wonderful. Perhaps discussion on whether current wool is as fine as old medieval English wool. They made wool batiste in the fifteenth century, wouldn't that be wonderful? I have received recommendations to try wool challis and to contact the Australian Wool Corporation, which I intend to do, but I also need fine woolens in the right, or appropriate, weaves. Something I know very little about. Thank you all for your time and patience. Teresa ------------------------------ From: BJHILL@STTHOMAS.EDU Date: Thu, 01 Jun 1995 10:44:21 -0600 (CST) Subject: Bicorns In answer to your question on bicorns. I have noticed that most men's clothes of this period seem to follow the military style, or vice versa. Thus the bicorn was also adapted for civilian wear. The bicorns I have seen have been worn side to side. A book that may be of some help that goes into the civilian and military hats is as follows. Hats Fiona Clark London 1992 ISBN # 071343774X The Empire and Regency era is more my specialty, so I am sorry I can't help with the "Wideawake" (I'm kinda sleepy (;-). Your most humble, and obedient servant, brian hill bjhill@stthomas.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jun 1995 12:34:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Gretchen Miller Subject: Re: Brave Heart Excerpts from internet.other.h-costume: 30-May-95 Re: Brave Heart by KATHLEEN@ANSTEC.COM > Depends on whether you are portraying a Lowlander or a Highlander. Lowlanders > wore what the English wore (surprise, surprise). I will check my sources later > today to see what I can find about 14th century Highlanders and women's > clothing. BTW, William Wallace was a Lowlander; therefore, he WOULD NOT have > been wearing tartan, woad or braided hair. So much for poetic license. back to > you later on the other stuff. While I agree with the last part (no tartan, woad, etc) I don't necessarily agree that "lowlanders wore what the English wore". There's all sorts of statements that lowlanders wore what the English wore WHEN THEY WERE IN TOWN, or in court, but not while they were in the country. When they were in the country (in the period we're refering to, by the way, I believe ALL out of town was refered to as "highlands"), they wore highland, or country clothes. Mostly cause when you were out of town, you were probably hunting, and highland clothings is admirably suited for hunting. toodles, gretchen ------------------------------ Subject: Elizabeth's corset and drawers Date: Thu, 01 Jun 95 09:57:40 -0700 From: Carol Ann Krug I was surprised to read the following in the Perspectives section of this week's Newsweek(!): "We don't know if it is the underwear she died in, but it certainly belonged to her. The corset has a very slim waist." Westminster Abbey librarian Tony Trowles, on a new exhibition featuring the corset and drawers of Elizabeth I. Has anyone seen the exhibition? What else is included in the exhibition? Are the corset and drawers owned by Westminster Abbey? Any chance the exhibition will travel? Carol Ann Krug carolann@cup.hp.com ------------------------------ From: Edward Wright Date: Thu, 1 Jun 95 10:22:43 TZ Subject: RE: wideawakes | >From the Dictionary of American History: | Wide-awakes, an antiforeign, anti-Catholic organization that flourished around | 1850. In the presidential campaign of 1860, Republican marching clubs under | this name arose everywhere. The first, in Hartford, Conn., wore black cambric | capes when marching as protection against torch drippings. These were later | replaced with oilcloth capes, If this definition meant to imply that oilcloth capes replaced cambric as a protection against torch drippings, I have grave doubts -- oilcloth is highly flammable! ------------------------------ From: Edward Wright Date: Thu, 1 Jun 95 11:00:13 TZ Subject: RE: The magazine Costume, brocades | I am looking for silk, linen (hah), and wool brocades as rayon and cotton | weren't big in the fourteenth century :-). Once again, I'll recommend Oriental Silks in Los Angeles. They carry quite an assortment of silk satin brocades at $12.99 a yard. Most of the patterns are quite oriental-looking, since they're imported from China, but so were many silks in period, so you may be able to find a pattern and color that will work for you. They also have a few rayon satin tapestries for, I think, around $7.99 a yard. ------------------------------ From: VICKI@lib.uttyl.edu Date: Thu, 1 Jun 1995 13:23:27 -0500 (CDT) Subject: wideawakes, again A colleague, after reading my post about "hats with no nap" mentioned that Brewer's might not be the best source of information--sometimes he just passed on folklore. Could be........ It did push me to go on to the Oxford English Dictionary. As a person, a wide-awake was "Thoroughly vigilant or on the alert; fully aware of what is going on, or of what it is best to do; intellectually keen, sharp-witted, knowing. Examples: 1833 In the language of the turf, his grace was 'wide awake.'; 1835 Our governor's wide awake, he is...He knows what's o'clock; 1857 Mr. Slope...was wide awake to what he hoped was his coming opportunity." Definition three was "Applied jocularly to a soft felt hat with broad brim and low crown: said to have been punningly so names as not having a 'nap'. Examples: 1841 Jonathan replied, that his hat was like himself--wide awake. 1861 Mr. Hubbard...wears a 'wide awake' hat, which is a novelty in the House. 1837 Such is the farm-servant, whether you see him in...his straw-hat, or his wide-awake. 1849 No covering for the head can compete with the thin small-crowned broad-brimmed beavers now known by the name of wide-awakes. >From the Dictionary of American English-- In the political campaign of 1860 and later, a supporter of Abraham Lincoln; frequently in plural, an organization of supporters of Lincoln. In reference to the cape--Congressional Globe, 23 June 1870, p. 4770--I remember the Wide Awake Club that I belonged to, and the Wide Awake cape that I wore. As far as the fabric of the cape--I don't recommend 'em--just report what I found! :-) This brings to mind other terms, such as "follow me boys"--the ribbons that hang down a girl's back. Vicki Betts (compulsive librarian) University of Texas at Tyler vicki@lib.uttyl.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jun 1995 08:41:39 -1000 From: Jan McEwen Subject: Re: 11-12th Century Headresses _Women's Headdress and Hairstyles in England from AD 600 to the Present Day_ by Georgine de Courtais, B.T. Batsford Ltd, London, 1986. ISBN 0 7134 5282 X Jan ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jan McEwen, Department of Horticulture, University of Hawaii SCA: Catriona Stewart, Barony of the Western Seas, Caid Internet: jmcewen@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jun 1995 13:48:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Teresa Shannon Subject: Re: Elizabeth's corset and drawers Well I'm curious. Just called my British book importer, they will fax a request to Ms. Trowles at Westminster Abbey today or tommorrow requesting information and any publications associated with said exhibit. When I get the information, if no one else eclipses it with their own, I will post it to the group. Teresa On Thu, 1 Jun 1995, Carol Ann Krug wrote: > Date: Thu, 01 Jun 95 09:57:40 -0700 > From: Carol Ann Krug > To: h-costume@andrew.cmu.edu > Subject: Elizabeth's corset and drawers > > > I was surprised to read the following in the Perspectives section of > this week's Newsweek(!): > > "We don't know if it is the underwear she died in, but it > certainly belonged to her. The corset has a very slim waist." > Westminster Abbey librarian Tony Trowles, on a new exhibition > featuring the corset and drawers of Elizabeth I. > > Has anyone seen the exhibition? What else is included in the exhibition? > Are the corset and drawers owned by Westminster Abbey? Any chance the > exhibition will travel? > > Carol Ann Krug > carolann@cup.hp.com > ------------------------------ From: Gregory Stapleton Date: Thu, 1 Jun 95 14:45:12 PDT Subject: Medieval Shoes in particular and Medieval Leatherwork in general Hello, All, :) I'm a Medieval reenactor for fun and a very little profit. Through a long and twisting path, I find myself becoming more and more involved in leatherwork. I've been making medieval shoes, gloves, bottles, jacks, pouches, etc., etc. I need help with some research. The only resource I've found for shoes, so far, is the British Museum book series on Archaeological finds in London. I know that there have been many other documented finds in York, Canterbury and other places, but don't know how to access this data. I'm looking for drawings/pictures/descriptions. Anyone have any resources they could point me toward? Also, I'm looking for any similar information on anything medieval made of leather and how it was made. I recently came across wonderful info on how to make a leather lanthorn with horn "glass". I've also just learned that there is a, Leather Museum of London. Has anyone on the list been there? Anyone have an address and or phone number? If anyone would like to discuss their leather working experiences or have any questions that I might be able to answer, please feel free to email me. Any help will be greatly appreciated. Yours, Gregory Stapleton Known As Gawain Kilgore ------------------------------ Date: 01 Jun 1995 15:18:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Library - Vineland Research Station Subject: Re: twill linen and silk velvet Following this thread (no pun intended) I've come up with a new idea for some enterprizing soul - sod sex phone lines! - how about a fabric fantasty line! For $5 the first minute and $3 thereafter you can talk about your fantasy fabrics with a sympathetic person. My personal fantasies (besides cheap batiste) is twill linen and silk velvet. I'm sure I'll go into cardiac arrest at the price if I ever locate any, but in the meantime I can dream, can't I? I know Colonial Williamsburg has silk decorating fabrics. Can anybody suggest some sources? Sheridan Alder (sorry, no editing, please excuse typos) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jun 1995 13:54:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Deborah Tarsiewicz - 3528981 Subject: Re: Authentic or not... On Wed, 31 May 1995 BEARLEE1@aol.com wrote: >Woman who painted at all, tended to paint the flower vase or the fruit >bowl. Not to split hairs but I can't say that I agree with this assessment of female artists. Deborah Tarsiewicz ------------------------------ End of Volume 318 -----------------------